I can't get tenants out

JonJoeDali

ztoical wrote: »

The op cannot legally enter the property under current laws. Seriously don't listen to anything about changing locks, making threats your just making huge costly mistake for yourself. Contact the PRTB first thing tomorrow and start the correct eviction process.

PRTB process takes 12 months. And tenants know it.

Even when you've gone through the process and can get the case heard before a judge, the judge won't necessarily kick 'em out - new-born babies/sick kids/long-term illnesses/depression/anxiety/stress have a habit of appearing. Also, they'll remain in the gaff until every last appeal avenue is exhausted.

goat2

could they be called squatters, since they are now not paying

Dublinstiofán

I would definitely put a couple of bunk beds in and move 6 or 8 students in for a 6 month contract and set rent at €200 a month each to try cover solicitor fees. When they are getting pissed the whole time and partying til all hours they will soon get sick of it.

snickers

ztoical wrote: »

The op cannot legally enter the property under current laws. Seriously don't listen to anything about changing locks, making threats your just making huge costly mistake for yourself. Contact the PRTB first thing tomorrow and start the correct eviction process.

The property was being shared so if landlord wanted to show a perspective tenant around he/she could not enter premises i dont think so.

ztoical

JonJoeDali wrote: »

First hearing, they'll probably appeal, second hearing, they'll appeal again. Only then can you go to court for an enforced eviction. And no judge will evict a family with a new-born.

Again the baby makes no difference the judge has to follow the law (and if it did take that long it wouldn't be a new born)

The fact that they just stopped paying rent and informed the op that it was there home and they werent moving rather then trying to feed the op lies about rent coming and looking for new house to rent makes it sound like they are well aware of the law and the rights they have so I would be very care full how you proceed op

JonJoeDali

Dublinstiofán wrote: »

And i would move about four or five people in. Try a few members of your family or friends or something just to piss them off. Hopefully they will move on.

Moving in friends/family can be seen as "harassment" and may not be looked upon favorably by the PRTB/a judge. A very serious point to consider.

Also, you'd want to have a very good friend/family member who'd put up with living in such a small house with 4 people. Not as easy as it seems - tenants can deny entry and they don't have to open the door. If you try and force your way in, the gardai will be around in a flash to investigate matters. Not the kind of thing you want brought up at PRTB hearings/court proceedings.

ztoical

snickers wrote: »

The property was being shared so if landlord wanted to show a perspective tenant around he/she could not enter premises i dont think so.

The tenants have use of communal spaces si the LL would have to get permission to enter. Also I think going by the ops posts the tenants are aware of their rights and if the op trys to use accessing the property to show tenants around as an excuse to spy on the tenants or to move famil or friends in the tenants can make claims if harassment if the op is not careful

JonJoeDali

ztoical wrote: »

Again the baby makes no difference the judge has to follow the law (and if it did take that long it wouldn't be a new born)

I know the process. Do not underestimate how long it takes to jump through all the hoops. A judge has to follow the law, yes, but has lots of discretion with regard penalties/orders/etc.

Of course you can fock it all up by getting hot-headed one day and changing locks/harass the tenant/etc.

ztoical wrote: »

The fact that they just stopped paying rent and informed the op that it was there home and they werent moving rather then trying to feed the op lies about rent coming and looking for new house to rent makes it sound like they are well aware of the law and the rights they have so I would be very care full how you proceed op

These tenants know exactly what they're doing. They're probably getting rent allowance straight into their pockets too.

No point persuing them when/if you get them out cos you can't take the knickers off a bare bottom.

ztoical

goat2 wrote: »

could they be called squatters, since they are now not paying

No you need to be in a property for a fair number of years and meet other criteria to try and gain squatters rights

Dublinstiofán

Personally i think its all the OP's own fault which has now turned into a massive problem.

I have no experience in renting out houses personally but i know people who do. And i know for a fact they have never had any trouble with any tenant in their houses for years and years as they have screened them carefully before allowing them into their property in the first place.

If she knew the lady was pregnant before she allowed them tenancy she must have known that whoever was renting the other room would run a mile when the baby arrived. Or was he/she just not thinking or involved in the renting process at all?

goat2

JonJoeDali wrote: »

I know the process. Do not underestimate how long it takes to jump through all the hoops. A judge has to follow the law, yes, but has lots of discretion with regard penalties/orders/etc.

Of course you can fock it all up by getting hot-headed one day and changing locks/harass the tenant/etc.



These tenants know exactly what they're doing. They're probably getting rent allowance straight into their pockets too.

No point persuing them when/if you get them out cos you can't take the knickers off a bare bottom.

but they can get on to the socail welfare and say that they are not being paid the rent, then the welfare system may send the cheque on to the land lord, as that money is not theirs but the landlords,

snickers

ztoical wrote: »

The tenants have use of communal spaces si the LL would have to get permission to enter. Also I think going by the ops posts the tenants are aware of their rights and if the op trys to use accessing the property to show tenants around as an excuse to spy on the tenants or to move famil or friends in the tenants can make claims if harassment if the op is not careful

Ok then is it harrasment for LL to chase rent arrears .Imo and if i was in this situation i would fight fire with fire and if what you are saying is correct then doing nothing or doing things by the book is exactly what they want .

JonJoeDali

Dublinstiofán wrote: »

Personally i think its all the OP's own fault which has now turned into a massive problem.

Oh well that means it's ok to have leeching "tenants" so.

JonJoeDali

goat2 wrote: »

but they can get on to the socail welfare and say that they are not being paid the rent, then the welfare system may send the cheque on to the land lord, as that money is not theirs but the landlords,

What? A couple of hundred Euro (that you'll have to write letters for and hassle people on the phone for ages to get your hands on it) for one room in a 2-bed house that's currently a liability rather than an asset for the foreseeable future?

ztoical

snickers wrote: »

Ok then is it harrasment for LL to chase rent arrears .Imo and if i was in this situation i would fight fire with fire and if what you are saying is correct then doing nothing or doing things by the book is exactly what they want .

I never said I agreed with the law just stating the current state of tenancy law is very much in favor of tenants over LL. It sucks but it's the reality of the situation.

goat2

JonJoeDali wrote: »

What? A couple of hundred Euro (that you'll have to write letters for and hassle people on the phone for ages to get your hands on it) for one room in a 2-bed house that's currently a liability rather than an asset for the foreseeable future?

just one phonecall really,as they are going to be there a long time, and better something than nothing, the ll will have to go to a solicitor for advice, will have to wait for hearing, could take from one to three yrs, i know as i have been where this ll is

knotknowbody

I would tell them your going to be arranging viewings for the other rooms, then i would start to arrange with my mates to go round to view the rooms at approx 8 AM everyday with a different mate, i would keep this up until i had gone through all my mates, cousins, nephews and nieces, that would take about 3 months for me, these people are generally lazy types who don't like getting up early so that will annoy them, there are other annoying little things you can do that may eventually piss them off and make them leave. Make life as difficult for them as you can without doing anything that infringes on their rights.

gimme5minutes

You really are looking at well over a year, maybe two to get them out if they flat out refuse to move and it certainly looks like this is the case. Until the day eventually comes when a court gives an eviction order that lets the gardai put them out....and you can forget about getting any of the money owed for 1-2 years worth of rent and utilities.

You cant change locks, cut electricity, etc as with Ireland's justice system that will cost you even more when you get slapped with a ridiculous fine for putting these scumbags out.

So I am in agreement with the other posters about the next course of action. Put a few students in there on a 3/6 month lease, find the messiest, loudest ones you can find and tell them you have no problems with house parties, cleanliness, etc... Or move in yourself, (or have a friend or relative move in), and have music on all night and generally be an absolute nuisance in the place. Basically you want them to experience living with housemates from hell, everything nice and legal though, and they will be left with no option but to move, and they will have no comeback as no law was broken.

gimme5minutes

JonJoeDali wrote: »

Moving in friends/family can be seen as "harassment" and may not be looked upon favorably by the PRTB/a judge. A very serious point to consider.

Ill tell you what wont be looked upon favorably by the PRTB/a judge - moving into a house and flat out refusing to pay the rent. These tenants are pure chancers, there is no law against OP putting himself, friends, family, or students in there. I have yet to hear of case taken against a landlord by their tenant because they were unhappy with a fellow tenant. These scumbags will eventually be turfed out but by that stage OP will be down thousands of euro and will have to put up with 1-2 years worth of constant stress.

gossipgal08

If they only rent one room surely the LL can rent the second room and show tennents arround after giving notice to the family. Could the LL arange for a friend in their late teens/ early twentys to move in for a small amount of rent and make noise/mess to encourage the family to leave. Also contact SW and tell them the people are not paying rent so the rent allowance is cut off.

senordingdong

Before people continue to swing the PRTB banner, we have to first check with the OP that he/she is registered with the PRTB.

Are you OP?


Anyway, legal/illegal advice aside, they are in your property, for two months now after their lease has expired, and after you gave them notice. And they haven't paid their rent?

Have you given the notice to them in person? With a witness?

Call the Gardaí.
They are on your property illeagally.

DarkJager

senordingdong wrote: »

Before people continue to swing the PRTB banner, we have to first check with the OP that he/she is registered with the PRTB.

Are you OP?


Anyway, legal/illegal advice aside, they are in your property, for two months now after their lease has expired, and after you gave them notice. And they haven't paid their rent?

Have you given the notice to them in person? With a witness?

Call the Gardaí.
They are on your property illeagally.

Agree with this. These people are occupying your property illegally. Bring the Gardai around and make sure they stay until these chancers are out the front door. A baby is no excuse to act like a scumbag. Get them out.

Fol20

athtrasna wrote: »

Do this and you're looking at a fine of about 10k!

Do you have a friend or family member who could move into the other room and make things less comfortable in the house? You could also lock the second room, they are not entitled to access it.

I would actually recommend getting a friend or relative to move into the second room for a month or 2..Tell him to be loud and proud.If he had music blaring at all times of the night it would get on my nerve and id move out.Especially if it was keeping the child up.

JonJoeDali

DarkJager wrote: »

Bring the Gardai around and make sure they stay until these chancers are out the front door.

Gardai won't get involved in civil matters.

Treehouse72

The posters saying these people are in the house "illegally" are talking off the top of their heads and would be better off not contributing at all than giving such facile and likely incorrect advice to OP.

john t

Rent other room and also rent out living room if possible..

Laisurg

Well if you've given them notice and they lied to you then you have every right to kick them out, btw if they're not paying any rent and are refusing to leave just call the guards, they'll get them out of there.

xxx3

Get a not so quiet couple of people to move in chances are the new noisy neighbours id get them out

Fol20

xxx3 wrote: »

Get a not so quiet couple of people to move in chances are the new noisy neighbours id get them out

I think you would have to at least know them a small bit to do that..Sure once you have got rid of the old group,you will know have a new bunch of noisy poor tenants.

CK2010

wow- some people have some neck, not paying rent and refusing to leave! i didnt think there were people like that!

i love how when its a situation like this everyone says 'the tenants have all the rights here',however in our case (noisy neighbours that keep making our lives hell and waking up our three year old at 5,6,7 o clock with their music every night) we're told 'you've no rights as tenants to break the lease and still get your deposit back'! nobody wins! apart from the scumbags every time :rolleyes:

i would recommend sending any letters through registered post to ensure they recieved them. its not alot and it doesnt ensure they've read it but its something that will eliminate the whole 'we never got it' excuse in future.

dont do any grand masterplans- it wont go in your favour, you'll just end up looking a fool, and in the wrong, if this ever goes through the legal route.

again, gardai cant do anything cause its a civil matter- we know this one by now with the noisy neighbours, they wont even call round to scare them by suggesting turning it down- although admitedly they have better things to be doing- but try telling us that after three nights of being kept awake by the scum next door!

id probably seek legal advice or contact the PRTB, send the tennants a letter through registered post (keep a copy for yourself) stating what has been happening- non payment of rent, ignoring your notice etc. and that you have been seeking legal advice regarding the issue and you would like them to resolve the issue out of court otherwise you will proceed through the legal route. hopefully this will scare them into either paying or getting out. also if they were getting rent supplement (you should have signed something for it afaik) ring social welfare and tell them.

the scum probably know their rights though, they always do, thats how they have the guts to invade someone elses house like that like its their god given right to live there for free :mad:

if all else fails come round to ours and bring our neighbours back to the house- they'll be out within seconds! especially now with the baby! :P

hope you get it sorted soon whatever you decide to do,its a horrible position to be in.
oh and dont feel bad about the baby- its the parents responsibility to provide a home for the child- not squat in one for free and avoid all responsibility. just a side note in case you do feel guilty, some people seem to think the parents are protected by the fact they have this baby and i dont see why