No show in restaurant, still have to pay!

maiden

Hi, I was at a meal last night in a restaurant, the organisers had it booked for 70 people but only 35 turned up.

When management and organisers realised there were a lot of no shows, the manager asked could they start selling off the tables and organisers agreed.

Anyway when paying the bill, manager asked for the money for the 35 no shows, claiming loss of income, wont be able to sell on food etc. After much haggling, the manager asked for the money for 22 of the no shows and this was paid as the organiser didnt want an argument in front of eveyone.

Now my question is, is the organiser entitled to the 22 meals? There are a lot of homeless shelters etc that could benefit from these meals. They are after all paid for!!!

Don't know but I imagine not - the food, tables and staff were available last night - not tonight.

poisonated

I presume so. The person didn't pay for 22 meals for nothing.

Run_to_da_hills

If the organiser should have requested 22 doggy bags and placed the meals in his freezer. Lesson learned.

maiden

I agree the restaurant should be compensated, but if food is paid for then it should be handed out! Even if it is in doggy bags!

I went back to restaurant today to see if we could come to some arrangemnt but manager is off. Still think SVP or some society can benefit from 22 thre couse meals

jor el

How about, make the 35 no shows pay for it themselves? Or collect the money from them now, and donate that to SVP or some other charity. That'll teach them not to say they'll be at a function when they've no intention of showing up.

tommy21

jor el wrote: »

How about, make the 35 no shows pay for it themselves? Or collect the money from them now, and donate that to SVP or some other charity. That'll teach them not to say they'll be at a function when they've no intention of showing up.

Probably the fairest way (though I suspect won't work). TBH the organiser should have collected all the money beforehand and who ever wanted to turn up could have.

davo10

Don't forget all the staff the restaurant had working to cater for 70, they had to be paid even though 35 were there, I agree with jor el, contact no shows and inform them they had made a commitment and organisers are considerably out of poccket by their no show

JohnC.

I wouldn't go chasing or blaming the no-shows. I certainly wouldn't have driven anywhere last night in those conditions. There are exceptional circumstances here.

maiden

Yeah it was a bad night out alright!

Anyone know what our rights are?

Just to point out all tables were filled during the evening. The meal consisted of a choice of 5 starters, 5 mains and set dessert.

the_syco

maiden wrote: »

When management and organisers realised there were a lot of no shows, the manager asked could they start selling off the tables and organisers agreed.

This is the crux of the matter: if the other tables were filled, why did the money have to be paid?

dudara

Were there any formal T&Cs or contract agreed with the restaurant?

Zab

jor el wrote: »

How about, make the 35 no shows pay for it themselves? Or collect the money from them now, and donate that to SVP or some other charity. That'll teach them not to say they'll be at a function when they've no intention of showing up.

tommy21 wrote: »

Probably the fairest way (though I suspect won't work). TBH the organiser should have collected all the money beforehand and who ever wanted to turn up could have.

That's completely ridiculous. They are likely douche-bags for not bothering to show up but there's zero moral or ethical burden on them to pay anything (unless of course everybody was paying for themselves, which I'm assuming wasn't the case).

I would certainly at least feel entitled to 22 meals worth of raw ingredients. I'd also be interested in how many tables they managed to sell on the night after it was agreed they could sell on the 35 seats.

smk89

I was at a black tie where this also happened. So we decided who got the extra portions.

The wierd thing though is that if you have extra guests then their meals are free, so always underestimate the number you imagine to be present

Miaireland

I'm guessing that it is too late to seek anything at this stage. As someone else said the food was available last night, there is not obligation to make it available today.

To be honest I think the organisers should have sought their doggy bags last night and make people pay in advance if they are having one again.

coylemj

maiden wrote: »

Just to point out all tables were filled during the evening.

Do you mean all tables apart from the 70 seats your group booked were filled or are you saying that they filled the seats left empty by the 'no shows'?

I certainly don't think they were entitled to the full price of the 35 meals that were not consumed because the desserts would certainly have been reusable on the following night and a lot of the starters and mains were either not already cooked or could have been reused on the following day. I'm thinking here of starters like salad or pate where the ingredients are not actually cooked on the spot and so there is no material loss if the expected number of customers don't turn up since the ingredients can be used the next day.

Can you clarify if the restaurant did eventually fill the seats that were empty because of the 35 who didn't turn up - it's not 100% clear from your posts if these seats remained empty all night.

joeKel73

I think you'd have been entitled to request the 22 meals to go when paying for them. You're paying for the staff that was taken on to cater for the group as well as the food. I don't think you can go back the next day and request it - they will be staffed to the requirements of their bookings for that night.

maiden

Thanks for all the replies! To clarify, the 35 no show seats were filled

looksee

Those seats might have been filled, but there were 35 'normal' seats that were not filled, that is, they would have got 35 sales over and above the 70. Its a bit of a nonsense to say they could use the food another night, food has to be at least half prepared even if it is not cooked, and most of it would be not usable later.

The organisers were expecting 70 meals to be eaten, and they were not, either way they were prepared to pay for 70 meals, so how have they lost out?

If the guests were supposed to pay for their own meals, well lesson number one of that kind of organising - get your money ahead, many people have no problem letting you down, regardless of the weather.

Our man in Havana

maiden wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies! To clarify, the 35 no show seats were filled

Restaurant is extracting the urine so.

Zab

looksee wrote: »

Those seats might have been filled, but there were 35 'normal' seats that were not filled, that is, they would have got 35 sales over and above the 70.

OP has said that "all tables were filled during the evening". You would of course be correct if the restaurant had the capacity, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

91011

If you booked 70 seats on ryanair and only 35 turned up, what do you think Michael O'Leary would say? - You'd need to go to after hours to get the answer as that language would not be permitted oin this thread:D

The labour costs in a restaurant are huge. The raw food itself only represents 20% of the cost on average. Cooking it, preparing it & serving it along with other normal business costs represents the rest.

The lesson learnt from an organising point of view is to find out how far in advance numbers can be changed (usually 2 days) and then make sure you confirm the numbers just beforehand & always underestimate by 20% for no-shows.

themadchef

Where to start........

dudara wrote: »

Were there any formal T&Cs or contract agreed with the restaurant?

I have never heard of anyone signing a contract when booking a function, might not be the worst idea in the world though.

the_syco wrote: »

This is the crux of the matter: if the other tables were filled, why did the money have to be paid?

If the management filled the other tables imo he shouldint have charged you for them... but this is only my opinion.

foto joe wrote: »

I think you'd have been entitled to request the 22 meals to go when paying for them.

Completely agree, you are being charged for them, ask, no, demand them. As it would deem the food was double sold if indeed the manager did resell the empty seats.

maiden wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies! To clarify, the 35 no show seats were filled

Look, only half of your group turned up. If the manager did not sell the other seats then you should have been liable for the whole bill. Food is perishable, you booked it in good faith and they accepted that booking. Staffing and overhead costs dont change just because your guests didint turn up.

So, in future, everybody reading this. Discuss with the establishment the "what if" clause. What happens if 10 more turn up? if ten less turn up? If one of the kids set the table cloth on fire .... any concerns you might have.

Ive gotten to the stage, i(f a function is booked mid week) that i advise the customer that the number booked for is the number charged for. If it's the weekend and i can sell it to someone else, the same night, no extra staff costs etc then you get away lucky.

I dont see how the establishment can re sell the tables and still charge you full whack. Even if they re sold the tables and used different menus (meaning your overbooked food was wasted) then you should have gotten a huge discount as the overheads and staffing costs were taken on by the new customers. This may be where the figure of 22 came from but it certainly shouldint have been a haggle to get there. Coustomers are hard to get in this climate and e wont keep his long with that attitude, especially if he turned out to have a full restaurant anyway!

Top tip, make sure you ask the establishment in ADVANCE what the bookings policy is.

My 2 cents

rubadub

maiden wrote: »

Still think SVP or some society can benefit from 22 thre couse meals

Health issues usually come into it, this is why the likes of McDonalds throw out food after so many minutes rather than give it out to shelters.

jor el wrote: »

How about, make the 35 no shows pay for it themselves?

Zab wrote: »

That's completely ridiculous. They are likely douche-bags for not bothering to show up but there's zero moral or ethical burden on them to pay anything

I don't think its ridiculous, this situation happens every year without fail at our Christmas party in work. A few people do not show and the boss and girl who organised it go mental at the waste of money (unless I am there and demand the extra food :pac:). IMO there is an ethical burden, it really sickens me when people view things as "free" and do not bother turning up -somebody has to pay. If the christmas party is €50 per head and 3 do not turn up turn up that is €150 down the drain that could have been on the limited drinks tab.

One year the boss wanted to charge people €50 in advance for the christmas party, and then would refund them on the night with the cash, I was all for it but many were against -but they should have been asked "whats the problem? are you planning on not turning up again? then just say you are not going right now".

In this case the snow probably hampered peoples plans, so they should have had the decency to phone the organiser in advance and tell them. Also the organiser really should have copped on too and rang around in advance and notified the restaurant.

91011 wrote: »

If you booked 70 seats on ryanair and only 35 turned up, what do you think Michael O'Leary would say?

He would take the money, but in this case it would be the equivalent of michael O Leary trying to sell on the seats -while I would want the extra room/comfort of a free seat beside me if I had paid for it.

Zab

rubadub wrote: »

I don't think its ridiculous, this situation happens every year without fail at our Christmas party in work. A few people do not show and the boss and girl who organised it go mental at the waste of money (unless I am there and demand the extra food :pac:). IMO there is an ethical burden, it really sickens me when people view things as "free" and do not bother turning up -somebody has to pay. If the christmas party is €50 per head and 3 do not turn up turn up that is €150 down the drain that could have been on the limited drinks tab.

One year the boss wanted to charge people €50 in advance for the christmas party, and then would refund them on the night with the cash, I was all for it but many were against -but they should have been asked "whats the problem? are you planning on not turning up again? then just say you are not going right now".

You're talking about a prearranged agreement that's perfectly fair. I was replying to the notion of suddenly trying to charge no-shows for something that they were told was going to be free. Which is still ridiculous to my mind. I have no problem with your plan except that in reality a lot of people will likely not pay (and not go) as they never wanted to go anyway.