A little help on consumer rights

Ninjedi

Hey guys just wondering if any of you know this off the top of your head:

A friend bought an item of clothing for her boyfriend for Christmas (a big woolly jumper before anyone asks ) and wants to return it because it's horrible. The store took it back, but the sales assistant only gave her €20 back instead of €40 because the jumper is on sale for that price now!

Am I away the wrong direction or is that a serious breach of her consumer rights?

TheZohanS

She should get the full amount back or a credit note. "being horrible" is not a valid excuse for return however.

FatherLen

i would say it is a breach but you are asking in the wrong forum.


it was'nt a jumper was it? it was a dildo!!!

WindSock

There is a consumer forum here:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=580

ArmaniJeanss

I'd be confident she's entitled to nothing, and that the store is being relatively fair giving her €20.

Ninjedi

Sorry, as you can tell from the post count relatively new here, didn't know there was a forum for this.

Can a mod move please? Or has it already been to corrupted with randomness to be able to live there now?

TouchingVirus

I advise a thorough look at the boards.ie menu at the top of the forum - the #1 way to learn what forums boards has and where to put your threads. Serious After Hours threads never end well

whiskeyman

As the good wasn't faulty, she wasn't entitled to a Cash refund.
She was entitled to a credit note of the refund value (value of good at time of purchase) = €40.

phasers

Since there's nothing wrong with it, the shop don't have to give you anything. Take the €20.

Mr Magners

Ninjedi wrote: »

Hey guys just wondering if any of you know this off the top of your head:

A friend bought an item of clothing for her boyfriend for Christmas (a big woolly jumper before anyone asks ) and wants to return it because it's horrible. The store took it back, but the sales assistant only gave her €20 back instead of €40 because the jumper is on sale for that price now!

Am I away the wrong direction or is that a serious breach of her consumer rights?

Did she have a receipt? If not, unfortunately, she'll only get the amount the item is currently being sold for.

TheZohan wrote: »

She should get the full amount back or a credit note. "being horrible" is not a valid excuse for return however.

As above, without a recipt the store can only refund the current value of the item. Otherwise I could go in today and buy the thing for x (sale amount), bring it back tomorrow and claim it was bough pre-sale and look for the full amount to be refunded. Agree with the excuse for return not being valid though

TheZohanS

whiskeyman wrote: »

As the good wasn't faulty, she wasn't entitled to a Cash refund.
She was entitled to a credit note of the refund value (value of good at time of purchase) = €40.

Bang on. However the OP neglected to advise us that it was in fact a jizz jumper, therefore she is entitled to nothing.

In future use a sock OP.

WindSock

This happened me before when I returned something to Penny's. I was only given a refund of the current value of the item at the time as it was on sale.

FreudianSlippers

whiskeyman wrote: »

As the good wasn't faulty, she wasn't entitled to a Cash refund.
She was entitled to a credit note of the refund value (value of good at time of purchase) = €40.

IF she had a valid sales receipt.

Notorious

Ninjedi wrote: »

The store took it back, but the sales assistant only gave her €20 back instead of €40 because the jumper is on sale for that price now!

Am I away the wrong direction or is that a serious breach of her consumer rights?

If you've no receipt then you've got no case. If you do have a receipt, then they've to refund you what you paid for it.

ALSO, you don't need a valid reason for the return if it's being returned within 28 days of it being purchased.

28064212

OisinT wrote: »

IF she had a valid sales receipt.

Notorious wrote: »

If you've no receipt then you've got no case. If you do have a receipt, then they've to refund you what you paid for it.

No, they don't

Ninjedi

ALSO, you don't need a valid reason for the return if it's being returned within 28 days of it being purchased.

I thought it was seven days (seven days...)


<SNIP> Removing After Hours nonsense<SNIP>

28064212

Notorious wrote: »

ALSO, you don't need a valid reason for the return if it's being returned within 28 days of it being purchased.

ALSO completely untrue.

No wonder people working in retail hate customers so much

WindSock

<SNIP>

Come to think of it, when I returned my item to Penny's, I had no reciept and they refunded the sale value anyway. I *think* they said I would get the full value if I had the reciept. Not too sure though as it was a while ago.

I've never been asked why I return the item. If I were though I wouldn't say because its ming, just say Auntie bought me one and I have one already or some toss.

seamus

Notorious wrote: »

If you've no receipt then you've got no case. If you do have a receipt, then they've to refund you what you paid for it.

Not strictly true. In the case that you have a valid reason for returning the item (i.e. faulty), you technically don't need a receipt as proof of the contract, though it does help immensely, obviously.
You can still avail of your rights without a receipt, but if a retailer won't play ball you'd have to go to court.

ALSO, you don't need a valid reason for the return if it's being returned within 28 days of it being purchased.

Legally you need a valid reason to return any item. If you don't have a valid reason for returning an item, a retailer is not obliged to entertain your request. 28 days is a goodwill policy operated by most clothing stores.

jackiebaron

28064212 wrote: »

Incorrect. "Being a horrible gift" is not a valid reason for a return. She was entitled to nothing. The €20 is a good-will gesture on behalf of the store

So what ARE valid reasons for returning something to the store?

28064212

jackiebaron wrote: »

So what ARE valid reasons for returning something to the store?

From the Consumer Issues sticky

The goods should be of reasonable quality taking into account what is said about them (advertising), what they are supposed to do, their durability and their price. Goods must also be fit for their purpose: in short they must do what they are sold as being capable of doing, and they must also be as described.

FreudianSlippers

28064212 wrote: »

No, they don't

Once there are no other conditions (eg time limit) then you are entitled to the amount you paid for the item should you return it.

This is regardless of whether or not it has been marked down in the meantime.

You have a contract with the company for a certain amount of consideration on both sides. Should you wish to rescind that contract and no outstanding conditions state otherwise, you are entitled to get the amount you paid back from the shop.

If you do not have a receipt, you still have a valid contract - but the problem then is that you cannot prove how much you actually paid for the item.
It is in these circumstances that they are in a position to offer only the current price for the item.

28064212

OisinT wrote: »

Once there are no other conditions (eg time limit) then you are entitled to the amount you paid for the item should you return it.

We're still talking about a non-faulty item, correct? An item the consumer has bought and then changed their mind about? You are not legally entitled to anything in that situation, not a refund, a credit note or the current price. Nothing

seamus

28064212 wrote: »

We're still talking about a non-faulty item, correct? An item the consumer has bought and then changed their mind about? You are not legally entitled to anything in that situation, not a refund, a credit note or the current price. Nothing

Not legally entitled, initially. But if a returns policy is a condition of sale (as it usually is), then the company cannot arbitrarily decide to not honour that returns policy as it forms part of the contract with the buyer.
In that case, they would be required to refund the full cost of the item as paid because they are allowing a method of rescinding the contract.

Where a receipt cannot be shown to prove when the item was purchased and how much was paid for it, then the shop would only be required to refund the current sale price of the item, not the price paid.

FreudianSlippers

28064212 wrote: »

We're still talking about a non-faulty item, correct? An item the consumer has bought and then changed their mind about? You are not legally entitled to anything in that situation, not a refund, a credit note or the current price. Nothing

In theory, yeah if there are no contractual return policies.. in practice this cannot actually occur. What about gifts etc?

I've never actually been to a shop where they would enforce such a stupid policy as no returns for changing your mind.

alwaysadub

28064212 wrote: »

We're still talking about a non-faulty item, correct? An item the consumer has bought and then changed their mind about? You are not legally entitled to anything in that situation, not a refund, a credit note or the current price. Nothing

Correct. Most shops will offer a credit note, maybe a refund sometimes. That is a gesture of goodwill on the shops behalf. But they are not obliged to take something back or refund you just cos you change your mind.

FreudianSlippers

What shops specifically are we talking about here that refuse to do returns if you change your mind?

Not to name and shame - but out of curiosity, we can easily find out their return policies.

28064212

OisinT wrote: »

In theory, yeah if there are no contractual return policies.. in practice this cannot actually occur. What about gifts etc?

....

OisinT wrote: »

Once there are no other conditions (eg time limit) then you are entitled to the amount you paid for the item should you return it.

We were talking about legal obligations

OisinT wrote: »

I've never actually been to a shop where they would enforce such a stupid policy as no returns for changing your mind.

Yes, most of the 'big' stores have returns policies. Many smaller retailers do not. And they can give you whatever they want. It is entirely dependent on what they decide at the time.

dolphin city

Ninjedi wrote: »

Hey guys just wondering if any of you know this off the top of your head:

A friend bought an item of clothing for her boyfriend for Christmas (a big woolly jumper before anyone asks ) and wants to return it because it's horrible. The store took it back, but the sales assistant only gave her €20 back instead of €40 because the jumper is on sale for that price now!

Am I away the wrong direction or is that a serious breach of her consumer rights?

that sounds right. If your friend still has her receipt then the sales person will give her full value for the "jumper". However if she does not have her receipt then she only gets sale value. How does the sales girl know that the jumper was not purchased in the sale, and you now want to get full value back for it therefore making money out of it.

get your receipt and you will get full value of the jumper. No receipt - then sales price only.

FreudianSlippers

28064212 wrote: »

....

We were talking about legal obligations


Yes, most of the 'big' stores have returns policies. Many smaller retailers do not. And they can give you whatever they want. It is entirely dependent on what they decide at the time.

Yes, if the shop does not have a policy then it is implied that the legislative policy is in place. As such, you have no redress for changing your mind etc.

However, when it comes down to the fact that the shop has agreed to accept the return (or if policy exists regarding returns) then unless specified elsewhere in the contract they must give you the amount you paid if you present a valid sales receipt.

28064212

OisinT wrote: »

However, when it comes down to the fact that the shop has agreed to accept the return (or if policy exists regarding returns) then unless specified elsewhere in the contract they must give you the amount you paid if you present a valid sales receipt.

The bolded part is wrong. If no returns policy formed part of the sale, the store can offer whatever they want. They can offer magic beans if they want to