World Cup 2018/2022 Decision to be made

ziggy

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Beefy78

ziggy wrote: »

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Then why is what I said not right? The guy I was responding to seemed to imply that Beckham could have contributed more or that England would have been better off using someone else.

SlickRic

ziggy wrote: »

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that had nothing to do with Beckham FFS.

that had to do with Russia being *ahem* 'formidable opponents' in bargaining with the 22.

and it had to do with Blatter's *ahem* 'reminder' about the British media 2 minutes before the vote happened.

ziggy

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ziggy

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SlickRic

ziggy wrote: »

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it's Brian Cowen and the snow's fault i missed that.

Beefy78

ziggy wrote: »

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No I didn't. I said he was more significant and effective than David Cameron or Prince William, which everything I've read and seen and heard backs up.

I made no comment on his effect on the vote because it's quite apparent that he didn't have any. As you say though, that isn't his fault.

Beefy78

I'm biased though. I bloody love Becks.

ziggy

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JerryHandbag

Its in interesting that they chose this year to announce the 2022 hosts, thats never happened before. In fact, Germany only had 6 years to get ready for WC2006, as did all nations before them. South Africa had 7 years.

I wonder was Qatar a shoe-in from a long way back? Giving them 12 years to get ready....its fairly obvious Australia, USA, Japan and Korea wouldnt need that amount of time to get ready, the normal 6/7 year preparation period would suffice I'm guessing. Just my own little conspiracy theory, and if so then what the **** was the point of yesterday at all, presentations and formalities? The whole thing stinks.

gosplan

gosplan wrote: »

I'm not disagreeing with this but I think people are overlooking the potential role of the English media.

Not just the BBC program the other day but the whole Fake Shiek/Rooney and prostitutes/Terry paid for tour of Chelsea angles that the British tabloid media take.

Every World Cup, certain media outlets take it upon themselves to sabotage the English team's campaign. They go after the manager, they go after the players, they go after the FA, and generally make a seriously good attempt to derail everything by either digging up or creating scandal.

I imagine that on some level the FIFA execs looked at that pattern and foresaw a tenacious media gunning for them over the next 8 years till the world cup took place.

All this is supposition of course but I'd be very surprised if the British tabloids weren't a big reason the world cup is going elsewhere.

SSN now reporting that a FIFA exec has said that given the media, awarding the WC to England would have been 'the final insult'.

The other thing that I think England don't get is the whole 'technical bid' aspect of it. The reason England had the best technical bid is because the football market in the UK is as big as it's going to get. I'd imagine that FIFA would see this as a negative rather than a positive.

All the stuff about the presentation is a load of rubbish IMO. At the end of the day it didn't matter a jot.

Beefy78

ziggy wrote: »

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Clearly not.

Dolph Starbeam

JerryHandbag wrote: »

Its in interesting that they chose this year to announce the 2022 hosts, thats never happened before. In fact, Germany only had 6 years to get ready for WC2006, as did all nations before them. South Africa had 7 years.

I wonder was Qatar a shoe-in from a long way back? Giving them 12 years to get ready....its fairly obvious Australia, USA, Japan and Korea wouldnt need that amount of time to get ready, the normal 6/7 year preparation period would suffice I'm guessing. Just my own little conspiracy theory, and if so then what the **** was the point of yesterday at all, presentations and formalities? The whole thing stinks.

I was thinking the same yesterday but i thought it might be just to make sure any of the nations have enough time, as they can see Brazil are way behind in getting ready and maybe they wanted to give nations more time to get ready. Your reason sounds more like Fifa though.

flahavaj

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

David Beckham is seen as a football ambassador all over the world, particularly in Asia and the USA.

He was an excellent choice by the England bid to be part of it

Can you tell me who else they should have used instead ?

Joey Barton.

Savman

Listen, regardless what one thinks of the England team flops, the gutter press or the colour of Becks' g-string, nobody in their right mind could suggest England are not perfect hosts for a World Cup. They have their choice of stadia most of which are well accessible by public transport, they are experts in putting on football games at this stage considering they have to do this week in week out.

Yes there is a small hooliganism element but nobody has done more than the English to stamp it out, credit where it's due, they have been trying hard to shake that image. Bottom line is they are just not liked around the world, maybe it's due to their arrogance, maybe their involvement in wars etc but there is no denying that them doing so poorly has more to do with politics than logistics.

Russia I can understand, massive nation and never hosted before, but get real for jaysis sake, there are real safety concerns here, I hope they get it sorted because it's potentially quite an interesting concept as host. I'm sure they will pull it off.

Qatar however, sorry not for me. If they are gonna award it to a country with such a small population then Ireland 2026 ftw.

gosplan

Savman wrote: »

Listen, regardless what one thinks of the England team flops, the gutter press or the colour of Becks' g-string, nobody in their right mind could suggest England are not perfect hosts for a World Cup. They have their choice of stadia most of which are well accessible by public transport, they are experts in putting on football games at this stage considering they have to do this week in week out.

Perfect hosts for a World Cup with well rested and prepared teams, a minimum of transport fuss, good safety at grounds and all the things important to you and I.

Personally I don't think FIFA give a monkey's about all of this stuff provided the money rolls in.

Dempsey

Qatar plans are pretty impressive, cant understand all this negetivity just because the WC isnt being hosted in a westernised country or a football stronghold. Some have a skewed criteria for what is needed to host a WC. Clearly FIFA wants to exploit the middle east, Qatar gave them that opportunity and they took it.

Le King

Dempsey wrote: »

Qatar plans are pretty impressive, cant understand all this negetivity just because the WC isnt being hosted in a westernised country or a football stronghold. Some have a skewed criteria for what is needed to host a WC. Clearly FIFA wants to exploit the middle east, Qatar gave them that opportunity and they took it.

They lined the pockets of the executive council. Come on Dempsey, you can't think the won on the merits of the build. Although not following the presentations closely Austalia should be a market used before Qatar, at least they have a football history. A pretty good one too.

ArmaniJeanss

England is held up as some sort of perfectly central location that is easily accessible to everyone, particularly in Europe.

Its actually one of the least accessible countries in Europe by virtue of being an island (Channel tunnel notwithstanding).

Russia is more accessible for most of the central and east european teams who usually make up half the European qualifiers anyway.

For people outside Europe its much of a much - the Russians waiving visa demands is a great move and I never saw any mention of England being willing to do the same for fans travelling from China, Nigeria, Trinidad, Uruguay etc.

IrishKev

Dempsey wrote: »

Qatar plans are pretty impressive, cant understand all this negetivity just because the WC isnt being hosted in a westernised country or a football stronghold. Some have a skewed criteria for what is needed to host a WC. Clearly FIFA wants to exploit the middle east, Qatar gave them that opportunity and they took it.

Sorry mate but that's clearly wrong. Most people on this were rooting for Australia to host the 2022 WC, so the westernised country stuff is nonsense. Do you think Ireland is big enough to host a World Cup?
Qatar is eight times smaller than Ireland ffs. Combine that with their climate and Islamic rules, and it makes for huge inconvenience for the vast majority of travelling fans.
It's just so clear that FIFA are getting millions upon millions for this decision.

niallo27

Dempsey wrote: »

Qatar plans are pretty impressive, cant understand all this negetivity just because the WC isnt being hosted in a westernised country or a football stronghold. Some have a skewed criteria for what is needed to host a WC. Clearly FIFA wants to exploit the middle east, Qatar gave them that opportunity and they took it.

Yes but do you not think a lot of group games will be played in front of near empty stadiums, where will the fans come from

Le King

IrishKev wrote: »

Sorry mate but that's clearly wrong. Most people on this were rooting for Australia to host the 2022 WC, so the westernised country stuff is nonsense. Do you think Ireland is big enough to host a World Cup?
Qatar is eight times smaller than Ireland ffs. Combine that with their climate and Islamic rules, and it makes for huge inconvenience for the vast majority of travelling fans.
It's just so clear that FIFA are getting millions upon millions for this decision.

I loved the suggestion about the GAA hosting the World Cup. Can you imagine 100,000 fans trying to book a room in Hayes, in Thurles. As Semple would be our second biggest stadium! :pac:

irishh_bob

JerryHandbag wrote: »

Its in interesting that they chose this year to announce the 2022 hosts, thats never happened before. In fact, Germany only had 6 years to get ready for WC2006, as did all nations before them. South Africa had 7 years.

I wonder was Qatar a shoe-in from a long way back? Giving them 12 years to get ready....its fairly obvious Australia, USA, Japan and Korea wouldnt need that amount of time to get ready, the normal 6/7 year preparation period would suffice I'm guessing. Just my own little conspiracy theory, and if so then what the **** was the point of yesterday at all, presentations and formalities? The whole thing stinks.

im pretty sure germany were awared 2006 in 1999

Dempsey

Le King wrote: »

They lined the pockets of the executive council. Come on Dempsey, you can't think the won on the merits of the build. Although not following the presentations closely Austalia should be a market used before Qatar, at least they have a football history. A pretty good one too.

I know FIFA are corrupt and have said as much in this thread. England lost their bid the second they started accusing executive members of corruption. They had an arrogant bid in 2006. They thought that a technical interview was enough, how naive.

So what if Qatar bribed them, other nations were probably at it too, just they did it better. I've little doubt that Qatar will be a successful WC host from looking at reports on how they are going about hosting the event. FIFA wanted to exploit new markets regardless of the highest risk technical assessments that Russia & Qatar had, both nations buttered them up the best.

Dont hate the player, hate the game. The selection process is a farce and has been long loooooong time before this vote. Its only the English media putting the spotlight on it that Irish seem to care.

Fr Tod Umptious

Savman wrote: »

Bottom line is they are just not liked around the world, maybe it's due to their arrogance, maybe their involvement in wars etc but there is no denying that them doing so poorly has more to do with politics than logistics.

Well I think it is that they are not liked within FIFA, regardless of their overall international reputation.

There was a guy on the radio last night talking about this and he said that one of the reasons England were not picked may have been because they are seen as 'outsiders'

England were saying something like '....come and bring your World Cup to our country the home of football and the Premier League.....'

Where as FIFA like to hear '....we want our country to be part of your World Cup....'

It's the lack of bowing down to FIFA that is costing them.

Mr. Presentable

CSF wrote: »

They could hold the World Cup at a month's notice.

Actually they couldn't. IIRC they are c50,000 hotel rooms short of the 60,000 requirement while Iberia have c100,000. It's not just about stadia.

Sour grapes from the English. Their attitude of entitlement is galling. Now they want the rules changed? More entitlement whinging. It's the Eurovision Song contest nonsense all over.

Dempsey

IrishKev wrote: »

Sorry mate but that's clearly wrong. Most people on this were rooting for Australia to host the 2022 WC, so the westernised country stuff is nonsense. Do you think Ireland is big enough to host a World Cup?
Qatar is eight times smaller than Ireland ffs. Combine that with their climate and Islamic rules, and it makes for huge inconvenience for the vast majority of travelling fans.
It's just so clear that FIFA are getting millions upon millions for this decision.

I'm sure the temperature and rules are fine for the rest of the middle east, the market that this WC is aimed at. Doha is like Amsterdam by Islamic standards. Also all the stadiums will deal with the high temperature for the players and fans so that argument was out the window before the vote took place.

I was rooting for Australia but I have nothing against Qatar getting it. Qatar is far more fit to host a WC than Ireland is. Do you remember Eircom Park, Abbotstown?? They have the financial muscle to build all that is required. We struggled to build T2 at Dublin. The comparisons to Ireland hosting a WC on its own is farcical.

Yes, I'll say it for the umpteenth time, FIFA is corrupt but you cant blame Qatar for playing their corrupt game and winning.

Mr Posh

What’s the FREE press got to do with the world cup FFS!!!?

Should all World Cups be held in countries where the press is gagged and ran by dictators to suite FIFA?

Fr Tod Umptious

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

England is held up as some sort of perfectly central location that is easily accessible to everyone, particularly in Europe.

Its actually one of the least accessible countries in Europe by virtue of being an island (Channel tunnel notwithstanding).

Yep, having Heatrhrow, the 4th busiest airport in the world, makes England a B**ch of a place to get to all right.

Mr. Presentable wrote: »

Sour grapes from the English..

The very same sour grapes the Irish had over the 'hand of Henry'

Savman

Mr Posh wrote: »

What’s the FREE press got to do with the world cup FFS!!!?

Should all World Cups be held in countries where the press is gagged and ran by dictators to suite FIFA?

I think Blatter's comments suggest so.

JerryHandbag

irishh_bob wrote: »

im pretty sure germany were awared 2006 in 1999

July 2000. Cos I remember where I was working at the time and listening to some Irish born DJ in South Africa on the radio, and he was f-ing and blinding that South Africa were "cheated" out of it

Dolph Starbeam

Talk on SSN about a break away World Cup :rolleyes:

Beefy78

Mr. Presentable wrote: »

Actually they couldn't. IIRC they are c50,000 hotel rooms short of the 60,000 requirement while Iberia have c100,000. It's not just about stadia.

Sour grapes from the English. Their attitude of entitlement is galling. Now they want the rules changed? More entitlement whinging. It's the Eurovision Song contest nonsense all over.

Who has said that England are entitled to anything?

ziggy

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Beefy78

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

BBC's Sports Editor David Bond just said on the news that before they voted for the 2018 host Blatter reminded everyone of the media reports in England and that he was strongly urging for a Russian win. Doesn't seem appropriate that the head of the sport is able to influence the outcome in this way.

Anyone know if this has been reported anywhere else?

karma_

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Yep, having Heatrhrow, the 4th busiest airport in the world, makes England a B**ch of a place to get to all right.



The very same sour grapes the Irish had over the 'hand of Henry'

Honestly, there were many of us extremely embarrassed by the cringe inducing outcry over that whole episode.

Pinturicchio

Extremists welcome Qatar World Cup, predict al-Qaeda takeover and Ronaldo kidnapping

EXTREMISTS welcomed FIFA's decision to have Qatar host the 2022 World Cup, predicting Al-Qaeda will establish an "Islamic State" in the Gulf region in the coming years, monitors said.

"You fools, know that Al-Qaeda is on the threshold of establishing the shariah (Islamic law) of Allah the Almighty," a user who went by the name Hafeed al-Hussein posted on the Shumukh al-Islam online forum, according to the US-based SITE Intelligence Group.

"And who knows, Allah may empower al-Qaeda so that it takes control of matters after a year or two, or five years at most.

"In 2022, there is no country with the name Qatar, and there is no province called Kuwait and there is no Saudi (Arabia). Instead, there is an emirate called the Islamic State," the post added.

After an agonising final day of presentations and furious lobbying in Zurich, FIFA head Sepp Blatter earlier announced Qatar as tournament hosts in 2022 - over the US, Japan, South Korea and Australia - while Russia beat off competition from England, Spain/Portugal and Netherlands/Belgium to host the 2018 World Cup.

Another user predicted Qatar's demise would come within seven years.

"By 2022, Qatar will not exist with permission from Allah. Instead, there will be the Islamic State of Qatar under the Islamic Caliphate established by Sheikh Osama bin Laden in 2017," Juleibib al-Irhabi wrote.

One of his colleagues, Abu Yassin, predicted that insurgents in the Russian Caucasus - where attacks on officials have become daily occurrences as Russian authorities battle the fighters - would help spell Qatar's downfall.

"In 2018, Russia will organise (the games) and the brothers in the emirate of the Caucasus, with permission from Allah, will make a case to cancel Qatar's" games, he wrote.

Another who called himself Abu Khubeib al-Khorasani said 2022 will be the "most exciting" World Cup final, predicting that Portuguese player Cristiano Ronaldo would be kidnapped and Al-Qaeda would win the tournament.

http://www.news.com.au/world/extremists-welcome-qatar-world-cup/story-e6frfkyi-1225965274028

Dolph Starbeam

ziggy wrote: »

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Sounds great and i'd love to see Fifa gone, but reading into it if the FA's agree to a break away World Cup each FA will be kicked out of Fifa and Uefa, meaning no Euro Championships, Champions League or Europa League for any of those countries more than likely. Its a bit much just because England lost the bid, as some Russian lad on SSN said, when they entered the bidding process they knew what goes on, if England had of got it and Qatar got it would they still want the process changed, i doubt it.

karma_

Pinturicchio wrote: »

http://www.news.com.au/world/extremists-welcome-qatar-world-cup/story-e6frfkyi-1225965274028

ffs, making news headlines from forum posters posting idiotic remarks, that is utterly ridiculous and just succeeds in giving these muppets a voice.

Beefy78

karma_ wrote: »

ffs, making news headlines from forum posters posting idiotic remarks, that is utterly ridiculous and just succeeds in giving these muppets a voice.

ahaha exactly. Can you imagine the headlines that this place could generate?

I still feel that there have to be security concerns with Qatar, though. Poor Australia.

ArmaniJeanss

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Yep, having Heatrhrow, the 4th busiest airport in the world, makes England a B**ch of a place to get to all right.

Indeed its perfectly accessible, exactly like Russia at the opposite end of Europe which is held up as some unreachable destination by the goons on SSN (and a few here as well unfortunately).

ArmaniJeanss

Beefy78 wrote: »

I still feel that there have to be security concerns with Qatar, though.

This little Englander mentality is all pervasive in the media, seemingly only happy if these events are held in the most sanitized of western countries, or the English speaking parts of the new world.

I've been hearing these security concerns about World Cups and Olympics for 30 years, rising to a crescendo in the run-up to South Africa 2010 where all visitors would be kidnapped, necktied, and shot. And still in all those 30 years the only murderous rampage has been during the Atlanta Georgia 1996 Olympics.

Beefy78

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

This little Englander mentality is all pervasive in the media, seemingly only happy if these events are held in the most sanitized of western countries, or the English speaking parts of the new world.

I've been hearing these security concerns about World Cups and Olympics for 30 years, rising to a crescendo in the run-up to South Africa 2010 where all visitors would be kidnapped, necktied, and shot. And still in all those 30 years the only murderous rampage has been during the Atlanta Georgia 1996 Olympics.

Slightly OTT response to a point that even FIFA acknowledged in their report.

IrishKev

Dempsey wrote: »

I'm sure the temperature and rules are fine for the rest of the middle east, the market that this WC is aimed at. Doha is like Amsterdam by Islamic standards. Also all the stadiums will deal with the high temperature for the players and fans so that argument was out the window before the vote took place.

I was rooting for Australia but I have nothing against Qatar getting it. Qatar is far more fit to host a WC than Ireland is. Do you remember Eircom Park, Abbotstown?? They have the financial muscle to build all that is required. We struggled to build T2 at Dublin. The comparisons to Ireland hosting a WC on its own is farcical.

Yes, I'll say it for the umpteenth time, FIFA is corrupt but you cant blame Qatar for playing their corrupt game and winning.

Doha has proposed six stadiums for the World Cup. Another poster said a while ago that the Ireland/Scotland bid for Euro 2008 was rejected because there would be two different games on in Glasgow in one day! And I can't wait to see how quick FIFA change their rule about having a maximum of two stadiums in one city for a WC. And with regard to the heat, fans still have to walk around the country. It's just too much of a coincedence that Qatar, who happen to have extremely rich leaders, beat USA and Australia in the 2022 Bid.

Beefy78

IrishKev wrote: »

It's just too much of a coincedence that Qatar, who happen to have extremely rich leaders, beat USA and Australia in the 2022 Bid.

And that the head of the Qatar FA was the only person tipped to stand against Sepp Blatter at the next elections but has now withdrawn leaving Blatter unopposed.

Probably a stupid question re the heat (sorry) but even if the stadiums are air-conditioned how will that protect the players from spending up to 150 minutes exposed to the Sun?

Dempsey

IrishKev wrote: »

Doha has proposed six stadiums for the World Cup. Another poster said a while ago that the Ireland/Scotland bid for Euro 2008 was rejected because there would be two different games on in Glasgow in one day! And I can't wait to see how quick FIFA change their rule about having a maximum of two stadiums in one city for a WC. And with regard to the heat, fans still have to walk around the country. It's just too much of a coincedence that Qatar, who happen to have extremely rich leaders, beat USA and Australia in the 2022 Bid.

So because Glasgow cant handle 2 matches in one day means that every other city is bound by this limitation? I'm sure that has been addressed like everything else.

Nobody had much of a problem with altitude in Mexico or South Africa but are kicking up an awful stink about temperatures. I've walked around in 40'C+ heat without too much difficulty, its hot but there an overreaction in this thread tbh.

Its not a coincidence, this sort of golden handshaking has been going on for decades, why the fuss now?

major bill

efb wrote: »

Why would u have in it engerland? Self appointed creators of the modern game, yet Brum Darby exactly showed where English football is...

Eastern Yurp and Middle East never hosted! Good look to Russia and Qatar!

most idiotic post i have read. russian hooliganism is a big problem and its plighted by nazi gangs and fifa expect african teams and fans to travel there then you have qatar a very poor footballing nation, an islamic state that treat women like sh1te very brave stupid move by fifa.

if anyone thinks FIFA made this decision on merit and fairplay then they need their head examined, FIFA are a very corrupt organisation and i really hope the english media roast blatter and Co.


btw ''engerland'':rolleyes: grow up

the_monkey

flahavaj wrote: »

Old enough to see the value of things like history and pedigree.

If it's history you want sure follow Liverpool !

Wolf Club

It would seem that is a bit of an experiment on FIFA's part. Obviously both Russia and Qatar will have the facilities and infrastructure to be able to host a WC when their respective years come around, but I think there still remains a few questions over Qatar. Russian deserve it IMO, their League and national team have been amongst the best in Europe recent years (failure to qualify for the recent WC excepting) and hosting the WC should help elevate it further.

steelcityblues

Given they were up against countries like Australia, Japan, South Korea and USA who all of us know by now can successfully hold major sporting tournaments, the selection of Qatar for 2022 is truly puzzling and shows how rotten behind-the-scenes FIFA must be!