FA CUP 3rd Round: Manchester Utd v Liverpool (Match Thread) Mod Warning #214 - READ!

Chucky the tree

flahavaj wrote: »

5. ****ing delighted to keep the Scousers in their box for another season, regardless of how its done. Season over in January, save for Thurday nights vs Sh*tsville FC. Happy days, get in. Number 19 would make this seaon perfect.

Lol, I love how the FA cup now has some huge meaning. :pac: Don't remember it being this important last year when United got tonked by Leeds, or when they didn't even bother playing it a few years ago. Season over expect for thursday against ****sville FC? Yes, because if we won today our season would be crucial playing against Southampton FC instead.:pac:

theoneeyedman

It never ceases to amaze me that many people believe or justify panalties and/or players diving with terms such as "there was contact" or he "touched the forward". Soccer is not a non-contact sport-for a foul to be committed a player must in the referees opinion, with

careless, reckless or using excessive force:
• kicks or attempts to kick an opponent
• trips or attempts to trip an opponent
• jumps at an opponent
• charges an opponent
• strikes or attempts to strike an opponent
• pushes an opponent

• tackles an opponent

defenders must be allowed to tackle and attempt to tackle attackers in a genuine manner. The way referees are interpreting the rules now is encouraging players to cheat by running into defenders and 'drawing' the penalty or as in todays case simply lay on the ground when the slightest contact is made. (BTW funny how ITV hemmed and hawed about berbatov and his 'winning' the pen but still gave the MOTM to him)

stumpypeeps

flahavaj wrote: »

Have read nothing of the thread an just in the door.

My take on the afternoon.

1. The penalty shouldn't have been given.

2. The sending off was 100% deserved, it was a dangerous lunge. Carrick was lucky to walk away from it. Gerrard at 30 years of age and with years of big game experience should really know better than that. Any Liverpool fans should give him a fair share of the blame today, he let ye down bigtime.

3. It was a poor game and I thought United didn't really play well at all, though they were in control for most of the 2nd half. Liverpool showed signs of passing the ball better than they did under Roy and the team selection was a good one, which is a source for optimism - Aurelio, Kelly and Agger all improve the side.

4. Rafael is a little warrior, I love him. As one of the lads said earlier, I love how he gets into a scrap in every game. What a find. Delighted with Johnny Evans' display as well, hes gotten a very hard time this year but I thought he looked good today.

5. ****ing delighted to keep the Scousers in their box for another season, regardless of how its done. Season over in January, save for Thurday nights vs Sh*tsville FC. Happy days, get in. Number 19 would make this seaon perfect.

Good post. Except you forgot there's a chance we might make the Europa league final in the Aviva. that'd be nice!

flahavaj

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Lol, I love how the FA cup now has some huge meaning. :pac: Don't remember it being this important last year when United got tonked by Leeds, or when they didn't even bother playing it a few years ago. Season over expect for thursday against ****sville FC? Yes, because if we won today our season would be crucial playing against Southampton FC instead.:pac:

Grand your season was over this morning before the match. I don't really mind either way horse.

Dave!

Dalglish didn't agree with the red card BTW. Said so in the interview on Setanta.

El Oh El

doc_17

Oliver Kay tweeted (or RT) in december:

"Alex Ferguson has chosen Howard Webb to referee Manchester Uniteds FA cup match against Liverpool"

Twas funny, only at the time tough

flahavaj

Dave! wrote: »

Dalglish didn't agree with the red card BTW. Said so in the interview on Setanta.

El Oh El

He did so well in his pre-game interview as well, all smiles and happiness. The old dour scowl wasn't long returning - the "oh sh*t what have I let myself in for" look on his face as Gerrad got the line was priceless.

He's deluded if he thinks that wasn't a red, shocking challenge.

Revolution9

Ordinary man wrote: »

Are you saying there was no contact? There's a big difference between a soft penalty and a dive. There was slight contact and he went down= soft penalty. It might not be given. Evan's claim was a lot more nailed on later.

Not enough contact to make a grown man stumble let alone drop to the ground from imaginary sniper fire.

stumpypeeps

flahavaj wrote: »

He did so well in his pre-game interview as well, all smiles and happiness. The old dour scowl wasn't long returning - the "oh sh*t what have I let myself in for" look on his face as Gerrad got the line was priceless.

He's deluded if he thinks that wasn't a red, shocking challenge.

In fairness 15 years ago it would have been a yellow at most. But you just can't leave the ground these days. Gerrard should have known better.

Ordinary man

If gerrard didn't lose the plot, liverpool could actually have won that game. Guess its easier to blame the ref (or the manager) than captain fantastic:rolleyes:

Ordinary man

Revolution9 wrote: »

Not enough contact to make a grown man stumble let alone drop to the ground from imaginary sniper fire.

Do you seriously want people to post up how much contact it takes to knock gerrard or torres in the penalty area?

flahavaj

flahavaj wrote: »

shocking challenge.

Come for fecks sake, why dont you follow basketball or something if your afraid of a bit of grit in a tackle.

If players dont get stuck in you will have people in here posting they aren't interested or they are past it etc, then when a good honest tackle goes in people would swear there were weapons used.

It was a yellow card no more, no less.

doc_17

Ordinary man wrote: »

Do you seriously want people to post up how much contact it takes to knock gerrard or torres in the penalty area?

Or Berbatov

Revolution9

Ordinary man wrote: »

Do you seriously want people to post up how much contact it takes to knock gerrard or torres in the penalty area?

I didn't see either dive after 30 seconds to win a penalty today

And when did I say they don't dive I said I was dissapointed because I always thought Berbatov was an honest player. Your jumping to conclusions.

citytillidie

Reports of 15 arrests in Old Trafford

Mental Mickey

Alejandra Inexpensive Minicam wrote: »

Come for fecks sake, why dont you follow basketball or something if your afraid of a bit of grit in a tackle.

A bit of grit!?? There was more than"a bit of grit" in that tackle. He went in with his two feet off the ground.

flahavaj

Alejandra Inexpensive Minicam wrote: »

Come for fecks sake, why dont you follow basketball or something if your afraid of a bit of grit in a tackle.

LOL. It was a filthy challenge he dived in with both feet FFS. Compare and contrast with Rafael a guy with a decade's less experience in the game who had the cop on to pull out of a similar chalange minutes beforehand.

flahavaj

stumpypeeps wrote: »

In fairness 15 years ago it would have been a yellow at most. But you just can't leave the ground these days. Gerrard should have known better.

Then your club is in trouble putting a man in charge who's stuck trying to analyse the game by the standards of 15 years ago.

Mitch Connor

citytillidie wrote: »

Reports of 15 arrests in Old Trafford

A lot of reports of nasty behavior today.

Mental Mickey

Alejandra Inexpensive Minicam wrote: »

Come for fecks sake, why dont you follow basketball or something if your afraid of a bit of grit in a tackle.

A bit of grit!?? There was more than"a bit of grit" in that tackle. He went in with his two feet off the ground.


http://soccertvlive.blogspot.com/2011/01/video-steven-gerrard-sent-off-on.html

Mental Mickey

Mental Mickey wrote: »

A bit of grit!?? There was more than"a bit of grit" in that tackle. He went in with his two feet off the ground.

flahavaj wrote: »

LOL. It was a filthy challenge he dived in with both feet FFS. Compare and contrast with Rafael a guy with a decade's less experience in the game who had the cop on to pull out of a similar chalange minutes beforehand.

Its not like they were meeting head on, they were side by side going for the ball. Makes a big difference imo.

I wouldn't be using rafaels tackle in defence, its was very very questionable and I think it deserved a yellow.

Revolution9

citytillidie wrote: »

Reports of 15 arrests in Old Traffard

Man U regularly top the "hooligan arrest league" as Yahoo so eloquently put it

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/23122009/58/premier-league-manchester-united-top-hooligan-arrest-league.html

Saying that, it was probably Liverpool fans annoyed at the post-match lock in trying to make a run for the exit.

Mental Mickey

Alejandra Inexpensive Minicam wrote: »

Its not like they were meeting head on, they were side by side going for the ball. Makes a big difference imo.

I wouldn't be using rafaels tackle in defence, its was very very questionable and I think it deserved a yellow.

It was a dirty tackle.

Pro. F

Alejandra Inexpensive Minicam wrote: »

Come for fecks sake, why dont you follow basketball or something if your afraid of a bit of grit in a tackle.

Personally I also like watching Rugby, Boxing, Muay Thai, MMA and bare knuckle boxing (whenever I can get my hands on a vid) and I think Gerrard's tackle should have been a red. Grit doesn't have anything to do with it. Tackles that so obviously risk leg breaks have no place in football.

Mitch Connor

Revolution9 wrote: »

Man U regularly top the "hooligan arrest league" as Yahoo so eloquently put it

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/23122009/58/premier-league-manchester-united-top-hooligan-arrest-league.html

Saying that, it was probably Liverpool fans annoyed at the post-match lock in trying to make a run for the exit.

reports of Liverpool fans bricking apartments leaving OT, and chucking seats down on top of United fans during the match.

doc_17

If Meirless had touched the ball first and hadn't pulled out of the tackle it would have been bad but neither of things happened so I can't really say he deserved a yellow. Twas probably a red card but never a penalty

Mental Mickey

Mental Mickey wrote: »

It was a dirty tackle.

We obviously have different opinions of how tough tackles should be, I think the tackle was a tough tackle which deserved a yellow and no more.

3hn2givr7mx1sc

Both sets of fans involved in violence apparently.

stumpypeeps

flahavaj wrote: »

Then your club is in trouble putting a man in charge who's stuck trying to analyse the game by the standards of 15 years ago.

I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in a manager disagreeing with a refereeing decision to be honest. As for Gerrards tackle, he was lunging after the ball not Carrick, who wasn't in possession of the ball. Silly yes. Filthy, not so sure.

flahavaj

flahavaj wrote: »

Then your club is in trouble putting a man in charge who's stuck trying to analyse the game by the standards of 15 years ago.

Maybe he should gain knowledge on boards.

Seems to be more experts on here

Revolution9

Mitch Connor wrote: »

reports of Liverpool fans bricking apartments leaving OT, and chucking seats down on top of United fans during the match.

baz2009 wrote: »

Both sets of fans involved in violence apparently.

Share your sources lads?

Mitch Connor

Revolution9 wrote: »

Share your sources lads?

twitter.

Revolution9

I hope Howard Webb isn't special guest referee for the scrap between the Liverpool and Man U supporters. We all know who'll win if he is!

theoneeyedman

doc_17 wrote: »

If Meirless had touched the ball first and hadn't pulled out of the tackle it would have been bad but neither of things happened so I can't really say he deserved a yellow. Twas probably a red card but never a penalty

there was no fear of morelas getting the ball.....he consistently pulled out of tackles both before and after the sending off and i thing gerrard was trying to inject a bit of life and jizz into the liverpool midfield with the tackle. The foul was probably a top of the range yellow/possible red but with howard in charge at OT it was obvious which side of the line it was going to be

citytillidie

Revolution9 wrote: »

Share your sources lads?

BBC says 15 arrests and it less than other games

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12142589

3hn2givr7mx1sc

Revolution9 wrote: »

Share your sources lads?

Twitter too.:P

Mitch Connor

theoneeyedman wrote: »

there was no fear of morelas getting the ball.....he consistently pulled out of tackles both before and after the sending off and i thing gerrard was trying to inject a bit of life and jizz into the liverpool midfield with the tackle. The foul was probably a top of the range yellow/possible red but with howard in charge at OT it was obvious which side of the line it was going to be

He was off the ground, two footed and studs showing. Didn't get the ball, hammered the player.

I am actually shocked people can make a claim to it not being a red.

Mental Mickey

theoneeyedman wrote: »

there was no fear of morelas getting the ball.....he consistently pulled out of tackles both before and after the sending off and i thing gerrard was trying to inject a bit of life and jizz into the liverpool midfield with the tackle. The foul was probably a top of the range yellow/possible red but with howard in charge at OT it was obvious which side of the line it was going to be

I lol'd.

IvySlayer

I love how every ABU is crying over our dodgy peno - yet there's hardly any mention that we should have gotten one in the second half.

Revolution9

The only argument against the red card was the fact that the tackle wasn't head on, probably a yellow ten years ago but in modern football most referees would've shown Gerrard a red.
It's just harder to accept considering the shocking penalty decision as well as Howard Webb's history at Old Traffod.

As for Kenny saying it wasn't a red, well it is his job to defend the players. If Gerrard had've taken out a machete and chopped Carrick's head off i'd still expect Dalglish to say it was only a yellow

Ordinary man

theoneeyedman wrote: »

there was no fear of morelas getting the ball.....he consistently pulled out of tackles both before and after the sending off and i thing gerrard was trying to inject a bit of life and jizz into the liverpool midfield with the tackle. The foul was probably a top of the range yellow/possible red but with howard in charge at OT it was obvious which side of the line it was going to be

anderson got a yellow for shouldering torres, fletcher got a yellow for tripping kuyt and you think gerrards attempt to smash a players ankle deserves the same?

3hn2givr7mx1sc

Revolution9 wrote: »

The only argument against the red card was the fact that the tackle wasn't head on, probably a yellow ten years ago but in modern football most referees would've shown Gerrard a red.
It's just harder to accept considering the shocking penalty decision as well as Howard Webb's history at Old Traffod.

As for Kenny saying it wasn't a red, well it is his job to defend the players. If Gerrard had've taken out a machete and chopped Carrick's head off i'd still expect Dalglish to say it was only a yellow

The penalty was hardly a "shocking decision" ffs, it was dubious. And the referee didn't have the benefit of a zoomed in slow-mo action replay when making the decision.

citytillidie

Ordinary man wrote: »

anderson got a yellow for shouldering torres, fletcher got a yellow for tripping kuyt and you think gerrards attempt to get the ball deserves the same?

Fixed that for you

Pro. F

Revolution9 wrote: »

The only argument against the red card was the fact that the tackle wasn't head on, probably a yellow ten years ago but in modern football most referees would've shown Gerrard a red.
It's just harder to accept considering the shocking penalty decision as well as Howard Webb's history at Old Traffod.

As for Kenny saying it wasn't a red, well it is his job to defend the players. If Gerrard had've taken out a machete and chopped Carrick's head off i'd still expect Dalglish to say it was only a yellow

It wasn't a shocking penalty decision. Maybe harsh, but Agger made a bad mistake and Berb went down. Blaming Howard for that is laughable.

Revolution9

baz2009 wrote: »

The penalty was hardly a "shocking decision" ffs, it was dubious. And the referee didn't have the benefit of a zoomed in slow-mo action replay when making the decision.

No, but Webb did have the benefit of a linesman who was in a much better position than Webb and who didn't flag for a penalty after the dive, when Webb clearly looked over to see his reaction.
It was a shocking decision, that conforms with Webb's record at Old Trafford.

IvySlayer

Revolution9 wrote: »

No, but Webb did have the benefit of a linesman who was in a much better position than Webb and who didn't flag for a penalty after the dive, when Webb clearly looked over to see his reaction.
It was a shocking decision, that conforms with Webb's record at Old Trafford.

It was a bad decision.

What about the stonewall penalty in the second half that wasn't awarded, you going to moan about that too?

baz2009

baz2009 wrote: »

The penalty was hardly a "shocking decision" ffs, it was dubious. And the referee didn't have the benefit of a zoomed in slow-mo action replay when making the decision.

The linesman was in perfect position to view it whereas Webb was not.

That's what linesmen are there for, to assist the referee.

flahavaj

Pro. F wrote: »

It wasn't a shocking penalty decision. Maybe harsh, but Agger made a bad mistake and Berb went down. Blaming Howard for that is laughable.

I woudn't blame the referee. I don't think it was a penalty but thats only something i cans ay after the benefit of several replays. The way Agger stuck his leg out made it look like a peno in real time. It was the wrong decision, but I have sympathy for Webb. As ever the whole issue of TV replays rears its ugly head.

citytillidie

Pro. F wrote: »

It wasn't a shocking penalty decision. Maybe harsh, but Agger made a bad mistake and Berb went down. Blaming Howard for that is laughable.

But as I have said Webb has told players in Blackpool to go down in the box so you can blame him.

You cant say this looks like a dive

citytillidie

IvySlayer wrote: »

It was a bad decision.

What about the stonewall penalty in the second half that wasn't awarded, you going to moan about that too?

What stone wall penalty?