Agonizing Last Words From Someone Who Couldn't Take Any More Of Life

BornToBe?

I really wish Bill had taken revenge and killed the guy who raped him, before he commited suicide. He would of done the world a favour, aswell as gaining some relief in knowing that in the end, he took the power. That guy destroyed his life, and put him through all that pain and robbed him of any hope of having a life. I dont care what people think, sometimes murder is justified, murdering someone who repeatidly raped a child is one of them.

I also wish everyone would print off that letter and post it to all those ******* priests who were convicted, or who covered up the sexual abuse scandals in this country, so they might have some form of insight of how their actions effected the victims, and hopefully it would haunt them till the day they die.

I also wish that people will put the times and dates together, and figure who was in Bill's life when he was a child, and figure out who his rapist was. It's sicking that someone who could do that to him, and more than likely others, could get away with it.

Darlughda

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

oh god drama llama in here.

Don't you have your own personal unfunny love-in forum to inhabit with your unhelpful comments?

Mahatma coat wrote: »

It dosent help, you dont suddenly become Magicaly Unmolested, you just drag more people into your Darkness and suffering, there are Pain junkies out there who make a living out of listening to other people pour their hearts out, but they also have to justify getting paid, so they prescribe all sorts of medications and attach labels to you which ultimatley make the situation a whole lot more unbearable and unavoidable, where previously you had been Moody and should be left alone for a bit now you're Depressed and need to be medicated.

There are some counsellors therapists who are just not good at their jobs. To be honest, calling them 'pain junkies' is not really accurate. Like in every profession or walk of life, you have people who are at best mediocre and just in it for the salary and benefits.

However, there are also many individuals who have a real vocation for this kind of work.
No, they cannot magically undo the past, but they can enable you work through horrific stuff to gain skills to cope with life, unearth a desire to truly live again, manage pain, anxiety+panic and develop a whole new perspective, where the horror of the past becomes a strength of what 'does not kill you, makes you stronger'.

Just because you may not have found the right counsellor/therapist, Mahatma Coat does not mean that others won't.

Granted, its not easy finding that person, and can take quite a lot of different attempts and searching which is just not easy when a lot of them charge silly money.
But many people who have survived sexual abuse have found the right person, so there is always hope.

midlandsmissus

A testiment to the fact that child abuse causes life long unbelivable hurt and trauma.

I felt the exact same as him. I only eventually managed to free myself by forgiving my abuser - an extremely hard thing to do, but it has given me a degree of freedom from what is a continual nightmare.

When you're abused as a kid, you spend your whole life thinking, "I can't let anyone know I'm not normal", and you spend you life looking at other people, wondering what it would be like to be "normal" like them.

That is the utmost horror caused by child abuse. You know the inherent lonliness we all feel, imagine that multiplied by a million. An abused person feels like an outsider looking in, knowing they can never be normal like other people, and they can NEVER change it. It is the lonliness and isolation of your state of mind that makes life unbearable.

If his letter is even read by one person with potential paedophile thoughts, and gets them to reconsider their actions, that would be good, but is it wishful thinking on my part? Do they realise the lifelong horror they cause, or do they know and not care?

amacca

Naikon wrote: »

Who knows. People in general are unpredictable. Best confide in your family members or someone you trust. Not some "health professional". Sorry, I am just skeptical of the general
concept of counselling.

I think I know where you are coming from and it is useful to confide in people you trust/close family members.

But I suspect there may be many cases where they don't have the experiences or skills needed to help you out beyond emotional support etc, if you are in a state..they may not be able to relate to or understand what is causing the problem or what type of personality you have that means you cant deal with that particular problem....it could be as simple as the fact that their lives are just too plain vanilla to be able to relate properly to whats causing you grief.

In that instance it might be better to seek out those with experience to help. . .. and keep looking if at first you dont succeed (irony being if you are depressed etc you may not be able to motivate yourself to persevere)

pablomakaveli

midlandsmissus wrote: »

If his letter is even read by one person with potential paedophile thoughts, and gets them to reconsider their actions, that would be good, but is it wishful thinking on my part? Do they realise the lifelong horror they cause, or do they know and not care?

I took a forensic psychology class last year and the woman teaching it worked for the gardai doing psycholigical work with sex offenders. She said a lot of padophiles will try and rationalize what they're doing.

She told us about one father who abused his daughter told her that he was only helping his daughter to learn about sex or something to that effect. Sadly it seems like some of them can't comprehend the damage they are doing which is even more depressing.

TimeToShine

I think that's absolutely amazing.

Misty Chaos

Read this last night, sad read, to say the least.

I was in a very dark place myself once back in 2002 but I managed to drag myself out of it, I guess my survival instincts were greater than any urge to kill myself. The very deep and dark depression I went through was very unpleasant, though the reasons I got that depressed had nothing to do with me being molested and more to do with me being made feel like there was something wrong with me for being the person I am by family.

To be honest, I still resent the fact that my family even tried to pull that sh!t on me and try and make into someone I'm not because I was completely different from them but enough about me. ( Don't worry, I'm doing fine now. )

The point is, people have a lot of reasons to be darkly depressed and while a lot of them can see or indeed, manage to somehow work their way out of it, many do not. I live in the infamous suicide blackspot of Ireland and I know a few people who killed themselves, most recent one being over Christmas. I know how it feels to be that depressed about life, that its almost worth going on being miserable and just want it to end by any means necessary.

I also know of people who committed suicide because they couldn't find work and / or ran out of money due the what I'll only refer to as the ' R ' word. Not that is a waste of life. Then again, all suicides are a waste of life.

For some, counselling or stuffing them with drugs ( I don't hold such drugs in high regard, tbh, no offence to those who do honestly benefit from taking them ) will work but its not a catch all solution, nothing is. Bill here was such a person but there are always very very exceptional cases.

What I will say for those here who are in that dark right now. Please for the love of god, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. I don't care what it is, be it fight through it yourself, talking to someone about, going to doctor, etc. Just don't resort to ending it all, I'm 99% certain your case isn't like poor Bill here. Life is worth living, honest.

midlandsmissus

pablomakaveli wrote: »

I took a forensic psychology class last year and the woman teaching it worked for the gardai doing psycholigical work with sex offenders. She said a lot of padophiles will try and rationalize what they're doing.

She told us about one father who abused his daughter told her that he was only helping his daughter to learn about sex or something to that effect. Sadly it seems like some of them can't comprehend the damage they are doing which is even more depressing.

I guess it's hard for any of us to admit that we have done something wrong.

I remember reading ages ago Charles Watson's (Manson murderer) autobiography, and he said he justified the killings by all these different reasons, and then one day he watched a documentary in jail about one victim.

It was about the young lad visiting the gardener of the house who Watson shot in the face. He said once he saw the clip of the young lad's family saying they all curled up in bed together too terrified to sleep, that he finally let himself feel what he had done.

He actually had a breakdown so consumed by remorse he was then.

I imagine paedophiles to be the same, it's much easier to come up with reasons why they did it, rather than face the truly awful truth of what they have done to another human being.

I want everyone on here to imagine for a second they are the paedophile reading that letter, and discovering how much hurt you have done to another's life. How would you live with it? I truly couldn't bear to know I had done that much damage to another's life. I think this is important to figure out how to get paedophile's to face up to what they're doing.

Copper23

It's just a shame some people abuse the facilities that ARE there to help people who actually need it.

I can't stand people using "illnesses", usually self-diagnosed, as an excuse to do ANYTHING they like and just say "oh it wasn't really me". It's sick. Worse again is people playing the suicide card just for attention. It's completely sick, we are lucky there are services for those who need them. Can only hope those that need it are getting the help despite some clowns wasting these resources.

PeakOutput

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Tough on his family to have that on the internet I'd say ,on top of the grief and guilt.

you obviously didnt read what he said about his family

Dudess

Copper23 wrote: »

people playing the suicide card just for attention.

What the hell does that mean?

amacca

Dudess wrote: »

What the hell does that mean?

The occasional person will threaten suicide with no intention of actually carrying out the act....they do just for attention.

A malingerer of sorts ...makes wild claims, craves attention etc.

presume the poster was referring to these people taking up the time of counselors, referral services


although if they are doing this then they need help too so presumably a good counselor will have some way to help them and they probably should be seen by a professional too

pablomakaveli

amacca wrote: »

The occasional person will threaten suicide with no intention of actually carrying out the act....they do just for attention.

Neil Prendeville did that and was criticised for it.

Dudess

I used always say that too: "Oh a person who's really suicidal wouldn't be going on about it" and Sam34, a member here who is a psychiatrist, advised me and others I was wrong. And she is slightly more knowledgeable. People can assume all they want (and that post by Copper23 is full of assumptions) but you can't claim something is a reality, especially in relation to something as serious as this, just because you "think"/"believe" it is.

Demonique

Dudess wrote: »

What the hell does that mean?

Most people who call suicide help lines are just attention whores?

I wonder how the poster came to that conclusion?

amacca

Dudess wrote: »

I used always say that too: "Oh a person who's really suicidal wouldn't be going on about it" and Sam34, a member here who is a psychiatrist, advised me and others I was wrong. And she is slightly more knowledgeable. People can assume all they want (and that post by Copper23 is full of assumptions) but you can't claim something is a reality, especially in relation to something as serious as this, just because you "think"/"believe" it is.

That doesnt however discount the fact that a small percentage (very small) of people do cry wolf for attention seeking reasons etc. I'm in no way trying to say its not a very serious thing even for those crying wolf but to ignore the fact that you cant always take everyone who claims to be suicidal at face value would be silly too - for one thing you might never get to the real bottom of what was making them say this. Their motivation might not be anything to do with depression.


You've heard of people who swallow medical implements so they will be treated or claim they have diseases/sickness so they will be admitted into hospital - and become the center of attention as they see it...you wouldnt just take their word for it if the symptoms did not match what they said they were suffering from?

jill_valentine

I've been persistently suicidally depressed since I was in my young teens. I finally started attending counselling a few years ago as a last resort and I wish I'd done it years before.

Of course it's not a catch all solution, but it does lay the groundwork for you to start sorting yourself out, rather than just pretending there's no problem until it becomes insurmountable.

What f*cking nerve anybody has to tell people it makes no difference. Ye've no idea. It was the stupid pigheaded Irish mindset that kept me away, and it's shamefully irresponsible to throw it around in ignorance.

Dudess

yoshytoshy wrote: »

I commented without reading the whole thing ,can't say I think suicide is something thats justified though.

Even with the man's eloquent reasonings? I agree with him in a way - it's also selfish of people to expect someone else to endure pain and suffering they cannot begin to imagine. That said, I'm not "in favour" of suicide - I'd prefer a world without suicide, where the suicidal person actually gets better and chooses life of their own accord (not for those around them) but if people are driven to such depths of despair that they cannot go on living, it's inexcusable to call them selfish, and displays a serious lack of empathy and understanding. If a person was in horrendous physical pain, there would be plenty of understanding if they signed up to be euthanised, but just because people who are suicidal aren't confined to bed all day (although some are) and generally have full use of their physical faculties, it's considered a different thing - I really don't see how it is though...

dan_d

It's a very sad read....someone who thought he was such an awful human being that there was no point trying to make himself better because he felt he was such a waste of space the world was better off without him.Someone who trusted nobody and felt that he could never be 'normal'.He might have had some hope of help if he had told someone about his childhood experiences, but he never did...
He never gave himself a chance.

I think what they say about people who talk about committing suicide is that they tend to be the ones that want to be stopped.It's those that say nothing about it, that are most likely to do it (which is a paradox in itself).It's not really what you'd call attention seeking.

Either way, people should always know that no matter how badly you think of yourself, no matter how dark the darkness is, try and get help...suicide is not the solution.

Jesus Wept

Talking for the sake of talking or talking to everyone and anyone is usually a bad idea.
Talking to the right people is a very good idea.

hacked

That was a tough read.

The thing people need to realise is that this problem (And by that I mean the child sexual abuse, which is the real problem that LED to the depression) is such a huge huge issue in this country.

I myself was abused as a child. It really does damage you so deeply and create problems in just about every aspect of life.

Although I have been in psych services for 10 years or so I am only about to start trauma therapy for the abuse this next week. It's very tough, but it really does help. For any of you who are considering it...there really is hope out there. Sometimes it takes a while, not every counselor will be a good fit, and it can take time. Sometimes it takes a while for you to figure out what your problems really are and what you need to work on, but when you reach that stage, it's all worth it.

jill_valentine

One thing that is worth noting is that I only availed of help when it was available to me for free and in confidence by my college.

Otherwise, the provisions for depression in Ireland are absolutely farcical. I dread to think what would have happened if I'd been dependent on public services alone.

midlandsmissus

hacked wrote: »

That was a tough read.

The thing people need to realise is that this problem (And by that I mean the child sexual abuse, which is the real problem that LED to the depression) is such a huge huge issue in this country.

I myself was abused as a child. It really does damage you so deeply and create problems in just about every aspect of life.

Although I have been in psych services for 10 years or so I am only about to start trauma therapy for the abuse this next week. It's very tough, but it really does help. For any of you who are considering it...there really is hope out there. Sometimes it takes a while, not every counselor will be a good fit, and it can take time. Sometimes it takes a while for you to figure out what your problems really are and what you need to work on, but when you reach that stage, it's all worth it.

Maybe we could start a support group? Seriously I don't know anywhere you can go where you can talk to survivors.

I do find talking to the few people I have told, that you can see them kind of go "ughh" and they can't really comprehend it, Not their fault but I would like to talk to peop who have gone through the same thing.

Loopy

A very tough read that.
It's very sad to think he felt he had no other way out. He wanted to die badly, I commend him for going ahead instead of living with all that pain.
IMO it's not a cowards way out, I believe it takes great strength to take your own life.

foxinsox

That was a sad read..

RIP

The saddest I thing I think is that there have probably been thousands of suicides (many in Ireland) that we never know why.

I think it is a good thing that this letter is available for many to read, I'm sure many have felt exactly like him (not necessarily as a result of abuse) and maybe have committed suicide just didn't have the ability to write such a letter.

If it makes people more aware/understanding of depression and how it can affect peoples thoughts then this is a good thing.

Please always remember there are people who can help.

hacked

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Maybe we could start a support group? Seriously I don't know anywhere you can go where you can talk to survivors.

I do find talking to the few people I have told, that you can see them kind of go "ughh" and they can't really comprehend it, Not their fault but I would like to talk to peop who have gone through the same thing.

Yes, I understand what you mean! I'm a single mother living on my own and putting myself through uni at the moment. I've been trying to be honest with sme friends about the therapy as I know I could get a bit messed up, but they don't seem to understand and it can just make things worse!

For the record, I'm happy to talk to anyone. There does seem to be very little in the way of support for CSA survivors.

galwayrush

I don't want to read it because things like that pull on my strings, too sad.

KERSPLAT!

Sad read, has really opened my eyes and changed my opinion somewhat on suicide, R.I.P

Robby91

Quite a sad tale to read - RIP

I hope that someone who is on the edge stumbles across this and, despite the man's lack of success in his search for professional help, tries to speak to someone they can trust. I can't say that my situation has been the same, but having someone to talk to helps immeasurably in lightening the burden (IMO)

J2D2

It is very sad, I know someone who tried, and when they told me about how they went about it I knew from what I'd studied about pharmaceuticals in college that what they had done actually had unknowingly saved them in the end. Only because of this failed attempt were they able to receive the care they desperately needed.

That person wouldn't be here today if they hadn't been able to get this treatment and I'm eternally grateful to the counseling services for helping them deal with some very serious personal issues and allowing them to get their life back on track with a lot of hard work.

thebigleap

http://1000memories.com/billzeller

Pics, bio, tributes.

Apparently his closest friends, including those who lived with him, didn't know 80% of what he wrote in the letter and are shocked by his suicide. They say he was a good friend and a mentor to young kids.

For all he went through he did a lot in his short life....

dr.bollocko

Folks please take that stuff to PM. Please post on topic from here on out or not at all.
PM for clarification. No more thread derailment from here on out.
Fair warning.
A number of posts will be removed.
PM with questions about that also if needed.

I think we can safely say that this thread will not be open for much longer.

Copper23

Dudess wrote: »

I used always say that too: "Oh a person who's really suicidal wouldn't be going on about it" and Sam34, a member here who is a psychiatrist, advised me and others I was wrong. And she is slightly more knowledgeable. People can assume all they want (and that post by Copper23 is full of assumptions) but you can't claim something is a reality, especially in relation to something as serious as this, just because you "think"/"believe" it is.

Dudess, I actually wrote a long reply to this but it's quite personal and I ended up really not wanting to post it in public.

When I said "using the suicide card" I meant people pretending they are going to do it and using it to manipulate you to do as they like, things like saying it will be your fault when they are dead if you do not do X. Doing this repeatedly to get your attention or to manipulate you.

What I said what not an assumption. I was talking about my own life experience and some real events which were just absolutely horrifying, heaving dealt with being the subject of this behaviour for a long time. I really didnt want to post personal details so I just kept my reply short here.

stupidusername

thebigleap wrote: »

http://1000memories.com/billzeller

Pics, bio, tributes.

Apparently his closest friends, including those who lived with him, didn't know 80% of what he wrote in the letter and are shocked by his suicide. They say he was a good friend and a mentor to young kids.

For all he went through he did a lot in his short life....

Just goes to show that you can't know a person is doing ok, even if they seem it.

Guill

I liked Lego as a kid.

Darlughda

I first experienced suicidal idealation in 2001. Actually, truth be told, it was as early as 1993 I really felt it.

I tried to take my life in a way that is not necessary to discuss on a social media, and ever since I have struggled with suicidal thoughts.

When all is well, and I am functioning 'normally' it is as inconceivable to me, like it is to others, how a person can be overwhelmed to die by suicide.

I worked with Samaritans and other suicide prevention groups, so I could help others who were about to take their lives.

I had to withdraw from such work, when my own overwhelm overtook me.

Thankfully, I have learnt to know the signs. Through the help of counsellors, and others. Nonetheless, there are times when these feelings hit and overwhelm me. But they do pass.

The urge to self harm and suicide during these times is a force so hard that it is impossible to describe in written terms.

Kimono-Girl

stupidusername wrote: »

Just goes to show that you can't know a person is doing ok, even if they seem it.

that is completely true, you can never know whats going on inside a person's head, i know from my personal experience i said and did some awful unthinkable things, but yet i tried to make everyone else believe i was ok, i was insistent i was ok when inside i was falling apart in more ways then one, people eventually saw through that, but it has shown me people only see what they want to see, nobody saw what i did coming, except me.

eventually the pressure got to me and i wanted out i wasn't thinking about my family, or my friends, or those who loved me, i have to say i felt weak, i felt i wanted to take the painless way out, i overdosed on every prescription medicine i had stored in the two years previous.

people outside your head, they don't see who you are, what you are going through, they will never understand what you've been through, they judge you, tell you to "get on with it", "get over yourself", they haven't felt the hellish feeling of simply not caring enough to live.

I have,

and its changed who i am, i may seem like the same person, but from deep down inside of me, i swore to never be there again, i promised to myself that i needed to do everything i could to make my life livable, i put the past behind me and i am here today living proof,

with the right kind of help others will hopefully be able to restore some kind of happiness and not end up having to take their lives for escape from the pain.

Gunsfortoys

A very sad state of affairs.

He used the route of counselling and it didn't work which is a shame. It goes to show that the longer you leave it the more it manifests and takes over every aspect of your life.

RIP

cian1500ww

Such a shame that a man who has achieved so much in such a short time has to die like this. As a CS student myself, I can only hope to achieve a small fraction of what he has done, he was truly a incredibly intelligent man and who knows how much more he could have achieved.

Rest In Peace Bill, you've earned it...

Millicent

Naikon wrote: »

Who knows. People in general are unpredictable. Best confide in your family members or someone you trust. Not some "health professional". Sorry, I am just skeptical of the general
concept of counselling. It's a great system for compiling statistics, but what about actual help? If the problem is serious enough, I am not so certain of counselling. "Yes but I didn't
mean to drive over the guy 14 times":pac:

Naikon, not trying to pick a fight but have you ever been in the situation where you needed counselling? Nothing in the world feels worse than knowing you are slowly falling apart but then, when you work up the courage to talk to a family member or close friend, they make you feel as if you are wrong, mental, overly dramatic, irritating, whining, deluded, unimportant, a burden, a source of shame, a victim, a drama-queen or worse, they simply ignore you, ridicule you or don't believe you.

Nothing compounds the loneliness and frustration of being that depressed more than the complete apathy of the people who are supposed to care about you. Counsellors, in that instance, are literally lifesaving and not to be made light of.

Millicent

Copper23 wrote: »

Dudess, I actually wrote a long reply to this but it's quite personal and I ended up really not wanting to post it in public.

When I said "using the suicide card" I meant people pretending they are going to do it and using it to manipulate you to do as they like, things like saying it will be your fault when they are dead if you do not do X. Doing this repeatedly to get your attention or to manipulate you.

What I said what not an assumption. I was talking about my own life experience and some real events which were just absolutely horrifying, heaving dealt with being the subject of this behaviour for a long time. I really didnt want to post personal details so I just kept my reply short here.

Ditto. I've a parent who used it all through my childhood to manipulate, control and generally be emotionally abusive. While (hopefully) people like that are in the minority, they do exist and they do make it harder for other people to be believed.

Thomas828

I'm not suicidal, I've never been abused in any way, physically, psychologically or sexually, I don't carry any of the mental scars caused by abuse. Reading Bill Zeller's sad and gruelling story makes me realise just how lucky I am.

I can read all about the grief that abuse victims go through, but I couldn't begin to imagine what's going through their mind, let alone put myself in their position.

I'm leading a happy life and I must never take that for granted. I also should never judge people only on outward appearances. Not everybody is living a pure, healthy and happy life like me and I should, as Americans say, cut them some slack.

All I can say about Bill Zeller is I hope you'll finally be at peace.

(And Dr Bollocko, you did the right thing deleting all those crass comments that so often come up in After Hours. Child abuse is nothing to joke about. Everybody should know that.)

I have no nightmarish experiences at any time in my history that would prevent me from living a full, happy and healthy life.

Naikon

Millicent wrote: »

Naikon, not trying to pick a fight but have you ever been in the situation where you needed counselling? Nothing in the world feels worse than knowing you are slowly falling apart but then, when you work up the courage to talk to a family member or close friend, they make you feel as if you are wrong, mental, overly dramatic, irritating, whining, deluded, unimportant, a burden, a source of shame, a victim, a drama-queen or worse, they simply ignore you, ridicule you or don't believe you.

Nothing compounds the loneliness and frustration of being that depressed more than the complete apathy of the people who are supposed to care about you. Counsellors, in that instance, are literally lifesaving and not to be made light of.

Like almost every person on this thread, things have happend in my life where I reckon I should have gone to counselling in retrospect. What stops me in particular though, is the notion that they are "there to help".
I think for most people, especially for people with limited/no family support it's worthwhile. For other issues, I just can't see the point. I don't like the fact any person I come across outside of my family/friends circle
is treated with suspicion. It's just the way I am I suppose and this is reflected in my attitude to counselling for worse.

Sadly, I share the mindset he had when it comes to counselling, and I didn't suffer any abuse That is not to say I am filled with hate, it's just I understand our social roots and react accordingly. Fact remains, privacy
is confined to a space between your ears. If something leaves that place, it is NEVER private. What can I say, I like privacy. You are right about family members though. Some things are just too important to state, even
to family members. You have to calculate based on potential what to and what not to say.

Son Of A Vidic

OP - You've wasted your time posting that in here, because surely you know some twit will come in with inappropriate comments. This is one topic that should transcend such attention seeking stupidity.

Very powerful stuff indeed, I never read a suicide note before. It just makes you wonder about the private torment some people go through in life. His loss of hope, faith and trust in humanity was shocking. But yet totally understandable given what he'd been through.

It's a real pity he did not name his abuser, because that bast@rd deserves his punishment. I said this on Boards before and I'll say it again, pedophiles are the lowest form of sub-human scum. The damage they inflict goes far beyond physical suffering, as this letter clear demonstrates. They do not deserve normal judicial treatment, a bullet to the back of the head is about right. But maybe perhaps to quick.

Who knows what exists after death, or even if there is an existence? But if there is an existence, I've no doubt that lad is in his own heaven right now. Reading that letter it's pretty clear he has already lived his private hell.
May he RIP.

The problem with talking with people close to you about these things is that they are close to you. They are emotionally involved and will probably, even if they want to help, want to hurry up the help and get you better so they don't have to deal with it as much. Particularly if they don't know how to help and feel frustrated. You then have the added worry of "oh no I'm burdening the people who love me".
Counsellors really are excellent at listening and knowing how to get deeper into the issues and they are a stranger.
I really think people should stop advising people to stay away from counsellors, it's extremely counterproductive.

Naikon

Just for the record, I don't think any less of people considering counselling. It's just I like to warn people not to expect a miracle. Privacy may be a concern. If it works for you, go nuts. It has never worked as a concept for me personally.

jill_valentine

Privacy isn't a concern. A counsellor won't breach your confidence. And since they have absolutely no emotional stake in what your telling them - they don't know you from Adam - they're a lot easier to speak to than somebody you have to live and work around.

Dudess

Naikon wrote: »

Just for the record, I don't think any less of people considering counselling. It's just I like to warn people not to expect a miracle.

And you're absolutely right to say that - people should not attend a therapist expecting a magic wand to be waved, and much of the work needs to be done by the person themselves, not just the counsellor.

Dudess

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

OP - You've wasted your time posting that in here, because surely you know some twit will come in with inappropriate comments. This is one topic that should transcend such attention seeking stupidity.

The irony of idiotic "Oh that's just drama, attention-seeking" type comments on threads like this is... they are nothing but attention-seeking, going against the grain themselves.

midlandsmissus

Dudess it's bugging me. WHO is your avatar? Is that a stressed looing Nicole Kidman?:D