New England Patriots thread (MOD WARNING - #4503)

j8wk2feszrnpao

Phew!!!

dh1985

No good for the heart. Incredible last 3 minutes. Horrible 57 preceeding them

me89

I Love this team. MVP Gostowski comes up big again. Magic.

My God are we lucky to have a QB like Tom, the man doesn't know the meaning of giving up.

j8wk2feszrnpao

me89 wrote: »

My God are we lucky to have a QB like Tom, the man doesn't know the meaning of giving up.

True, but he and the rest of the offense need to start a lot better than they have been.

bruschi

YYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



that is all.

HigginsJ

Reports suggesting Gronk has a torn ACL

kryogen

HigginsJ wrote: »

Reports suggesting Gronk has a torn ACL

I will hold off on the tears until tomorrow but this is some serious bull**** regarding him and his injuries. Its ridiculous like

j8wk2feszrnpao

HigginsJ wrote: »

Reports suggesting Gronk has a torn ACL

If so, then it'll be 9mths.

NFL needs to review those type of hits.
Currently legal, but possibly it's always an injury waiting to happen.

Officials had a baring on today's game. Thought they had a number of dodgy calls against and for the Pats.
The two 'intentional groundings' were harsh.
Don't believe the 2nd one would have called if Pats hadn't been penalised.

Son Of A Vidic

I'll talk about the knee hit another time, but it really was too much to ask to have Gronk for the playoffs wasn't it. 3 fúcking years in a row we lose him, 3 bloody years. Him and Brady are unstoppable, unless he's crippled by a poor tackle of course. But I just can't see us doing much now without him. This team has great guts and the never say die attitude of Brady, well what can you say about him, there are no words.

me89

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I'll talk about the knee hit another time, but it really was too much to ask to have Gronk for the playoffs wasn't it. 3 fúcking years in a row we lose him, 3 bloody years. Him and Brady are unstoppable, unless he's crippled by a poor tackle of course. But I just can't see us doing much now without him. This team has great guts and the never say die attitude of Brady, well what can you say about him, there are no words.

GOAT end of.

CZ 453

I seen the last browns touchdown and turned off the laptop to tend to the smallie.......BIG MISTAKE.I come on here and read 1 or 2 comments.Back onto gamepass.......oh the joy!!! The complete turn around of emotions. Amazing end. Shame about Gronk. Some amount of injuries this season and still motoring on.

AbusesToilets

Listening to Gronk on the ground after that hit was saddening. Sounded in agony. Pats need to step it up heading into the play offs, leaving it way to late in these games to get motoring on offense.

JaMarcus Hustle

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Listening to Gronk on the ground after that hit was saddening. Sounded in agony. Pats need to step it up heading into the play offs, leaving it way to late in these games to get motoring on offense.

We're averaging 12 less points a game without Gronk. It's not looking good. I love the comebacks, I think they're amazing, but this is an injury too far.

Son Of A Vidic

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Listening to Gronk on the ground after that hit was saddening. Sounded in agony. Pats need to step it up heading into the play offs, leaving it way to late in these games to get motoring on offense.

Reminded me a Vollmer when he broke his leg . You could clearly hear Brady shouting in the background - "Look at the fúcking replay Ref." Players have been having their knees smashed all season by stupid fúckwits. But the league doesn't give a shít, they were quick to jump and cover their asses with the concussion compo deal. Nearly every player to a man will tell you, they'd gladly take being dazed after a head blow, over a season and potentially career ending knee hit. The NFL needs to get its finger out of its ass and seriously address this issue in the offseason.

j8wk2feszrnpao

JaMarcus Hustle wrote: »

We're averaging 12 less points a game without Gronk. It's not looking good. I love the comebacks, I think they're amazing, but this is an injury too far.

If confirmed, then it is.
The offense may have been able to carry the injury woes in the defense, but not with Gronk out.

Son Of A Vidic

The Ankle injury in 2011, the arm break and then the arm re-break in 2012. Now we have the knee blown out in 2013. First time in my life I walked away from a Pats game today, once Gronk went down I finally had enough of all the crap this season. Having Gronk fit for the playoffs was the one thing sustaining me all season. No team could afford to lose Gronk and we've been through it 3 times now and it's absolutely sickening. It's heart breaking to see this great kid having to go down the long road to rehab once again.

bruschi

well the elation and excitement of winning that game has been brought back with a mighty thud once the realisation sets in on everything that transpired.

Firstly, on the game, if you only tuned in for the last quarter, or even the last 2 minutes, then what a game. Unbelievable come back and masive credit to the players in digging out a win. Brady was really composed in those final minutes when he was under pretty deserve pressure and made som excellent throws. A few quick outs to stop the clock and then the TD to Edelman. Questionable call on hitting him in the endzone gave a really good start to try the onside kick, and great credit to Gostkowski on an excellent kick and recover, as he was vital to the recovery too.

The PI call to bring the ball to the one was a stinker. Horrible call, but f$%K it, I'll take it. We lost to Carolina when I thought we should have got a call, so I'll take a dodgy one now. To eek out a win in a seemingly lost game was really good courage from all elements on the team.

But, and its a big but, we were horrendous for the rest of the game. And no matter how good these wins seem, playing like this will eventually cath up on the team. BB seemed more happy than down after the game which is a bit surprising, maybe he rates Clevland more than I do, or thinks more about the end result rather than the scutter that came before it. But I said it from the outset, this team, IMO, is not good enough to sustain a long playoff run, and is far too inconsistent on both sides of the ball.

And that is before even talking about Gronkowski being out. Even with him, I didnt think we had much of a chance, depsite being No2 and having defeated Denver already, I just felt that long term in the season, we wouldnt be able for it. Whatever doubt was in my mind about that is now long gone. We are half an offense without Gronk. I really, really feel sorry for the guy. He got a lot of crap last year for the partying and being out whilst injured, and how he'd be fecked come the start of the year etc and so many were down on him. but he quietened down, worked hard, and was pretty much straight away at 100% when he came back. His first involvement against the Jets and he got hammered on his injured arm, but he got up, shook it off, and kept going. That was a clear sign to me straight away that he was fine and was going to make a huge impact on the season. And he did. But this, is just awful luck. Its one of those things that is pretty much unavoidable. It has nothing to do with being injury prone, or being weak or anything, just a tackle that went wrong on him.

Anyway, it is great to get the win, to secure playoff spot, but I wont be expecting much this year. Hopefully some of the rookies on both sides get good experience and we have a good crack at the playoffs and who knows, I'll still be roaring them on to win it all.

Son Of A Vidic

With the shocking play of the O line, I do not know how Brady managed 418 passing yards yesterday. 4 more sacks on Brady and 6 other QB hits is just not good enough. If there was any positive from yesterday's game, it was Vereen being the best WR on the field. I'm pretty sure his 12 receptions for 153 yards is a record for a Pats RB. I might be wrong there, but I can't recall a RB ever doing that. Then we had Gost with another fine 50 yard FG and the onside kick was the play of the game for me.

Son Of A Vidic

bruschi wrote: »

But this, is just awful luck. Its one of those things that is pretty much unavoidable. It has nothing to do with being injury prone, or being weak or anything, just a tackle that went wrong on him.

Nobody here has, but any Pats fan on the planet who even tried to suggest Gronk is weak is an idiot imo. His ankle injury was one of those things, his arm breaks were just freaky bad luck. And the knee injury is the result of players thinking it is safer to go low than to go high. So we can thank the NFL for that shítfest. But I think it is pretty safe to say that Gronk is certainly injury jinxed. Everything happens in threes as they say. So with this being the third straight year we've lost Gronk, I'm hoping that saying rings true and hopefully it will be the last time we lose Gronk. But I doubt it somehow.

BizzyC

I always get nervous when Gronk has ball in hand, he's a big guy, and big guys can be guilty of it, but he runs too upright.

Upright runners have always been more injury prone and they open their bodies up to more damaging hits.

Most receivers would have begun to lower their pad height after the catch with the DB coming across, but not Gronk.

It was the same with his ankle injury. If he didn't try to break tackles with a bolt-upright body position, he'd have a much longer career.

Son Of A Vidic

I couldn't disagree more. First, the ankle injury in 2011 had nothing to do with Gronk or how he runs with the ball. I could have happened as easily to an undersized slot receiver.



The two arm breaks were also nothing got to do with how he runs with the ball. They were both freaky breaks based on how he landed. That said, the second break would not have accord if Gronk was not rushed back. He was only given the minimum allowable healing time for an Ulnar fracture. He should have been given at least another two weeks of healing, as a safety margin but wasn't. Yesterday's injury again was nothing to do with how Gronk runs with the ball. Ward gave his reason for the injury happening after the game...

"My intention is never to hurt anyone," said Ward. "That's not what this game is about. That's not how I play, I hate to see guys go down with any type of injury and I just wanted him to know, whether he accepted it or not, it wasn't an intentional hit to injure him. But we have to play this game, we have to play it the way that they force us to, and unfortunately, we incurred an injury for him."

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/_/id/10103044/rob-gronkowski-new-england-patriots-carted-leg-injury?ex_cid=espnapi_public

The NFL's obsession with concussions has increased these low hits on players and caused a lot of knee in injuries this year. As Ward said himself, they have to play the game the way the League forces them to. Avoid the fine and go low. That's the reason Gronk is going for an MRi scan today and not how he runs with the ball.



Gronk was just completing his second stride there after catching the ball and gets taken out. I mean what TE or WR is going to even think about lowering pads there, never mind having the time to even do it?

Here's a similar style hit that happened to Cobb back in October.....



He didn't lower his pads after the catch and why would he, he's not a RB? He's trying to get maximum yardage. No amount of pad lowering will protect a player from these low hits. Unless you're capable of running in a horizontal position.

Gronk is a beast, we've all seen him carry 3-4 guys down the field on his back. That's what he can do and any team in the league would kill to have him. Because of his skill, size and ability he will always be double and triple teamed. He will always take a lot of punishment and there's nothing he can do about it. Unless he becomes Brandon Lloyd and is hitting the deck before he even catches a ball.

BaronVon

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

But I think it is pretty safe to say that Gronk is certainly injury jinxed.

To be fair, his physicality is a huge part of his game. Every time he touches the ball, he makes contact, and is always blocking in the run game. I always think back to the Redskins game a few years ago, when a few defenders jumped on him trying to being him down, and he shrugged them off and kept going.

In another game, he went in for a TD, tackled, and landed on his head.

It's just his game, it's what he brings to the field. I doubt we'll ever get a full season out of him for that reason!

Son Of A Vidic

infacteh wrote: »

It's just his game, it's what he brings to the field. I doubt we'll ever get a full season out of him for that reason!

I think you just posted that seconds after my one, but that's the point I just made in my last post......

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Because of his skill, size and ability he will always be double and triple teamed. He will always take a lot of punishment and there's nothing he can do about it.

j8wk2feszrnpao

"My intention is never to hurt anyone," said Ward. "That's not what this game is about. That's not how I play, I hate to see guys go down with any type of injury and I just wanted him to know, whether he accepted it or not, it wasn't an intentional hit to injure him. But we have to play this game, we have to play it the way that they force us to, and unfortunately, we incurred an injury for him."

Yes, the league has modified the rules. And yes it can make it more difficult for defensive players.
But the league did not force him to target the knee area. He could have easily made a tackle, but went for the hit instead.
The same happened with Cobb when Elam targeted his knee area with his helmet when he could have made a standard tackle.

It didn't break any rule. But when players complain about the league forcing them to play a certain way, I think it's rubbish.
They changed the high hits because players were seriously injuring players, so what else could the league do?
I'm not Goodells biggest fan, but the concussion case has forced the league to protect the game from the players.
And I wouldn't be surprised if they made another change due to the Gronk/Cobb injuries for next season.

Blured

Odin Brief Watchband wrote: »

And I wouldn't be surprised if they made another change due to the Gronk/Cobb injuries for next season.

Flag football?

bruschi

Odin Brief Watchband wrote: »

Yes, the league has modified the rules. And yes it can make it more difficult for defensive players.
But the league did not force him to target the knee area. He could have easily made a tackle, but went for the hit instead.
The same happened with Cobb when Elam targeted his knee area with his helmet when he could have made a standard tackle.

It didn't break any rule. But when players complain about the league forcing them to play a certain way, I think it's rubbish.
They changed the high hits because players were seriously injuring players, so what else could the league do?
I'm not Goodells biggest fan, but the concussion case has forced the league to protect the game from the players.
And I wouldn't be surprised if they made another change due to the Gronk/Cobb injuries for next season.

I dont blame Ward for this. He was to tackle a guy who is 65lbs heavier than him (or 30kgs or nearly 5 stone, whichever system anyone wants to use!) which is a huge amount of wieght differential. he is also 8 inches shorter than Gronk. If he tried tackle him up high, or catch him on the waist, Gronk would have steamrolled him out of the way. He was trying to disable his legs and stop them moving, in a cut block sort of way. If he didnt stop him by by trying to take him down in a conventional way, he'd have been slated for not making the tackle.

If gronks right kee wasnt planted, then it would have been a normal tackle that all players walk up from and get to the next play. it was just unfortunate that it was on the ground as the tackle is made. I certainly dont blame Ward for it, its just one of those things.

j8wk2feszrnpao

bruschi wrote: »

I certainly dont blame Ward for it, its just one of those things.

Agreed. I'm not trying to blame Ward and suggest that he's a dirty player, nor that one of our own players wouldn't pulled off a similar hit.
But he shouldn't start blaming the league for the injury, he was the one on the field. Players need to be accountable as well.

CJC86

bruschi wrote: »

He was to tackle a guy who is 65lbs heavier than him (or 30kgs or nearly 5 stone, whichever system anyone wants to use!) which is a huge amount of wieght differential. he is also 8 inches shorter than Gronk. If he tried tackle him up high, or catch him on the waist, Gronk would have steamrolled him out of the way.

I don't necessarily blame Ward for it, but yes, they should have to tackle players rather than hit their knees. If you watch rugby, then you see those sort of tackles happening all the time. The tackling technique of defensive players around the league is awful, and it leads to injuries.

I've said it before on this forum, I'm a huge fan of both rugby and American Football, but the tackling in the NFL infuriates me. People also complain about the measures that are taken in rugby to ensure player safety (eg. tip tackle is a red card), but the players learn and get on with it.

CJC86

It's ridiculous to think that if Gronk hits the IR we'll have 4 pro-bowlers from last season on IR. I can't think of another team losing so many key players to injury.

People have said that this has "America's Game" written all over it, but I don't remember seeing one so ridiculous. A playoff run is looking very unlikely right now.

bruschi

CJC86 wrote: »

I don't necessarily blame Ward for it, but yes, they should have to tackle players rather than hit their knees. If you watch rugby, then you see those sort of tackles happening all the time. The tackling technique of defensive players around the league is awful, and it leads to injuries.

I've said it before on this forum, I'm a huge fan of both rugby and American Football, but the tackling in the NFL infuriates me. People also complain about the measures that are taken in rugby to ensure player safety (eg. tip tackle is a red card), but the players learn and get on with it.

yeah tackling technique can be poor. but the one difference I see in both sports, and please correct me if I am wronog as I wouldnt be the most avid rugby fan, but do you not have to wrap your hands around in rugby when making a tackle? ie you cant just hop off the other player with the ball and put him on the ground. whereas in American Football the play ends once the player hits the ground, so the object is more to put him down, rather than stop him in his tracks (even though it does both), like rugby where they dont necessarily need him to be on the ground, but to stop momentum. the fact you have pads and helmet in AF too means that you are less likely to get injured yourself if you just launch aimlessly at a player to make him fall to the ground.