We might have joined NATO around 1980?

newcavanman

According to the 1980 government papers revealed the other day , as part of the negotiations between Thatcher and Haughey, we seriously discussed possible/probable NATO membership for ROI . I was just wondering, considering the times that were in it, if we had joined, what do people think might have happened the Defense Forces, particularly the Aer Corp . In my opinion, the most likely scenario, was to see US foces based here . Most likely to include the following , a P-3 squadron, probably based in Shannon or Knock, and also an air defense squadron, F-15A s probably .Also we might have had part of the country used for low level training, and the likely regular naval visits to Cork etc, possibly including Carriers .
The other scenario is that the Aer Corp might have been expanded . If similar requirements to the above were included, we might have seen the supply of surplus F-4E s which were readily available from US stocks at the time, and also possibly the supply of C-130s . Im not sure we would have bought or being supplied with MR aircraft, as the US seemed to have had adequate numbers of aircraft, the baseing rights for a permanent deployment would have been more valuable i think . Perhaps we might have been supplied with surplus F-4 s in exchange for the baseing rights ? I ventured Knock as a possible base, because i do remember chat amongst the spotters in Dublin around that time, that the runway was of a lenght to accomodate B-52s and other US military aircraft, that Monsignour Horan, was hedging his bets regarding the viability of the airport .
Also of course the yanks would have been interested in having fighter aircraft which could help to cover the UK-Iceland gap , i seem to recall there was a plan to deploy fighter to Macrahinish in the Hebridies to partly close this gap . Anyway, just wonder what the rest of ye think of this scenario?

westdub

According to the 1980 government papers revealed the other day , as part of the negotiations between Thatcher and Haughey, we seriously discussed possible/probable NATO membership for ROI

From what I understand there was never any mention of Ireland joining NATO from the goverment in 1980, just a comment from the late Brian Lenihan snr that we 'Might' in the future be willing to join ''if '' the UK gave up the 6 counties...

Anyway, just wonder what the rest of ye think of this scenario?

As far as I'm concerned it's just pure fantasy and we might as well discuss the chance of the Air Corps getting F15s for the 1916 anniversary...:rolleyes:

Steyr

newcavanman wrote: »

particularly the Aer Corp .

Its Air Corps or Aer Chór na hÉireann, not Aer Corp.. Welcome to A&A Dave

OS119

NATO has only ever really been interested in Ireland for basing rights for Maritime Patrol/Anti-Submarine Warfare Aircraft and the Tankers, Fighters and AWACS to support them in operations over the Atlantic. certainly there might have been some equipment transfers had they been asked for, but wthin NATO there has never been any over-riding need to have active Irish involement - firstly because as a relatively poor country with 4 million inhabitants Ireland was never going to bring much to the table anyway, and secondly the internal political (insurgency?) problems that active Irish participation might well bring would outweigh whatever active participation Ireland was able to bring forward.

Stornoway, Machrihanish and Prestwick are/were designated forward operating bases for such air groups (along with half a dozen other outlying scottish airfields) - Shannon would have been a useful addition to that, and still would be - but as the range and speed of MP aircraft increased, and Air-to-Air refueling became more and more commonplace, the 'need' for FOB Shannon decreased.

the obvious parallel is with Iceland - Iceland is a member of NATO and has a large, NATO run airfield at Keflavic who'se role is closing the Greenland-Iceland-UK gap to Submarines, Ships and Aircraft. it has no Air Force, no Navy, and had to invent an Army in order to send a platoon to Afghanistan. its value to NATO was in its location, not in whatever force it was able to generate.

xflyer

Well Ireland would have joined NATO back when it was formed but there was the issue of recognising existing borders which wasn't really possible back then. It is possible now of course. Not that it will happen, seeing as the myth of neutrality has gained such a hold.

But for the sake of discussing the issue. It might well have led to a beefing up of the defence forces via military aid from the US. No F4s, a far more likely scenario would F5s, probably F5As. They were the lightweight fighter of choice for small countries at the time. A bunch of Hueys for the army and a certain Americanisation of the ground troops. Probably M16s and M1 helmets like most of the rest of Europe at the time.

As for bases, yes Maritime patrol and perhaps a Naval base somewhere like Galway and maybe a few radar stations like the one on Woodcock hill. The original one was blown up by idiots who actually thought it was a NATO radar station.

It's fun to speculate but it would never happen.