New England Patriots thread (MOD WARNING - #4503)

D9Male

Ha that is classic about JJ Watt. I suppose if you are as good a player as Watt or Gronk, it is hard not to listen to your agent telling you to ham it up. I mean it clearly helped their popularity on the way up.

eagle eye

Adamcp898 wrote: »

Yep, I've grown tired of it at this stage.

It was fine for a while because it was fun to see someone unashamedly enjoying their fame and wealth in a goofy kind of way as if to suggest they didn't know what to do with themselves.

But now it just feels like he's trying to act out a caricature of himself.

I think you are looking at it wrong. He has always been this sort of guy. Thing is that now he has become a big star and the media want as much as they can get of him.

I don't think he has changed at all just that we see more of him now.

Hazys

D9Male wrote: »

Ha that is classic about JJ Watt. I suppose if you are as good a player as Watt or Gronk, it is hard not to listen to your agent telling you to ham it up. I mean it clearly helped their popularity on the way up.

Bullet to brain

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvDfkojKKSs

Adamcp898

eagle eye wrote: »

I think you are looking at it wrong. He has always been this sort of guy. Thing is that now he has become a big star and the media want as much as they can get of him.

I don't think he has changed at all just that we see more of him now.

I've no doubt that's the type of fella he is.

Maybe it's just me, but it feels like he has "toned it up" in tune with the spotlight and exposure whereas one would expect it to go the other way the more he gets used to it if it was natural.

If he's doing it to make more money for himself then all power to him but personally I'm just tired of it.

empacher

Adamcp898 wrote: »

I've no doubt that's the type of fella he is.

Maybe it's just me, but it feels like he has "toned it up" in tune with the spotlight and exposure whereas one would expect it to go the other way the more he gets used to it if it was natural.

If he's doing it to make more money for himself then all power to him but personally I'm just tired of it.

I acted exactly like him when i was his age, and a whole lot worse. Only thing that matters is that he delivers mondays thursdays and sundays.

Adamcp898

empacher wrote: »

I acted exactly like him when i was his age, and a whole lot worse. Only thing that matters is that he delivers mondays thursdays and sundays.

I think people are misreading what I said.

I don't care how he's acting or what he's doing. Personally, I'm just tired of the "Gronk" act and the stories of him boozing, vines of him crushing beers, Deez nutz etc etc don't interest me.

But I don't blame him for perpetuating it for as long as he can for the money.

Son Of A Vidic

Vandango wrote: »

I love the time he said he was gonna spend the offseason in the woods, training hard, alone, in a log cabin.


And then Corvus post pictures of his luxurios + 4,000 square foot luxury log cabin, with a garage the size of a small factory. And all a two minute drive from civilisation.:D

I'm too lazy to go find that post, but that cabin was a fecking palace alright. Watt trying to make out he was Rocky heading to the mountains - the fecking sap.

Son Of A Vidic

I don't think Gronk has any 'act', he's just a big kid and that's who he is. He grew up with 5 brothers and monkeying around and buffoonery is in his DNA since childhood. In a career that can end in an instant, I think every player should maximise their commercial value and earning potential and I have no problem with that.

The key for me is him on the field. Last week in mini-camp, Gronk was bítch slapping McCourty and the rest of the Secondary on the field and was doing playful celebration dances with every catch. They couldn't stop him and as the boys from PFW said, it was like watching a man playing with kids.

As much of a kid as Gronk is off the field, there are very few players that work or train harder than him, apart from maybe Brady. The boy off the field is a highly competitive man on the field. And for all his publicity, he's been smart enough to keep his nose clean and stay out of trouble. Gronk is a football machine and with a bit of luck avoiding injuries, he should finish his career as the GOAT TE.

Vandango

Everybody knew when Bradys appeal date was and I found it disappointed, that Robert Kraft made sure he was out of the country yesterday. He submitted a written affadavit, but apprently turned down the oppourtunity to testify via phone. If that is true, then what little respect I had left is gone.:(

BKWDR

Vandango wrote: »

Everybody knew when Bradys appeal date was and I found it disappointed, that Robert Kraft made sure he was out of the country yesterday. He submitted a written affadavit, but apprently turned down the oppourtunity to testify via phone. If that is true, then what little respect I had left is gone.:(

But he did submit a "lengthy glowing" written report in favour of TB's appeal. I think this is just where the line gets a bit murky between business and sports.

bruschi

Vandango wrote: »

Everybody knew when Bradys appeal date was and I found it disappointed, that Robert Kraft made sure he was out of the country yesterday. He submitted a written affadavit, but apprently turned down the oppourtunity to testify via phone. If that is true, then what little respect I had left is gone.:(

Did Bill testify by phone? Or anyone else for that matter?

Vandango

BKWDR wrote: »

But he did submit a "lengthy glowing" written report in favour of TB's appeal. I think this is just where the line gets a bit murky between business and sports.

I know, I mentioned the affadavit in my prevous post.

bruschi wrote: »

Did Bill testify by phone? Or anyone else for that matter?

Last time I checked Bill is not the franchsie owner. One player and the entire franchise were unjustly punished via a pile of nonsense. That one player and the franchise owner were leading the charge for justice. Bill Belichick had no involvement in that process, so why bring him up? Brady will fight for justice and his honour. Kraft did a U turn, took one up the ass and all to preserve his billionarire club membership status. I thought the least he could do was make an appearance yesterday, but it looks like his spine couldn't take the strain.

JCTO

This campaign of hatred for Robert Kraft is tiresome at best. He is a businessman and the organization and him running it will always be his number 1 goal. Players are nothing more small pieces in the machine whether it is Tom Brady or a rookie.

I don't get why people think Kraft should have done more yesterday. This was not his beef. Tom Brady and his Legal team can handle this. If you honestly think Kraft would have made a difference yesterday or should have been there you are naive at best.

I have lost some respect for him over the deflategate I feel he should have fought more but I do understand the reasons why he did not. The business got in the way. He has to protect his team. And we can easily say we dont care about what owner we have but lets get real Kraft turned this organization around. If any of you think he is just an owner and replaceable sure keep on believing that because there are some ****ty ones out there and if Kraft was forced out we could end up getting a ****ty one.

bruschi

Vandango wrote: »

I know, I mentioned the affadavit in my prevous post.



Last time I checked Bill is not the franchsie owner. One player and the entire franchise were unjustly punished via a pile of nonsense. That one player and the franchise owner were leading the charge for justice. Bill Belichick had no involvement in that process, so why bring him up? Brady will fight for justice and his honour. Kraft did a U turn, took one up the ass and all to preserve his billionarire club membership status. I thought the least he could do was make an appearance yesterday, but it looks like his spine couldn't take the strain.

the point in bringing up Bill is why bring up Kraft? Kraft had nothing at all relevant to bring to yesterdays hearing, so why is he getting stick for not being around for it? As you say, one player and franchise owner were leading the charge for justice, the franchise owner pulled out, the player is still going. The process is separate entities in how it is being handled, so Kraft had no influence or business being involved in yesterdays hearing, and its just nonsense bashing for the sake of it.

I understand peoples reason for disliking him (whilst also massively disagreeing with some of the over the top reaction to it), but not to do with not being available on the phone yesterday, thats just kicking him for the sake of it.

JCTO sums it up perfectly above. What I dont get by some is how easy they will forgive Bill and his team selections or roster choices etc by saying In Bill we trust, because he knows the situation better and is intimate with the daily ongoings of the process, yet these same people are ready to throw Kraft under the bus without knowing what went down behind the scenes with the deflategate crap. Kraft is as much the reason the Patriots are where they are now. It was a 3 way process, Bill Tom and Bob, no matter what way you look at it, I think it would be nigh on impossible to have achieved what they have if one of the 3 was absent. And as a result, I think Kraft deserves the respect of trust for making the decision he did, regardless of agreeing with it or not.

Vandango

I don't get this 'protecting the franchise' business. How does accepting the loss of a 1st & 4th round draft picks and a $1 million dollar fine protect the franchise? Accepting an unjust stain in no way protects the franchise.

And if Kraft faced expulsion from his elite club, why didn't he come out and say so and say it like it is? Fans would have respected that. But personnally, I think that is not a reason becasue it would have been very damaging PR for the league.

I like a lot of fans put Kraft up on a pedestal and he just opened a lot of our eyes. Not being willing to even testify via phone was pretty wimpish imo. It would have been nice to see Kraft attending even just to offer morale support to Brady.

I see Brady having to take this to court. But I would love to see Goodell lift his penalty. Becasue that would put kraft in an awkard postion, because if brady is exonereated, then the franchise should in thoery be exonerated. So the question would be, would Kraft grow a pair and challenge the team penalty if it stills stands and Brady's is lifted?

bruschi

Vandango wrote: »

I don't get this 'protecting the franchise' business. How does accepting the loss of a 1st & 4th round draft picks and a $1 million dollar fine protect the franchise? Accepting an unjust stain in no way protects the franchise.

And if Kraft faced expulsion from his elite club, why didn't he come out and say so and say it like it is? Fans would have respected that. But personnally, I think that is not a reason becasue it would have been very damaging PR for the league.

I like a lot of fans put Kraft up on a pedestal and he just opened a lot of our eyes. Not being willing to even testify via phone was pretty wimpish imo. It would have been nice to see Kraft attending even just to offer morale support to Brady.

I see Brady having to take this to court. But I would love to see Goodell lift his penalty. Becasue that would put kraft in an awkard postion, because if brady is exonereated, then the franchise should in thoery be exonerated. So the question would be, would Kraft grow a pair and challenge the team penalty if it stills stands and Brady's is lifted?

just on those 2 points, Kraft was out of the country. Who knows how long that was planned for. Brady had plans when the team met the president. Stuff happens and plans are made that sometimes means you cant do things that crop up later. He wasnt requested by the NFL to be there, and the NFLPA asked him to be on the phone, but who knows if that would have even been premissable, or why they even needed that?

One quote

Patriots owner Bob Kraft, who is on a trip to Israel with a group of Pro Football Hall of Famers, sent a sworn affidavit backing Brady. One source said the affidavit was very compelling and had "almost a holy feel to it."

about his statement.

I just dont know what you expect from him in this appeal hearing? I know your thoughts on the acceptance of the team punishment, which I too didnt agree with, but accept that he did it for whatever reasons he chose to, and I trust his judgement. Who knows what deals he did with Goodell, and I'd be more willing to wait until the result of Bradys appeal comes out, as Kraft could have been an influence on that.

And no, if Brady wins his appeal, it doesnt automatically mean the Patriots are exonerated. It means Brady is, it doesnt mean the ball boys didnt tamper with the balls.

JCTO

Vandango wrote: »

I don't get this 'protecting the franchise' business. How does accepting the loss of a 1st & 4th round draft picks and a $1 million dollar fine protect the franchise? Accepting an unjust stain in no way protects the franchise.

Owners can lose their teams as easy as Goodell getting kicked out. If the owners give Kraft a vote of no confidence he is gone and they will find someone else. 2 draft picks and 1m is nothing compared to losing the team and Kraft knows that. Its all business. Is Kraft happy with the outcome? No most likely not as he thought it seems he would get support but then business got his way and he lost the confidence of other owners.

And if Kraft faced expulsion from his elite club, why didn't he come out and say so and say it like it is? Fans would have respected that. But personnally, I think that is not a reason becasue it would have been very damaging PR for the league.

Why didn't he say anything? It is business saying something makes him look stupid and could possibly end up being him getting booted. You pick your battles in the business world and Kraft picked his because he knew it wouldn't make sense to fight the NFL and the other owners.

I like a lot of fans put Kraft up on a pedestal and he just opened a lot of our eyes. Not being willing to even testify via phone was pretty wimpish imo. It would have been nice to see Kraft attending even just to offer morale support to Brady.

What are you talking about? Myself and others have said we lost respect for him for not fighting more but understand why he did what he did. As for the pedastal the man did great things for the Pats and turned the team around he deserves a lot of credit. Besides the phone call there is no solid proof Kraft hasn't talked to Tom before or after the meeting to offer support. The media are spinning this like Kraft is a monster. We don't know what deal he had in place or if he actually did give Brady and his team the heads up long before now. Stop getting sucked into the nonsense.

I see Brady having to take this to court. But I would love to see Goodell lift his penalty. Becasue that would put kraft in an awkard postion, because if brady is exonereated, then the franchise should in thoery be exonerated. So the question would be, would Kraft grow a pair and challenge the team penalty if it stills stands and Brady's is lifted?

Brady taking Goodell and the NFL to court wont affect Kraft or put him in an awkward position. This is a player fighting a ban. The team had their chance to fight their penalty and decided not to. They are not 1 in the same. Kraft wont get involved in the Brady case as they are not defending themselves or on Trial. This is Tom Brady versus the NFL over his ban.

eagle eye

Whatever about appearing at the appeal hearing, he lost me by shouting about fighting for an apology and then again just before he caved in. We all got behind the man and shouted 'hell yeah' and then he goes and backtracks and basically takes a punishment for cheating after Belichick coming out and explaining how there was no cheating. He basically spit on the legacy of Brady and Belichick by taking that punishment.

And further to that to leave us in no doubt about his new backtracking, sell out ways he made a statement only a week or so ago with a comment of “It's our hope that opening game here that we'll have the privilege of having everyone who deserves to be on the field starting that game. I know that's what our fans want, and that's what we want.”

That comment never mentions Brady's name. Why doesn't it? Because he doesn't want to be seen to be publicly backing Tom Brady which might upset his 31 billionaire buddies. He can **** right off as far as I'm concerned.

Vandango

Tbh, I haven't the time of energy to respond to all the quoted stuff.

bruschi wrote: »

And no, if Brady wins his appeal, it doesnt automatically mean the Patriots are exonerated. It means Brady is, it doesnt mean the ball boys didnt tamper with the balls.

Oh you mean the 'alleged' tampering that wasn't proven.

JCTO wrote: »

The team had their chance to fight their penalty and decided not to.

Team? The team had no say in it. Kraft decided it period.

This thread is running against the grain of most pats fan foums. While I have lost all respect for Kraft, my opinion is tame compared to other fan forums. Go over to Patsfans.com and you'll find a deep hatered from a lot of fans towards him. Anyone defending him over there is in a very tiny minority.

I suppose another reason I'm pisssed off is, Kraft associating the franchise with the IDF - Israeli Defense Froces. Apparently we had the IDF over in Gillette last week with kraft for a photo shoot. I find that pretty disgusting and distatesful. I'd prefer if The Pats weren't associated with an oppressive army, that has a brutal human rights record and a penchant for killing unarmed kids. If Kraft is a zionist, I rather he not stain the franchise with similar associations.

JCTO

Vandango wrote: »

Team? The team had no say in it. Kraft decided it period.

He is the team and team decisions are his too make whether you agree or not. At the end of the day he owns the team and he can do whatever he wants that he thinks is best for the team from a business standpoint.

This thread is running against the grain of most pats fan foums. While I have lost all respect for Kraft, my opinion is tame compared to other fan forums. Go over to Patsfans.com and you'll find a deep hatered from a lot of fans towards him. Anyone defending him over there is in a very tiny minority.

This is absolute bollocks. I live and work in MA and a forum online is a small percentage of fans overall. I also am a member of patsfans and there is a lot of people that agree with both sides of the coin.

I suppose another reason I'm pisssed off is, Kraft associating the franchise with the IDF - Israeli Defense Froces. Apparently we had the IDF over in Gillette last week with kraft for a photo shoot. I find that pretty disgusting and distatesful. I'd prefer if The Pats weren't associated with an oppressive army, that has a brutal human rights record and a penchant for killing unarmed kids. If Kraft is a zionist, I rather he not stain the franchise with similar associations.

Talk about an overreaction to a business move.

JaMarcusHustle

I hear Robert Kraft is also responsible for the introduction of property tax, as well as being a massive Hitler sympathiser.

Adamcp898

No harm to anyone, but how would Bob Kraft's presence have affected anything?

He has nothing to do with the specific events of any of this and so the most he could have done is acted as a character witness for Brady............which he did.


Wrt taking the fine on the chin, the NFL is a closed, self ruling organisation so I don't really see how that was ever a surprise. If it was a league whereby the organisations were single entities and free to build themselves how they pleased then it'd have been somewhat of a surprise but this is one which is ruled collectively and everyone gets to enjoy the fruits of the collective's success so it makes sense not to put it in jeopardy.

glued

Don't get all the hate for Kraft. Himself and Belichick have distanced themselves completely from this.

It's nothing to do with them so I'm not sure why they would get involved. I'm sure they're supporting Brady behind the scenes.

Just reading a few reports Brady seemed to do himself huge favours in the appeal but it seems as if the Brady will go to court if the ban isn't significantly cut. I think it could go down to a 1 or 2 game suspension and then everyone will be happy.

The only person the Pats nation should be blaming is Brady's agent who must have given him poor advice going into the interview because all the reports suggest that Brady was fully cooperative this time and the consensus is that the NFL were happy with his responses and he gave a good account of himself.

Son Of A Vidic

eagle eye wrote: »

“It's our hope that opening game here that we'll have the privilege of having everyone who deserves to be on the field starting that game. I know that's what our fans want, and that's what we want.”

That comment never mentions Brady's name. Why doesn't it? Because he doesn't want to be seen to be publicly backing Tom Brady which might upset his 31 billionaire buddies. He can **** right off as far as I'm concerned.

I watched that clip and it would have been nice to see him mentioning Tom, but unsurprisingly he didn't. So admittedly, I found that to be a bit gutless. But no matter, I'll keep supporting the team and our HC. I'll worry about kraft when we need to appoint our next HC.

BizzyC

NFLPA making a complaint against the Patriots discipline against Butler for missing the first practice.

Their stance is that these practices are not mandatory so you cant discipline for being late.

From what I saw though, there was no discipline, he just wasn't allowed to join in later in the day, he was out at the next practice.

Thats a long way off a Jonas Gray scenario where he shows up late and gets left on the bench for a month.

bruschi

BizzyC wrote: »

NFLPA making a complaint against the Patriots discipline against Butler for missing the first practice.

Their stance is that these practices are not mandatory so you cant discipline for being late.

From what I saw though, there was no discipline, he just wasn't allowed to join in later in the day, he was out at the next practice.

Thats a long way off a Jonas Gray scenario where he shows up late and gets left on the bench for a month.

no he sat out up to 6 (I think) practices. Was allowed do everything else with regards meetings etc though.

UnitedIrishman

Gonna be in Boston for the week of the Jags game and was looking at tickets on Stubhub - any of ye guys know do tickets be cheaper around the day of the game or do they stay as high as they are? Up on 200 dollars at the min for the cheapest seats.

AbusesToilets

Another cracking video from these lads.

http://www.boredfilmgrads.com/#!exclusive-videos/cgpl

JCTO

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Gonna be in Boston for the week of the Jags game and was looking at tickets on Stubhub - any of ye guys know do tickets be cheaper around the day of the game or do they stay as high as they are? Up on 200 dollars at the min for the cheapest seats.

They can be as stubhub try to offload them quickly but it is a gamble waiting on them. The first two home games are a bitch to get tickets for. There are single game tickets going on sale soon though. Limited but myself and Hazy have been successful in the past grabbing a couple. I know he has gotten a fair few from them but he will confirm.

Vandango

JCTO wrote: »

I also am a member of patsfans and there is a lot of people that agree with both sides of the coin.

I've been member of that site long before I ever joined Boards.ie and from what I've seen, posters supporting Kraft are a small minority there.