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RIRA make new years statement- Threaten to "expand its campaign in 2011"

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Comments

  • #302
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    Protestants got killed you know. Sectarian murder. All there is to it.
    Catholics did too, and a Mormon at Omagh, the attack was not sectarian, you are simply WRONG.


    If all they wanted to do was kill protestants why would they bomb a town with a large nationalist population?


  • #303
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    Catholics did too, and a Mormon at Omagh, the attack was not sectarian, you are simply WRONG.


    If all they wanted to do was kill protestants why would they bomb a town with a large nationalist population?
    I consider the murder of the Protestants at Omagh as sectarian murder.
    Thats why I am pissed that keith is basically accusing me of being sectarian.
    No i didn't. Perhaps you should read the posts. The only one who seems to get accused of that around here is me or Junder.


  • #304
    gandalf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    Personally I abhor sectarianism, killing people solely because of their religion is wrong.

    Personally I would say that killing people is wrong and leave it at that.


  • #305
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    I consider the murder of the Protestants at Omagh as sectarian murder.


    No i didn't. Perhaps you should read the posts. The only one who seems to get accused of that around here is me or Junder.
    Fine, continue to live under that illusion.


    You are wrong, thats it really.


  • #306
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    gandalf wrote: »
    Personally I would say that killing people is wrong and leave it at that.
    I wouldnt make such a blanket statement. There would want to be damn goodreasons though.


    Gandalf, you seem a smart person, do you think that Omagh was a sectarian attack aimed at protestants?


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  • #307
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    gandalf wrote: »
    Personally I would say that killing people is wrong and leave it at that.
    Yeah but its a points scoring sort of argument.


  • #308
    gandalf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    I consider the murder of the Protestants at Omagh as sectarian murder.

    Keith I think you are getting carried away. Omagh was mass murder of people despite their religion. It was an indiscriminate act by a pack of desperate dinosaur criminals who are now threatening the people of NI again despite the majority there and in the republic rejecting the kind of tribal fascism that they represent.


  • #309
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    gandalf wrote: »
    Keith I think you are getting carried away. Omagh was mass murder of people despite their religion. It was an indiscriminate act by a pack of desperate dinosaur criminals who are now threatening the people of NI again despite the majority there and in the republic rejecting the kind of tribal fascism that they represent.
    You have to consider this though. The RIRA hate Unionist Protestants. You just have to look at Kingsmill to see this. So, the aim was to kill as many people as possible, with the hate of Protestants, they would not care if they got killed either.

    That is sectarian murder.


  • #310
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    You have to consider this though. The RIRA hate Unionist Protestants. You just have to look at Kingsmill to see this. So, the aim was to kill as many people as possible, with the hate of Protestants, they would not care if they got killed either.

    That is sectarian murder.
    The RIRA was formed in 1997, kingsmill was in 1976. I already explained what the aim was, the courthouse, they couldn't find a space, then everything went into sh!t. If the aim was simply to kill people why give warnings at all?

    They didnt roll into town to "kil dem prods" as you seem to be suggesting by saying it was sectarian.

    Of course it doesnt make the attack any less reprehensible, but it was simply not sectarian.


  • #311
    irelandspurs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,081 ✭✭✭irelandspurs


    They must be bored now the recessions here.
    'oh what can we do now,i know lets bomb somewhere'


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  • #312
    pablomakaveli
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    gandalf wrote: »
    This is what I hate about any discussions on the troubles. Its the we didn't stoop as low as the others therefore we are better than them train of thought.

    All sides were involved in criminal acts against people whether they maimed them or killed them, they are all as equally bad as each other and should be held in equal contempt.

    Couldn't agree more. Trying to make out that one side were slightly worse than the other is a pointless exercise. Both sides were as bad as each other.


  • #313
    gandalf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    You have to consider this though. The RIRA hate Unionist Protestants. You just have to look at Kingsmill to see this. So, the aim was to kill as many people as possible, with the hate of Protestants, they would not care if they got killed either.

    That is sectarian murder.

    Look the RIRA, IRA lite, "I can't believe its not the IRA" or whatever other sad moniker they decide to give themselves are opposed to a lot of things. They hate protestants, probably based on the information available;they detest the British, definitely; the hate the Republic of Ireland in its current form, yep I would say that is true; they have no respect for democracy, thats definitely true as well given their behaviour after the majority on this island endorsed the GFA.

    We can say that all of these are drivers towards their unsupported acts of barbarism. I prefer to call them criminals because at the end of the day they have criminally ended peoples lives, they have criminally injured people and they have criminally damaged peoples property.


  • #314
    danbohan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭danbohan


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    You have to consider this though. The RIRA hate Unionist Protestants. You just have to look at Kingsmill to see this. So, the aim was to kill as many people as possible, with the hate of Protestants, they would not care if they got killed either.

    That is sectarian murder.

    thats wars over keith , the people who fought that war are now your minsters and make decisions that effect you life as a citzen of northern ireland . the rira is what is been discussed

    of course if you want to dwell on sectarian murder we can look at a history of sectarianism in northern ireland and it wont make comfortable reading for you or other unionists on this board


  • #315
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    gandalf wrote: »
    Look the RIRA, IRA lite, "I can't believe its not the IRA" or whatever other sad moniker they decide to give themselves are opposed to a lot of things. They hate protestants, probably based on the information available;they detest the British, definitely; the hate the Republic of Ireland in its current form, yep I would say that is true; they have no respect for democracy, thats definitely true as well given their behaviour after the majority on this island endorsed the GFA.

    We can say that all of these are drivers towards their unsupported acts of barbarism. I prefer to call them criminals because at the end of the day they have criminally ended peoples lives, they have criminally injured people and they have criminally damaged peoples property.
    I wouldnt say they hate protestants tbh, they may hate unionists, they would hate people because of their political views rather than solely on account of their religion.


  • #316
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    The leader of the Kingsmill incident is apparently the leader of the RIRA.


  • #317
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    The leader of the Kingsmill incident is apparently the leader of the RIRA.
    Apparently? Any evidence/proof?


    I was under the distinct impression that that is not the case at all.


  • #318
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    Apparently? Any evidence/proof?


    I was under the distinct impression that that is not the case at all.
    Would not rule it out. Can see a similar attack coming up. They seem determined.


  • #319
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    Would not rule it out. Can see a similar attack coming up. They seem determined.
    So thats a no to the evidence and proof then?

    I disagree, and I have posted extensively on why I think so.


  • #320
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    Would not rule it out. Can see a similar attack coming up. They seem determined.
    Oh, and when can I expect that apology for accusing me of explaining away sectarian attacks when I did no such thing?


  • #321
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Keith, Can you at least provide a link for that speculation?

    "Would not rule it out." just doesn't cut it.


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  • #322
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    So thats a no to the evidence and proof then?

    I disagree, and I have posted extensively on why I think so.
    Don't always need proof. We all know Gerry Adams was in the IRA, still denies it.

    This group is only going to get stronger, as disillusioned republicans get angry with the peace process and no United Ireland in sight. They will only grow in numbers. Its a scary thought but we can't be easy on this group.

    Something big i feel is going to happen. I really hope not though.


  • #323
    gandalf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,458 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    I wouldnt say they hate protestants tbh, they may hate unionists, they would hate people because of their political views rather than solely on account of their religion.

    Actually you are right Unionists would be a more accurate description. Although I would hazard a guess and I am sure that you would agree with me in the past being Protestant would be viewed as being Unionist by the type of criminals who make up the so called rIRA.


  • #324
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    gandalf wrote: »
    Actually you are right Unionists would be a more accurate description. Although I would hazard a guess and I am sure that you would agree with me in the past being Protestant would be viewed as being Unionist by the type of criminals who make up the so called rIRA.
    Well that was the reality on the ground, nigh on every protestant in Ulster was a Unionist.



    Republicanism is not a sectarian ideology. Not saying that noone who considered them such was sectarian.


  • #325
    RichieC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭RichieC


    Bunch of scum is all they are.


  • #326
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    Look up the definition of sectarian, you are obviously confused.
    Protestants got killed you know. Sectarian murder. All there is to it.

    That's not all there is to it. A 'sectarian attack' is one with a primarily religious motive, not one in which people of a different sect/religion get killed even though the intent wasn't specifically religious.

    Either make the claim that Omagh was intended specifically to kill Protestants because they were Protestants and defend it, or stop using it, because there is a difference, and wilfully ignoring that difference in the teeth of correction is trolling.

    moderately,
    Scofflaw


  • #327
    junder
    Registered Users Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭junder


    Papa Smut wrote: »
    Keith, Can you at least provide a link for that speculation?

    "Would not rule it out." just doesn't cut it.

    According the articule I posted the leader of the kingsmill massacre is a major suspect in the omagh bombing which atleast shows involvement in dissident activity.


  • #328
    junder
    Registered Users Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭junder


    pablomakaveli wrote: »
    Couldn't agree more. Trying to make out that one side were slightly worse than the other is a pointless exercise. Both sides were as bad as each other.

    Which is the point I have been making all along except some people still want live with the illusion that the troubles were all about the goodies versus baddies and that one side was some how nobler.


  • #329
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    Out of interest, what are your opinions on the men of 1916

    Didnt realise they were all men :pac:


  • #330
    Wolfe Tone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    Mike 1972 wrote: »
    Didnt realise they were all men :pac:
    Haha, good point!

    You know what I mean though, the "people of 1916" then!


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  • #331
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    MUSSOLINI wrote: »
    You need to read up on Omagh.


    They wanted to bomb the couthouse, was no spaces, so for incomprehensible reasons they left the car 400yards down the road. They phoned in warnings to the effect "bomb near courthouse, main street"(along those lines).
    Omagh doesn't have a main street, so for reasons only known to them, the RUC deviated from normal procedure(I believe they usually sent everyone to the bus depot in a bomb scare) they herded everyone towards the bomb.

    There was a police ombudsman report which found that the RUC basically made a bags of it, ignored warnings etc, the RUC even tried to stop it from getting published. Mi5 also received a warning with lots of details a couple of days before, they never passed it on.


    They are the facts.


    Of course the ultimate responsibility lies with the RIRA. But it was not just a case of leaving a bomb in a town in order to massacre people. That just makes no sense. Those deaths didnt benefit the RIRA. Thats why you have allegations from some that the RUC and Mi5 deliberately let it happen. ie, this is what you are in for if you don't go for the GFA.


    Look at the newry courthouse car bomb last year, they did that in the dead of night.

    OK, so if a fireman tries to help you out after an arson attack and gets it wrong, then he's somehow to blame ?

    Saying "the blame lies ultimately with RIRA" doesn't cut it. Neither does giving RIRA the benefit of the doubt while referring to "allegations from some that the RUC and MI-5 deliberately let it happen".

    As for parking spaces, jesus what a cop-out!

    If there are no parking spaces in town on a Saturday I don't even park in a disabled area, let alone dump a car with a bomb somewhere else!

    I'm sorry, but whatever about your general feelings (and I think I've even thanked one or two of your posts) I cannot have a discussion with someone who regurgitates the excuses of one crowd and gives them credibility and caveats while simultaneously referring to allegations of collusion for the other.

    So count me out of any further discussions of this nature with you, but feel free to come back to me when you realise that bringing a bomb into a town is an absolute disgrace and the ONLY people to blame for the consequences are the ones who left the bomb there.

    If someone parked a truck containing nuclear waste in the middle of a town and pissed off for lunch would you blame the emergency services for not saving people, or would you agree that the driver should never have taken the truck near the town in the first place ?


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