The Pub trade is dying - Minimum price for Alcohol?

DrGreenthumb

just make the bottles and cans bigger and that would get around the minimum,

2 euro for a liter can

VinLieger

DrGreenthumb wrote: »

just make the bottles and cans bigger and that would get around the minimum,

2 euro for a liter can

Its per unit pricing so that wouldnt help get around anything.


Considering the EU court of justice are still yet to rule on Scotlands version of this which by all accounts is pretty much the same as ours this is very premature

Glenbhoy

VinLieger wrote: »

Legislation is gonna be published today, no figures yet but the rumours are 7-8 euro minimum for a bottle of wine and 2 euro for a can of beer, the parties over thanks to Leo.

We can say thanks to Leo, but with an election coming up, fg/lab must feel that the public in general are supportive (that or that people have finally realised the democracy doesn't work).
Are the public generally supportive?
Personally, I'm not particularly bothered or wouldn't be if this was going to increase govt revenue, what I don't understand is why it looks like the increased revenue generated is going to stay with the retailer/manufacturer and not to the public coffers, we won't know until the legislation is published of course, but if that's how it works out, then I don't see the point of it, other than satisfying the publicans lobby groups under the guise of health benefits.

senordingdong

VinLieger wrote: »

Legislation is gonna be published today, no figures yet but the rumours are 7-8 euro minimum for a bottle of wine and 2 euro for a can of beer, the parties over thanks to Leo.

Well, be sure to bring it up the next time one of them darkens your door.

VinLieger

Glenbhoy wrote: »

We can say thanks to Leo, but with an election coming up, fg/lab must feel that the public in general are supportive (that or that people have finally realised the democracy doesn't work).
Are the public generally supportive?
Personally, I'm not particularly bothered or wouldn't be if this was going to increase govt revenue, what I don't understand is why it looks like the increased revenue generated is going to stay with the retailer/manufacturer and not to the public coffers, we won't know until the legislation is published of course, but if that's how it works out, then I don't see the point of it, other than satisfying the publicans lobby groups under the guise of health benefits.

Thats the thing, it looks like the publicans are really the only ones who will benefit.

We have one of the highest prices of alcohol in europe which proves price is not a factor when people choose to overindulge to an unhealthy extent so this is really only going to affect those who don't have a problem.

There is zero evidence available to suggest that minimum unit pricing will affect people who have drinking problems in Ireland. The study that is most often quoted is one done in a tiny province in canada which demographics wise just cannot be compared to ireland in any way so again there is no evidence to support this. Its very convenient the real push for this legislation only came in once it was evident wetherspoons were making a conceretyed push here which again lends evidence to the theory this is all coming from the publicans.

Also keep an eye on the EU court of justices ruling on the scottish version of this. They tried to enact very similar stuff a few years ago but it had to be put on hold. The court of justice will only allow it if it can be proven without a doubt that this legislation is the best and only course of action to helping solve this specific health issue. Again since there is pretty much no evidence to support this its hard to see how it can make it through which means our law will hopefully suffer the same fate

dr.fuzzenstein

http://www.irishferries.com/ie-en/news/irish-ferries-unveils-spring-sale-to-france/

macnug

Newstalk saying 1.6 euro for a can of standard beer. Which would mean slabs up to 38. Not much change for a box of beer though.

Flex

Glenbhoy wrote: »

We can say thanks to Leo, but with an election coming up, fg/lab must feel that the public in general are supportive (that or that people have finally realised the democracy doesn't work).
Are the public generally supportive?
Personally, I'm not particularly bothered or wouldn't be if this was going to increase govt revenue, what I don't understand is why it looks like the increased revenue generated is going to stay with the retailer/manufacturer and not to the public coffers, we won't know until the legislation is published of course, but if that's how it works out, then I don't see the point of it, other than satisfying the publicans lobby groups under the guise of health benefits.

As far as Im aware publicans have been shouting for this for ages and are a fairly strong lobby group. My own assumption is that the government increased excise on alcohol twice in the past few years which really upset publicans, so now the government in preparation for the coming election want to win back publican support without cutting taxes so the cheapest way is to ramp up prices in the off-trade. Another tax increase will further upset publicans and the poor aul sods cant be expected to cut their ridiculous margins to get people back in their doors :rolleyes: , so this is win-win :rolleyes:

VinLieger

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

http://www.irishferries.com/ie-en/news/irish-ferries-unveils-spring-sale-to-france/

http://www.homebrewwest.ie

https://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/

The way forward, said it before on this thread but I can make a batch of near 30 bottles of very drinkable wine in 2 weeks that costs around 50 cents to 1 euro per bottle depending on the kit you buy. Only takes a 3-4 goes for you to get your money back for purchasing the gear required too.

Blackwell

It's not going to fix anything. I know plenty of publicans who do their shopping in Supermarkets so it's still going to hit their profits

Herb Powell

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

http://www.irishferries.com/ie-en/news/irish-ferries-unveils-spring-sale-to-france/

lol

Atlantic Dawn

You wouldn't see the likes in North Korea.

neris

The Nanny state strikes against to protect the vested interests of a few over the majority

Akrasia

I thought the E.U. recently struck down a minimum alcohol price law in Scotland due to it being deemed anti free trade?

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/sep/03/scotlands-minimum-alcohol-price-plan-dealt-huge-blow

I can't see how the E.U. would take any different view on an irish minimum pricing law. Especially considering the very high price Leo is advocating as the minimum. It seems designed by the pub industry to hurt the off licence trace.

Lights On

Already having the most expensive booze in the EU isn't high enough? Well, I guess Leo knows best.

VinLieger

Akrasia wrote: »

I thought the E.U. recently struck down a minimum alcohol price law in Scotland due to it being deemed anti free trade?

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/sep/03/scotlands-minimum-alcohol-price-plan-dealt-huge-blow

I can't see how the E.U. would take any different view on an irish minimum pricing law. Especially considering the very high price Leo is advocating as the minimum. It seems designed by the pub industry to hurt the off licence trace.

It hasnt been struck down yet, but every indication looks like it will be. They have to prove it is the only viable and best solution to the problem and the fact there is zero evidence to help do so makes this very difficult.

All evidence in fact points to the contrary where consistent price increases here have never once affected drinking attitudes

L1011

Will be struck down by the EU just as the equivalent for smokes was.

Unlikely this will progress in time before the election anyway. Dail holidays over Christmas will eliminate most available time

splashthecash

I have no sympathy but did pubs not try to have offers\promotions in the past which was shot down due to the old "its encouraging binge drinking" chestnut?

OldNotWIse

VinLieger wrote: »

It hasnt been struck down yet, but every indication looks like it will be. They have to prove it is the only viable and best solution to the problem and the fact there is zero evidence to help do so makes this very difficult.

All evidence in fact points to the contrary where consistent price increases here have never once affected drinking attitudes

Yes, look at the way they've constantly increased the price of tobacco and that hasn't really helped. Far be it for me to be cynical but could this be an attempt to use concern for our health as a scapegoat for what is simply just fleecing us yet again?

Will be buying wine in bulk from France and even if the cost is the same, it will be worth it just so that I don't pay anything into their money-grubbing little paws.

Lux23

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Yes, look at the way they've constantly increased the price of tobacco and that hasn't really helped. Far be it for me to be cynical but could this be an attempt to use concern for our health as a scapegoat for what is simply just fleecing us yet again?

Will be buying wine in bulk from France and even if the cost is the same, it will be worth it just so that I don't pay anything into their money-grubbing little paws.

Is that really true? Smokers are a dying breed (in more ways than one). I think the price of a packet of smokes now would definitely hinder young people from starting.

brevity

Any idea how quickly this will be implemented? Do I need to stockpile a few boxes of Heineken?

OldNotWIse

Lux23 wrote: »

Is that really true? Smokers are a dying breed (in more ways than one). I think the price of a packet of smokes now would definitely hinder young people from starting.

I don't know

Sh1tbag OToole

macnug wrote: »

Newstalk saying 1.6 euro for a can of standard beer. Which would mean slabs up to 38. Not much change for a box of beer though.

Damn, there I was looking forward to opening a shop in Fishguard that only sells Beamish and Murphys

smash

How exactly are they going to enforce a rule of a minimum distance from a school before you can advertise alcohol? I know of numerous locations where schools are situated beside shopping centres or supermarkets.

BattleCorp

I don't think this will do much to reduce binge drinking or increase the money earned by publicans. People will still stay away from pubs.

All it will do is increase the amount of tax that the government take in from alcohol sales.

VinLieger

brevity wrote: »

Any idea how quickly this will be implemented? Do I need to stockpile a few boxes of Heineken?

Hopefully it will be stalled until the EU make their judgement on the scottish version

2smiggy

for someone who used drink way way too much, but still managed to work as normal, price was never an obstacle to drinking.

This only really affects low paid people or the unemployed badly, who may have zero alcohol problems, but now possibly cannot buy a cheap box of beer as easily.

here is a link of former FF minister and Doctor driving plastered the wrong way of a duel carriageway. But he will still easily be able to afford alcohol to fuel this behavior.

Perhaps the price of a pint should be set to €35 (or more) in the dail bar to keep them in check ? link here of FG Tom Barry pulling another female TD onto his lap. Or shut the Dail bar altogether. I don't know many places where you can drink alcohol at work

hatrickpatrick

The ECJ's final ruling is (unconfirmed, but supposedly) due on December 23? So there might not be THAT much time for stalling if the case doesn't go our way. I'd advise stockpiling to some degree. On the other hand, does anyone else seem to recall somebody stating that this minimum price rule would be suspended for one year to give supermarkets etc time to adjust and not just suddenly have their profits plummet? We could have mew breathing time if that's the case.

the_syco

Lux23 wrote: »

I think the price of a packet of smokes now would definitely hinder young people from starting.

They're just more likely to start off with the dodgy smokes, tbh.

BattleCorp wrote: »

All it will do is increase the amount of tax that the government take in from alcohol sales.

But this new "tax" doesn't go into the governments pockets...

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The ECJ's final ruling is (unconfirmed, but supposedly) due on December 23?

I wonder if the ECJ ruling would actually cut the price of drink elsewhere?

BattleCorp

the_syco wrote: »

But this new "tax" doesn't go into the governments pockets...

Where does the new tax go then?