Perhaps a silly question about logging dives...

howtomake

So next year I will be working on getting my Club Diver 2** for CMAS and my Advanced Open Water for PADI (need this one asap).

My question is can I log (& get signed by instructor) any "appropriate" dives on both my PADI log and my CMAS?

I mean a dive is a dive as long as I am with someone qualified, right?

MFZ

You keep 2 logs? I thinks that is unnecessary.

And I would not recommend logging PADI training dives against CMAS requirements
and vice versa.

If it is just about the number of dives you should be fine but any dives
dedicated to specific topics in one course I would not count them towards
a similar or even the same topic in the other course.

After all AOWD is just 5 dives on top of OWD and can easily be done over one weekend.

seadeuce

You can log PADI dives in your CFT logbook, towards your Club Diver, providing the dives have been done in Northern European (ie cold) waters.
The Red Sea diving will have to wait until later in the logbook!

Club Diver has depth-specific dives, not specialty-specific, so there's no problem there. Ideally the dives should be done in depth sequence, but they very rarely - if ever - are.

Cannot comment on logging CFT dives in a PADI logbook.


Seadeuce

howtomake

I'll have to look at both specifications and get back with some examples. Perhaps I can get a better understanding and form a specific question. Also no I don't log every dive into two log books, but was just wondering about the ones where this is some cross over.

Thanks, but yes all my dives next year will be in cold water, not sure if I can afford to go away, might as well see as much of Ireland underwater as possible.

joeKel73

Can't see any problem logging both. PADI dives tend to be skills based and CMAS dives tend to be depth based (for club diver anyway)... so if you cover your skills and hit the depth - no reason not to log in both.

Hand signals differ between the organisations so agree this during the buddy check. Also no-decompression-limits, tables and planning differs between organisations so ensure you can do both clearly. And don't confuse yourself! If it's only for 5 dives it shouldn't be a problem - do it PADI style and if you hit a depth you can log in CFT, do.

I think it's healthy to be aware of both systems and question why they differ - you'll realise decompression isn't an exact science and might want to read more into it.

howtomake

foto joe wrote: »

Can't see any problem logging both. PADI dives tend to be skills based and CMAS dives tend to be depth based (for club diver anyway)... so if you cover your skills and hit the depth - no reason not to log in both.

Hand signals differ between the organisations so agree this during the buddy check. Also no-decompression-limits, tables and planning differs between organisations so ensure you can do both clearly. And don't confuse yourself! If it's only for 5 dives it shouldn't be a problem - do it PADI style and if you hit a depth you can log in CFT, do.

I think it's healthy to be aware of both systems and question why they differ - you'll realise decompression isn't an exact science and might want to read more into it.

Ah yes that's what I wanted to know, thanks for answering. I'll make sure to try not confuse myself and always get the ok from my club's training officer on what counts and what doesn't when I go on any dives done outside of the club.

My "buddy" is the same and will always be the same for both PADI and CMAS.

diverdad

howtomake wrote: »

Ah yes that's what I wanted to know, thanks for answering. I'll make sure to try not confuse myself and always get the ok from my club's training officer on what counts and what doesn't when I go on any dives done outside of the club.

My "buddy" is the same and will always be the same for both PADI and CMAS.

You may want to revise this opinion or practice. While its great to have a buddy who you get along well with when facing diving conditions but its better to mix it up sometimes.

You may learn to adapt too much to each others style of diving. By adapting to each other you will also be compensating for each other. This could hinder your own personal development in particular areas.

I'll give you an example;

I was diving with my daughter as a buddy. We both enjoyed it. I however had some bouyancy issues and found it hard to actually sink myself or submerge. She on the other hand could drop herself down like a stone (better diver than me tbf) and would then yank on my leg or an outstretched arm. A quick tug under the water from her and then as soon as there was some weight over me I'd drift down and stabilise.
This became a pattern.
As a result I wasn't taking ownership of my problem because we had compensated through habit to get around it.
It never became an issue but was embarrassing when I buddied up with other divers that didn't know what was happening. An embarrassment that made me rectify the issue asap and focus on my breathing, weights, etc.

For her part she relied on me to always keep control of the dive and watch depth, time, air, etc.

One of my proudest moments as a father was on a dive trip/safari in the West, when I'd submerged with a new buddy and as we were getting our bearings there was a swim past of about five newly qualified divers already in the water. My daughter was leading them and was keeping control of them like a parent fish keeping a shoal of sprats together.
She had learned from diving with me but was now taking it on herself to use that experience and accepting the responsability.

Good luck with your levels training.

howtomake

diverdad wrote: »

You may want to revise this opinion or practice. While its great to have a buddy who you get along well with when facing diving conditions but its better to mix it up sometimes.

You may learn to adapt too much to each others style of diving. By adapting to each other you will also be compensating for each other. This could hinder your own personal development in particular areas.

I'll give you an example;

I was diving with my daughter as a buddy. We both enjoyed it. I however had some bouyancy issues and found it hard to actually sink myself or submerge. She on the other hand could drop herself down like a stone (better diver than me tbf) and would then yank on my leg or an outstretched arm. A quick tug under the water from her and then as soon as there was some weight over me I'd drift down and stabilise.
This became a pattern.
As a result I wasn't taking ownership of my problem because we had compensated through habit to get around it.
It never became an issue but was embarrassing when I buddied up with other divers that didn't know what was happening. An embarrassment that made me rectify the issue asap and focus on my breathing, weights, etc.

For her part she relied on me to always keep control of the dive and watch depth, time, air, etc.

One of my proudest moments as a father was on a dive trip/safari in the West, when I'd submerged with a new buddy and as we were getting our bearings there was a swim past of about five newly qualified divers already in the water. My daughter was leading them and was keeping control of them like a parent fish keeping a shoal of sprats together.
She had learned from diving with me but was now taking it on herself to use that experience and accepting the responsability.

Good luck with your levels training.

Hey Diverdad. That's a cute story about your daughter, but damn the youth and their ability to pick up things faster than their elders!:rolleyes:

Will definitely take into consideration on that point. Well at the moment we are not really 'buddy' buddy divers since we are both pretty much going through training, so we are split up with instructors. But it is an interesting point, it kind of highlights another possible plus for doing it the PADI way with going to different dive shops and not just in a club with the same people. Well I guess it depends on the club and the number of members. Our club seems to kind of rotate buddies but there are only so many combinations, especially over the years.

seadeuce

howtomake wrote: »

Our club seems to kind of rotate buddies but there are only so many combinations, especially over the years.

CFT have many clubs all over Ireland.

Why not dive as a visiting diver with other clubs? You would be made welcome, and you are insured for two dives with any CFT club as a visiting diver.

No shortage of buddies! Go and get them!!


Seadeuce

joeKel73

seadeuce wrote: »

...you are insured for two dives with any CFT club as a visiting diver...

I would have thought your CFT insurance would have covered as many dives with other CFT divers as you wanted... didn't think it was tied to your club? In fact are you not insured if you dive with CFT insurance with a non-cft (dan insured) diver?

howtomake

seadeuce wrote: »

CFT have many clubs all over Ireland.

Why not dive as a visiting diver with other clubs? You would be made welcome, and you are insured for two dives with any CFT club as a visiting diver.

No shortage of buddies! Go and get them!!


Seadeuce

That's good to know. Maybe I should wait until we get our club diver 2* before I unleash ourselves unto another club

seadeuce

howtomake wrote: »

Maybe I should wait until we get our club diver 2* before I unleash ourselves unto another club

Whereabouts do you live?

You do not have to be qualified to dive with another club, providing your dive buddy is! Even better if he/she is a Leading Diver or Instructor, IOW "experienced".

Seadeuce

howtomake

seadeuce wrote: »

Whereabouts do you live?

You do not have to be qualified to dive with another club, providing your dive buddy is! Even better if he/she is a Leading Diver or Instructor, IOW "experienced".

Seadeuce

No we are both at the same level, started the same time and same number of dives even. Thanks though.

seadeuce

howtomake wrote: »

No we are both at the same level, started the same time and same number of dives even. Thanks though.

Sorry about the misinterpretation here.

I meant you each can dive with another club provided your dive buddy assigned to you FROM THAT CLUB is qualified.

Bit of a difference.


Cheers


Seadeuce

howtomake

seadeuce wrote: »

Sorry about the misinterpretation here.

I meant you each can dive with another club provided your dive buddy assigned to you FROM THAT CLUB is qualified.

Bit of a difference.


Cheers


Seadeuce

Ah ok, I see. A misinterpretation, that's pretty rare on forums isn't it? Does this mean we have to start a flame war with each other