An Garda Siochana - Do you respect them?

flanum

no

Bosco boy

johnn wrote: »

Let's be honest here....we all hate them cause they took our CANS off us in the field when we were younger.

I've learned to like Dutch gold, but it's taken time!

pah

In relation to the student protests, the Gardaí stood there ground for a very long time and let the protest happen. When things started to get a bit wild a decision would have been made by a senior officer and the crowd would be informed over the loudspeaker to leave the area under the public order act.

Now at this stage, whether you're throwing something, running into riot shields or sitting on the floor it's time to go. When the public order unit are given the order to clear the street, they will clear the street. Gardai have the power to use force in this situation whether you're sitting lying or standing.

Anyone who doesn't move is a fool. Just because it's a group of peaceful protesters, that does not give them the right to ignore the law and ignore legal directions under the public order act to leave the area in a peaceful manner.


Have a read of this thread
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056083024

pah

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Not a shred of respect for 99% of them.
"To self-serve and self-protect" should be the Garda motto. It's true that most people seem to think they're OK... until they have some dealings with them. Then you'll find the real story.

So to go back to one of your first posts in this thread Dan_Solo, what dealings have you had? Tell us the "real story"

laugh

I respect the law and the organisation in general and each Guard I meet earns or loses it.

Banjaxed82

I find the the traffic cops on the motorbikes love themselves a bit too much.

pah

pah wrote: »

Anyone who doesn't move is a fool. Just because it's a group of peaceful protesters, that does not give them the right to ignore the law and ignore legal directions under the public order act to leave the area in a peaceful manner.

ah cop yourself on, Gardai are to use force that is equivalent to the threat facing them. People sitting on the ground should of been dragged away and arrested (this was done correctly in some cases) but hitting people on the head with the baton is not on. Gardai have a standing order not to hit people on the head with the baton its simply too dangerous. There is a distinction between arresting someone and beating them up. We dont want any thugs in the police force.

See how the farmers who occupied the Department of Finance lobby were left there while the Gardai got a court order to make them leave while the students were treated very differently.

MagicSean

Dan_Solo wrote: »

I clearly have what clearly?
Do you have any examples of battery (that is what an assault that causes injury is called, yes?) on a Garda by an adult that were resolved with a fine and no criminal record?

Now you're just being childish. So I used the same word twice. If that is the extent of your debating skills you should head back to college.

I have plenty of examples of Gardaí being injured and noone even going to court. I know one Garda who is missing a tooth from a kick he got to the face. No prosecution was brought against his attacker. I know another who had to wait six months for test results because a junkie tramp bit him. This was the week before his wedding. No prosecution. I know another who had his nose broken. Court imposed a fine. i know another who had blood spit in his face by a guy with hep c. No prosecution. Would you like some more?

Darraghnormal wrote: »

A paticular night out I had about 6 months ago greatly lowered my respect for them.

Id just been laid off from work and was out on the gargle, as ye do, and being annoyed and pissed off at the world, bought a bag of jolly green as well. So everones out havin a good time, pretty drunk,giving out about work and about a hundred "if i was in charge, i tell ye what id do" conversations, back to a party in artane, everyones happy.
I left the session at about 3 in the morning, walking through artane and the guards drove by and got out. Asked me had i been drinking, which i clearly had been, told them yes, showed them ID and my work card, told them what happened that day and that i was just heading home. Then they asked me could they search me, when I asked them why they said i must have something to hide, and said tell them if i had anything on me i shouldnt have i better tell them now. So i but my hands in my pocket, and took out the bag of green i had, which wasnt much, cuffed, back to station, stripped and left in a freezing cell for 2 hours.

All for about 2 g's of green?

Respect has plummetted since then.

So not only did where they polite but they did their job too? The bastards. Would you have felt less hard done by if you had heroine on you?

johnn wrote: »

No Respect for the Filth,.

This phrase tells me more about you then anything else. Only one kind of person uses that term.

Deleted User wrote: »

ah cop yourself on, Gardai are to use force that is equivalent to the threat facing them. People sitting on the ground should of been dragged away and arrested (this was done correctly in some cases) but hitting people on the head with the baton is not on. Gardai have a standing order not to hit people on the head with the baton its simply too dangerous. There is a distinction between arresting someone and beating them up. We dont want any thugs in the police force.

See how the farmers who occupied the Department of Finance lobby were left there while the Gardai got a court order to make them leave while the students were treated very differently.

Perhaps it was because the farmers didn't attack them. Can we not leave the protest arguments to the numerous threads already in existence where it has been done to death.

pah

pah wrote: »

In relation to the student protests, the Gardaí stood there ground for a very long time and let the protest happen. When things started to get a bit wild a decision would have been made by a senior officer and the crowd would be informed over the loudspeaker to leave the area under the public order act.

Now at this stage, whether you're throwing something, running into riot shields or sitting on the floor it's time to go. When the public order unit are given the order to clear the street, they will clear the street. Gardai have the power to use force in this situation whether you're sitting lying or standing.

Anyone who doesn't move is a fool. Just because it's a group of peaceful protesters, that does not give them the right to ignore the law and ignore legal directions under the public order act to leave the area in a peaceful manner.


Have a read of this thread
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056083024

I happened to witness this complete lout on a megaphone abusing the Garda on horses.

They were very calm cause I have to say even walking by I wanted to split the braindead cúnt clean open with a very large brick. He was nothing short of a smelly, mouthy (apologies) culchie bastárd. May have had a naggin on the bus on the way up to Dublin.

I still disagree that they should use any force necessary when clearing an area. Sufficient defense is a case if you decide to bate the head off someone after they hit you once, so the Garda are above the law, clearly.

cursai

Loike i can't believe it loike! Da Goirds are such woinkers!
WHOS STREETS.....OUR STREETS......wheres moi Da Loike!!!

pah

Jay D wrote: »

I still disagree that they should use any force necessary when clearing an area. Sufficient defense is a case if you decide to bate the head off someone after they hit you once, so the Garda are above the law, clearly.

Force should be reasonable, proportionate and neccessary. For the most part it seems to have been. If there were members of the gardaí that acted above the law and it can be proven, then I do believe that this should be fully investifated by the ombudsman.

pah

pah wrote: »

Force should be reasonable, proportionate and neccessary. For the most part it seems to have been. If there were members of the gardaí that acted above the law and it can be proven, then I do believe that this should be fully investifated by the ombudsman.

Sorry I worded my post wrong, I meant I disagree they should use excessive force, which in fairness was clearly used on some.

I'm still skeptical of any sort of justice for police brutality here. Camera evidence is pretty concrete I would have thought.

pah

Jay D wrote: »

Sorry I worded my post wrong, I meant I disagree they should use excessive force, which in fairness was clearly used on some.

I'm still skeptical of any sort of justice for police brutality here. Camera evidence is pretty concrete I would have thought.

Well at least we have the ombudsman who is impartial in these matters and will not hesitate to initiate a prosecution against a Garda if the evidence is there.

HarryPotter41

El Horseboxo wrote: »

Why do a lot of people think that you only deal with the guards when breaking the law?

In the Finglas station even asking for a passport form is a fúcking effort and they look quite pissed off that they had to get up and walk to the hatch and then pick up a piece of paper.

Generally forms are in a rack in the public office for people to pick up without going to the desk, maybe thats why?

ShadowGal

Banjaxed82 wrote: »

I find the the traffic cops on the motorbikes love themselves a bit too much.

chips

HarryPotter41

TrollHammaren wrote: »

Likewise, I'm not going to vote because it's not really a fair question. Gardaí definitely do get my respect by default, and absolutely get my courtesy. I've called the Gardaí quite a few times, and most of the time the help I got was exceptional to the point that I sent a letter of thanks to their station.

There are definitely some dickheads, I'm not going to deny that. I've never been caught breaking the law, but a few times I was unfairly suspected of doing so. Most of the time they were grand, but a few times they were quite aggressive, discourteous, and displaying very poor social skills.

As an institution that employs humans, you're always going to get dickheads; it's just a fact. You could argue that a better recruitment system is needed to weed out the power-trippers, aggressors, and people with caveman social skills, but I don't know enough about it and don't want to sound like just another opinionated, ignorant member of the public.

For now, I'll commend the work of those who truly do a good job. When I deal with a Garda, I'm automatically going to be courteous, just like I would with a cashier at McDonalds, and if I have to deal with a bad one, I'll be sure report them, rather than berate them on boards.

Exactly the route to go, contact the district office and let the Superintendent know how unhappy you are with dealings, instead og moaning about it. No Superintendent wants bad eggs in his basket so to speak and they would be dealt with quickly.

johnnyrotten

Nothing to see here, move along now...

Kev_ps3

Why wouldn't you respect them? They do a very tough job and are not payed enormous amounts of money for it.

pah

Kev_ps3 wrote: »

Why wouldn't you respect them? They do a very tough job and are not payed enormous amounts of money for it.

I agree but you'll find entire threads here arguing gardai are way overpaid

steddyeddy

K-9 wrote: »

They generally don't in riot situations.

The focus isn't on arrests as you admitted earlier.

And we're back at the naivety point.

yes you seem to be hitting it again and again and basically in a riot situation generally people are going to be attacking the gaurds. no gaurd can remember being attacked so in fairness riot doesnt describe the situation does it. So the students who didnt attack the gaurds were navie not to have been expecting a gaurd to attack them? I suppose the students sitting on the ground was naive not to expect a gaurd to hit him on the head with a baton when he was sitting down.

steddyeddy

K-9 wrote: »

The guys causing the trouble ran into the crowd, sitting down having the peaceful protest, big men that they are.

Classic tactics, the last refuge of the scoundrel.

sitting down peacefully is the last refuse of the scoundrel? Yet the problem you have is that they thought they were big men sitting down at a protest instead of attacking people ect?

If their big men sitting down on the ground what does that make the gaurd that attacked the man sitting down?

Dan_Solo

pah wrote: »

So to go back to one of your first posts in this thread Dan_Solo, what dealings have you had? Tell us the "real story"

Er, I already did. About as good at gathering evidence as can be expected I suppose.
I was invited by a cop once, when I witnessed a bouncer attacking a patron, to make a statement the following morning at the station. When I asked him what his name was so I could say which Garda I had reported the incident to?
"Why don't you go and **** off"
That's the "real story" of An Garda Siochana.

Dan_Solo

HarryPotter41 wrote: »

Exactly the route to go, contact the district office and let the Superintendent know how unhappy you are with dealings, instead og moaning about it. No Superintendent wants bad eggs in his basket so to speak and they would be dealt with quickly.

Would you ever haddaway and? You expect a garda to get a telling off over being a jerk at front desk? We all know it'll be a case of "guess the date" on the report form so it can get thrown out.

MagicSean

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Er, I already did. About as good at gathering evidence as can be expected I suppose.
I was invited by a cop once, when I witnessed a bouncer attacking a patron, to make a statement the following morning at the station. When I asked him what his name was so I could say which Garda I had reported the incident to?
"Why don't you go and **** off"
That's the "real story" of An Garda Siochana.

And did the person who was attacked not complain about the Garda?

MagicSean

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Would you ever haddaway and? You expect a garda to get a telling off over being a jerk at front desk? We all know it'll be a case of "guess the date" on the report form so it can get thrown out.

Gardai get a telling off for much less. If you don't bother reporting these cases how do you expect them to be addressed.

K-9

steddyeddy wrote: »

sitting down peacefully is the last refuse of the scoundrel? Yet the problem you have is that they thought they were big men sitting down at a protest instead of attacking people ect?

If their big men sitting down on the ground what does that make the gaurd that attacked the man sitting down?

I didn't say that at all.

K-9 wrote:

The guys causing the trouble ran into the crowd, sitting down having the peaceful protest, big men that they are.

Classic tactics, the last refuge of the scoundrel.

You must have missed that part.

Dan_Solo

K-9 wrote: »

You must have missed that part.

And we must have all missed the part where you told us why they didn't bother to just arrest the lone troublemaker and instead started battering peaceful protesters.
Are cops so thick that they can't spot a guy who attacks them and wanders over a few yards and sits down?

Bosco boy

Dan_Solo wrote: »

And we must have all missed the part where you told us why they didn't bother to just arrest the lone troublemaker and instead started battering peaceful protesters.
Are cops so thick that they can't spot a guy who attacks them and wanders over a few yards and sits down?

Can't tell you that dan for operational reasons, but we never forget a face!

Dan_Solo

Bosco boy wrote: »

Can't tell you that dan for operational reasons, but we never forget a face!

Really? On the basis of Robocop, it seems Gardai can't even identify other Gardai they work with every day of the week.

amacachi

pah wrote: »

Well at least we have the ombudsman who is impartial in these matters and will not hesitate to initiate a prosecution against a Garda if the evidence is there.

LOL.

afc4ever

Big ups to all the GUARDS for the job they do, regardless of what your opinion is they put their lives on the line everyday to protect us and rid the streets of scum. maybe all the guards could make a public apology to the nation for being human and having feelings and emotions or maybe all the people with no respect for them could sign up to the guards and do a better job and be able to put their emotions aside everyday?? RESPECT is earned not given the guards earn it everyday that they put their lives on the line for our families and friends !!!!

MagicSean

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Really? On the basis of Robocop, it seems Gardai can't even identify other Gardai they work with every day of the week.

Is your entire knowledge of the gardai supplied by tabloids. I notice you have a tendency to ignore facts or questions which don't fit your viewpoint. Do you work for the media by any chance.

Any idiot could easily understand why you do not try and arrest someone from a violent crowd when you are outnumbered. If you can't understand it then god help you. If you want to keep referring to 2002 maybe you should learn some new facts. The majority of gardai on the frontlines have 5 years or less service. Since 2002 there has probably been 30% turnover in gardai. Since 2002 there has been massive training put into specialised public order units. The riot police are in no way comparable to the gardai in 2002.

baltimore sun

I love when people type in capital letters, it makes the point even clearer than it would've been without them :rolleyes:

I've had good and bad experiences with the gaurds, like someone said a few pages back, they're just people so obviously there's gonna be a few dicks in there, but show me any job where people have to wear a uniform that doesn't have an amount of douchebags

bnt

baltimore sun wrote: »

I've had good and bad experiences with the gaurds, like someone said a few pages back, they're just people so obviously there's gonna be a few dicks in there, but show me any job where people have to wear a uniform that doesn't have an amount of douchebags

Sure, but what are the odds? In my experience with police forces in a few countries (not as a "customer") the uniform itself attracts douchebags. You cease to be a "member of the public" when you put on the uniform: you rise "above" the masses: it's a profession in which you appear to get to lord it over people.

Note that I said appear, since I know the reality of life in the service can be very different once you gain experience. Neither am I saying that all aspiring Garda are dicks. I am saying that the odds of dick-hood are higher than the odds for the general public, due to the basically authoritarian nature of the position.

Bosco boy

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Really? On the basis of Robocop, it seems Gardai can't even identify other Gardai they work with every day of the week.

If you only you had the brains to get in we might have a good pair of eyes!

PrivateEye

While you work, they cut your wages.

I've family in the fire service, and respect people willing to work on the frontlines, but the actions of the Gardaí in recession-Ireland have been very hard to stomach. The cheek of the GRA to march through Dublin after more or less working as a security company for Shell/Statoil during the handover of our gas? Too much for me.

What we (students) were given on November third was a message to everyone else. It comes from well above the poor eejits on the streets with the batons however. They're going to be used as a security company once more.

Folks, remember on Budget Day who will be there to protect Fianna Fail, the Greens, the bankers and the rich on the streets. It will be the very people they are hitting hardest. It's actually tragic.

Bosco boy

PrivateEye wrote: »

While you work, they cut your wages.

I've family in the fire service, and respect people willing to work on the frontlines, but the actions of the Gardaí in recession-Ireland have been very hard to stomach. The cheek of the GRA to march through Dublin after more or less working as a security company for Shell/Statoil during the handover of our gas? Too much for me.

What we (students) were given on November third was a message to everyone else. It comes from well above the poor eejits on the streets with the batons however. They're going to be used as a security company once more.

Folks, remember on Budget Day who will be there to protect Fianna Fail, the Greens, the bankers and the rich on the streets. It will be the very people they are hitting hardest. It's actually tragic.

The november 3rd message you talk of was that some of the current crop of students are spoilt Celtic tiger cubs who had everything on a plate for them, reality check guys, we're all going to have to chip in to pay for this mess, any sympathy I had is now gone, you had the chance to give a message to the government but you ended up looking like dickheads with cans of Dutch gold in your hands, I pity the decent students, Education fees should be means tested and let the tiger cubs pay first!!!!!!

johnn

afc4ever wrote: »

regardless of what your opinion is they put their lives on the line everyday to protect us

Yeah right standing at the top of O'Connell street suffering the occasional heckling from a junkie, really life threatening. Did a Garda start this thread looking for a pat on the back?

Dan_Solo

Bosco boy wrote: »

If you only you had the brains to get in we might have a good pair of eyes!

If that made an ounce of sense it might even constitute personal abuse.
I imagine I'm among the higher end of the 99% of the Irish population who are eligible to join the Gardai by virtue of well, passing the Leaving Cert in any way shape or form. If only I had the brains? It would appear I'm at least ten times smarter that the basic requirement for being a cop.

Bosco boy

johnn wrote: »

Yeah right standing at the top of O'Connell street suffering the occasional heckling from a junkie, really life threatening. Did a Garda start this thread looking for a pat on the back?

Is that what every garda does, at least i now know where to go for my next tour of duty, shows what a narrow mind you must have!

johnn

Bosco boy wrote: »

Is that what every garda does, at least i now know where to go for my next tour of duty, shows what a narrow mind you must have!

My mind is as wide as the grand canyon, i don't go around giving credit where it ain't due.

Dan_Solo

k_mac wrote: »

Is your entire knowledge of the gardai supplied by tabloids. I notice you have a tendency to ignore facts or questions which don't fit your viewpoint. Do you work for the media by any chance.

Let's face it, if you had any evidence of this you'd be able to quote it.
Coppers making up allegations with no evidence? Sound familiar anybody?

johnn

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Coppers? Sound familiar anybody?

Yeah its a nightclub on Harcourt st. I think mate

pah

johnn wrote: »

Yeah right standing at the top of O'Connell street suffering the occasional heckling from a junkie, really life threatening. Did a Garda start this thread looking for a pat on the back?

Not every Garda has to stand around at the top of O Connell street, just as not every Garda gets blown off their traffic bike with a sawn-off or has to put the door in at a house to discover a child double murder.

At least have some respect for the job that has to be done if not for individuals that you recall seeing or dealing with off the top of your head.

MagicSean

johnn wrote: »

Yeah right standing at the top of O'Connell street suffering the occasional heckling from a junkie, really life threatening. Did a Garda start this thread looking for a pat on the back?

Have you ever taken on a junkie?

Dan_Solo wrote: »

If that made an ounce of sense it might even constitute personal abuse.
I imagine I'm among the higher end of the 99% of the Irish population who are eligible to join the Gardai by virtue of well, passing the Leaving Cert in any way shape or form. If only I had the brains? It would appear I'm at least ten times smarter that the basic requirement for being a cop.

At least you are modest.

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Let's face it, if you had any evidence of this you'd be able to quote it.
Coppers making up allegations with no evidence? Sound familiar anybody?

All you have to do is read back my posts. You asked about gardaí who were injured and I gave you a list which you forgot. I asked if you had ever made a complaint and you ignored it. There's a few more if you can take the time out of your hectic education schedule to read the posts.

angelfire9

My husband had a malicious complaint made against him by a woman who's son he arrested
She accused him of assaulting her the day following the arrest while Gardai were executing a search warrant on their house
The ombudsman was notified and it could have spelt disaster for him but for the small fact that he wasn't even on duty at the time of the alleged incident :cool:

johnnyrotten

johnn wrote: »

Yeah right standing at the top of O'Connell street suffering the occasional heckling from a junkie, really life threatening. Did a Garda start this thread looking for a pat on the back?

Ridiculous post of the day !:rolleyes:

Dan_Solo

k_mac wrote: »

At least you are modest.

Whatever. Doesn't change the facts.

k_mac wrote: »

All you have to do is read back my posts. You asked about gardaí who were injured and I gave you a list which you forgot. I asked if you had ever made a complaint and you ignored it. There's a few more if you can take the time out of your hectic education schedule to read the posts.

Nah, I've already completed a proper education. You should try it.
Your list of anecdotes wasn't backed by a single source. You may be used to assuming people will believe you because you said so, but you'll have to try a bit harder around here.
As to making a complaint about the Gardai, I already gave you a link a judicial report that stated that the Gardai are almost to a man dodgy. They simply will not co-operate with any complaint made against a fellow cop.
I'm far too smart to bother complaining about dodgy cops to other dodgy cops, thanks.

angelfire9

Dan_Solo wrote: »

I already gave you a link a judicial report that stated that the Gardai are almost to a man dodgy. They simply will not co-operate with any complaint made against a fellow cop.
I'm far too smart to bother complaining about dodgy cops to other dodgy cops, thanks.

I find this post offensive
With the exception of those muppets in Donegal most Gardai I know would co-operate with the investigation of a genuine complaint against another cop

Then again I actually KNOW the Gardai i have spent my entire life around cops

steddyeddy

Well guys how about a new line of thinking, did you think that the heavy handed tactics of the garda towards protesters tonight were justified?