Should TG4 be closed down in the 2011 budget?

wow sierra

tRANSLATION: Tá TG4 ar fheabhas agus tá sé de dhíth sa saol atá inniu ann. Tá sé i bhfad níos fearr ná bheith ag éisteacht leis na magairlí asail ar Frontline srl.= TG4 is excellent and it is necessary in todays world. It is much better than listening to the asses bol**x on Frontline etc.

I would never use the language to exclude anyone if that is what people think. I think minority languages and minority cultures add greatly to the quality of life in an increasingly globalised world. There are many Irish people from the Gaeltacht for whom English is very much their second language, and even the most educated of them , will say that they are not very comfortable expressing themselves in English. There is much more to this than a hobby of fanatics.

Capt'n Midnight

RTE2 was setup to show foreign programs, we need something like that to keep the revenue in the state. IIRC UTV gets 30% of it's advertising revenue from down here.

TG4 consistently punching above it's weight. Not all of it's programs are for everyone. Unlike a lot of other channels it isn't mostly lowest common denominator stuff. As others have posted they show better series and films than the other Irish channels, though some of the world cinema stuff on RTE2 can be quite good if rare. ( I'm still shocked that TV3 showed Run Lola Run ! )

There is no reason for TV3 other than to take advertising revenue from other stations, nothing they show would be out of place on UTV or RTE2.


TG4 could probably be paid for if RTE 1's top "celebs" got benchmarked relative to similar sized operations in the UK. I think we can take the risk that they would get poached by the UK channels. If they get poached they'll send money home

If you don't like it , don't watch it. If you want to complain about the cost, it's less than the eVoting machines. It would only get you a few meters of Luas.

Minstrel27

AnneElizabeth wrote: »

Let it die along with everything else Irish-language related.

Narrow minded nonsense from you.

Minstrel27

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

3e of course!!

You do know who owns 3e?

starbelgrade

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If you don't like it , don't watch it. If you want to complain about the cost, it's less than the eVoting machines. It would only get you a few meters of Luas.

You make some good points, but your argument falls flat there. Most of the country did not ask for eVoting machines or the Luas, so it is still worth asking the question of "is it worth funding TV4"?

I can only say that, as I can't even get a signal for it where I live, then my answer would be 'no'.

starbelgrade

Minstrel27 wrote: »

You do know who owns 3e?

Are you trying to score drugs?

I know a man who has at least 50 e's he needs to shift fast.

PeterIanStaker

Minstrel27 wrote: »

You do know who owns 3e?

Tha same ppl dat useta own Channel 6? :P

johnmcdnl

starbelgrade wrote: »

You make some good points, but your argument falls flat there. Most of the country did not ask for eVoting machines or the Luas, so it is still worth asking the question of "is it worth funding TV4"?

I can only say that, as I can't even get a signal for it where I live, then my answer would be 'no'.

I don't use the Luas or any of Ireland's motorways because there too far away from where I live - doesn't mean I go out crying that they cost too much and that I don't think money should be spent of them because I personally amn't able to use them...

maybe they should increase funding so you can get reception - that'd make a lot more sense than taking it away from everyone else who can watch it just because you don't want to spend a wee bit just because you can't...:rolleyes:

randylonghorn

Mike 1972 wrote: »

the same argument can be made to justify just about any area of public spending though.

True to an extent, I accept.

However, most public spending generates jobs in areas where there is at least *some* chance of attracting alternative inward investment, while most direct and indirect employment generated by TG4 is in areas which are (despite often being scenic!) otherwise unattractive to alternative employers for reasons of distance and infrastructure.

By the nature of its remit it produces / buys in a lot of programming produced in this country, certainly a far higher proportion than RTE. It also seems to manage to sell quite a bit of programming on, thus recouping some of its costs, despite what would seem to be the disadvantage of trying to sell programming in the Irish language.

I also pointed out in the same post that in my opinion RTE has given its top staff and stars very generous bonuses and contracts in recent years, and tbh I don't think they're justified.

Not to mention some highly suspect expenditure such as taking a box at Croke Park for the U2 concerts where selected RTE staff shared fingerfood and drinks with 98 privileged guests. The cost for fingerfood and drink alone was more than €60 per guest, apparently. How can that kind of extravagance be justified?

I would foresee TG4 having to tighten its belt still further in the next while, as we will all have to do, nor am I arguing that point ... but I think closing it down would be a mistake.

Personally, I think that if there are to be cuts in funding in the area of national broadcasting, RTE expenditure should be the first to be subjected to close scrutiny.

Capt'n Midnight

starbelgrade wrote: »

You make some good points, but your argument falls flat there. Most of the country did not ask for eVoting machines or the Luas, so it is still worth asking the question of "is it worth funding TV4"?

I can only say that, as I can't even get a signal for it where I live, then my answer would be 'no'.

The point is that not every penny of government spending has to directly benefit everyone, you can't just do lowest common denominator, there has to be balanced funding for stuff other than majority interests. Off topic does a significant amount of lotto money that go to elite places like golf clubs ??

I could have mentioned the Western Rail Corridor

Signal may get better when we go Digital Terresterial, but when the Europeans launch the new satellite we will have a spot beam for the whole island and so you should be able to pick it up that way. And yes TG4 have wider coverage than TV3

High energy

What in the flying f**k do they need €36 million a year for?

entropi

leave TG4, banish RTE/TV3 and CH6....giving ud news we dont want nor have to hear!

State sponsored news will always be biased anyway!

ArmaniJeanss

High energy wrote: »

What in the flying f**k do they need €36 million a year for?

Mainly for dubbing old episodes of Scooby Doo.

Yakult

I hate when Im flicking through the channels during the day and see south park on, sweet I says and bang...... Its in Irish.

Other than that Im all for it, promote the language!

Im actually jealous of my friends who can speak it so well. Someday I will learn it again.

randylonghorn

High energy wrote: »

What in the flying f**k do they need €36 million a year for?

What did RTE do with €375 million in 2009 (apart from run a deficit)?

Oh wait ... one thing they did was pay Director-General Cathal Goan a €46,000 performance bonus, bringing his overall earnings (including pension contributions) to €394,000 for that year.

Anyone else getting a sense of deja-vu?

GizAGoOfYerGee

High energy wrote: »

What in the flying f**k do they need €36 million a year for?

What the flying feck to Anglo Irish Bank need THIRTY THOUSAND MILLION Euro for? A black hole.

TG4 have produced first class content with their measly €33m. That is what it costs to run a TV station.

Yet you still moan and piss on about it.

Get real :rolleyes:

Cunning Alias

I can barely understand it (yes im ashamed), but im happy that it exists and I don't want it to disappear.

Why not cut the stupidly high wages of the rte celebs. €1 million for Tubridy. Really???

GisforGrenade

Really wish you could specify what your license fee funds, I would split the 160 euro equally between TG4 and Lyric FM. TG4 is the best of the four terrestrial channels, the rest are just woeful.

Kev_ps3

I suggest we end the bank guarantee and increase tg4s money

Venom

RTE, TV3 and TG4 should each get 1/3 of the licence fee and not a penny more from public finances. The millions RTE wastes in paying its so called "top people" from a fund the public have no choice but to pay due to the law really is an outrage.

Level the playing field for all the various media outlets supported by public funds and let them sink or swim on the quality they produce just like every other business in the country.

gbee

Yes, I've support this.

We proabbly still have more native polish speakers in Ireland than native Irish speakers, we certainly did in our recent past.

And on a safety note, get ride of those stupid dual language road signs too, rather don't get ride of them just stop making them.

Stop hundreds of thousands of leaflets and booklets being translated into Irish too, total nonessential and a waste of money even for those good time days.

In the Irish forum one will find where €300,000 was spent on some Government document to translate into Irish ad ONE, one solitary copy was purchased.

Irish nonessential.

Mike 1972

Venom wrote: »

RTE, TV3 and TG4 should each get 1/3 of the licence fee.

TV3 should get the same as RTE 1 & 2 combined :eek:

Why should TV3 get the steam off our p1$$ theyre a private business for crysakes ?

dmm1000

AnneElizabeth wrote: »

Let it die along with everything else Irish-language related.

disgustingly inappropriate comment - and sad especially (if) you are an Irish person

storm2811

TG4 is far better than RTE imo, and miles better than TV3!
They have some fantastic documentaries, their take on reeling in the years is very good and they had a documentary series a while ago about each person who signed the Proclamation of the Irish Republic in 1916, it was fantastic I thought.

Ros na Run isn't bad either, doesn't have the same cliched plotlines as Eastenders and Corry, and it makes me laugh too.

They get great films too, just a few weeks ago there was Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas & Thirteen.

If anything, TV3 should be scrapped completely, just replaying ITV's terrible shows while failing to make their own stuff too, the only thing I watch on TV3 is Ireland AM & sometimes Midday.

twinQuins

dmm1000 wrote: »

disgustingly inappropriate comment - and sad especially (if) you are an Irish person

I'm Irish and I find it neither disgusting nor inappropriate but in fact relevant. What I do find disgusting is the fanaticism of some speakers as well as the sneering tone of "a real Irish person would support it".

On topic: I don't particularly care what happens to it. While I understand the need for public broadcasting to cater to a wide range of interests (including the niche), I have to wonder just how far that should extend.

mikemac

TG4 is a model that RTÉ would do well to learn from.
They have a small budget and punch well above their weight.

If you're looking for cuts OP, RTÉ is where you go
Marion Finuance on 500k for four hours of radio a week
Slash those salaries, like where is she going to go to?
Joe Duffy on 400k but Philip Boucher Hayes did a great job filling in. Give him 100k and get rid of Joe

I'd be giving the TG4 managers a bonus and ship them over to RTÉ.
Edit: Mike 1972 explained it better on page 1. Do that!

Dostoevsky

Sardonicat wrote: »

[/B]
Thanks for posting in a language I don't understand. Appreciate that.

You're on an Irish website, used by Irish people who understand Irish (shock, horror), so get over it. Perish the thought that Irish people could be allowed to write in Irish as well as English on Boards.ie. The intolerance is breathtaking.

Dostoevsky

Morkarleth wrote: »

What I do find disgusting is the fanaticism of some speakers as well as the sneering tone of "a real Irish person would support it".

And thank God we don't have innumerable examples of the fanaticism of some English speakers in Ireland such as "How dare Irish be used on an Irish website!" "Who do these Irish people think they are having a station which broadcasts in Irish?" "They should all change to English like us, the real representatives of modern, progressive Ireland"

...

Sir Oxman

Sardonicat wrote: »

The subject of the thread is TG4.

The majority language of this country is English. By a million miles, whatever it states in the constitution and whatever aspirations were held by some fascistic blokes at the turn of the century, English is the predominate language spoken here. All Irish people can understand English, so do us the courtesy of posting in that language we all understand on a forum that is not designated for Irish speakers, or at the very least, a translation.

Despite 12 years of school here I came out with more French than Irish. I lay the blame for that firmly at the door of the policy makers who decided how to teach it. A sizeable number of Irish people really do not care if no-one speaks it or not. I am not one of them, but God, do I hate the language fascists.

Use Google Translate - it takes two seconds:

"TG4 is excellent and it is needed in the modern world. It is much better than listening to the donkey testicles on Frontline etc."

Dostoevsky

starbelgrade wrote: »

Sovereignty means that a territory has complete independant authority over its own jurisdiction.

If that's your definition of sovereignty then no country in the developed world, if not the entire world, has "sovereignty".

Dostoevsky

OPENROAD wrote: »

Genuine question here would you be willing to pay a bit extra for it, in terms of licence fee?

I would, certainly. Would monoglot English speakers be willing to pay extra for the far greater number of TV shows available in their chosen language?

At any rate, TV is so last century. TG4 is refreshingly different with more diversity, more beautiful women, superb documentaries and some of the best continental films. It's much better value for money, as well.

Mike 1972

Dostoevsky wrote: »

Would monoglot English speakers be willing to pay extra for the far greater number of TV shows available in their chosen language?

$ky/UPC/etc seem to think they are

Dostoevsky

gbee wrote: »

get ride of those stupid dual language road signs too, rather don't get ride of them just stop making them.

:rolleyes: Now that's English language fanaticism in action. The intolerance and insecurity underlying it is cringe-worthy.

Dostoevsky

Mike 1972 wrote: »

$ky/UPC/etc seem to think they are

They aren't paid for by the licence fee, which was the poster's question: would people pay more in their licence fee for Irish language programmes/support for TG4. I would. Would people pay more for their TV licence for the far greater number of English language programmes which are funded by the licence fee on RTÉ 1 and RTÉ 2?

Mardy Bum

It would be a shame to see it go.

People only realise the value of having their own cultural identity when its gone.

twinQuins

Dostoevsky wrote: »

And thank God we don't have innumerable examples of the fanaticism of some English speakers in Ireland such as "How dare Irish be used on an Irish website!"

A privately owned website, I might remind you. There's an Irish language forum for those who wish to converse in it, doing so outside it is pure ignorance and a childish sticking the tongue out to those who don't speak it.

Just because you can do something doesn't always mean you should.

Mardy Bum wrote: »

People only realise the value of having their own cultural identity when its gone.

This is something I don't get: Irish is not part of my (and I'm sure many others) cultural identity. Don't presume to speak for me.

Dostoevsky

Mardy Bum wrote: »

It would be a shame to see it go.

People only realise the value of having their own cultural identity when its gone.

Isn't that the truth.

Clarehobo

TG4 is vastly superior to RTE 1 & 2 and it is the polar opposite of TV3.

Brilliant documentaries, brilliant commissioned programmes, the top shows from across the pond and brilliant movies as well.

For example, they did Hector i Meiriceá Theas years before Charlie Bird did his Amazon trip. Check out the difference in reaction between the guys when they were offered the tree sap that is a basis for Milk of Magnesia. Says it all really.

Reading the subtitles could help improve some peoples English here as well as their Irish;)

Keep them going on the budget they have.

Dostoevsky

Morkarleth wrote: »

A privately owned website, I might remind you. There's an Irish language forum for those who wish to converse in it, doing so outside it is pure ignorance and a childish sticking the tongue out to those who don't speak it.

Just because you can do something doesn't always mean you should.

A privately-owned commercial website, which is Irish and depends largely on Irish people - a majority of whom are very positive towards the Irish language, oddly enough.
That somebody wants the Irish language to be sent off to the online equivalent of a native American reservation says more about the mentality of that person.

Usually when I come across something on this website that I don't understand/am not interested in I move on. I don't make a big issue out of it and intolerantly demand the removal of it so that the website is brought down to my level of ignorance. :rolleyes:

twinQuins

Dostoevsky wrote: »

A privately-owned commercial website, which is Irish and depends largely on Irish people - a majority of whom are very positive towards the Irish language, oddly enough.

You're missing my point - just because the website is Irish owned does not mean one has to speak or even allow the speaking of Irish on it. The owners can decide that.

That somebody wants the Irish language to be sent off to the online equivalent of a native American reservation says more about the mentality of that person.

What I want (though thanks for putting words in my mouth) is of no consequence, there is a sub-forum of AH for people who want to post in Irish, that is the reality.
Also, you may want to drop the persecution complex, it's juvenile and belittles your position.

Usually when I come across something on this website that I don't understand/am not interested in I move on.

But the person who was addressed in Irish is interested in this topic and to reply to them in a language they don't speak is nothing short of ignorant.

I don't make a big issue out of it and intolerantly demand the removal of it so that the website is brought down to my level of ignorance. :rolleyes:

Ignorance? Really? I find your attitude impudent and ignorant. The implication that if someone can't speak Irish they're ignorant really says a lot about you.

Do you really think that being this melodramatic is doing anything for your argument?

Mardy Bum

Morkarleth wrote: »

This is something I don't get: Irish is not part of my (and I'm sure many others) cultural identity. Don't presume to speak for me.

I am not speaking for you, I am speaking generally and I am not just talking about cultural identity in relation to language alone but taking into account all its other aspects.

TG4, as well as promoting language, promotes Irish culture which can be seen in its programming schedule and it also brings in American shows to increase viewer numbers.

Culture in the country is dying though so maybe it should be cut. Buy in ABC sure.

Mike 1972

Morkarleth wrote: »

A privately owned website, I might remind you. There's an Irish language forum for those who wish to converse in it, doing so outside it is pure ignorance and a childish sticking the tongue out to those who don't speak it.

You and I would be considered pretty rude were we to go barging into said forun speaking English. If we kept it up we would probabably (and quite deservedly) get a sitewide ban.

twinQuins

In fairness, it was only one post but it's unfair to assume the person being addressed speaks that language. However, considering the nature of this thread it leaves little room for speculation as to the purpose: to antagonise.

Krusader

GizAGoOfYerGee wrote: »

The answer is simple: All public schools in Ireland should be Gaelscoils by 2060!

Not at all, magority of schools should be bilingual, that is more of a realistic prospect and would appease many on both sides,

As regards TG4, it is a cracking little station that shows great documentaries, Ros na Rún is a great soap, up there with corrie, there are shows that appeal to all and sundry on the station.
It's the jewel in the Irish broadcasting industry and don't forget the mná Ghaelacha on it

Mike 1972

Crosáidí wrote: »

Not at all, magority of schools should be bilingual

I thought they were ?

Dostoevsky wrote: »

:rolleyes: Now that's English language fanaticism in action. The intolerance and insecurity underlying it is cringe-worthy.

Which is fair enough provided you are prepared to acknowledge that the insistance (enshrined in an act of the Oireachtas) on Irish only roadsigns in (or pointing to) towns in (often only nominally) Gaeltacht areas amounts to Irish language fanaticism.

Or are you trying to have it both ways ?

purpleorchard

I actually can't believe there is mention of it, it is a disgrace if they do, the only connection we have left, to what our ancestors fought for.... independence and irishness and looking like our independence is nearly gone surely we can stand up for what we are... Irish!
if politicans wages were cut, and the rte big shots then we could make a difference! why are we the only ones suffering and they still have their first class lifestyle!!! When are they going to wake up and see what is happening right under their noses!!

Krusader

Mike 1972 wrote: »

I thought they were ?

Teach different subjects through both tongues then

Zebra3

TG4 gives us the fantastic seven part documentary series on the signatories of the 1916 Rising.

Wtf does RTÉ show? Is Bono Ireland's greatest ever person? Fcuk off RTÉ!!! :mad:

To get back to the OP, first up for cuts has to be politicans' mercs and percs.

Leave it alone, in the grand scheme of things €32 million is chicken feed!

Dostoevsky

Morkarleth wrote: »

You're missing my point - just because the website is Irish owned does not mean one has to speak or even allow the speaking of Irish on it. The owners can decide that.

Ahem. Are you one of the owners of Boards.ie? If not, why are you so concerned about how they run their business? What's the relevancy of all this nonsense to your demand that Irish be removed from this website? That you're getting upset by a single line in Irish is the "fanaticism" here.

Morkarleth wrote: »

Also, you may want to drop the persecution complex, it's juvenile and belittles your position.

And this from the person who's supporting a poster who is intolerant about a single line, a single line, being written in Irish on this thread. Jeeze.

Morkarleth wrote: »

But the person who was addressed in Irish is interested in this topic and to reply to them in a language they don't speak is nothing short of ignorant.

If you get your facts clear, the poster wasn't replying to them: he/she was addressing viewers generally, most of whom appear to have had no difficulty understanding his/her single sentence in Irish. Amazingly.

Morkarleth wrote: »

Ignorance? Really? I find your attitude impudent and ignorant. The implication that if someone can't speak Irish they're ignorant really says a lot about you.

Actually, if somebody cannot speak Irish they obviously are ignorant. Likewise, if somebody cannot understand political issues, economic issues and so forth. Because some people are ignorant of these things, we should ban them all from Afterhours? Everybody is ignorant of some thing - obviously, everybody is ignorant of the vast majority of things. But what you're supporting is the censorship of somebody who does something, in this case writes a single line in Irish, which the "offended" poster claims ignorance of. Nice to see all standards should be lowered to the level of the most ignorant.

Morkarleth wrote: »

Do you really think that being this melodramatic is doing anything for your argument?

From the person who is getting all offended about a single line in Irish ....:rolleyes: