Huge waste of money by University

billy the squid

bigpink wrote: »

If not one penny of taxpayers money is used in this chanting course and the school its taught in i say chant on:)

I did 2 years and passed going on was an option thats not dropping out

If it was a four year course then it was., you kept someone who might have done the whole course out of a place.

ClutchIt

bigpink wrote: »

Ok what is the value of a chanting course?

Are you Data from Star Trek? Or do I not have to explain why people can get enjoyment from things?

bigpink

billy the squid wrote: »

I think paying for an undergrad only for them to drop out half way through their course is a bigger waste of money to be honest.

I did a 2 year course
I got good use out of the accounting and the computer subjects how is that a waste or dropping out?

bigpink

ClutchIt wrote: »

Are you Data from Star Trek? Or do I not have to explain why people can get enjoyment from things?

Enjoyment but not value to normal people

smk89

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

Could also say the same about music and art or any performing art, sure lets just abolish it all :rolleyes:

That's the spirit

billy the squid

ClutchIt wrote: »

Are you Data from Star Trek? Or do I not have to explain why people can get enjoyment from things?

Even Data from star trek was aware of the importance of music.

ClutchIt

bigpink wrote: »

Whats your course?
If your going to be a teacher i must say id give great respect,its a vocation

OK, and that's the most contradictory post of the thread. Congrats.

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

Enjoyment but not value to normal people

Who are these normal people you speak of?

bigpink

prinz wrote: »

What I see is a 'reverse snobbery' along with an unhealthy side portion of shoulder chips.

If my anger at waste comes across as snobby i will say sorry to everyone debating here

But there is a huge snobbery when peopl defend arts
If your are a normal working person your viewpoint is limited as one poster said or an close minded eejit as one said

mojesius

prinz wrote: »

Who are these normal people you speak of?

The pre-cogs.

bigpink

prinz wrote: »

Who are these normal people you speak of?

Normal working people trying to pay bills,get houses,raise kids

People who wouldnt want taxes used for chanting and dance courses

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

If my anger at waste comes across as snobby i will say sorry to everyone debating here.But there is a huge snobbery when peopl defend arts. If your are a normal working person your viewpoint is limited as one poster said or an close minded eejit as one said

I'm a normal working person.

ClutchIt

bigpink wrote: »

Normal working people trying to pay bills,get houses,raise kids

News flash: People doing these things also may enjoy music

In fact I am one, and I will defend this course to the hilt.

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

Normal working people trying to pay bills,get houses,raise kids

Ah I get you now. You're one of those plebs people.

Why don't you let the people with no bills, free housing and no kids, AKA the 'arts crowd' talk now?

bigpink

ClutchIt wrote: »

News flash: People doing these things also may enjoy music

In fact I am one, and I will defend this course to the hilt.

So tax money should be used to pay for chanting and dance etc?

I enjoy music but no way should tax be wasted on it

Donkey Oaty

Hey, chill out everyone, with this 1990 classic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfH6w6_0-rc

The lads doing the Gregorian chant had to take legal action to get their fair cut after samples were used without permission.

c_man

bigpink wrote: »

But there is a huge snobbery when peopl defend arts

This is true. I'm not saying they're wrong, but I'd love to see some of these people as Minister for Arts sitting down with the cabinet when discussing the budget. You have people dying on trolleys, a massive bite to be taken out of health budget and you're getting funds for stuff like this...?


I think art and culture is important.

Yes yes, TD expenses and all that could be saved.

bigpink

prinz wrote: »

Ah I get you now. You're one of those plebs people.

Why don't you let the people with no bills, free housing and no kids, AKA the 'arts crowd' talk now?

I dont stop anyone from talking
Plebs nice to know what you think

bigpink

So should we fund a clown or mime course just cause the arts crowd want it?

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

So tax money should be used to pay for chanting and dance etc? I enjoy music but no way should tax be wasted on it

I presume you feel the same about Government money ending up going towards Croke Park?

bigpink

bigpink wrote: »

Normal working people trying to pay bills,get houses,raise kids

People who wouldnt want taxes used for chanting and dance courses

What is this, no true scotsman?
I'm a "normal working person", I think the course is great.
Or am I not a "normal working person" BECAUSE I think the course is great?

prinz

bluewolf wrote: »

What is this, no true scotsman?
I'm a "normal working person", I think the course is great.
Or am I not a "normal working person" BECAUSE I think the course is great?

You're with us now! Someone else will raise your kids for you and if you do the secret gregorian chant down the line to Jim in Accounts, your Eircom bill will disappear. Muwaahahahaha.

Moist Bread

c_man wrote: »

This is true. I'm not saying they're wrong, but I'd love to see some of these people as Minister for Arts sitting down with the cabinet when discussing the budget. You have people dying on trolleys, a massive bite to be taken out of health budget and you're getting funds for stuff like this...?


I think art and culture is important.

Yes yes, TD expenses and all that could be saved.

You are right. I would prioritize health care above the arts too, as it effects everybody, people without jobs and even chanting lecturers. This is not to say that we should completely cut all finance to the arts. I still don't get the issue with this course, seeing as it's a MA with fee's that cover the salary of the lecturers.

Hayte

bigpink wrote: »

So should we fund a clown or mime course just cause the arts crowd want it?

Oh go away you twilly troll.

bigpink

prinz wrote: »

I presume you feel the same about Government money ending up going towards Croke Park?

Dont know the ins and outs but the Gaa is a community group you dont have to play to be involved

Chanting is of no benefit to people

krudler

I'm starting a course on didgeridoo appreciation and playing the flute with my nose, this valuable contribution to the arts is essential for the country,anyone who thinks I'm wasting the taxpayers money is clearly a reverse snob.

Moist Bread

krudler wrote: »

I'm starting a course on didgeridoo appreciation and playing the flute with my nose, this valuable contribution to the arts is essential for the country,anyone who thinks I'm wasting the taxpayers money is clearly a reverse snob.

Tell us how you really feel?

c_man

Moist Bread wrote: »

You are right. I would prioritize health care above the arts too, as it effects everybody, people without jobs and even chanting lecturers. This is not to say that we should completely cut all finance to the arts. I still don't get the issue with this course, seeing as it's a MA with fee's that cover the salary of the lecturers.

I was just talking in general terms. With regard to this course, I think that if you go down the round of deciding which courses/areas should receive any tax payers money then we may as well cut funding to them all equally. I'm sure every course and lecturer could defend themselves and make a good case. It'd be madness. Students would flock to courses which they may have no interest in, merely due to free fees, packing them out and diminishing the education for all.

bigpink

It seems if your not an arts lover here your only a brain less peasant

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

Dont know the ins and outs but the Gaa is a community group you dont have to play to be involved. Chanting is of no benefit to people

You said it gives enjoyment but no value. Watching GAA in Croke Park gives me enjoyment but it doesn't provide any actual "value".

krudler wrote: »

I'm starting a course on didgeridoo appreciation and playing the flute with my nose, this valuable contribution to the arts is essential for the country,anyone who thinks I'm wasting the taxpayers money is clearly a reverse snob.

Not sure what point you are trying to make, but trying to portray a false divide between the 'art people' and 'normal people' is ridiculously snobbish. Same sort of fools who will scoff at people interested in classical music and then bounce around a niteclub at a dance track ripped from a classical track.

Defending money spent on one item =/= automatically defending money spent on everything.

btw I think you are late. They have been playing the didgeridoo down in Limerick for years.

krudler

Moist Bread wrote: »

Tell us how you really feel?

Eh, its a double edged sword, its hard to prioritse one worthy art course over another, espcially in monetary terms, say someone does a filmmaking course and then goes on to make a film here which generates jobs and the like, thats fairly worthwhile. A course in someone learning something which will benefit nobody in any way whatsoever is harder to judge, they may be equally as valid in artistic terms, but in the sense of it being worthwhile to spend money which could be put to better use elsewhere in the economy then its a sticky situation.

Millicent

bigpink wrote: »

It seems if your not an arts lover here your only a brain less peasant

Why are you assigning attributes to people that they aren't displaying? I've already told you I'm working class and currently unemployed, but just because I defend a course, I'm a snob? I'm not sure what sort of complex you have here but it's nothing to do with anyone else who's posting here.

And back out again!

chucken1

bigpink wrote: »

Dont know the ins and outs but the Gaa is a community group you dont have to play to be involved

Chanting is of no benefit to people

I find chanting very benificial..(normal unemployed person)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrKI6YVbRic&feature=related

bigpink

Gaa does tons of work with kids in sports and even singing and anyone is welcome in the Gaa but deffo not in niche arts courses

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

Gaa does tons of work with kids in sports and even singing and anyone is welcome in the Gaa but deffo not in niche arts courses

You're digging a hole here chief.

bigpink

Millicent wrote: »

Why are you assigning attributes to people that they aren't displaying? I've already told you I'm working class and currently unemployed, but just because I defend a course, I'm a snob? I'm not sure what sort of complex you have here but it's nothing to do with anyone else who's posting here.

And back out again!

I didnt call you a snob i said there is a snobbish vibe from the defenders of a chanting course
Do you think ud get support for a chanting course from normal working people?
What course are you studying?

krudler

prinz wrote: »

You said it gives enjoyment but no value. Watching GAA in Croke Park gives me enjoyment but it doesn't provide any actual "value".



Not sure what point you are trying to make, but trying to portray a false divide between the 'art people' and 'normal people' is ridiculously snobbish. Same sort of fools who will scoff at people interested in classical music and then bounce around a niteclub at a dance track ripped from a classical track.

Defending money spent on one item =/= automatically defending money spent on everything.

btw I think you are late. They have been playing the didgeridoo down in Limerick for years.

Dammit, late on the bandwagon as always..

Nothing wrong with being into the arts at all, nearly everyone is in some way, be it film or music or whatever, I agree about the classical music snobbery. I used to work in HMV and we were on the same floor as were all the classical/jazz/world etc music was, really opened my eyes (ears?) to different music being surrounded by more eclectic stuff all day.

bigpink

prinz wrote: »

You're digging a hole here chief.

Your the one that made the point about the Gaa,my thread is about chanting keep it on that so

Millicent

bigpink wrote: »

I didnt call you a snob i said there is a snobbish vibe from the defenders of a chanting course
Do you think ud get support for a chanting course from normal working people?
What course are you studying?

How can one not be a snob if there is a snobbish vibe coming from them? That doesn't make any sense.

And since I was a normal working person while studying, yes, I'm more than happy for my taxes to go towards education and the arts. It's not an either/or deal.

I've finished both courses, an undergrad an postgrad. I told you what I degree I had in the second post.

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

I didnt call you a snob i said there is a snobbish vibe from the defenders of a chanting course
Do you think ud get support for a chanting course from normal working people?

We are normal working people. Or do you think I'm sitting here in my tweed jacket with elbow patches and corduroy slacks and a monocle?

bigpink

Well if i asked anyone in my family would they support this i would be laughed out the door
So you think taxpayers should pay for all these niche courses?

prinz

bigpink wrote: »

Your the one that made the point about the Gaa,my thread is about chanting keep it on that so

You're digging a whole because you are contradicting yourself left and right.

Moist Bread

krudler wrote: »

Eh, its a double edged sword, its hard to prioritse one worthy art course over another, espcially in monetary terms, say someone does a filmmaking course and then goes on to make a film here which generates jobs and the like, thats fairly worthwhile. A course in someone learning something which will benefit nobody in any way whatsoever is harder to judge, they may be equally as valid in artistic terms, but in the sense of it being worthwhile to spend money which could be put to better use elsewhere in the economy then its a sticky situation.

I agree with your general sentiment here. The chanting is just part of a music course, someone else posted how it is a fundamental part of music theory (I know little about the subject myself, so I'm just taking their word for it). We can then come back to your point about a film grad. If someone who comes out of this music course makes it big here and generates jobs through music videos, gigs w/e then it would be hard to tell which course has more value?

krudler

*removes monacle discreetly*

bigpink

Millicent wrote: »

How can one not be a snob if there is a snobbish vibe coming from them? That doesn't make any sense.

And since I was a normal working person while studying, yes, I'm more than happy for my taxes to go towards education and the arts. It's not an either/or deal.

I've finished both courses, an undergrad an postgrad. I told you what I degree I had in the second post.

So what you hoping to with your degree,teach?

Millicent

bigpink wrote: »

So what you hoping to with your degree,teach?

Journalism, actually. I finished my degree in the recession so had to do a postgrad but that's the plan anyway.

bigpink

Millicent wrote: »

Journalism, actually. I finished my degree in the recession so had to do a postgrad but that's the plan anyway.

Well journalism you can earn with
How mean your finished in the recession and had to do a postgrad?

Millicent

bigpink wrote: »

Well journalism you can earn with
How mean your finished in the recession and had to do a postgrad?

I had to do the journalism postgrad to get an edge out of college because there were absolutely no jobs available. And if I was a better musician (I'll freely admit I'm not anywhere on a par with a lot of people in my course) I'd be earning right now. Having a niche like Gregorian chant would mean I could specialise too.

bigpink

Come on chanting so no benefit,at least with english you could always teach

krudler

I kinda get what the op is getting at, on one hand, money is wasted on courses and art projects that only a handful of people will appreciate,but on the other, if someone wants to study something then more power to them. If there was a way to fund these things and not let money be prevented from being spent on more worthwhile projects or something that would benefit a lot more students in a particular university then it'd be great, but its six of one half a dozen of the other. You're never going to keep everyone happy, for everyone who thinks learning philosophy is worthwhile, you're find people who think its a joke and you should get a "real" qualification.