The RSA *All RSA Discussion Here*

Going Forward

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

that just means they are doing the depts job for them.
Actually what does the DoT do these days, theres a specific quango vaguely under its control for every aspect of transport anyway.

Yes, and quangos abound; and when the RSA cant answer a query its sent to the DoT and vice versa, it seems to suit both of them to have this facility.

donkey balls

When the RSA was set up people who worked in the enforcement section for both trucks&buses/ drivers hours etc got taken under the RSA remit,From my dealings with them they seem to have a bit of cop on compared to there private counterparts in the UK who target Irish and other foreign drivers/companies with fines.
As for their driver training section it,s a joke anyone with a bus/truck licence has to do a one day course(driver CPC) for the next five years,For years on end I have been trained both as a driver&mgr by companies providing good training within the industry who know there stuff.
What has happened since the introduction of the driver CPC is that anyone can deliver the course,When I did my course to keep my licence upto date there was RSA appoved course books given to use yet they used pictures of american trucks&trailers which do not comply with irish law(no side barriers on them/under run bars),I have since questioned them about professional drivers having to do this course for the rest of their lives and the reply is that they will look into it compared to the likes of France were the five years training is a once off.
And the last thing I noticed as i will need to renew my drivers card is that they charged 50e here in Ireland yet the same card in the UK costs £19,I have questioned their costs compared to the UK yet all i get is we will be in contact.

Going Forward

donkey balls wrote: »

When the RSA was set up people who worked in the enforcement section for both trucks&buses/ drivers hours etc got taken under the RSA remit,From my dealings with them they seem to have a bit of cop on compared to there private counterparts in the UK who target Irish and other foreign drivers/companies with fines.
As for their driver training section it,s a joke anyone with a bus/truck licence has to do a one day course(driver CPC) for the next five years,For years on end I have been trained both as a driver&mgr by companies providing good training within the industry who know there stuff.
What has happened since the introduction of the driver CPC is that anyone can deliver the course,When I did my course to keep my licence upto date there was RSA appoved course books given to use yet they used pictures of american trucks&trailers which do not comply with irish law(no side barriers on them/under run bars),I have since questioned them about professional drivers having to do this course for the rest of their lives and the reply is that they will look into it compared to the likes of France were the five years training is a once off.
And the last thing I noticed as i will need to renew my drivers card is that they charged 50e here in Ireland yet the same card in the UK costs £19,I have questioned their costs compared to the UK yet all i get is we will be in contact.

The CPC annual training day is seen both as a joke and an insult by professional drivers who are often read to from a book by someone who clearly has no practical knowledge or interest in the subject.

I have been told of one individual giving the course on behalf of a training company who is awaiting a court appearance on serious charges. The individual by occupation is well known to drivers, but has since been discharged of his official duties.

Drivers I believe would welcome the CPC if it was a purely skills and critical driving excersise, along with tachograph training.
As it stands, all that is literally required to "pass" the course is simply to show up (and pay up), and listen to or participate or indeed "zone out" of it if one wishes.

donkey balls

Going Forward wrote: »

The CPC annual training day is seen both as a joke and an insult by professional drivers who are often read to from a book by someone who clearly has no practical knowledge or interest in the subject.

I have been told of one individual giving the course on behalf of a training company who is awaiting a court appearance on serious charges. The individual by occupation is well known to drivers, but has since been discharged of his official duties.

Drivers I believe would welcome the CPC if it was a purely skills and critical driving excersise, along with tachograph training.
As it stands, all that is literally required to "pass" the course is simply to show up (and pay up), and listen to or participate or indeed "zone out" of it if one wishes.

A freind of mine did his CPC last year and the person given the course had never sat in a truck never mind drive one yet she gave the course,What i find particular odd especially the RSA veiw is that a professional driver will have to do one a year for the rest of there driving careers:eek:.
So up to now all drivers are not professional untill they do this course as for doing a day every year for the rest of your driving career is mad,I have a mate who is an airline pilot he does two sim course a year can anyone name any other career that you need to do one day a year?.

Going Forward

Yes folks the longly awaited Customer Charter has been proudly quietly unveiled by the RSA:


http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/About%20Us/Customer_Charter_OCT_2010.pdf

it carries the very recent creation date of 17/12/10.




Dont waste your time reading it: if your not satisfied with the RSA's dealings with you, you complain to the RSA about.

L1011

There's some clear budget incineration going on in the RSA of late, seen/heard a far higher % of ads than normal across TV, radio, web video and web static.

Interesting mix of budgets, and effectiveness I'd suspect too. There are short purely verbal and informative radio ads that mainly deal with handling current road conditions - cheap and probably effective.

However, I've also seen a lengthy ad completely in Irish. On TG4 admittedly, but in an adbreak on an English language movie carrying English only 888 subtitles. I can't see this being at all effective - however they might be obliged to do some in Irish. I've never seen the same ad in English.

Lads, just noticed ye may have left out a word from that sig ye have .........


I'm calling any employee of the RSA to come speak to us as a community, stand up and work with us rather than against us, educate us and we in turn can educate you, for the RSA to really work it needs to understand the mind of it's target audience. Do this and I'm 100% (SURE/POSITIVE or SIMILAR MAYBE) it will pay dividends

Joe 90

Going Forward wrote: »

I'm also skeptical that whilst the motives of the RSA are impenetrable, it looks like it was set up at the behest of:
A. Insurance Companies who were forking out millions in claims every year, and who also seem to sponsor every road safety event; just look up the reports of financial costs per road death, not nice I know, but they are businesses after all.
B. The EU, cos there seems to be a safety statistics league going on, and we want to be the best. Fine, please provide decent roads, signage, services etc. etc.


PS- Get Gay Byrne to make a TV series about taking the test.

Given his age, I would say he never took one.

Going Forward

RoverJames wrote: »

Lads, just noticed ye may have left out a word from that sig ye have .........


I'm calling any employee of the RSA to come speak to us as a community, stand up and work with us rather than against us, educate us and we in turn can educate you, for the RSA to really work it needs to understand the mind of it's target audience. Do this and I'm 100% (SURE/POSITIVE or SIMILAR MAYBE) it will pay dividends

It would take a brave RSA soul to take it on for fear of being ambushed!

It is a very good idea, but one person wont be able to field all queries (and they would have to be filtered, some would be vexacious(new word??!!), how would it work then?

Gophur

Why would any representative of the RSA get involved? This forum is so biased against the RSA, refusing to even partially countenancer any good being done, that any person from the RSA would be wasting his/her time.

I've had contributions to this debate deleted, with some ridiculous excuse offered, I have no intention of partaking in any further discussions. Free speech is not allowed, for some reason.

And, as for this forum being representative of the motoring public? Many would beg to differ.

How about doing some proper lobbying? Go to the RSA and offer your opinions?
Contact the Board members?

Be proactive, and do not hide behind internet personae.

Tefral

Gophur wrote: »

How about doing some proper lobbying? Go to the RSA and offer your opinions?
Contact the Board members?

Be proactive, and do not hide behind internet personae.

I myself have personally tried this on behalf of a modified car forum I run. I have given them to opportunity to meet and talk to those they think their campains are for.. however I have been met with silence.

-Chris-

Going Forward wrote: »

It would take a brave RSA soul to take it on for fear of being ambushed!

It is a very good idea, but one person wont be able to field all queries (and they would have to be filtered, some would be vexacious(new word??!!), how would it work then?

The lads in the Politics forum managed to have a quite successful debate with Paul Gogarty not too long ago. It included everyone chipping in together to nominate questions, voting on which questions to ask, and then running a tightly moderated thread where these questions were put to PG.

I'm sure we could copy their template quite easily.

Gophur wrote: »

Why would any representative of the RSA get involved? This forum is so biased against the RSA, refusing to even partially countenancer any good being done, that any person from the RSA would be wasting his/her time.

Well, the hope would be that someone who's representing the RSA and is knowledgeable about their workings may be able to explain their stance on various issues and the logic behind their actions and hopefully win people over.
Normally people who are converted are the greatest zealots, if the RSA could create a group of zealots in the Motoring section of the largest discussion board in the country, I'd call that quite a coup.

Gophur wrote: »

I've had contributions to this debate deleted, with some ridiculous excuse offered, I have no intention of partaking in any further discussions. Free speech is not allowed, for some reason.

This is the excuse I gave.

-Chris- wrote: »

I've deleted some posts relating to a specific traffic incident. Please keep the discussion in this thread general about road behaviour or specific about the RSA.

I'm not sure how it's ridiculous, I'm merely trying to keep the thread on-topic. I'd hope that was fairly apparent.
As for free speech - no, it's not automatically granted on this privately owned website, and that's never been suggested otherwise.
Feel free to not partake in any further discussions, but please don't discuss/question moderation decisions on-thread as it takes the thread off-topic.

Seth Brundle

Gophur wrote: »

Why would any representative of the RSA get involved? This forum is so biased against the RSA, refusing to even partially countenancer any good being done, that any person from the RSA would be wasting his/her time.

I think that you are confusing bias with a either criticism or in some cases a lack of faith in their work.
People on here henerally consider their work to be of such poor quality to be of no use. Can you show any evidence of bias?

Gophur wrote: »

I've had contributions to this debate deleted, with some ridiculous excuse offered, I have no intention of partaking in any further discussions. Free speech is not allowed, for some reason.

Were your posts removed for breaking the rules or because their content was not aligned with the moderators or what?
As for free speech, what is this? Free speech is allowed but at a cost!

Gophur wrote: »

And, as for this forum being representative of the motoring public? Many would beg to differ.

Maybe I missed it but I don't recall anyone claiming that this forum represented the motoring public. It is a forum on the internet for people who are interested in cars or who have a query about cars.
What do you think this forum represents?

Gophur wrote: »

How about doing some proper lobbying? Go to the RSA and offer your opinions?
Contact the Board members?

Be proactive, and do not hide behind internet personae.

Maybe that is what the OP plans but you seem to have dismissed it before its even completed. Furthermore, I'm not hiding behind anything and if someone really wanted to find out more about me, they could.

Going Forward

Unfortunately the RSA comes across as being beyond reproach and will not be subject to external analysis or questioning.

If any one has had cause to phone enquiring about for example a technical issue, they invariably ask you for your name!!

That is simply bad practise, but AFAIK done deliberately so that :

A Your issues are noted against you to dissuade you from calling again
B The person who has dealt with you can inform others "in the office" of your awkwardness
C To enable the person you are looking for "TO BE IN A MEETING"


If anyone has had a genuinely tough query handled well by the RSA in a pro-active fashion, or if the RSA has ever admitted to anyone that they have made a mistake please, please post it on this thread!

Marcus.Aurelius

1. How about some useful information for their educational ads, rather than the usual baby steps crap. Keep left unless overtaking on dual-carriageways and motorways, fine them if they don't. Easy to lobby government for.
2. Replace mobile speed cameras with fixed location cameras. If the idea is to modify behaviour rather than collect statistics, why not advertise and signpost the cameras?
3. Lobby government to enforce new driver training, something like the Aussies have, except with less time delays in getting a full driver licence.
4. Fire that moron Byrne and replace him with a retired Traffic Corps copper, (not a Fianna Failer bloody higher officer)
5. Review all speed limits on road by road basis instead of the bloody stupid blanket limit crap. It makes sense to modify the limit around dangerous bends etc.
6. Enforce the existing rules and modified speed limits fairly and completely, no half hearted crap.
7. Get rid of bus lanes and replace them with Transit lanes in the cities, where cars with multiple passengers can also use the lanes with buses and taxis.

I'm sure there's more, but my blood pressure needs some attention.

Going Forward

"The RSA received a large number of responses to the
consultation which are currently being evaluated. The RSA will
then finalise its recommendation to the Minister for
Transport."

(- In relation to a Public Consultation on the proposal to introduce Daytime Running Lights in Ireland.)-Not a bad idea, granted!

But what precisely is a Large Number- 10, 200, 3450000?

Has anyone who has had dealings with the RSA, ie they have your contact details, ever been contacted to partake in these Public Consultations?

Also, in a proposal to changes in vehicle braking regulations seen here:

http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Vehicles-and-Legislation/Consultations/Closed-consultations-/Proposed-changes-to-the-braking-requirement/http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Vehicles-and-Legislation/Consultations/Closed-consultations-/Proposed-changes-to-the-braking-requirement/

The following statement is published:

"Stakeholders contacted included:
vehicle manufacturers and convertors (150)
vehicle distributors (1200)
members of the Gardai Siochana (8)
state agencies
relevant RSA staff consultants."

The mention of 150 manufacturers and convertors, along with an astonishing figure of 1200 vehicle distributors appears at least to be gilding the lily somewhat.

Its also noteworthy that no vehicle users were contacted, even though the RSA is in possesion of all license holders details.

The simple time/logistical planning required alone in contacting and receiving useful information from some 1350 different businesses (which must have been from all around the world if the figures mentioned are to be believed) would take years to undertake, before any such data could even be collated, considered or verified etc.

These figures look a bit exaggerated to me- Doubting Thomas.

Yakult

I thought one of the new adverts on TV was pure tosh.

Its the one where the mother is saying how the son had a few drinks and stumbled onto the road and got knocked down...

Whats the point of it?

Is the RSA telling people that if your drunk, dont stumble onto a road and get killed?

or

Are they telling drivers that we're responsable for some drunk people falling onto the road infront of our vehicals and dying?

Eoin

Maybe it really is as simple as them asking pedestrians to take care around roads if they're pissed. If you looked at their site, you can see a link right on the home page for pedestrian safety.

ninty9er

Nobody is contacted about public consultations, otherwise they would be targeted consultations.

The RSA announces these things in newspapers from time to time and also on its website.

I submitted a response to the DRL on and received the following reply

Dear ninty9er,

Thank you for your further comments to the Road Safety Authority Public Consultation on the policy options available for the use of Daytime Running Lights (DRL).



Your comments are greatly appreciated and will be taken into consideration as part of the overall consultation process.



Kind regards



RSA Employee

Vehicle Standards

Going Forward

ninty9er wrote: »

Nobody is contacted about public consultations, otherwise they would be targeted consultations.

The RSA announces these things in newspapers from time to time and also on its website.

I submitted a response to the DRL on and received the following reply

What did you think of the process, you didnt elaborate, and I'm a bit slow tonight!!!!

Were you satisfied with that ackowledgement reply?
Did you ever hear any more from them to either say they agreed with your input, or disagreed for any reason, etc?
Does it look like a system generated reply?

In the past I submitted responses too, but dont know if they were ever read.

Also, according to their website, the RSA claims to have contacted more than 1350 stakeholders in a consultation re:

"Update on proposed amendments to Braking Regulations for:
passenger vehicles (M2 and M3 categories)
goods vehicles (N category)
trailers (O category vehicles)

Stakeholders contacted included:
vehicle manufacturers and convertors (150)
vehicle distributors (1200)
members of the Gardai Siochana (8)
state agencies
relevant RSA staff consultants."

It doesnt appear that many actual owners or service providers such as Bus Eireann, the Irish Road Haulage Association or the Coach Transport Tourism Council were contacted, even though they are the ones running these kind of vehicles and might be relied on to give some worthwhile input!

It would actually be interesting if the RSA would truthfully disclose how many valid responses they receive for each public consultation, as to do so could show if anyone actually bothered to make a submission!!

If numbers were very low, then either there is public apathy towards actually making a submission, or is it that the mechanism for advertising the consultation should be improved?

Going Forward

eoin wrote: »

Maybe it really is as simple as them asking pedestrians to take care around roads if they're pissed. If you looked at their site, you can see a link right on the home page for pedestrian safety.

It is that simple, but the ad confuses it by introducing too many sideline issues which distract from it, as mentioned in the previous post.

Gimmicks such as handing out Hi Viz jackets at the Ploughing Championships are all well and good, but surely a stack of these things could also be offered to rural publicans for walking customers to take on the way home, it might well save a life.

Anyone who drives late at n ight on country roads is perpetually afraid of hitting a dark object, but the dark object to my knowledge does not ever get fined for being a danger unless they are literally lying in the middle of the road.

Drivers are ultimately responsible, as pedestrians who also have responsibilities do not as yet have license plates attached to them!!

Going Forward

Dead Thread?- No Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"According to a recent Goodbody report ‘Cost Benefit Parameters and Application Rules
for Transport Project Appraisal (August 2004)’ road fatalities in 2004 cost the state
€852,720,000 and serious injuries cost €911,363,200.

The cost to the State is most clearly seen in relation to the use of scarce resources of the
Hospital and Emergency services and the impact of so many injury admissions as a
consequence of road collisions."

Source-
The National Safety Council's Presentation to:
The Joint Committee on Enterprise and Small Business: October 19th 2005
The Joint Committee on Transport: October 20th 2005

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=joc+road+safety
+2005&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=


Dont be under any illusion that speed cameras, penalty points etc are not state fundraisers to offset the costs of traffid accidents.

The RSA strap-line should be changed to "Working to Save Money".

The somewhat poignant "Working to Save Lives" catch phrase is not apt as the RSA is not a medical organisation.