New England Patriots thread (MOD WARNING - #4503)

Son Of A Vidic

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Well I'd really have to question the loyalty of anyone who would boo Robert Kraft and say "f*ck him".

I've been a Pats fan for nearly 35 years so I don't need anyone questioning my loyalty.And in case you missed it, this what I said when I first spoke on this subject...

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

My loyalty is to the team and the coach and it always will be. In fact to be honest, I don’t give a crap who owns the franchise as long as they adhere to two rules – don’t meddle with the HC/GM/team and don’t move the franchise.

A pity you couldn't take a leaf out of JCTO's book. Who offered a differing opinion to me and he managed to do it without incitement. I wouldn't have the gall to question anyone's loyalty here. Anyway, I'm done with this nonsense.

eagle eye

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Well I'd really have to question the loyalty of anyone who would boo Robert Kraft and say "f*ck him". Personally, Kraft has built up more than enough trust and brownie points over the years for me to be able to move on here.

Well tbh I have never considered you a very strong Pats fan. You follow them but the picture in your sig is of a USC player. I remember you gushing about a WR before last year's draft and saying you hope one of our AFC East opponents picked him in the draft which sounds completely ridiculous but you did say it.

It'd be right up your street to go defending Kraft.

I've said all I have to say about it to this point and if I do go to Gillette for the season opener I am pretty confident that the majority of fans are going to boo Robert Kraft and if that happens I will join in. Of course all this can change if Tom Brady ends up with no suspension and his name cleared.

Up to when Kraft accepted the punishments handed out by the NFL he was one of my three ultimate Patriots' heroes along with BB and TB. I've lost respect for him after this.

JaMarcusHustle

eagle eye wrote: »

Well tbh I have never considered you a very strong Pats fan. You follow them but the picture in your sig is of a USC player. I remember you gushing about a WR before last year's draft and saying you hope one of our AFC East opponents picked him in the draft which sounds completely ridiculous but you did say it.

Wow, this is just beyond nonsensical. You've always been odd, but this is a new level.

Vandango

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Wow, this is just beyond nonsensical. You've always been odd, but this is a new level.

A bit rich considering it was you who started questioned people's loyalty and now you're launching personal attacks. Stay classy bud.

JaMarcusHustle

Vandango wrote: »

A bit rich considering it was you who started questioned people's loyalty and now you're launching personal attacks. Stay classy bud.

Rich how? Because booing and cursing our owner is the same as not having a Patriots signature on a forum?

Hazys

Tristram

When it's mid-season and the Pats are looking at another AFC title and play-run all this will be but a distant memory.

empacher

Vandango

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Rich how? Because booing and cursing our owner is the same as not having a Patriots signature on a forum?

Rich because you crossed and line and made it personal with the comments about eagle. It was stupid and unnecessary, quite like how you questioned peoples loyalty. And nobody cursed Kraft, they said they couldn't give a crap/f**k who the owner is. That's not cursing the owner. Supporting the team regardless of who owns them, is an opinion I completely agree with.

phatkev

Jesus Jamarcus, you better get the that TB12 tattoo covered with Mark Sanchez or Matt Leinart incase someone mistakes you for a Pats fan!!

JCTO

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FONN-0uoTHI

JCTO

Cone on guys, Really? We are going to fight with each other over a matter of opinion. Calling each other out over loyalty is mad to be fair. Look whatever you think of Kraft is your opinion and feelings on it. We really shouldn't be questioning each others feelings or opinion. To each their own whether you agree or not.

JaMarcusHustle

Vandango wrote: »

And nobody cursed Kraft, they said they couldn't give a crap/f**k who the owner is. That's not cursing the owner.

No, but that's not what was said. This was:

Corvus Maximus wrote:

your were a Pats fan long before Kraft took over so fúck him

Basically, I just can't get over the mentality that an owner that has overseen the transformation of this franchise from just another team to the most successful of the last 15 years can be turned on so quickly. Especially when so little of the facts are known.

For Kraft to have done so much for this team, and to be treated like he has these past few weeks is disgraceful. Far be it from me to feel sorry for a multimillionaire, but Kraft has been a huge, huge reason for why it's been especially fantastic to be a Pats fan and I just can't believe the reaction of people I thought were supporters. Because now at the first perceived stumble, we're on to booing him and cursing him?

It's a spoilt, petulant mentality, throwing toys out of prams. It's so easy for internet posters on a forum to say "ah bejaysus, sure take 'em to court, sure didn't yer man on Twitter say we have a case and all like... " when you're completely uninvolved in the process.

Son Of A Vidic

I was letting all this go, but since you've quoted me again. First of all Ja Marcus let's look at what I said in its full context....

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Like some of us, your were a Pats fan long before Kraft took over so fúck him and what he does. I follow the team and support our HC and I couldn't careless who owns the team now.

My point there is pretty obvious and I been saying it since my first post on this....

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I’ve been a Pats fan long before Kraft took over and I’ll be a Pats fan long after he is gone. My loyalty is to the team and the coach and it always will be. In fact to be honest, I don’t give a crap who owns the franchise as long as they adhere to two rules – don’t meddle with the HC/GM/team and don’t move the franchise.

Tbh, I don't know why or how that opinion could offend anyone tbh. For me it's just football reality, Kraft can stay or go, but it won't affect my support for the team in the least.

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Basically, I just can't get over the mentality that an owner that has overseen the transformation of this franchise from just another team to the most successful of the last 15 years can be turned on so quickly.Especially when so little of the facts are known.

It was very disappointing to have an owner who has spewed about The Pattriot Way for 15 years - team first, money last. To then cave into his elite club of 32 buddies and put their interests (money) first. I and a lot of fans have lost respect and trust for Kraft after what he did. And regarding not knowing the facts, if you're referring to the Wells report there. Didn't kraft throw that away, when he abandoned an opportunity to challenge it and the clowns in the league office.

But if you're referring to the circumstance behind Kraft's decision to abandon the fight. Then if Goodell completely overturns the Brady ban and removes the fine. Then Kraft's behaviour would make complete sense and I will eat humble pie and laud him as a genius. Now I hope I'm wrong, but I think pigs have a better chance of flying before that happens.

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

For Kraft to have done so much for this team, and to be treated like he has these past few weeks is disgraceful. Far be it from me to feel sorry for a multimillionaire, but Kraft has been a huge, huge reason for why it's been especially fantastic to be a Pats fan and I just can't believe the reaction of people I thought were supporters. Because now at the first perceived stumble, we're on to booing him and cursing him?

I don't how he's been treated these past few weeks like you say. Because I wasn't on Boards.ie for over a month. But I've already praised him for the stability he brought and for having the good sense to learn from his Parcells screw up and for having the wisdom to hire Belichick. But let's be real here, our success has come through the greatness of Belichick and Brady not Kraft. Kraft learned not to meddle and I'm grateful for that and that's his most significant contribution imo. It's a very important contribution, but without Bill & Tom we don't have the last 15 years.

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

It's a spoilt, petulant mentality, throwing toys out of prams.

Now perhaps some fans who have only ever known winning, or only ever known the Belichick-Brady era might have become spoiled. But anyone who was a Pats fan back in the Eighties or the Nineties. knew nothing about being spoilt or petulant and I'd be pretty shocked if they developed that mindset. We were the hard luck team of the league and a lot of rival fans were actually quite fond of the Pats because of it.

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

It's so easy for internet posters on a forum to say "ah bejaysus, sure take 'em to court, sure didn't yer man on Twitter say we have a case and all like... " when you're completely uninvolved in the process.

This was my view on the legal fight.....

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I couldn’t care less if a legal fight may or may not have been eventually futile. Some things in life come down to principle and honour and kraft for me put money and business interests above all that.

So forgive me for losing respect & trust in the man.

eagle eye

It's quite simple for me really. By doing an about turn and taking the punishment Kraft has basically thrown the legacy of Tom Brady and Bill Belichick under the bus. On top of that he just left all the fans hanging, all the ones who said fcuk yeah, after listening to his battle cries. I'll never forgive him for that.

Regardless of whether Brady wins his appeal or not the media will still report, and fans of other fans will say, that the Patriots cheated because Kraft took the punishment for it.

bruschi

eagle eye wrote: »

It's quite simple for me really. By doing an about turn and taking the punishment Kraft has basically thrown the legacy of Tom Brady and Bill Belichick under the bus. On top of that he just left all the fans hanging, all the ones who said fcuk yeah, after listening to his battle cries. I'll never forgive him for that.

Regardless of whether Brady wins his appeal or not the media will still report, and fans of other fans will say, that the Patriots cheated because Kraft took the punishment for it.

regardless of anything that would or could have happened, fans will still say they cheated no matter what any conclusion came from any report. you only have to look at the whole spygate thing and how people claim that had some impact on superbowl wins, despite the fact that what they did then was minimal in terms of both the rules being broken, and the advantage gained.

I doubt Kraft wanted to do this, but he is the one who has to make the calls, whether they piss off the majority or not. He has made other big calls which people havent agreed with, but at the end of it all, he has to do what he thinks is best for the stability and the future of the franchise. If he feels this is the best course of action, then I think as fans, we have to understand and respect that. I didnt agree with it at first, but I suppose I have come around to the conclusion that he has his reasons and logic, and far more information than me to make the call.

eagle eye

bruschi wrote: »

regardless of anything that would or could have happened, fans will still say they cheated no matter what any conclusion came from any report. you only have to look at the whole spygate thing and how people claim that had some impact on superbowl wins, despite the fact that what they did then was minimal in terms of both the rules being broken, and the advantage gained.

I doubt Kraft wanted to do this, but he is the one who has to make the calls, whether they piss off the majority or not. He has made other big calls which people havent agreed with, but at the end of it all, he has to do what he thinks is best for the stability and the future of the franchise. If he feels this is the best course of action, then I think as fans, we have to understand and respect that. I didnt agree with it at first, but I suppose I have come around to the conclusion that he has his reasons and logic, and far more information than me to make the call.

There are two things though, this was in a Superbowl winning year so they'll say that and you can't refute it because the punishment was accepted by Kraft. If he appealed it then you could argue that it was a screw job but not now when he just accepted the punishment and especially when he did that after saying he would be demanding an apology beforehand.

Vandango

bruschi wrote: »

regardless of anything that would or could have happened, fans will still say they cheated no matter what any conclusion came from any report. you only have to look at the whole spygate thing and how people claim that had some impact on superbowl wins, despite the fact that what they did then was minimal in terms of both the rules being broken, and the advantage gained.

Fúcktards who mention spygate don't seem to have the cop on to realise, that videotaping opponents was perfectly legal before 2007. Every team was at it and that's why every team in the league was sent a memo. Of course you can't let facts get in the way of hate & jealousy.

bruschi wrote: »

He has made other big calls which people havent agreed with, but at the end of it all, he has to do what he thinks is best for the stability and the future of the franchise. If he feels this is the best course of action.

I just don't get this for the good of the franchise commentary. I fail to see how meekly accepting a ridiculous and unjust punishment, benefits the franchise. In what way would the stability of the franchise be threatened, if Kraft decided to fight it all the way? Maybe his ownership was threatened by his billionaire buddies, but I cannot see how fighting for the honour and name of his team hurts the Patriots. Rob clearly wants to keep in with his billionaire pals, than be the fan that he has always claimed to be.

Hazys

Vandango wrote: »

Fúcktards who mention spygate don't seem to have the cop on to realise, that videotaping opponents was perfectly legal before 2007. Every team was at it and that's why every team in the league was sent a memo. Of course you can't let facts get in the way of hate & jealousy.

Also its still completely legal to tape defensive signals today as long as you don't do it on the sideline. You can do it from the stands directly behind the sidelines.

Son Of A Vidic

Who would have thought when the season ended, we would end up losing Revis, Browner, Arrignton & Dennard. That's nearly the entire starting secondary gone. I have high hopes for Butler and I expect him to be a starter in September and if he keeps up his natural ball hawking I think he'll do well. But who starts opposite him is a head scratcher for me anyway. I don't know enough and haven't seen enough of Fletcher & McClain to know what their chances are.

And for Logan Ryan, well I think he regressed last season. Which didn't suprise me in a way, because a lot of our drafted secondary players seem to regress in their second year for some reason. So it's gonna be an interesting battle in camp, but I think it's safe to say our secondary will be a lot weaker than last year. Right now, my expectations for our secondary isn't high and If we can avoid a return to teams converting 3rd & longs, I'll happily take that.

AbusesToilets

Seems like they are gearing up to focus on pass rush as the main defensive weapon this season. I'll be happy if we can improve against the run at least, that has been a bit of a weakness for awhile.

Son Of A Vidic

Certainly looks that way alright and with Revis & Browner gone, we'll probably play a lot more zone and a lot less man coverage. We should have a much aggressive front 7 this year, which will hopefully take some pressure of the secondary. It's also real good to have Spikes back, because we certainly missed him in our run defense last year.

JaMarcusHustle

These chaps will sit proudly on my desk at work from Monday.

JCTO

Brandon Spikes is going to be in trouble. His smashed up car found abandoned on 495. There was a crash not far from Foxoboro a car rear ended and the car that hit him fled and it is believed to have been Spikes. Bye Bye Brandon. Fleeing the scene of an accident is a big no no.

http://www.wcvb.com/news/police-investigating-crash-involving-car-of-patriots-brandon-spikes/33451006

AbusesToilets

That would be disappointing if he turns out to be responsible for hitting the other car. Should be fairly straightforward to determine that from forensic evidence. Not going to jump to conclusions.

JCTO

Various stories flying about what he hit. But either way he walked away from his car which is considered the scene of an accident. John Law will want to question him. Be interesting to see if the Patriots just dump him just in case.

Edit: Ask youself why he didn't stay with his car and call his Agent and lawyer and the Patriots just in case and to make sure he covered his ass. Wee hours of the morning means only one thing he was probably under the influence.

For his sake I hope he just decided to go home and come back to his car later and didn't realise the consequences of his actions.

Son Of A Vidic

I don't know about ye lads, but this doesn't look good. Look at the way the car bonnet is pushed up&back in the picture below. Now I'm not an expert, but it looks like rear ending kind of damage to me.....

JCTO wrote: »

Edit: Ask youself why he didn't stay with his car and call his Agent and lawyer and the Patriots just in case and to make sure he covered his ass. Wee hours of the morning means only one thing he was probably under the influence.

I think you're right, if he was involved then you have to suspect he was was boozed up or had a wee smoke of the oul weed. Either way, he's gone if he was involved.

JaMarcusHustle

....aaaaand he's been released.

j8wk2feszrnpao

Emmm. What are the odds that they lift paint matching the Nissan Murano from Spikes car?
Unless the deer was also driving a similar coloured Murano.

JCTO

How stupid are they with the deer excuse. Not an ounce of blood or hair on the car. I have been in a car when it clipped a deer and there was deer everywhere. I have also been in a Ford F150 behind another F150 and the front F150 smashed a deer out of it and parts of deers ended up on our F150. Deer explode on impact.