England v France: 17/11/2010, Wembley Stadium, KO 20:00, Live ITV1

Insect Overlord

How'd he do that?! :eek:

Great goal.

Beefy78

Mister men wrote: »

Em yes they are. Their players are tactically lost againest any side of quality. England fans will be calling for Capello's head and his replacement to be a good old English manager. Then after a few more years of failure they'll be calling for a more technical international manager again, whilst all the while it's really the players that just are'nt good enough.

There's a lot of truth in what you're saying. England doesn't breed technical footballers because of the way that our kids are trained and coached from Primary School upwards. Until that situation is addressed and kids are taught how to actually play the game rather than how to beat the school down the road England will be also-rans

GOAL!!! Crouchy!!!

Anyway, as I was saying, whilst England aren't Spain or Germany or Italy there's a certain standard that they should be reaching and the current team aren't doing it for whatever reason.

Raskolnikov

I seriously can't believe Jay Bothroyd is getting an England cap.

Raskolnikov

England 9/1 to win Euro 2012.
France 12/1 to win Euro 2012.

Yes please France.

eagle eye

Crouch has some record for England.

I thought Bothroyd looked decent in the short time he got. I'd like to see more of him before I'd make my mind up about him though.

ctrl-alt-delete

eagle eye wrote: »

Crouch has some record for England.

I thought Bothroyd looked decent in the short time he got. I'd like to see more of him before I'd make my mind up about him though.

Did you not see enough of him at Blackburn?

He is doing well for Cardiff, but I think Championship is his level.

eagle eye

ctrl-alt-delete wrote: »

Did you not see enough of him at Blackburn?

He is doing well for Cardiff, but I think Championship is his level.

He had a real bad attitude back then and he didn't look good but you just always knew the talent was there.

Its hard to call whether he can make it in the Premier League now but he has all the necessary attributes to do it now that he is scoring. He has got great pace and good physical strength too. He is good in the air and good with his feet. And from all reports he has matured a lot and is taking his career very seriously now.

I think he could still have a big career, he is 28 and while thats not young he still may have a good 5/6 years left in him.

ctrl-alt-delete

eagle eye wrote: »

He had a real bad attitude back then and he didn't look good but you just always knew the talent was there.

Its hard to call whether he can make it in the Premier League now but he has all the necessary attributes to do it now that he is scoring. He has got great pace and good physical strength too. He is good in the air and good with his feet. And from all reports he has matured a lot and is taking his career very seriously now.

I think he could still have a big career, he is 28 and while thats not young he still may have a good 5/6 years left in him.

Yeah it is true his attitude has changed, I saw an interview with him, basically him acknowledging as much - mainly about his time at Arsenal - but we know that continued on for years after that.

Cardiff might get up this year and we might see,

I suppose i'd like if Blackburn still had him, we could do with one like him right now.

NickDrake

England were awful tonight again. All they did was use the long ball. Terrible football.

How long are we going to have to put up with the media talking up this team??

eagle eye

NickDrake wrote: »

England were awful tonight again. All they did was use the long ball. Terrible football.

How long are we going to have to put up with the media talking up this team??

They had a lot of young or new players out there tonight. You can't base anything on a friendly .

Seaneh

Sky sports lads making excuses tonight "This is a team in transition, there were only a combined 271 caps on the field for england tonight, its understandable they didn't gell".


Italy had a combined 60 caps and an average age of 24.5 years old against Romania, got a Draw and looked pretty good. England just have zero depth in their player pool.

Just for a bit of perspective, Italy's most capped player tonight was Rossi with 18 caps followed by Aqualani with 12 and Mauri with 8 (his last cap before tonight was 5 years ago!).

NickDrake

eagle eye wrote: »

They had a lot of young or new players out there tonight. You can't base anything on a friendly .

I am not basing it on a friendly. They have been awful for a while now. Admit it.

It doesn't matter what players they play, they still play the same awful football.

Their defence was hardly young.

Mister men

Seaneh wrote: »

Sky sports lads making excuses tonight "This is a team in transition, there were only a combined 271 caps on the field for england tonight, its understandable they didn't gell".


Italy had a combined 60 caps and an average age of 24.5 years old against Romania, got a Draw and looked pretty good. England just have zero depth in their player pool.

You get what you deserve for watching sky tbh. Complete BS.

Raskolnikov

Seaneh wrote: »

Sky sports lads making excuses tonight "This is a team in transition, there were only a combined 271 caps on the field for england tonight, its understandable they didn't gell".

Didn't gel? Pathetic. England were played off the park at home by a team that was as equally inexperienced as they were.

eagle eye

NickDrake wrote: »

I am not basing it on a friendly. They have been awful for a while now. Admit it.

It doesn't matter what players they play, they still play the same awful football.

Their defence was hardly young.

The had a very bad World Cup but they looked excellent in qualifying for it.

So exactly how long are you talking about?

Beefy78

NickDrake wrote: »

England were awful tonight again. All they did was use the long ball. Terrible football.

How long are we going to have to put up with the media talking up this team??

When have the media talked up this team recently? A decent qualifying performance for the World Cup aside, England have been woeful since 2004 and the media, certainly in England, haven't been shy about talking about it.

If the England side are over-rated anywhere it's in those ridiculous World Rankings. Trust me, no one back home thinks we're the 6th best side in the World. It's utterly depressing being an England fan right now.

NickDrake

eagle eye wrote: »

The had a very bad World Cup but they looked excellent in qualifying for it.

So exactly how long are you talking about?

All World Cup and destroyed be Germany and their recent games. Isn't that long enough. Dear god ye are terrible. I cannot understand why ye didn't get a new manager. All he did is bring in new players here and there but his system it the exact same.

NickDrake

Beefy78 wrote: »

When have the media talked up this team recently? A decent qualifying performance for the World Cup aside, England have been woeful since 2004 and the media, certainly in England, haven't been shy about talking about it.

If the England side are over-rated anywhere it's in those ridiculous World Rankings. Trust me, no one back home thinks we're the 6th best side in the World. It's utterly depressing being an England fan right now.

The media are ALWAYS talking up England. They were at it today in the English papers and on TV. Saying they would win.

Sure are Gareth Southgate said on the BBC " we would have won the world cup if Frank Lampard's goal had been allowed"

A deluded bbc and a deluded sky

eagle eye

Seaneh wrote: »

Sky sports lads making excuses tonight "This is a team in transition, there were only a combined 271 caps on the field for england tonight, its understandable they didn't gell".


Italy had a combined 60 caps and an average age of 24.5 years old against Romania, got a Draw and looked pretty good. England just have zero depth in their player pool.

Just for a bit of perspective, Italy's most capped player tonight was Rossi with 18 caps followed by Aqualani with 12 and Mauri with 8 (his last cap before tonight was 5 years ago!).

174 of those caps were two players though. If you add in Gareth Barry then its 210 of those caps between 3 of them and 51 between the other 8 starters.

eagle eye

NickDrake wrote: »

All World Cup and destroyed be Germany and their recent games. Isn't that long enough. Dear god ye are terrible. I cannot understand why ye didn't get a new manager. All he did is bring in new players here and there but his system it the exact same.

Whats this ye business? I'm Irish.

Beefy78

NickDrake wrote: »

The media are ALWAYS talking up England. They were at it today in the English papers and on TV. Saying they would win.

Sure are Gareth Southgate said on the BBC " we would have won the world cup if Frank Lampard's goal had been allowed"

A deluded bbc and a deluded sky

I didn't see the build-up as I was making dinner but I'm pretty sure that Southgate didn't say that exactly. Not saying you're lying but perhaps you mis-heard? People in England barely made a big deal about the Lampard 'goal' simply because of how battered we got before and after it.

There's this perception that the media talk up England but pick up any English newspaper or tune into the Sunday Supplement on Sky any week and I doubt any stories about England will be flattering or optimistic.

Ush1

England easily outplayed by continental European team shocker.

ironbluedun

NickDrake wrote: »

A deluded bbc and a deluded sky

a major part of their problem far too much media bullsh1t surrounding the squad....all of them are experts and none of them have a fcuking clue.

everdead.ie

I think Huddlestone should be given a chance in midfield with Lampard and Gerrard behind Rooney Adam Johnson as Rw and I would give Jarvis a try on the left if that failed put johnson left with Lennon or Wallcott RW.

Kess73

everdead.ie wrote: »

I think Huddlestone should be given a chance in midfield with Lampard and Gerrard behind Rooney Adam Johnson as Rw and I would give Jarvis a try on the left if that failed put johnson left with Lennon or Wallcott RW.

Huddlestone is out for another two or three months.

Pepe LeFrits

Huddlestone, Wilshere and Milner would be a decent midfield three by Euro 2012 I reckon!

qwertplaywert

Don't have a clue what Capello was doing playing Jakielka right back, he is no full back in any way.
Team really needs changes. If Ferdinand can stay fit, a Ferdinand/Jakielka partnership [ or Dawson if he gets back to fitness, and ferdinand drops again] at the centre of decent is neccessary[Terry has achieved alot in the game, but its not hard to see he is not the player he was a few years ago].
Gareth Barry should be nowhere near an England squad, at least as a first choice midfielder. Ideally they would have a fully fit Hargreaves back, but since thats unlikely the likes of Huddlestone and Parker should be given their chance.
Jarvis has done very well this season, deserves a go on the left wing, Milner on the other.
Upfront,they have no real exciting options. Aghbonlour could be a good player if he continues to develop, but he is far too injury prone. Defoe is proven at this level, but seems to go missing in games at times. Rooneys just a mess at the minute but I don't tihnk anyone could bet against him getting back to his best. Crouch is not the greatest player in the world, and not a real option for starting, but he will give defenders trouble when he comes off the bench. Caroll could become a real star, or become the new Barton. Booythroyd is a talended lad, but really needs to prove it in the premiership before even being considered international worthy. Carlton Cole wouldn't deserve to be on the first team for a league 2 club.

Bounty Hunter

qwertplaywert wrote: »

Aghbonlour could be a good player if he continues to develop, but he is far too injury prone.

The Injury Gabby has just returned from is the only big chunk of time i can remember him missing since breaking into Villas first team tbh apart from the occasional 1 or 2 game absence.

tbh in the short term if England were free of injuries i think they could do alright but it will take time to integrate the players who are still developing in many cases that england need to play their system to a top international standard. Players like Huddlestone, Wilshire and maybe even Caroll could shape Englands future if they continue to improve at the current speed.

Overall England like Ireland need an overhaul of grass roots level football but focussing soley on the emerging english first team baring injuries they do have options, if they are willing to accept change.

Even gradual change could see an improvment for england imo, near future team:

....................................Hart

G.Johnson..........J.Terry..........R.Ferdinand........A.Cole

.............................................T.Huddlestone
...............................S.Gerrard

T.Walcott...............................................A.Johnson
..................................Rooney
.............................................Caroll

Subs: Green, Gibbs, Jagielka, Milner, Wilshere, Lampard, Defoe, Gabby

Backup: Foster, Dawson, Richards, Parker, Lennon, Bent


no matter what the problems at grass routes etc that 25man squad should be technically good enough to not be produce football that results in them getting boo'd

Beefy78

qwertplaywert wrote: »

Crouch is not the greatest player in the world, and not a real option for starting, but he will give defenders trouble when he comes off the bench.

I think it's getting to the point now where Crouchy needs to be considered for a starting position. His goalscoring record is brilliant and has been for five years now. He's only five goals away from breaking into the top ten England goalscorers ever despite winning most of his 42 caps from the bench.

The problem with playing him is the lack of discipline of the players behind him who just hoof the ball forward even more than usual whenever he's on the pitch.

everdead.ie

Kess73 wrote: »

Huddlestone is out for another two or three months.

I know but when fit he rarely gets picked for the squad and when he does he doesn't play anyway