More...soccer for dummies..

Fittle

I posted a while ago, am a mum with a soccer mad 8yr old and ye were all pretty helpful about a real madrid jersey..and tips about what I should or shouldn't shout from the sideline.:D

Anyway, he got the jersey and got some vouchers for sportshops...so he now has the real madrid jersey (with ronaldo 7 on the back:)) and yesterday, we bought the barcelona jersey from his vouchers. He wants to get messi on that jersey.

So I know nothing about european football and I'm wondering if real madrid and barcelona are like man u and liverpool??? Are they extreme rivals? There's a lad on the road (he's 9, and much more street wise than my lad:mad:) and he says that wearing the rm jersey one day, and wearing the bc jersey the next day, is the same as wearing the man u jersey and the liverpool jersey...this might sound like a silly post, but I'd appreciate your advice again lads. Thanks:D

Blatter

Allthough they are bitter rivals, I can assure you he won't get slagged for it.
Wearing a Liverpool jersey one day and a united one the next, is a completely different story because they are both premiership teams.

In short, it's ok to wear what ever foreign jersey he likes(excluding England).

Fizman

It kind of is in a way. It's arguable that the rivalry is bigger than that of Man Utd v Liverpool, particularly on a global scale. A part of me would like to think that a 9 year old kid could get away with wearing whatever he wants, but such is the tribal nature of soccer (even amongst kids of that age), it probably would be frowned upon by a few, and slaggings would ensue.

Just make sure that if you force him to pick one, it's gotta be Messi/Barca.

greendom

Huge huge rivalry, fuelled with years of oppression of Catalunya and superiority complexes on both sides. Nothing wrong with an 8 year old in Ireland wearing both though imo

S.R.F.C.

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

In short, it's ok to wear what ever foreign jersey he likes(excluding England).

Unfortunately the above is true in most people's eyes here. Although it should read excluding the premiership rather than England as a whole.

OhNoYouDidn't

Fittle can get away with comparing Il Classico to Man U and Liverpool, no-one else can.

In short Fillte, it is an oxymoron considering the extreme politics of the derby and what both clubs represent but an 8 year old kid in Dublin can get away with it.

OhNoYouDidn't

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

Allthough they are bitter rivals, I can assure you he won't get slagged for it.
Wearing a Liverpool jersey one day and a united one the next, is a completely different story because they are both premiership teams.

In short, it's ok to wear what ever foreign jersey he likes(excluding England).

Am I reading this right? You don't consider Man U and Liverpool to be foreign?

tonycascarino

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

In short, it's ok to wear what ever foreign jersey he likes.

This.

stovelid

I'd hazard a guess (as in I don't know cos I'm not from Spain) that Madrid/Barca is worse because of the politics and that fact that both clubs have always been the top dogs in La Liga.

United and Liverpool is a regional derby that got worse in recent times because of the see-sawing of success between the two clubs (70s/90s vs 90s/00's) although they are both close enough really (40 miles) to generate real hatred.

If City keep going the way they are, the real rivalry for United will be restored instead of being one-way for the last 20 years.

Fittle

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Fittle can get away with comparing Il Classico to Man U and Liverpool, no-one else can.

In short Fillte, it is an oxymoron considering the extreme politics of the derby and what both clubs represent but an 8 year old kid in Dublin can get away with it.

Emmmm, glad you dumbed that down for me, hadn't a clue what you were talking about:D

So we'll just tell the 9yr old street-wise kid (who has neither jersey and is a chelsea fan:rolleyes:) to take a running jump?

OhNoYouDidn't

Fittle wrote: »

Emmmm, glad you dumbed that down for me, hadn't a clue what you were talking about:D

So we'll just tell the 9yr old street-wise kid (who has neither jersey and is a chelsea fan:rolleyes:) to take a running jump?

I would.

Its clear your son isn't straddling the fence on the Spanish national question and just has two shirts of the two best teams out there with the two best players out there.

That or tell the 9 year old that Chelsea are a shower of loyalist bástards and get your kid a Celtic shirt.... :pac:

Fittle

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I would.

Its clear your son isn't straddling the fence on the Spanish national question and just has two shirts of the two best teams out there with the two best players out there.

That or tell the 9 year old that Chelsea are a shower of loyalist bástards and get your kid a Celtic shirt.... :pac:

Hilarious:D Boards soccer forum is brill:D:D

Blatter

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

Allthough they are bitter rivals, I can assure you he won't get slagged for it.
Wearing a Liverpool jersey one day and a united one the next, is a completely different story because they are both premiership teams.

In short, it's ok to wear what ever foreign jersey he likes(excluding England).

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Am I reading this right? You don't consider Man U and Liverpool to be foreign?

You didn't read it right.

Dolph Starbeam

I doubt many people in Ireland will care to much to be honest, i think i still have a phiot somewhere i me and my brother in Real and Barca Jerseys from a holiday in Spain years and years ago. Now that he has a Barca jersey he can throw away the Real jersey anyways.


edit: Found it, i think that Real jersey fitted me for about 5 years

OhNoYouDidn't

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

You didn't read it right.

Well you will have to clarify. You are saying that wearing a Barca the Real shirt is ok as they are foreign, but wearing a Liverpool then Man U one isn't because they are EPL sides.

Spain is as foreign as England....

BERBA

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Am I reading this right? You don't consider Man U and Liverpool to be foreign?

pedantic pat:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Fittle

MOG7 wrote: »

Now that he has a Barca jersey he can throw away the Real jersey anyways.[/IMG]

Love the pic:D

You obviously never read my previous post before Xmas (can't find it now) about 'what number is ronaldo', when I got the wrong number printed on his RM Ronaldo jersey from santa:eek::eek:. That RM jersey will be worn by him till he's 27, after the drama I went through if I have my way!!!;)

OhNoYouDidn't

BERBA wrote: »

pedantic pat:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Thats not pedantry..

Saying that its ok to wear Barca and Real shirts despite it being the biggest derby in the world on the basis its 'foreign', but not Man U and Liverpool is not only contradictory, its downright daft.

Eirebear

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Am I reading this right? You don't consider Man U and Liverpool to be foreign?

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

get your kid a Celtic shirt.... :pac:

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

not only contradictory, its downright daft.

You said it dude.

Blatter

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Well you will have to clarify. You are saying that wearing a Barca the Real shirt is ok as they are foreign, but wearing a Liverpool then Man U one isn't because they are EPL sides.

Spain is as foreign as England....

I would have thought it's fairly self explanatory tbh but here goes.

99% of Irish soccer fans support English clubs.
Therefore, If you wear a Utd jersey, It's fairly safe to assume that you are a United fan. However if you wear a Liverpool jersey the next day, you will offending the people who thought you were a Utd fan and hence the flurry of slaggings. You would also be looked on as a fake football supporter by others because you would be seen to be changing clubs. Even if people thought you weren't switching clubs, you wouldn't be looked upon as a true football supporter.

As 99% of Irish soccer fans support English clubs, It is safe to assume that 99% of Irish soccer fans don't support clubs from outside England(ala, Spain).
Therefore if you wear a Barcelona jersey, it's fairly safe to assume that you are not a Barcelona fan. So, if you wear a Real Madrid jersey the next day, you will not be offending anyone, because nobody assumed you were a Barcelona fan in the first place.

Dub13

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Spain is as foreign as England....

In the strict sense yes that statement is true but culturally we are a lot closer to England then Spain.

Fittle

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

I would have thought it's fairly self explanatory tbh but here goes.

99% of Irish soccer fans support English clubs.
Therefore, If you wear a Utd jersey, It's fairly safe to assume that you are a United fan. However if you wear a Liverpool jersey the next day, you will offending the people who thought you were a Utd fan and hence the flurry of slaggings. You would also be looked on as a fake football supporter by others because you would be seen to be changing clubs. Even if people thought you weren't switching clubs, you wouldn't be looked upon as a true football supporter.

As 99% of Irish soccer fans support English clubs, It is safe to assume that 99% of Irish soccer fans don't support clubs from outside England(ala, Spain).
Therefore if you wear a Barcelona jersey, it's fairly safe to assume that you are not a Barcelona fan. So, if you wear a Real Madrid jersey the next day, you will not be offending anyone, because nobody assumed you were a Barcelona fan in the first place.

Just brilliant:D

Sorry lads, but MY biggest gripe with the RM vs Barca debate is that the RM jersey stays clean for approximately 17 minutes:mad: and he'll get at least a full day out of the barca jersey.... Apologies, but I'm the mammy;)

S.R.F.C.

Fittle wrote: »

Just brilliant:D

Sorry lads, but MY biggest gripe with the RM vs Barca debate is that the RM jersey stays clean for approximately 17 minutes:mad: and he'll get at least a full day out of the barca jersey.... Apologies, but I'm the mammy;)

Brilliant! And there ya go, thread done with, think we can end all arguments at that.

OhNoYouDidn't

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

I would have thought it's fairly self explanatory tbh but here goes.

99% of Irish soccer fans support English clubs.
Therefore, If you wear a Utd jersey, It's fairly safe to assume that you are a United fan. However if you wear a Liverpool jersey the next day, you will offending the people who thought you were a Utd fan and hence the flurry of slaggings. You would also be looked on as a fake football supporter by others because you would be seen to be changing clubs. Even if people thought you weren't switching clubs, you wouldn't be looked upon as a true football supporter.

As 99% of Irish soccer fans support English clubs, It is safe to assume that 99% of Irish soccer fans don't support clubs from outside England(ala, Spain).
Therefore if you wear a Barcelona jersey, it's fairly safe to assume that you are not a Barcelona fan. So, if you wear a Real Madrid jersey the next day, you will not be offending anyone, because nobody assumed you were a Barcelona fan in the first place.

THAT was self explanatory?

The idea that an 8 year old kid wearing an English club shirt is 'more' of a fan of their foreign club than an 8 year old kid wearing a Spanish shirt is bewildering. But the problem is you actually believe it to be true.

You have almost stumbled onto what LoI fans think of EPL fans by the way. If only you followed your own logic one step further...

OhNoYouDidn't

Dub13 wrote: »

In the strict sense yes that statement is true but culturally we are a lot closer to England then Spain.

As may be, but the idea that a Man U fan from Ireland can sneer at a Barca fan from Ireland for supporting a 'foreign' side neatly encapsulates the rather strange mindset that too many Irish football fans suffer from.

From any rational viewpoint its bizarre stuff, and made worse by the fact that it will be defended on here as a viewpoint.

Blatter

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

As may be, but the idea that a Man U fan from Ireland can sneer at a Barca fan from Ireland for supporting a 'foreign' side neatly encapsulates the rather strange mindset that too many Irish football fans suffer from.

From any rational viewpoint its bizarre stuff, and made worse by the fact that it will be defended on here as a viewpoint.

You seem confused.

That's a totally different issue that has nothing to do with my viewpoint.

OhNoYouDidn't

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

You seem confused.

That's a totally different issue that has nothing to do with my viewpoint.

Damn right I am confused. What the hell are you saying, as you aren't making a great deal of sense. An 8 year old can have two teams in one foreign league but not another?

Bodhisopha

Prefers La Liga over the EPL? Smart kid, you should be very proud of him.

Dub13

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

As may be, but the idea that a Man U fan from Ireland can sneer at a Barca fan from Ireland for supporting a 'foreign' side neatly encapsulates the rather strange mindset that too many Irish football fans suffer from.

From any rational viewpoint its bizarre stuff, and made worse by the fact that it will be defended on here as a viewpoint.

I don't think in this instances we are talking about how 'foreign' man utd or barca are to us as Irish people.The point here is even non soccer people like the granny on the road will flag a young lad one day wearing a Utd top and the next day wearing a Liverpool top.Thats because culturally we are very very similar to England.

The same granny will not have a clue about El Clasico..

Fittle

Lads, lads lads....

As its my 8yr old we're talking about can I explain that he's a Man U fan normally. We don't have skysports, but keep up to date on the premier league website/soccer saturday etc, and he's obsessed by Match Attax - so he follows Man U in the english premiere league, and wouldn't be caught dead wearing any other english league jersey - wouldn't even drink from another english league cup, as I witnessed when someone gave him a cup of sprite in an arsenal mug over xmas - he was horrified, to say the least!

He hasn't a clue about the spanish league, and isn't a 'fan' of either barca or RM or Lazio or anyone else for that matter. He's gotten to know both messi and ronaldo from fifa 11 and the world cup and youtube etc - but we don't 'follow' the spainish leagues and couldn't tell you who wins what, when.

So 'Soccer4lifes' post nailed it on the head for me.

OhNoYouDidn't

Dub13 wrote: »

I don't think in this instances we are talking about how 'foreign' man utd or barca are to us as Irish people.The point here is even non soccer people like the granny on the road will flag a young lad one day wearing a Utd top and the next day wearing a Liverpool top.Thats because culturally we are very very similar to England.

The same granny will not have a clue about El Clasico..

and doesn't that say a great deal about the myopic relationship Irish people have with football. Imagine a kid in Dublin getting abuse for wearing foreign jersey a over foreign jersey b.

Blatter

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Damn right I am confused. What the hell are you saying, as you aren't making a great deal of sense. An 8 year old can have two teams in one foreign league but not another?

I'm saying that if an 8yr old Irish kid is wearing a Man Utd jersey, it's safe to assume that he's a Man Utd fan. So he will inevitably get jeered at for wearing a Liverpool jersey.

If another 8yr old Irish kid wears a Barcelona jersey, it's safe to assume he's not a Barcelona fan, as 99% of Irish soccer fans, support English clubs. So, because it's assumed he is not a Barcelona fan, it's OK to wear the Real Madrid jersey because he more than likely supports neither.

OhNoYouDidn't

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

I'm saying that if an 8yr old Irish kid is wearing a Man Utd jersey, it's safe to assume that he's a Man Utd fan. So he will inevitably get jeered at for wearing a Liverpool jersey.

If another 8yr old Irish kid wears a Barcelona jersey, it's safe to assume he's not a Barcelona fan, as 99% of Irish soccer fans, support English clubs. So, because it's assumed he is not a Barcelona fan, it's OK to wear the Real Madrid jersey because he more than likely supports neither.

What is it safe to assume about him if he is wearing a Shamrock Rovers jersey?

Blatter

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

What is it safe to assume about him if he is wearing a Shamrock Rovers jersey?

That he's a Shamrock Rovers fan, what's your point?

Fittle

If he's wearing a SR jersey, it's safe to assume he supports SR no doubt, and his dad probably brings him to SR matches. But even if he's wearing the SR jersey, it's still ok for him to support an english premier league club, and wear that jersey also.

That's the way it is with his mates anyway - one lad wears a Bohs jersey the odd time, and an english premier league jersey another time, and other times, a barca jersey.

OhNoYouDidn't

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

That he's a Shamrock Rovers fan, what's your point?

I'm just trying to get to grips with your assumption matrix - the wearing of what shirts make you a fan and what don't.

Dub13

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

and doesn't that say a great deal about the myopic relationship Irish people have with football.

The Irish people are a complex beast,a thread about a 8 year old is maybe not the best place to try and trash out a debate on it especially considering the said 8 years olds mother thinks Lazio play in Spain...:)

stovelid

Fittle wrote: »

If he's wearing a SR jersey, it's safe to assume he supports SR no doubt, and his dad probably brings him to SR matches. But even if he's wearing the SR jersey, it's still ok for him to support an english premier league club, and wear that jersey also.

That's the way it is with his mates anyway - one lad wears a Bohs jersey the odd time, and an english premier league jersey another time, and other times, a barca jersey.

Talaght stadium has plenty of kids in English jerseys. Why not? They're supporting their local team and like an English team as well.

Don't see a problem there.

Fittle

Dub13 wrote: »

The Irish people are a complex beast,a thread about a 8 year old is maybe not the best place to try and trash out a debate on it especially considering the said 8 years olds mother thinks Lazio play in Spain...:)

Whoops:eek: Hence the thread title:p

eZe^

This thread makes me sad! But as a mod, gotta be impartial;


Lads, the pointless bickering in here over whether F.C Barcelona (the best club in the world ) are more foreign than Liverpool F.C is just that, pointless. We've done it before, and while it does bring up interesting debate at times, it gets very militant very quickly. Now, I personally don't have a problem with the debate, but it isn't for this thread. This thread is about a mother (who naively let her son get a satan 7 shirt :P ) who is just looking for some advice. I have no problem with the debate continuing in a more appropriate 'forum'.


My advice - burn the Madrid jersey and buy him two Barca ones, one with Messi 10, and another with Pique 3. hahaha. Don't poison your kid with Real Madrid tendencies so young, he'll do better in his junior cert and leaving cert if he follows Barca, I promise you that. :P :P :P :P

dfx-

When he becomes a full blown Barca fanboy in later years (as all good boys do..), he'll probably try to hide or disown the bit where he used to have a Real jersey. For his own sake

Nudge him towards Barcelona. Go on

CSF

Ditch them both and choose Atletico.

eZe^

CSF wrote: »

Ditch them both and choose Atletico.

Setting the kid up for a rollercoaster of nearly moments. He'll die of a heart attack and frustration by 15. :P

dahat

Slagging of football jerseys and allegiances are all part of football supporting.

Your boy wont take too long to be as streetwise as the boy who slagged him off.
as for the jerseys,leave him wear as he wishes from sides outside the EPL,just keep that man utd fire burning inside him!!!!

krankykitty

The lad has good taste anyway, Man Utd and La Liga...

pickarooney

OhNoYouDidn't has so much righteous indignation to feed off in this thread he's going to explode

Fittle

eZe^ wrote: »

This thread makes me sad! But as a mod, gotta be impartial;


Lads, the pointless bickering in here over whether F.C Barcelona (the best club in the world ) are more foreign than Liverpool F.C is just that, pointless. We've done it before, and while it does bring up interesting debate at times, it gets very militant very quickly. Now, I personally don't have a problem with the debate, but it isn't for this thread. This thread is about a mother (who naively let her son get a satan 7 shirt :P ) who is just looking for some advice. I have no problem with the debate continuing in a more appropriate 'forum'.


My advice - burn the Madrid jersey and buy him two Barca ones, one with Messi 10, and another with Pique 3. hahaha. Don't poison your kid with Real Madrid tendencies so young, he'll do better in his junior cert and leaving cert if he follows Barca, I promise you that. :P :P :P :P

Are you sure you're not a Parenting Mod too:D:D

Advice was great lads, thanks - pal of ours has a 15yr old Man U fan and today, dropped us up a bag of old Man U jerseys...so he's out the back, standing in his new goalpost, with that very colourful Peter Schmeichal jersey on, and has decided he might just become a goalie after all:D:D.

You know......this one...

http://www.google.ie/imgres?imgurl=http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ykzXszKKxso/TJ-mG4mSUcI/AAAAAAAADYw/lCLsQ4QhXMg/s640/Peter-Schmeichel.jpg&imgrefurl=http://forums.pesfan.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D235495%26page%3D55&h=381&w=594&sz=62&tbnid=k4WK78JmXoCEjM:&tbnh=87&tbnw=135&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dpeter%2Bschmeichel&zoom=1&q=peter+schmeichel&hl=en&usg=__hWQRar9i-K_8NjE90De21EdyHP8=&sa=X&ei=I8IhTZ6DA5O2hAer7pm3Dg&ved=0CFAQ9QEwCQ

Mars Bar

Fittle wrote: »

Are you sure you're not a Parenting Mod too:D:D

Advice was great lads, thanks - pal of ours has a 15yr old Man U fan and today, dropped us up a bag of old Man U jerseys...so he's out the back, standing in his new goalpost, with that very colourful Peter Schmeichal jersey on, and has decided he might just become a goalie after all:D:D.

You know......this one...

http://www.google.ie/imgres?imgurl=http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ykzXszKKxso/TJ-mG4mSUcI/AAAAAAAADYw/lCLsQ4QhXMg/s640/Peter-Schmeichel.jpg&imgrefurl=http://forums.pesfan.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D235495%26page%3D55&h=381&w=594&sz=62&tbnid=k4WK78JmXoCEjM:&tbnh=87&tbnw=135&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dpeter%2Bschmeichel&zoom=1&q=peter+schmeichel&hl=en&usg=__hWQRar9i-K_8NjE90De21EdyHP8=&sa=X&ei=I8IhTZ6DA5O2hAer7pm3Dg&ved=0CFAQ9QEwCQ

I hope your lad realises just how lucky he is to get those old jerseys!

Fittle

Oh he does...got an AIG and Sharp one too (all in great nick!)....and an old blue one, which I think was an away jersey a few seasons ago...he's only delighted and we've been trying to find man u playing in them, on youtube:D:D

Mars Bar

This one? I wanted it so bad but never got it.

Fittle

That's it:D

It's age ten though...:( Sorry!

He got a very plain black one too - just with a grey stripe and man u logo in grey too - think it's a training jersey, but might have been a cheapy from long ago? Any ideas?