Getting a good mark in English

Chuchoter

Just got my Christmas result back and I got a B2 (which I know is alright but English is one of the subjects I need an A1 in). I'm really not happy. I got caught for misquoting (my own fault) and then he took loads of marks off me for not 'referring back to the question'. I don't understand what that means, do I just have to keep repeating the words in the question over and over? Also how specific do you have to be? If I say what Claudius did to Hamlet do I have to say killing his father even though thats really obvious? English was my best subject but this LC business just isn't working. :mad:

storm2811

Referring back to question is like making sure what you're saying in your answer is relevant, like don't just ramble on.
Like if the question ends like "Discuss this claim/show how this is/is not true" etc then just say something like "I find this is/is not true due to.." whatever with every point you make.

Sorry I couldn't really give a better example.:pac:

That's what I've been doing this year and for the JC and I've done pretty well so far in my tests and stuff.

Oh and, point, quote, explain, always!

seriouslysweet

I tend to blab on a bit and every single sentence I wrote my teacher said I should have been able to say WHY it was relevent. I'm assuming that is what was meant.

DaveMur1

Never depend on English for an A1 ,that can only end in dissapointment.
Every year the students who often get 600 points out of their 7 subjects miss out on A1's in english,because you can't really rely on the right questons coming up & you're structure being good!

soup1

DaveMur1 wrote: »

Never depend on English for an A1 ,that can only end in disappointment.
Every year the students who often get 600 points out of their 7 subjects miss out on A1's in English,because you can't really rely on the right questions coming up & you're structure being good!

Im sorry but that is dreadful advice! Getting an A1 in English is not easy by any means, but neither is any other subject! Of course you cant rely on particular questions coming up - you have to adapt your answers! Just know your texts, practice writing paragraphs everyday, and get comfortable using a variety of syntax. Stand out from the crowd as best you can - don't be the same as the other 30 scripts in your class! Don't be afraid to challenge the boundaries of what you consider "acceptable"! And most importantly, dont conform to the opinion that 100% is impossible in Leaving Cert English!

spurious

Answer the question asked. It might seem mad, but every year, thousands of so-called Higher Level English candidates fail to do so.

Bbbbolger

Just about being relevant to the question...I see a lot of people saying in other threads "just make sure you repeat some words from the question in each paragraph." I think thats terrible advice. You cant just tag on a few words at the end of a paragraph and suddenly make it relevant to the question. I'd advise for every question you do take 30 seconds to a minute to do a short plan. Just a key word for every paragraph you plan to write. I used to hate people telling me this but when I did it once I realised how much it helps. You need to make sure that every paragraph you write doesnt need that litle tag at the end explaining why it's relevant to the question. It should be obviously apparent by the content you write. People tend to fall into the trap of writing one or two good sentences and then reverting back to spewing out streams of sentences that they've learned off that sound very good, but are not relevant at all to the question...rant over. Sorry. Just really needed to say that! Hope there's a bit of help underneath all that.

Chuchoter

So how do I do that though? First he said I wasn't backing up my answers, so then I did that. If a question asked 'so and so is a very complex charachter, would you have to put the word complex in every point you made? Not necessarily tagged on at the end like. I do make plans and I don't learn things off. I think my ideas and expression is good, I just seem to be missing something.

DaveMur1

soup1 wrote: »

Im sorry but that is dreadful advice!
Dreadful advice ?

And most importantly, dont conform to the opinion that 100% is impossible in Leaving Cert English!

I merely stated the facts that it's a bad idea to depend on the leaving cert subject,statistically with the lowest A1 grade rate being an 3.2% for males!So Yes any fool could completely agree with you,3 in every 100 people looks like great odds!:p

Really I said it was imposible? Please quote me clearly on where I said this & i'll happily apologise!

Finally & this is my favourite part you yourself don't appear to be in such a position to give advice on an A1 in English! Refer to the second quote I highlighted fom you're reply,notice anything wrong?The sentence begins with 'And' No A1 student is ever going to try start a question with a conjunction doing so creates a sentence fragment, not a complete sentence. And, is used primarily to join two independent phrases together and create a relationship between them.

In relation to the original poster, Getting an A1 in english is really to broad ,but if you are looking for help in any specific areas such as poetry , comparative or single text. I will gladly help you !

Chuchoter

DaveMur1 wrote: »

I merely stated the facts that it's a bad idea to depend on the leaving cert subject,statistically with the lowest A1 grade rate being an 3.2% for males!So Yes any fool could completely agree with you,3 in every 100 people looks like great odds!:p

Really I said it was imposible? Please quote me clearly on where I said this & i'll happily apologise!

Finally & this is my favourite part you yourself don't appear to be in such a position to give advice on an A1 in English! Refer to the second quote I highlighted fom you're reply,notice anything wrong?The sentence begins with 'And' No A1 student is ever going to try start a question with a conjunction doing so creates a sentence fragment, not a complete sentence. And, is used primarily to join two independent phrases together and create a relationship between them.

In relation to the original poster, Getting an A1 in english is really to broad ,but if you are looking for help in any specific areas such as poetry , comparative or single text. I will gladly help you !

I guess poetry and characters then? Thats what we're doing at the moment.

ride-the-spiral

DaveMur1 wrote: »

I merely stated the facts that it's a bad idea to depend on the leaving cert subject,statistically with the lowest A1 grade rate being an 3.2% for males!So Yes any fool could completely agree with you,3 in every 100 people looks like great odds!:p

Really I said it was imposible? Please quote me clearly on where I said this & i'll happily apologise!

Finally & this is my favourite part you yourself don't appear to be in such a position to give advice on an A1 in English! Refer to the second quote I highlighted fom you're reply,notice anything wrong?The sentence begins with 'And' No A1 student is ever going to try start a question with a conjunction doing so creates a sentence fragment, not a complete sentence. And, is used primarily to join two independent phrases together and create a relationship between them.

In relation to the original poster, Getting an A1 in english is really to broad ,but if you are looking for help in any specific areas such as poetry , comparative or single text. I will gladly help you !

Ahem...

DaveMur1

DaveMur1 wrote: »

I merely stated the facts that it's a bad idea to depend on the leaving cert subject,statistically with the lowest A1 grade rate being an 3.2% for males!So Yes any fool could completely agree with you,3 in every 100 people looks like great odds!:p

Really I said it was imposible? Please quote me clearly on where I said this & i'll happily apologise!

Finally & this is my favourite part you yourself don't appear to be in such a position to give advice on an A1 in English! Refer to the second quote I highlighted fom you're reply,notice anything wrong?The sentence begins with 'And' No A1 student is ever going to try start a question with a conjunction doing so creates a sentence fragment, not a complete sentence. And, is used primarily to join two independent phrases together and create a relationship between them.

In relation to the original poster, Getting an A1 in english is really to broad ,but if you are looking for help in any specific areas such as poetry , comparative or single text. I will gladly help you !

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

Ahem...

Ye that's the laptop it's randomly skipping letters i'm actually fairly sure I put another paragraph in that reply!

Stewie Griffin

Did that illegitimate computer you have there print a full stop in the last line too? It should be a comma, not a full stop.

Feckin' computers have a mind of their own....

DaveMur1

Basically ,I just decided to give you the whole english,being as specific I could be for what you require!
(ride-the-spiral this took around 10 minutes, but feel free to point out any mistakes you may or may not find!)

Paper 1
You are expected to read Paper One fully i.e. read all the texts as you would a magazine.
These texts are centred on a single theme e.g. OUR WORLD
They will give you material for the compositions which are also based around this central theme.
You will actually be rewarded if you creatively use material from the texts in your composition!
Think about REGISTER and the LANGUAGE AREAS (i.e. information, argument, persuasion etc.) in Composition Writing.
For instance, your writing for a "popular magazine" (Composition 3) will be a bit different to that used in a "serious newspaper or journal" (Composition 1).
Paper 2
Know your STUDIED TEXT well - be clear on CHARACTER, THEMES and IMAGERY - above all, learn some apt quotes. They make it obvious that you know the text and this impresses the examiner.
POETRY
You DON'T need to know all the poems of a particular poet equally well. Try to cover a range of his/her poetry - but concentrate on the ones that affected you most and be able to explain HOW and WHY they affected you (even if you hated them!)
THE COMPARATIVE STUDY
Beware of studying the texts as separate works. The skill here is what it says - Comparative - so your job is to find links between the three texts and show how they are either alike or different.
All will be explained....
Basic Know-How for The Comparative Study
FACT! - preparing for the Comparative is very different to preparing for the Single Text.
You do not need to make close studies of the Comparative texts - this is a waste of time. After you have read the text go back and select KEY MOMENTS.
Here is an outline of the differences. Make sure you try to put them into practice.
READING APPROACHES
SINGLE TEXT COMPARATIVERead text closely.Read for story.Trace Character development.Search for key moments.Know Themes.Know the modesPlot and subplot.Revist the key moments Language and Imagery.Put the similarities and differences together .Role of minor characters,Find links

UnLuckyAgain

Okay, back to answering crayolastereo's question...

crayolastereo wrote: »

.I don't understand what that means, do I just have to keep repeating the words in the question over and over?

The most important thing is make sure you are answering the question that is asked. This is how the examiner can differentiate between a student who has rehearsed and regurgitated answers, and students who really understand the text, and are able to apply their knowledge to any question.

You really should be aiming to show that the points you have made in each paragraph are not only relevant to the question at hand, but most importantly, are evidence which support the question.

Throughout your answer, try using statements like "this is proof that....(some variation of the question)" or "this point reinforces the idea that...(question asked)". Also, I think that being able to reiterate the question somewhat differently throughout would make your answer seem less robotic.

Hope that helps.

LambsEye

I got an A1 in my Higher Level English many years ago (5.)

A lot of students go wrong when they've prepared for a certain question and it doesn't come up. The knowledge is there but they panic because they don't know how to relate the knowledge they've learned in the context of which it is asked.

What I used to do before writing anything is vomit all my knowledge onto a rough piece of paper, write down all the keywords and knowledge you've learned.

Then reread the question and start dividing your knowledge into paragraphs that are pertinent to the question and have some form of flow. You should ALWAYS have the question in mind and think of different ways to relate the paragraph back to the question.

A paragraph should be: Quotes, your points, how your point relates to the question, how your paragraph flows onto the next.

Your introductory paragraph should be an outline of the approach you are going to take in the following paper. Each paragraph should then make it's own point and each point should back up the stance you are taking. You should then try and link the paragraphs.


E.g. "The appeal of Hamlet lies in the title characters complex nature, Discuss."

Intro: "Shakespeare's Hamlet is an enigmatic and irrational protagonist. His erratic and contradictory behaviour drives the plot and serves to intrigue the viewer. (Agree with the statement, setting the tone of your argument.)

Now you've agreed with the statement WHY/HOW is he complex and HOW does it appeal to you, the audience?

1. Insight into Hamlet's complex mind: His soliloquies, his unhappiness, suicide contemplation. This is the WHY/HOW he is complex. It is interesting because? This should lead into his:
2. Procrastination. Why does his complexity make him procrastinate, why is this appealing to an audience? This should lead into his:
3. Madness: Real or Fake? This should lead into:
4.. The repercussions of his madness: Ophelia. Why does Hamlet's complexity cause Ophelia's downfall and why does this appeal to an audience (because it progresses the play.)
5. Some other point. It's been a while since I did Hamlet!

Conclusion: Should sum up but not repeat all the points made and give a final statement about your analysis of the question: "Thus we can see that the complexity of Hamlet's character lies in his unreliability as a central protagonist. His confusing nature appeals to the reader as it forces them to take an active role in the play's narrative and decipher for themselves whether or not he is mad. Etc. Etc."

Hope this helps!

highlydebased

Luck on the day is alot of it.
Don't do an Eavan Boland on it.

Unfortunately I'm of the opinion that the exam is not a reflection of your TRUE ability in English, instead its a race and performance indicator in June.

UnLuckyAgain

Neon-Circles wrote: »

Luck on the day is alot of it.
Don't do an Eavan Boland on it.

Unfortunately I'm of the opinion that the exam is not a reflection of your TRUE ability in English, instead its a race and performance indicator in June.

Not necessarily, if you have a thorough knowledge of your texts, you should be able to prove your ability in english, by being able to respond to whatever is thrown at you. Although I do agree that often it is a race against time, but practicing regularly will help you pick up your pace.

randylonghorn

spurious wrote: »

Answer the question asked. It might seem mad, but every year, thousands of so-called Higher Level English candidates fail to do so.

QFT. And in my personal opinion, this has a lot to do with the grind school mentality which has crept into our "education" system, which encourages rote learning of answers, essays, etc. beforehand and their regurgitation on the day. LambsEye's post above illustrates a far better approach to English in particular, though it's relevant to other subjects as well.

Bbbbolger wrote: »

People tend to fall into the trap of writing one or two good sentences and then reverting back to spewing out streams of sentences that they've learned off that sound very good, but are not relevant at all to the question...

That's exactly what often happens.

DaveMur1 wrote: »

Finally & this is my favourite part you yourself don't appear to be in such a position to give advice on an A1 in English!

If you are going to criticise others for their use of English on what is, after all, an internet forum, it is probably advisable to make sure your own house is in perfect order.


Crayo, if you want to, feel free to PM me one of your answers where you had problems / got marked down and I'll have a look at it when I get time and see if I can make any useful suggestions.

soup1

DaveMur1 wrote: »

I merely stated the facts that it's a bad idea to depend on the leaving cert subject,statistically with the lowest A1 grade rate being an 3.2% for males!So Yes any fool could completely agree with you,3 in every 100 people looks like great odds!:p

Really I said it was imposible? Please quote me clearly on where I said this & i'll happily apologise!

Finally & this is my favourite part you yourself don't appear to be in such a position to give advice on an A1 in English! Refer to the second quote I highlighted fom you're reply,notice anything wrong?The sentence begins with 'And' No A1 student is ever going to try start a question with a conjunction doing so creates a sentence fragment, not a complete sentence. And, is used primarily to join two independent phrases together and create a relationship between them.

<snip>
<mod>No need for abuse - any more and you'll be taking a break.</mod>

patar

Anybody have any tips on the poetry part? The worst thing about poetry for me is the personal response... How do you write one without be completely repetitive?

whadabouchasir

crayolastereo wrote: »

and then he took loads of marks off me for not 'referring back to the question'. I don't understand what that means, do I just have to keep repeating the words in the question over and over?

You have to avoid giving a summary of the play/novel/film and answer the question asked.Say for example that the question is"IT is ultimately Macbeths ambition which leads to his downfall.Discuss."Here you have to make sure that you talk about Macbeths downfall and how it was brought about by his ambition.IF it's not about his downfall and it wasn't caused by his huge ambition then it shouldn't be mentioned in your answer.I found that the best way to do this is to refer back to the question at the end of each paragraph.If you're discussing a character or character trait then refer to that character/trait at the end.The same goes for a theme.If you're discussing the theme of forgiveness then the last line of that pragraph should contain the word forgiveness in it.

crayolastereo wrote: »

Also how specific do you have to be? If I say what Claudius did to Hamlet do I have to say killing his father even though thats really obvious? English was my best subject but this LC business just isn't working. :mad:

If you were asked "what did Claudius do to Hamlet?"or a question to that effect and you didn't mentipn something really obvious then you would almost certainly lose marks.Nothing is too obvious.

Aoifums

patar wrote: »

Anybody have any tips on the poetry part? The worst thing about poetry for me is the personal response... How do you write one without be completely repetitive?

I have to ask, is this you answering Write a personal response on the poetry of *some poet*, or just part of an overall question? Because as far as I know, they don't give such generic titles anymore. They used to back when the course changed but not so much anymore.
When I respond to a poet's work, I am fairly honest. I write about how that poetry appeals to me and what it makes me think. Obviously it does't work if I hate the poet *cough*Dickinson*cough* but it works fairly well when I like the poet's work.

UnLuckyAgain

patar wrote: »

Anybody have any tips on the poetry part? The worst thing about poetry for me is the personal response... How do you write one without be completely repetitive?

A handy trick you could try is to mark out one poem as your 'personal favourite' (and state this) and leave it until the end - the last paragraph before your conclusion. Discuss exactly what it is you enjoy specifically about that poem (e.g. complex symbolism because it makes you think - appeals to your inquisitive nature etc).

By mentioning your personal favourite towards the end, it will ensure the examiner knows that you are answering the question.

Also, use 'I' throughout your answer, but not excessively. Emphasise how the poetry made you feel, how it made you question things.

brianthebard

patar wrote: »

Anybody have any tips on the poetry part? The worst thing about poetry for me is the personal response... How do you write one without be completely repetitive?

What planning have you done for it so far? Can you avoid these questions if you want?

highlydebased

UnLuckyAgain wrote: »

Not necessarily, if you have a thorough knowledge of your texts, you should be able to prove your ability in english, by being able to respond to whatever is thrown at you. Although I do agree that often it is a race against time, but practicing regularly will help you pick up your pace.

Well having sat last year's paper thats the way I felt. However lack of an A grade is compensated by now working for a newspaper

ConstantJoe

If you want to show your examiner that your answer is relevant to the question, and that you are refering back to the question, what I do is I pick the key word from your question, and whenever I use that word in my essay, I highlight it. Pick a key word and try to use it maybe once a paragraph to show that you're actually answering the question you're asked.

irishharper

OP-the most important thing with english is IMO having the confidence in what you're writing ! Whenever you're writing any answer in English don't doubt what you're writing . It's the belief and the confidence in yourself that will keep you calm in the exam and help you to do your best on the day!

Planning is essential -it will help keep you on track especially if you feel you are waffling.a one page plan was what I found to be the best way of planning any question

start timing your answers now and have a look at the paper to see where your strengths and weaknesses are with each section. a time plan is great to do for the pres and lc

Other posters have talked about structure and actually answering the question properly -seems silly to say but so many don't -but with regards learning quotes make up a list for hamlet and poetry now so that closer to the exam you won't have to!

Hope this helps- got an a1 two years ago so anything else just ask!

nommm

I have a question. Whenever I do my personal response and say I loved the poets use of language, imagery etc. my teacher always writes something along the lines of 'Do you really mean this?'. She says that we should write anecdotes relating to what is in the poem. All the notes and revision books I've read have said otherwise. Does anyone have any advice?

Meller

nommm wrote: »

I have a question. Whenever I do my personal response and say I loved the poets use of language, imagery etc. my teacher always writes something along the lines of 'Do you really mean this?'. She says that we should write anecdotes relating to what is in the poem. All the notes and revision books I've read have said otherwise. Does anyone have any advice?

i suppose stating that you 'love' a certain aspect of the poem is pretty meaningless and irrelevant unless it goes further or is used in the making of a point. i wouldn't say 'include an anecdote', exactly, but make sure you explain why you love it and why mentioning that you do benefits your answer.

ASVM

Your teacher is right in saying that you love the poem is a cliche.You've got to be more creative. Perhaps you could say how the poem makes you feel,give your personal response.I know this from correcting exams.We can spot a fake a mile off so rememer keep it real.