Offer reneged

Son Of A Vidic

I moved from the public sector in the private sector in February 2009. Coming from the HSE I was used to having a written signed contract of employment. I’m now working with a private medical company and I have never received or signed any contract since I joined. I was offered a package to join the company, but since then part of their offer/package is still outstanding.

1) I was short-changed 1000K from a bonus, when I was promised X amount. To clarify, this bonus was not performance related and was offered as part of a signing on fee, if I stayed with them past a certain time frame ect.

2) They also promised as part of their initial package to me, to take over our private health insurance payments after 12 months. This of course has not happened.

I had a review last month, which they delayed and delayed and I can now see why. I waited and waited and nothing was mentioned about them breaking they’re word to me and reneging on their offer when I was joining them. The consultant who recruited me has moved to another company, but is aware of the situation and remembers the terms offered to me. He has offered to help but what would you guys suggest. I am now aware that my boss and the company Directors are a shower of dangerous bast@rds, so I've held my fire until now.

qwertz

If you don't have it in writing then you don't hold good cards.

Mrs OBumble

medicman2009 wrote: »

The consultant who recruited me has moved to another company, but is aware of the situation and remembers the terms offered to me. He has offered to help but what would you guys suggest. I am now aware that my boss and the company Directors are a shower of dangerous bast@rds, so I've held my fire until now.

The consultant who recruited you does indeed seem to be a wise man. Perhaps you should follow his example.

Apart from that, are you prepared to have a major legal fight with the company? Seems to me that is what it would take to get what you were promised, and as the other poster said, without a written contract proving anything will be very difficult.

It all comes down to how angry you are with them, and how much you're prepared to fight.

I wouldn't blame you at all if you just walked away.

Son Of A Vidic

JustMary wrote: »

The consultant who recruited you does indeed seem to be a wise man....

Just in case of confusion here, this was a recruitment consultant - not someone working for my current employer.

I've no problem fighting own battles and have always been able to look after myself in that regard. It's just that when I do leave and move on, I'm concerned they may try and be spiteful in a reference, just to get back at me. You know by saying something like I'm not reliable, or something similarly damaging. I've seen how vindictive and poisonous they've been about former employees.

castie

medicman2009 wrote: »

Just in case of confusion here, this was a recruitment consultant - not someone working for my current employer.

I've no problem fighting own battles and have always been able to look after myself in that regard. It's just that when I do leave and move on, I'm concerned they may try and be spiteful in a reference, just to get back at me. You know by saying something like I'm not reliable, or something similarly damaging. I've seen how vindictive and poisonous they've been about former employees.

Your entitled to receive any reference provided about you also.
Any character assassination in these you could also go to court with.

Mrs OBumble

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Just in case of confusion here, this was a recruitment consultant - not someone working for my current employer.

Ahh.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I've no problem fighting own battles and have always been able to look after myself in that regard. It's just that when I do leave and move on, I'm concerned they may try and be spiteful in a reference, just to get back at me. You know by saying something like I'm not reliable, or something similarly damaging. I've seen how vindictive and poisonous they've been about former employees.

I'm sure you CAN fight your own battles. The question is, do you want to. It will be long, legal and tedious. You need a fair bit of anger to sustain you in fight ...

You may like to think abut some sort of agreement where you don't chase them for what they owe you, and they don't be nasty. This will take some negotiating, but may be your best bet.

seamus

You're entitled to receive a written copy of your contract of employment within 30 days (I think) of starting work there.

Ask the HR department for a copy of your employment contract, as they too must have it on file. If they don't have an employment contract on file for you, then you probably have the upper hand here because they have broken the law in regards to their obligations as an employer.

Speaking to NERA about what you can do is probably a good idea. Even though it's not written down, that doesn't mean you're not entitled to what was offered before you started your employment.

I would personally keep pestering someone - HR or your boss - about what was promised at the start of your employment until you get a firm answer about whether or not they're going to follow through on it. Innocent pestering - "What's the story with this?" or "Any idea when...?".
Once you know that they're not going to honour it, then you at least know what direction you have to take. They're obviously stalling, but going down the serious legal route straight away could be more damaging than simply forcing their hand on it.

Son Of A Vidic

castie wrote: »

Your entitled to receive any reference provided about you also.
Any character assassination in these you could also go to court with.

How would I know if they gave me a vindictive reference?
Could I request to see it in advance?

castie

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

How would I know if they gave me a vindictive reference?
Could I request to see it in advance?

No, you would have to make a freedom of information request after the interview to retrieve any references received by them.

Son Of A Vidic

castie wrote: »

No, you would have to make a freedom of information request after the interview to retrieve any references received by them.

Would that not make them wonder why I was doing so?

Here's a thought, say if I make a freedom of information request to the current bast@rds I work for, regarding references they got for me. That might make them wonder? They might realise that when I leave, I'll probably check references they've sent? Thoughts anyone?

seamus

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Would that not make them wonder why I was doing so?

Here's a thought, say if I make a freedom of information request to the current bast@rds I work for, regarding references they got for me. That might make them wonder? They might realise that when I leave, I'll probably check references they've sent? Thoughts anyone?

Freedom of information/data protection only applies to records. If a phone conversation takes place, there doesn't necessarily have to be any specific written or recorded reference. The potential employer might simply note, "Unsatisfactory reference" after speaking to your old employer.

Very hard to pre-empt a bad reference. The usual advice if you suspect that a previous employer will give or has given a bad reference is to have a friend ring up the company posing as a potential employer and request a reference.

Note also that there's nothing wrong with giving a bad reference, provided that it's completely factual.

Son Of A Vidic

I could put - references provided upon request on my CV, so when they request contact details I could give them a contact name & address only and no phone number. This hopefully might direct them down the written reference route. Or if I'm asked for references, could I ask them to request a written reference only?

I just want to be clear on this because I don't trust the bast@rds. They always speak very badly about previous employees, which I think is very unprofessional and reflects poorly on them. So I want to cover my ass when I leave.

Nody

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I could put - references provided upon request on my CV, so when they request contact details I could give them a contact name & address only and no phone number. This hopefully might direct them down the written reference route. Or if I'm asked for references, could I ask them to request a written reference only?

I just want to be clear on this because I don't trust the bast@rds. They always speak very badly about previous employees, which I think is very unprofessional and reflects poorly on them. So I want to cover my ass when I leave.

No one will ever accept a written reference only; written references are about as useful as toilet paper since they have no possibility to verify it.

Son Of A Vidic

Nody wrote: »

No one will ever accept a written reference only; written references are about as useful as toilet paper since they have no possibility to verify it.

Actually prior to me moving into the private sector, all my references had to be written upon HSE or NHS letter heads, with departmental stamps, date&stamps, fax details ect. Printed and clearly signed by the person providing the reference. A questionaire also had to be completed by the person giving the reference and forwarded to the new employer. Phone references were not acceptable and were not allowed.

doolox

It would be a great idea if the govt was to impose the same restrictions on the private sector. There is something sinister and Stalinist about the practice of private sector bosses holding the power of secret phone calls over the head of their hapless workers.

Any reference should be in the public domain regarding the employee and the current and former employers, so that the employee can refute any allegations made.

Mrs OBumble

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Actually prior to me moving into the private sector, all my references had to be written upon HSE or NHS letter heads, with departmental stamps, date&stamps, fax details ect. Printed and clearly signed by the person providing the reference. A questionaire also had to be completed by the person giving the reference and forwarded to the new employer. Phone references were not acceptable and were not allowed.

I'm sure there were still unofficial, off-the-record phone callls, as well as the formal process.

But it sounds like the formal reference process for heath professionals is a bit different from the rest of us - actually I have a vague memory of hearing something similar from social worker friends too.

Son Of A Vidic

JustMary wrote: »

I'm sure there were still unofficial, off-the-record phone callls, as well as the formal process.

But it sounds like the formal reference process for heath professionals is a bit different from the rest of us - actually I have a vague memory of hearing something similar from social worker friends too.

It is different for Doctors, Nurses ect alright. In a former role, I've filled out and completed questionaires for employees that were moving on. So back to my initial question, should I put on any future CV the following - "Reference provided upon request." or "Written references will be provided upon request." Any suggestions?

Eoin

The first one. Written references don't mean much.

InReality

keep in mind some companies will only provide written references and some places will only accept written references.

put down 1 anyhow , its more the norm.