Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

UK Retailers Threaten to Ban Steam

Options
2»

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    death1234567
    Registered Users Posts: 3,333 ✭✭✭death1234567


    I only buy from online retailers or steam anyway. I'm not even sure the retail stores near me stock PC games anymore.


  • Options
    #33
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,313 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    WopTittyPop wrote: »
    Am I the only person left alive that actually likes to have the physical disc and box in my possession as apposed to just having the game saved on a hard drive?

    Apart from that, the only other flaw I can see in the solely digital distribution era, that appears to be coming closer with every new game release, is the fact that you need a credit/debit card to purchase online. I don't know about you guys, but I didn't get my first debit card until I was 15! What about the kids who still buy games with pocket money/allowances? The majority of elderly people still aren't comfortable with buying online, and unless kids start getting debit cards and their pocket money goes digital too, I can't see completely digital distribution ever fully working!
    You haven't really adopted the whole 3V thing at all, have you. Young kids do not have problems purchasing digitally and if they did - what's the problem with that? Having a parent in the loop? Have you been to a game store? Kids drag in who with them to the store to buy what?

    Boxes are just boxes. You'll see them get phased out soon enough. And by soon enough I figure within 10 years you'll only see them as collector's editions and you won't see standard editions on shelves.

    I don't think your hypothesis on the elderly is based on reality either. The Elderly or the Elderly Gamer? One is not the Luddite.
    Because they don't have to be subjected to release dates,
    Developers in general are subject to them though. Valve is self-funding and self-sufficient and entirely profitable, so it has the patience to send a title into a 5 year production cycle. Other developers simply don't have the luxury, they have kids to feed and bills to pay. So you then get either the Indie developer who can sustain themselves during the development cycle or you get a developer that is financially supported by a publisher. Publishers like EA won't disappear; they'll still have money to throw around, Developers to Patronize, etc.


  • Options
    #34
    uberpixie
    Registered Users Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭uberpixie


    Overheal wrote: »
    You haven't really adopted the whole 3V thing at all, have you. Young kids do not have problems purchasing digitally and if they did - what's the problem with that? Having a parent in the loop? Have you been to a game store? Kids drag in who with them to the store to buy what?

    I agree.....

    Both my brothers are teenagers, both have never had a problem getting the credit card off the parents to buy a game when they were getting one as a present or had the cash to pay them back. It's not a big deal for many people, I won't say all as not everyone had broadband or a credit card!

    The 3V route also seems to work out well on this site for many students who don't have credit cards.


    At this late stage retail should just take the knock and accept that the digital market is well established at this stage, Steam isn't going away any time soon.
    @ Venom Ireland: yeah they would get a cut of each game sold, Direct2Drive bit the bullet and now sell Steamworks games and I'm sure they make more money than not stocking the Steamworks games and crying in the corner about it......

    Valve took the risks early on and reaped the rewards and now dominate the PC digital download market. They have provided the "value added" services to gamers and Developers which is the icing on the cake.
    Granted I hate their pricing but love their sales and the auto patching, the in game chat/voice chat and the web overlay so I gave have a quick look at the internet in the middle of a game. I can even add non steam game shortcuts to Steam and I can still use all of the chat and web browsing features mid game which is pretty sweet.

    Retailers lacked the vision and will pay the price unless they stop being little bitches and start competing with Valve and provide keen pricing. Valves prices are very high and I'm sure a retailer with decent pricing would take a cut of the market, even reselling Steamworks games.....


    Some of the comments at the bottom of the original link really caught my eye....:

    "As a mainly PC publisher I can say without fear of contradiction that if we had been reliant on retail in the UK and US for our business we would not have a business.
    Outside of our Russian market and Germany, the Digital business is our major revenue earner.
    In recent conferences when the two distribution methods have been discussed, everyone has focussed on the sales numbers, and no-one has mentioned how beneficial it is to have your 60/70% wire transferred direct to your bank account by the end of the month following sale, rather than the old way of getting 30/40% sometime in the following quarter. 30% more margin, 5 months quicker is not something any businessman can look lightly upon!"


    "As a publisher, I don't care about retail. They barely stock my games and I make most of my revenue through Steam. But I do see a problem of having one dominant player. Our devs don't use Steamworks. Although we have discussed it."

    "I had a meeting with one of my UK publishers, who was complaining that they could only get 30 units of a new title of ours into a major retailer. that's 1 each for their top 30 stores. Cos "There is no demand for it". I had my Steam instant sales tool on screen at the time and my response was "In the 10 seconds it's taken you to tell me there is no demand for it, 45 customers have started to download it on Steam".
    Nuff said?"

    Retailers should be paying attention to comments like this and perhaps up their game while they still have a market to play in?


  • Options
    #35
    cherryghost
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    Selling 3V vouchers to under 18's is actually illegal. Anyone selling it to them is nearly as bad as selling alcohol to minors. That is all. Continue.


  • Options
    #36
    K.O.Kiki
    Registered Users Posts: 18,707 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki


    cherryghost wrote: »
    Selling 3V vouchers to under 18's is actually illegal. Anyone selling it to them is nearly as bad as selling alcohol to minors. That is all. Continue.
    You must be 16 years or older to register for a 3V Customer Card.

    ;)


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    cherryghost
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 17,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭cherryghost


    Interesting, seeing as I work with Payzone and to sell vouchers to people they must be over 18 :confused:


  • Options
    #38
    WopTittyPop
    Registered Users Posts: 187 ✭✭WopTittyPop


    Overheal wrote: »
    You haven't really adopted the whole 3V thing at all, have you.

    I completely forgot about 3V, as I've never used it, so you make a good point there. But like it's been said, you need to be 16/18 to register for a card, and from what I can remember gamer kids come in younger ages than 16!
    Overheal wrote: »
    Boxes are just boxes.

    That's the exact response I was expecting, and it's what very few people apparently seem to understand. It's not just the box, it's the box art, the manual *regardless of if you read it or not*, the extras you can get with the game (maps etc.), and the fact of actually having a disc in physical possession rather than a virtual one.
    Overheal wrote: »
    I don't think your hypothesis on the elderly is based on reality either. The Elderly or the Elderly Gamer? One is not the Luddite

    I mean the general elderly, not the specific elderly gamer, and yes it is based on reality. There's plenty of elderly people out there, with kids, who don't know how to use a computer let alone buy something through the internet. And no, I'm not exaggerating. I worked in an electronic store for 3 years and was constantly asked questions that would seem simple to those who are familiar with computers, yet seemed impossible to these customers.
    I hardly imagine they would feel comfortable letting their teenage kid use their credit card to buy something on a machine they're not comfortable with. And not every kid is as computer savvy as you might think they are! I know plenty of people, of all ages, that still wouldn't really be comfortable buying something through the internet.

    I think you're taking my point of view on the whole thing the wrong way! I'm not against digital distribution of games, and I can definitely see game stores being rid of in the not to distant future. I just feel there are sides to it that people won't like!


  • Options
    #39
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,324 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    For the first time I'm actually torn on the digital distribution thing. I usually only buy stuff on Steam when there's sales on, however World of Warcraft Cataclysm is being relased digitally as well as retail. I have the Collector's Edition pre-ordered and it's most likely going to be €70 to €80, while the digital edition will only be €35 and will be available to pre-download and then play at midnight on December 7, which means no queuing up at a midnight launch then coming home (via taxi) and installing and patching.

    Actually I think I've just talked myself into the digital version, it'll mean I miss out on all the extras but it's just more convenient.


  • Options
    #40
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,313 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    super_furry wrote: »
    For the first time I'm actually torn on the digital distribution thing. I usually only buy stuff on Steam when there's sales on, however World of Warcraft Cataclysm is being relased digitally as well as retail. I have the Collector's Edition pre-ordered and it's most likely going to be €70 to €80, while the digital edition will only be €35 and will be available to pre-download and then play at midnight on December 7, which means no queuing up at a midnight launch then coming home (via taxi) and installing and patching.

    Actually I think I've just talked myself into the digital version, it'll mean I miss out on all the extras but it's just more convenient.
    Ladies and Gentlemen: My case and point.

    :)
    and the fact of actually having a disc in physical possession rather than a virtual one.
    There's only one disc I like to keep handy and thats my Operating System DVD. What was the point of the Starcraft Collectors Edition while sure it has a nice dog tag and a neat pet but in terms of the Disc, I installed and still had to sit around for Patches to take place. That right there just illustrates how much faster the industry is these days that DVD can't keep up: by the time you print a Master and have it published and distributed and ready for release, the Developer has already gone and continued improving on the IP to the point where you'll need to run patches X Y and Z before you play anyway.


  • Options
    #41
    cian1500ww
    Registered Users Posts: 2,904 ✭✭✭cian1500ww


    The only disadvantage to digital distribution for me is when I need to format my PC, I hate having to download everything again and I know I should back them up but that'd also take bloody ages!! It's nice to have a physical copy right there :)


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 51,441 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Overheal wrote: »
    :)There's only one disc I like to keep handy and thats my Operating System DVD. What was the point of the Starcraft Collectors Edition while sure it has a nice dog tag and a neat pet but in terms of the Disc, I installed and still had to sit around for Patches to take place. That right there just illustrates how much faster the industry is these days that DVD can't keep up: by the time you print a Master and have it published and distributed and ready for release, the Developer has already gone and continued improving on the IP to the point where you'll need to run patches X Y and Z before you play anyway.

    Is it not more a case of 'We're going to miss the deadline! Screw QA and just fuck it out there, We've 2 months from gold to release we can just patch the bugs we find on release day'. It's more indicitive of what's wring with the industry.

    I'd rather have a physical copy on case the digital provider goes titsup and I lose all my games.
    Untitled Image




  • Options
    #43
    Cuddlesworth
    Registered Users Posts: 13,995 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    Is it not more a case of 'We're going to miss the deadline! Screw QA and just fuck it out there, We've 2 months from gold to release we can just patch the bugs we find on release day'. It's more indicitive of what's wring with the industry.

    I'd rather have a physical copy on case the digital provider goes titsup and I lose all my games.

    Lol, its funny to hear somebody say that about starcraft. They were minor bug fixes and balance changes. The original starcraft was still being patched in early 2009.

    The fact is with PC's you have millions of different configurations and there will be issues on launch with a huge title.


  • Options
    #44
    marco_polo
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 10,079 Mod ✭✭✭✭marco_polo


    cian1500ww wrote: »
    The only disadvantage to digital distribution for me is when I need to format my PC, I hate having to download everything again and I know I should back them up but that'd also take bloody ages!! It's nice to have a physical copy right there :)

    Unless it has a big scratch in it. ;)


  • Options
    #45
    K.O.Kiki
    Registered Users Posts: 18,707 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki


    With digital distribution, I don't have to worry about losing the disc, ever.

    The data is on my account, and unless Half-Life 2: Episode 3 is complete and utter crap, I don't see Steam going belly-up any time soon.


  • Options
    #46
    Fnz
    Registered Users Posts: 2,848 ✭✭✭Fnz


    K.O.Kiki wrote: »
    unless Half-Life 2: Episode 3 is complete and utter crap, I don't see Steam going belly-up any time soon.

    Lol, as if Valve need to make another game, ever.

    I'd wager the Steam service be laying golden eggs all over the hizzle.... fo'shizzle.


  • Options
    #47
    Nehaxak
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,717 ✭✭✭Nehaxak


    I really love the ease of use of Steam, I know it's stupidly more expensive for prices in Euro and even compared to bricks and mortar shops but still, I'm sick of discs and boxes lying around. That and I'm always buggering up my windows install sooner or later and have to reinstall, so thankful for steam backups on another HD, or even having to download them all again, still better than stupid discs and patching stuff up again.

    Oh and installing Steam on my sons computer, copying across all my games, logging out myself and letting him play them - such an added bonus.

    Normal shops are barely even taking an interest in PC games anymore anyway, probably due to the cut they make on second hand console games so they can shove it far as I'm concerned.


  • Options
    #48
    Cuddlesworth
    Registered Users Posts: 13,995 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    My steam games folder is 360gigs. I shudder to think of where I could store all those box sets.


  • Options
    #49
    WopTittyPop
    Registered Users Posts: 187 ✭✭WopTittyPop


    Overheal wrote: »
    There's only one disc I like to keep handy and thats my Operating System DVD. What was the point of the Starcraft Collectors Edition while sure it has a nice dog tag and a neat pet but in terms of the Disc, I installed and still had to sit around for Patches to take place. That right there just illustrates how much faster the industry is these days that DVD can't keep up: by the time you print a Master and have it published and distributed and ready for release, the Developer has already gone and continued improving on the IP to the point where you'll need to run patches X Y and Z before you play anyway.

    Are you completely putting console games to the side, and focusing only on PC games, when you talk about digital distribution? Because I was considering both!


  • Options
    #50
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,313 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    WopTittyPop wrote: »
    Are you completely putting console games to the side, and focusing only on PC games, when you talk about digital distribution? Because I was considering both!
    Nope


  • Options
    #51
    WopTittyPop
    Registered Users Posts: 187 ✭✭WopTittyPop


    Overheal wrote: »
    Nope

    Well then, PC games aside, your point about waiting around for installation and patches is irrelevant!


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,313 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    WopTittyPop wrote: »
    Well then, PC games aside, your point about waiting around for installation and patches is irrelevant!
    You didnt notice with the PS3 and 360 that you were waiting around to "install" DLC or to preload your game onto your hard drive?


  • Options
    #53
    Gunmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 4,067 ✭✭✭Gunmonkey


    Wonder if those retailers refused to sell Black Ops, as it requires Steam AFAIK.


  • Options
    #54
    WopTittyPop
    Registered Users Posts: 187 ✭✭WopTittyPop


    Overheal wrote: »
    You didnt notice with the PS3 and 360 that you were waiting around to "install" DLC or to preload your game onto your hard drive?

    Last time I checked you don't go through an install process for DLC on consoles, only a download process. And I don't bother installing games to the hard drive, as it doesn't seem make that much of a difference to me.
    Also if discs were rid of, and everything was digitalised, DLC would still work under the exact same process. Whether the game itself is on a disc or on the hard drive has no effect on DLC. Unless you see a way it would be different?


  • Options
    #55
    sink
    Registered Users Posts: 4,314 ✭✭✭sink


    Nobody has so far mentioned Microsoft points and itunes gift cards being sold through retailers. You don't need to be 16/18 and you don't need to have a credit card. A 12 year old can go and buy MS points and itunes credit with his/her pocket money and then download games/music/films till their hearts content. Valve could very easily bring out something similar.

    Fact is that Steam is PC/Mac only at them moment and very few under 18s game on PC/Mac. Steam is coming to PS3 sometime in the future and you can bet Valve will start selling steam credit through local stores when that happens.


  • Options
    #56
    Sierra Oscar
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,500 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    Gunmonkey wrote: »
    Wonder if those retailers refused to sell Black Ops, as it requires Steam AFAIK.

    That's what I was thinking - quite a lot of popular PC games are beginning to use SteamWorks these days.


  • Options
    #57
    marco_polo
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 10,079 Mod ✭✭✭✭marco_polo


    Sierra Oscar wrote: »
    That's what I was thinking - quite a lot of popular PC games are beginning to use SteamWorks these days.

    Steamworks provides alot of useful functionality (completely for free to developers unless I am mistaken?) Hard to see Developers/Publishers walking away from all that just because of the demands of a few high street retailers, who barely sell PC games anyway. (In fact it is doubly hard to see imagine Publishers/Developers pandering to retailers given the ongoing shape shadow boxing over the second hand game trade)


  • Options
    #58
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,313 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    WopTittyPop wrote: »
    Last time I checked you don't go through an install process for DLC on consoles, only a download process.
    Funny, thats exactly how Steam works..


  • Options
    #59
    WopTittyPop
    Registered Users Posts: 187 ✭✭WopTittyPop


    Overheal wrote: »
    Funny, thats exactly how Steam works..

    If this is you agreeing with me that you don't have to wait around to install DLC, and you just have to simply download it, then you're completely contradicting the point you made with the following comment:
    Overheal wrote: »
    You didnt notice with the PS3 and 360 that you were waiting around to "install" DLC or to preload your game onto your hard drive?


Advertisement