Tipperary North election thread

mikemac

Gotta agree with you Shazanne.
Kathleen was a great worker for Tipp North and she took leadership on some areas like childcare and working parents for the Labour party and became spokesperson. Excellent public speaker too.

You'd often see Kathleen around Silver St in Nenagh, her office was up there.

But Tipp North had big FF support with Michael Smith, running mate Hoctor and an unbeatable Michael Lowry.

She had laid a lot of foundations and Alan Kelly will stroll in as a bright new face and take a Dail seat. Just isn't right
But recently people are turning against Kelly. If he loses he'll be on expensed flight straight back to Brussels.
It's not like he resigned and gave everything for Tipp North. No, he has a backup plan

mccoist

alan kelly will probarbly top the poll
it is not his fault kathleen omeara never got elected or when he is standing
give a new face the chance and consider this ,do not let the same thing happen to kelly as it did to omeara bright young prosoect politically speaking never getting their chance

mayhem#

I am amazed by the number of people stating here that such and such is great because they "did a lot for North Tipperary". This is NOT an election for North Tipperary! This is an election for the Irish Government and requires people who can hold their own in national & international politics.
What we have had so far is a group of what should have been county councillors (with all due respect to councillors) running the country.
If a politician is running on local issue he/she should stay in local politics.
Ask your candidates what they will do (and insist on real actions) on national & international issues.

beagga

mccoist wrote: »

alan kelly will probarbly top the poll
it is not his fault kathleen omeara never got elected or when he is standing
give a new face the chance and consider this ,do not let the same thing happen to kelly as it did to omeara bright young prosoect politically speaking never getting their chance

Funny thing about Alan Kelly on his page he has 'jobs remain the big issue'.
I was on facebook and up popped a picture of Alan Kellys jeep and car. It seems however that they were both done by a signwriting company in cahir (south Tipperary).
Do we not have a few of these companies in north Tipp that could have done with the work? Is there someone in nenagh even?
I know he still got it done in Tipperary but if he's knocking on doors for votes its a surprise he didn't keep it very local to himself.

Not to just single Alan out as a matter of interest I wonder where they all got their signs, vehicles, flyers, embroidery, etc done.

support local = local support ?
Maybe I'm way off the ball but am I wrong with this?

mccoist

I would like to read your version of what you think of candidates that are running
I have stated previously i think we have got a poor choice
Kelly I figure being the pick of them
Coonan just does nothing and is getting elected because he has the good fortune to be FG
Lowery supported the ff and has a chequered past, I am not to keen on loose cannon independents after the carry on of various individuals in the last dail
Morris not really making a big impact but seemingly nenagh will give local vote
Hocter well will the old ff be enough
none of these bar kelly seem to have enough charisma or whatever to make it on a bigger national level

Shazanne

mccoist wrote: »

I would like to read your version of what you think of candidates that are running
I have stated previously i think we have got a poor choice
Kelly I figure being the pick of them
Coonan just does nothing and is getting elected because he has the good fortune to be FG
Lowery supported the ff and has a chequered past, I am not to keen on loose cannon independents after the carry on of various individuals in the last dail
Morris not really making a big impact but seemingly nenagh will give local vote
Hocter well will the old ff be enough
none of these bar kelly seem to have enough charisma or whatever to make it on a bigger national level

Forgive me for saying so but charisma would most certainly not be one of Alan Kelly's qualities! Neither would people skills, manners or approachability. He tries too hard to mimick his Leader and it's not working for him either.
However, maybe that's what people want from a politician?
Yes, I agree that North Tipperary has a less than appealing selection of candidates on this occasion, but I feel that people are alot more clued in for this Election - they are looking at the bigger picture and, whereas once upon a time all they knew was the local politician, they now know exactly what he/she represents in national terms.
It is unfortunate that the newer candidates are not on the scene a bit longer (and God knows they knew there was an Election coming up!) because they are well informed, articulate and tuned in.
Seamie Morris, as an individual, would do very well but I feel he will be held back because of his party. Lowry will do what he does best - win votes - by whatever means he has but not to the same extent as he has done in the past. Hoctor, I understand, is fighting back and her support may very well be growing as the staunch FF's get a second breath. Coonan will plod along - he wont light any fires, but it must be said that he is approachable and does not look down at people like Kelly does and this can mean a great deal to ordinary people.

mayhem#

@Shazanne @mccoist What is your opinion on the two Independents running in the GE11 for North Tipp?

Shazanne

The most refreshing thing about them is their openess and honesty and the fact that the "system" has not tainted them yet.
Kate Bopp is an intelligent lady who has her finger on the pulse of how the average man/woman on the street is feeling at this time. Says she decided to run because she could find no politician that represented her own feelings at this time and that it very true of many people. She seems to have the ability to click in with people and what they are thinking. However, she admits to being an admirer of Declan Ganley, which may not win her any favours. I think she may be one to watch in the future - if she sticks with it and doesn't run scared after her first outing.
Not sure which other candidate you are asking an opinion on. Michael Lowry is the other Independent, Billy Clancy is Independent/New Vision.
Lowry - I know what's said about him and I agree with much of it. But if I wanted something done in the morning he would be the one I'd go to. I not a supporter as such but I know he'd get it done just the same! And, call a spade a spade, that's what people want.
Billy Clancy is a good, solid guy who has proven himself well at Council level but it may be a bit too soon to branch out onto the National scene. Unfortunate for him that he left it so late to declare his intention to run - he could have had alot more groundwork done by now. Plus, New Vision is, as the name says, "New" - needs to be tried and tested a little before people take it seriously.

mayhem#

Note: Kate Bopp will be on Vincent Brown tonight after 11 pm...

Shazanne

mayhem# wrote: »

Note: Kate Bopp will be on Vincent Brown tonight after 11 pm...

Really? Heard that one of the Laois/Offaly new Independent candidates is on tonight too - wonder what Browne's angle is on this?

beagga

Shazanne wrote: »

Billy Clancy is Independent/New Vision.

Is new vision just a group of independents (like the lowry team) or an actual party?

Shazanne

My understanding is that it is a group of Independents that are party of a party, but can if they wish retain their Independent voting rights in the Dail. However, unlike the so called "Lowry Team" who are led and said by Michael Lowry, these Independent will all represent the interests of different constituencies and their joint status will be used for the purpose of obtaining strong financial advice from one of their founders, David McWilliams.

beagga

Shazanne wrote: »

My understanding is that it is a group of Independents that are party of a party, but can if they wish retain their Independent voting rights in the Dail. However, unlike the so called "Lowry Team" who are led and said by Michael Lowry, these Independent will all represent the interests of different constituencies and their joint status will be used for the purpose of obtaining strong financial advice from one of their founders, David McWilliams.

So they dont lose their independent status by running under the new vision ticket.

Independent: Definition: Not dependent; free; not subject to control by others; not relying on others; not subordinate

Doesn't it sound a little contradictory to be promoting themselves as New Vision party members but also independents?

Shazanne

Yes, it probably does. That's why I feel it's a system that will have to be tried and tested before the public would buy into it.

beagga

Shazanne wrote: »

Yes, it probably does. That's why I feel it's a system that will have to be tried and tested before the public would buy into it.

I agree, probably because I'm not buying it at the moment..............:)

beagga

mayhem# wrote: »

Note: Kate Bopp will be on Vincent Brown tonight after 11 pm...

Just saw her on it. She didn't do that well at all in my opinion.
She doesn't seem to understand the IMF/EU bailout and what the money is needed for.

Shazanne

beagga wrote: »

Just saw her on it. She didn't do that well at all in my opinion.
She doesn't seem to understand the IMF/EU bailout and what the money is needed for.

I didn't get to see her so can't comment on that. But, when you consider it, she is a housewife who decided to run for very "human" concerns. She's probably on a learning curve when it comes to the major political stuff. That's why I feel that, if she sticks with it, her time may come - but not yet.

beagga

Shazanne wrote: »

I didn't get to see her so can't comment on that. But, when you consider it, she is a housewife who decided to run for very "human" concerns. She's probably on a learning curve when it comes to the major political stuff. That's why I feel that, if she sticks with it, her time may come - but not yet.

Maybe her time will come, but she didn't seem to have a good prepared answer to the IMF/EU bailout ready and it must be the most talked about subject of political debates at the moment.
TBH Judging by any of the independents performances that were on last night, there wouldn't one of them get my vote.

Shazanne

I just heard on local radio that Alan Kelly claims that 300 of his posters have been stolen/destroyed by opposition candidates. Surely to God if posters at 300 different locations were tampered with someone would have seen something??!! He reckons the other candidates are "afraid" of change and the influence he will have! Now, in all honesty, a couple of days before an election wouldn't it be a bit crazy for any politician to remove someone elses posters that have been up more than two weeks? Even it it were true, what sort of impact would it have? Would it not be more likely that they either came down during the high winds we had recently or were vandalised by a member of the public, as opposed to another politician or his/her supporters?
It all appears to me that Kelly is begining to panic a bit and he's lashing out all around him (Gilmore style!). It reminds me of a playground situation - "Yous are all pickin' on me"

tipptom

beagga wrote: »

Maybe her time will come, but she didn't seem to have a good prepared answer to the IMF/EU bailout ready and it must be the most talked about subject of political debates at the moment.
TBH Judging by any of the independents performances that were on last night, there wouldn't one of them get my vote.

Yea,id be a supporter of her views but i have to say VB has being catching candidates for months now on,"what if the eu says no to defaulting and were not giving you any more money,what do we do then",in other words if they call your bluff,she should have been briefed up to her ears on this,and he just dismissed her flat tax out of hand she should have been strong enough on it to come back at him.But i wouldnt fancy been on VB with not much of that type of media experience and try and hold him of while hes thinking to himself i should have bigger fish on but for this equality malarky so ill just play with them and then swat them.Hey,but at least she went on unlike some others with multiple pr gurus there to have every reply prepared for them.

beagga

Shazanne wrote: »

I just heard on local radio that Alan Kelly claims that 300 of his posters have been stolen/destroyed by opposition candidates. Surely to God if posters at 300 different locations were tampered with someone would have seen something??!! He reckons the other candidates are "afraid" of change and the influence he will have! Now, in all honesty, a couple of days before an election wouldn't it be a bit crazy for any politician to remove someone elses posters that have been up more than two weeks? Even it it were true, what sort of impact would it have? Would it not be more likely that they either came down during the high winds we had recently or were vandalised by a member of the public, as opposed to another politician or his/her supporters?
It all appears to me that Kelly is begining to panic a bit and he's lashing out all around him (Gilmore style!). It reminds me of a playground situation - "Yous are all pickin' on me"

FFS 300 posters stolen by the other candidates? Is he having a laugh or what? I don't get why he'd be making such wild accusations like this.
I do remember last week or that after the strong winds there was a lot of them blown all over the place.(All candidates ones not just Kellys).
Did he look in the fields near where they were?

(As per my previous post about where the work went maybe they're been stolen because they were made outside north tipp...........:D)

beagga

@tipptom. I do agree VB would be a fair baptism of fire for a first appearance on TV. But she did agree to appear and to have not prepared for a common question like this was very silly. The economy questions are top af the agenda after all.

Cat Melodeon

Had some of Billy Clancy's canvassers on my door this morning. Told them I wouldn't be voting for them because of his anti-Europe stance. They had a few arguments about attracting multinationals and keeping our fisheries and not needing the EU, I argued them down with the importance of common trade area to our exports, free movement of goods & services, stability of belonging to a larger union etc. They switched tactic and asked me who I was voting for, I said probably Alan Kelly and they said oh you know you're voting for abortion then?!!!!!!! Ffs. I told them it is the people's right to have their decision in the referendum legislated for and to have women's rights enshrined in the law and sent them packing. Why is this even an issue????

Shazanne

It's not - and hopefully it stays that way! That's all we'd need for the next couple of days!

mayhem#

I spoke to Kate this morning on her appearance on Vincent Browne last night and while we both agreed that it wasn't the best performance there were certain events that happened before the show that rattled her.
Apparently she was asked by Browne if there were any specific issues that she wanted to rasie and when she said she wanted to mention two important issues (http://katebopp.com/2011/02/22/press-release-kate-bopp-calls-for-independent-candidates-to-forego-e205000-leaders-allowance/ & http://katebopp.com/2011/02/18/i-am-calling-on-labour-mep-alan-kelly-to-clarify-his-comments-regarding-the-euimf-bailout-interest-rate/ ) he tore into her and threatened that he would have her removed from the panel, live on air, if she dared to bring either of these two issues up.

This together with his agressive questioning and interrupting completely put her of and she lost her "flow". She is clear enough on these issues.

As usual there is more to every story ;-)

Cat Melodeon

mayhem# wrote: »

I spoke to Kate this morning on her appearance on Vincent Browne last night and while we both agreed that it wasn't the best performance there were certain events that happened before the show that rattled her.
Apparently she was asked by Browne if there were any specific issues that she wanted to rasie and when she said she wanted to mention two important issues (... ) he tore into her and threatened that he would have her removed from the panel, live on air, if she dared to bring either of these two issues up.

This together with his agressive questioning and interrupting completely put her of and she lost her "flow". She is clear enough on these issues.

As usual there is more to every story ;-)

Is that you Evert?

Here's the link, people can judge for themselves (from 16:00 onwards):
http://www.tv3.ie/shows.php?request=tonightwithvincentbrowne&tv3_preview=&video=32776
Personally I thought Kate Bopp was a bit stuttery and didn't come across at all convincingly on the bailout/alternatives to it. In fairness, neither did the other candidates on the panel with her, with the exception perhaps of the more practiced Michael Healy Rae, but then again, he blusters so much I'm not even sure if he did address the questions asked. Vincent Browne was no more aggressive with her than any of the others, perhaps more so with Catherine Connolly, that's his questioning style and is why Enda Kenny won't go on the show.

Her Kelly bugbear is a non-runner, he has spoken about this publicly on numerous occasions, Labour raised objections at every turn on the bailout and were the only party to vote against it.

I agree with her on the expenses issue, Vincent Browne probably didn't allow her raise it as time was very limited. He's not exactly renowned for his pleasantness with 'minor' guests, that's the price you pay for exposure on his show.

Btw, does Mrs Bopp know that the constituency extends south of Templemore? She only referenced the very northern Tipperary towns and villages in the interview. what about Thurles and surrounds?

tipptom

Cat Melodeon wrote: »

Is that you Evert?

Here's the link, people can judge for themselves (from 16:00 onwards):
http://www.tv3.ie/shows.php?request=tonightwithvincentbrowne&tv3_preview=&video=32776
Personally I thought Kate Bopp was a bit stuttery and didn't come across at all convincingly on the bailout/alternatives to it. In fairness, neither did the other candidates on the panel with her, with the exception perhaps of the more practiced Michael Healy Rae, but then again, he blusters so much I'm not even sure if he did address the questions asked. Vincent Browne was no more aggressive with her than any of the others, perhaps more so with Catherine Connolly, that's his questioning style and is why Enda Kenny won't go on the show.

Her Kelly bugbear is a non-runner, he has spoken about this publicly on numerous occasions, Labour raised objections at every turn on the bailout and were the only party to vote against it.

I agree with her on the expenses issue, Vincent Browne probably didn't allow her raise it as time was very limited. He's not exactly renowned for his pleasantness with 'minor' guests, that's the price you pay for exposure on his show.

Btw, does Mrs Bopp know that the constituency extends south of Templemore? She only referenced the very northern Tipperary towns and villages in the interview. what about Thurles and surrounds?

labour only voted against it on its final sitting on a technacality,on all others stages they had voted for it.

Cat Melodeon

tipptom wrote: »

labour only voted against it on its final sitting on a technacality,on all others stages they had voted for it.

It still remains that they voted against it though. Coupled with their insistence that it must be renegotiated, it's a more principled prospect than Fianna-dum or Fine-dee.

Will23

mayhem# wrote: »

I am amazed by the number of people stating here that such and such is great because they "did a lot for North Tipperary". This is NOT an election for North Tipperary! This is an election for the Irish Government and requires people who can hold their own in national & international politics.
What we have had so far is a group of what should have been county councillors (with all due respect to councillors) running the country.
If a politician is running on local issue he/she should stay in local politics.
Ask your candidates what they will do (and insist on real actions) on national & international issues.

fully agree with this, so on this basis what does the undecided voter in north tipp do? in your opinion?

i dont know if you're as confused as i am, but christ it would be nice to have a few candidates in the mix that you wanted to vote for!

W.

beagga

mayhem# wrote: »

he tore into her and threatened that he would have her removed from the panel, live on air, if she dared to bring either of these two issues up.

This together with his agressive questioning and interrupting completely put her of and she lost her "flow". She is clear enough on these issues.

As usual there is more to every story ;-)

While this may be so, I do agree that VB can be very agressive towards guests but its hardly her first time seeing the show and she should have known what to expect.
Remember she still is standing for election to the dail and to not have a clear answer rehearsed on the IMF/EU bailout, one of the most talked about issues of this election.
Also it would have done her street cred some good if she was removed live on air for asking independents to give up some money that a lot of people are not even aware they receive.