Neighbours dumping furniture on path.

KazDub

Neighbours, a few doors away from me, are turning into a real problem. A few months ago they dumped a large, black sofa outside their house, on a public path and it sat there for a week or so until somebody else moved it. Then they dumped old bedside lockers in the same spot a few weeks later. Now they have two small children's chairs and cardboard boxes outside their house. Their usual routine is (a) leave crap in their side garden (b)move crap onto the wall between the garden and the public path (c) move crap outside their house onto the path and hope someone will come and get it.
This is just getting ridiculous. They are making the place look disgraceful. I have no idea what happened to the previous items that they've left there, but can only assume that they washed their hands of the problem of disposing of the items once they'd 'dumped' them outside their house. I don't know these people and don't fancy calling to them about this. I'm sure some of you will say that I should, but in fairness I have previously contacted Fingal about other domestic waste being dumped in green areas near me, so I'm not totally useless. I just don't fancy knocking on a stranger's door and encountering someone who might be less than amiable about the issue. If the chairs are still there this evening I'm going to feck them back over the wall into their garden. They also have a small plastic tub, like a baby bath or laundry basket, on the wall. I'm sure that will magically have appeared on the path by tonight. Is there a number in Fingal that I can contact regarding these people and their dumping? Is it the same number that you contact regarding domestic waste? Part of me hopes that perhaps they use this forum and realise that their neighbours know what they're up to and stop! But I don't think people who dump stuff like this actually have a conscience, so there goes that notion.
What's a good way of stopping this, once and for all?

mustang68

I would imagine that it is plain and simple littering and you should get onto a litter warden about it. That would drive me up the walls.

daymobrew

KazDub wrote: »

Is there a number in Fingal that I can contact regarding these people and their dumping? Is it the same number that you contact regarding domestic waste?

Report it to the Litter Management Unit. Residents are responsible for maintaining their property, even if the litter is dumped by someone else!!

KazDub wrote: »

What's a good way of stopping this, once and for all?

Litter fines.

KazDub

Please note that should you witness a member of the public littering or dumping rubbish a litter fine will be issued on foot of your report. Should the fine remain unpaid we will pursue the matter in the District Court where a Judge will make an independent ruling. In order to obtain a prosecution in court, you will be requested to act as a witness in court.

..and in one quick swoop they stop you in your tracks from reporting this. I have to live near these people, when my kids are older they'll encounter them and their kids out playing on the street. I hope there's a way of doing this anonymously as I have no intention of getting involved in any potential prosecution against these people. What a stupid way of doing things!

I may just phone them and see what's involved. Thanks for the pointers though.

daymobrew

KazDub wrote: »

..and in one quick swoop they stop you in your tracks from reporting this. I have to live near these people, when my kids are older they'll encounter them and their kids out playing on the street. I hope there's a way of doing this anonymously as I have no intention of getting involved in any potential prosecution against these people. What a stupid way of doing things!

I may just phone them and see what's involved. Thanks for the pointers though.

Your name is not disclosed even if the case ended up in court.
I have been reporting littering from cars (generally cigarettes) for years, over 100 reports. I have only been to court at a witness 3 times and in two cases the defendant didn't turn up. In the other case the driver forgot to pay and his fine was doubled. The driver did not speak to me at all.

A visit from the Litter Warden should sort this out or reduce it significantly.
In the very unlikely event of it going to court you could back out at that point (just don't tell FCC that you would think of doing this).

Gaspode

I've reported several cases of littering over the years, some of which did lead to prosecution of the offenders, and I've never had to go to court.

brightkane

daymobrew wrote: »

Your name is not disclosed even if the case ended up in court.
I have been reporting littering from cars (generally cigarettes) for years, over 100 reports. I have only been to court at a witness 3 times and in two cases the defendant didn't turn up. In the other case the driver forgot to pay and his fine was doubled. The driver did not speak to me at all.

A visit from the Litter Warden should sort this out or reduce it significantly.
In the very unlikely event of it going to court you could back out at that point (just don't tell FCC that you would think of doing this).

littering from cars really really annoys me. Do you know how many they have sucessfully fined? or they ever ask for evidence ect, Whats involved if you dont mind me asking and is it the litter warden you report it to?

daymobrew

brightkane wrote: »

littering from cars really really annoys me. Do you know how many they have sucessfully fined? or they ever ask for evidence ect, Whats involved if you dont mind me asking and is it the litter warden you report it to?

As far as I know all my reports result in fines - if the person doesn't pay then it goes to court.

I have never been asked for evidence. I simply complete a Witness Statement Form (I have it as a Word doc) and email it to envserv@fingalcoco.ie. They forward it to the Litter Warden who will, in the case of littering from a car, gets the owner details via the reg plate and issues a fine of 150 euro.

You can phone in the report, see http://www.fingalcoco.ie/Environment/LitterControl/ReportingLitter/

I would be happy to post an anonymised copy of one of my Witness Statement Forms, to show the type of info I include.

RTT

I don't blame you for being annoyed. Some people are just so lazy when it comes to getting rid of their rubbish. It still bugs me when I see washing machines dumped at the side of the road, often on the lanes leading down to the Strawberry Beds. Coolmine Recycling Centre take them for free, or even Powercity. As for sofas etc, you pay in bin tags.
Maybe take some photos of them doing it. No respect for themselves, property or their neighbours by the looks of it.

Arciphel

Daymobrew, if you could post up that sample form I would much appreciate it. Have a family living near me who are constantly dumping their crap all over the road, enough is enough and it's time to do something about it. Cheers.

dollyk

on a lighter note, we cleaned out our shed and attic, got a skip, filled it and..........next morning it was empty save for a bag of clothes...:D

DickyC

daymobrew wrote: »

Your name is not disclosed even if the case ended up in court.
I have been reporting littering from cars (generally cigarettes) for years, over 100 reports. I have only been to court at a witness 3 times and in two cases the defendant didn't turn up. In the other case the driver forgot to pay and his fine was doubled. The driver did not speak to me at all.

A visit from the Litter Warden should sort this out or reduce it significantly.
In the very unlikely event of it going to court you could back out at that point (just don't tell FCC that you would think of doing this).

You say you only have been in court 3 times but how many of your reported incidents actually went to court? and you say your name is not disclosed, fair enough. You reported car drivers not neighbours, bit of a difference if you think about it. Do you not think there is a chance the accused would recognise you? So there is a risk of reprisal unless the neighbour doing the dumping is BLIND!

Gaspode

It is more than likely though that the neighbour doing the dumping will be fined first, so it may never go to court if they pay the fine.
It's only if they dont pay that it will end up in court.

Yawns

If they don't care enough to dispose of rubbish properly then I think they may not care to pay a fine? Of course this is just an assumption but I dare say a reasonable one.

wildlifeman

what if i dont like you and think..ah i'll report that guys reg for throwing crud out of his car when in fact you did nothing..so you get a fine..i get a nice big smile on my face and no one asks me for evidence of this act..doesnt seem very fair to me..

daymobrew

DickyC wrote: »

You say you only have been in court 3 times but how many of your reported incidents actually went to court?

3 times.

DickyC wrote: »

and you say your name is not disclosed, fair enough.

It is not mentioned in the court or in the fine sent to the registered owner.

DickyC wrote: »

You reported car drivers not neighbours, bit of a difference if you think about it.

Agreed.

Gaspode wrote: »

It is more than likely though that the neighbour doing the dumping will be fined first, so it may never go to court if they pay the fine.
It's only if they dont pay that it will end up in court.

It will go to court if they don't pay, whether they forget to or dispute my report.
I have had 2 court dates that didn't happen. For one the person paid a few days before the court date - maybe they forgot or figured they could ignore the original fine.
In another instance the car owner's solicitor contacted FCC to ask me to confirm the claim. The car owner said they weren't at the location and they don't let anyone else drive their car (i.e. the car could not have been there either). I confirmed the accuracy of my claim. I was later notified about a court date and then, a few days before the date the car owner paid the fine. Chancer in my opinion.

Yawns wrote: »

If they don't care enough to dispose of rubbish properly then I think they may not care to pay a fine? Of course this is just an assumption but I dare say a reasonable one.

Losing money makes people change their behaviour. Look at the plastic bag tax - a small amount of money but a big change in behaviour.

Attached is a sample form. I changed the car and date info. The incident and location are real - just to show the detail I provide. I provide a Google Maps link so that there is no ambiguity of the location.

brightkane

Thanks for that. If you put an X in the wont appear in court, will they still fine the person as normal?

Are you updated by FCC to let you know when they have sucessfully fined on behalf of your report?

or is it more report, forget it until you might get a date for court?

daymobrew

brightkane wrote: »

Thanks for that. If you put an X in the wont appear in court, will they still fine the person as normal?

Are you updated by FCC to let you know when they have sucessfully fined on behalf of your report?

or is it more report, forget it until you might get a date for court?

I think that they will not fine if you put the X in the "won't appear in court" box - best to ask FCC.
FCC only confirm receipt of the report. It's very much a send-it-and-forget-it. I make sure the original report is reasonably detailed, and that I keep a copy of it, to remind me of the incident if I need to recall it in court.

CrazyRabbit

About 15-16 years ago, I had a neighbour with the same attitude. Dump rubbish outside on the path and hope someone takes it away.

So myself & 2 other neighbours went out late one night, gathered ALL the rubbish/discarded furniture we could find in the estate (into a van), and then quietly dumped it all in the neighbours garden.

The were furious (they never figured out who did it). But they got the message. Skips appeared and everything was cleared away within a week.

Nowadays, I'm too lazy. I'd just knock at the door and asked them to clear it up. Couldn't care less about their reaction.

DickyC

daymobrew wrote: »

I think that they will not fine if you put the X in the "won't appear in court" box - best to ask FCC.
FCC only confirm receipt of the report. It's very much a send-it-and-forget-it. I make sure the original report is reasonably detailed, and that I keep a copy of it, to remind me of the incident if I need to recall it in court.

You do good work, but I would say that if push came to shove you would have to stand up in court. After all it would be your word against theirs, but you have to take into account the mentality of some of these knuckle-dragging dumpers. Just be careful and keep up the good work.

daymobrew

wildlifeman wrote: »

what if i dont like you and think..ah i'll report that guys reg for throwing crud out of his car when in fact you did nothing..so you get a fine..i get a nice big smile on my face and no one asks me for evidence of this act..doesnt seem very fair to me..

I do not have an answer. Non-littering court cases must have the same issue, I wonder how they deal with a lying witness.

thehomeofDob

wildlifeman wrote: »

what if i dont like you and think..ah i'll report that guys reg for throwing crud out of his car when in fact you did nothing..so you get a fine..i get a nice big smile on my face and no one asks me for evidence of this act..doesnt seem very fair to me..

I completely agree. That system is wide open for all sorts of abuse. You could target anyone randomly or someone you know personally that you don't like, and yet as long as you confirm that you saw them there at that place and time there's nothing they can do. They may have been there, but done nothing wrong, but they have no choice but to pay a €150 fine.

System is completely flawed.

daymobrew

thehomeofDob wrote: »

I completely agree. That system is wide open for all sorts of abuse. You could target anyone randomly or someone you know personally that you don't like, and yet as long as you confirm that you saw them there at that place and time there's nothing they can do. They may have been there, but done nothing wrong, but they have no choice but to pay a €150 fine.

System is completely flawed.

One would have to be willing to repeat the claim in court. I would hope that the judge and the especially defendant's barrister would do their best to expose the lie.

As this 'flaw' exists in the entire court system, not just for littering claims, I expect that the court system has procedures to minimise false claims.

wildlifeman

whats your car reg daymobrew? :rolleyes:

daymobrew

wildlifeman wrote: »

whats your car reg daymobrew? :rolleyes:

My bike doesn't have a reg plate - so I can litter and there is nothing you can do about it