New England Patriots thread (MOD WARNING - #4503)

Chucky the tree

TO. wrote: »

He writes all that and this is what you come up with? Keep up the good work.

Yes. As I said I just wanted EE opinion on Tebow and his work ethic. I got it so that's me happy.

Chucky the tree

eagle eye wrote: »

There is a huge difference between singling somebody out as 'the hardest worker' and saying he is a really hard worker.

Its been said by almost everybody who has worked with him so I'm not saying anything that isn't common knowledge. Thats the end of the conversation about his work ethic as far as I'm concerned. If you want to believe he is not an incredibly hard worker then so be it but don't bother coming back to me about it.

I'd say 99% of QB's in the NFL are really hard workers. I thought your opinion but Tebow possibly top 5 or - I don't see a huge difference between top 5 and 1.


I never said he isn't a hard worker.

Son Of A Vidic

One of the finds this year could be undrafterd FA rookie Zach Sudfeld. He seems to be having a productive day every day. He has shown real good hands and has nearly caught every ball thrown his way in OTA's & camp. Love to see a kid like this go from stenght to strenght and make the final roster.

Undrafted FA WR Kenbrell Thompkins put in another strong showing again today. Not a field burner, but he has shown good strenght and physicality on the perimeter. He did drop a pass for an Int near the end of the seission, but such is life.

Love these under the radar signings Bill likes to pick up, hopefully they can only improve and build on their good progress so far.

TO.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

One of the finds this year could be undrafterd FA rookie Zach Sudfeld. He seems to be having a productive day every day. He has shown real good hands and has nearly caught every ball thrown his way in OTA's & camp. Love to see a kid like this go from stenght to strenght and make the final roster.

Undrafted FA WR Kenbrell Thompkins put in another strong showing again today. Not a field burner, but he has shown good strenght and physicality on the perimeter. He did drop a pass for an Int near the end of the seission, but such is life.

Love these under the radar signings Bill likes to pick up, hopefully they can only improve and build on their good progress so far.

Was reading about the WR situation earlier and was evident is that the rate its going it will most likely end up being the Unkown or under the radar guys who could come out trumps out of camp. It is going to be a nerve wracking camp this year. The prospect of possibly having a weak WR corp doesn't sit well.

Have to say though I love reading about the guys that no one had on any list or even batted an eye lid to

Son Of A Vidic

TO. wrote: »

Was reading about the WR situation earlier and was evident is that the rate its going it will most likely end up being the Unkown or under the radar guys who could come out trumps out of camp. It is going to be a nerve wracking camp this year. The prospect of possibly having a weak WR corp doesn't sit well.

Can you remember a year like it? Because I certainly can't. The most frustrating thing of all for me is, I really wish Dobson and Boyce could be out there to learn and they're not.

TO.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Can you remember a year like it? Because I certainly can't. The most frustrating thing of all for me is, I really wish Dobson and Boyce could be out there to learn and they're not.

I really can't. I think its been a very long time since we dealt with a Positional situation that has entered the unknown. Im hopeful for Boyce and Dobson. I keep telling myself they will turn their performances around and prove they deserve the spots.

Son Of A Vidic

TO. wrote: »

I really can't. I think its been a very long time since we dealt with a Positional situation that has entered the unknown. Im hopeful for Boyce and Dobson. I keep telling myself they will turn their performances around and prove they deserve the spots.

Poor Brady, if he whips these WR guys into shape, it would rank amongst his greatest achievments for me. I think Dobson and Boyce are potentially two very good prospects and it would be so nice to have them as viable targets for brady in 2013. I'm losing hope though.

Son Of A Vidic

What do ye think about Spikes staying away for private workouts during the OTA's? I don't think it sits to well with Bill, he briefly mentioned the one guy (Spikes) who stayed away in yesterdays conference. It's his contract year coming up and I have a feeling in my bones it could be his last.

frostie500

I logged in about ten minutes ago just to see what was being said on the forum and my God I have never seen such petty crap posted in the American Football forum. The constant stream of personal attacks against either other forum members, players or teams is embarrassing and it would be much more applicable to the soccer forum rather than our forum.

I've always loved that in this forum everyone is given the chance to speak freely and there's a respectful tone to each others views. Yeah at times we disagree but at least we act like adults and actually listen to the other persons viewpoint rather than sticking to our guns and never wavering from our first thought.

I've had great debates with each of you over the last few years and a great debate is when both sides are willing to take what the other person (or people) have said and adjust their views accordingly to a reasoned argument. Of course at sometimes the arguments don't change our viewpoint but at least the discussion will bring to light both sides for the other posters.
Can anyone that posted in the last four or five pages really say that they have brought forward an argument or would you agree that this topic has gotten to the point where no-one is willing to have their views changed by other peoples views? It's not a weakness to say that someone has made a good point even though it is not something that you agree with. The thanks button can be used as a mark of respect for an alternative viewpoint as well as one that you agree with.

The last few pages have gotten very personal and I'm going to have to spend some time cleaning things up. If your post gets deleted I want you to actually think if everything that you wrote in your post was truly to support your argument or was instead used to belittle some other poster. If you still think that my action in deleting your post is unwarranted PM and we'll discuss it.

I won't be handing out infractions but believe me if anyone, I don't care if it's the first time that you've posted in the thread about this discussion or not, takes their post as an excuse for a personal attack the yellow flags will fly and you'll be given a holiday from the forum. You have been warned so please show each other some respect.

On a side note it's worth remembering that Tim Tebow is now a third string quarter back in the NFL with a contract with no guaranteed money and will not be earning a pay cheque until week one of the regular season if he is still a member of the Pats...does a third string QB with so little job security really warrant what has been posted?

TO.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

What do ye think about Spikes staying away for private workouts during the OTA's? I don't think it sits to well with Bill, he briefly mentioned the one guy (Spikes) who stayed away in yesterdays conference. It's his contract year coming up and I have a feeling in my bones it could be his last.

Id say we could be saying good bye to him. As he was the only non injured player not to turn up he has put himself on the wrong radar. Whatever is going through his head he needs to snap out of it and prove himself because at this point he has started going down the wrong road. Its a pity.

TO.

Just adding to the Spikes thing. There is a lot of suggestion it could be to do with his contract. I hope for his sake it is not because he goes into his final year of his rookie contract this year. Surely the best thing to do would be get on with it and wait until the Patriots come to you before the end of the coming season. I can't see his logic at all by missing OTAs to prove a point. Its baffling. Risk your current contract over a future contract.

Son Of A Vidic

TO. wrote: »

Id say we could be saying good bye to him. As he was the only non injured player not to turn up he has put himself on the wrong radar. Whatever is going through his head he needs to snap out of it and prove himself because at this point he has started going down the wrong road. Its a pity.

I agree, all that lone wolf crap just comes across as very sulky to me. I think he has already maxed out his ability anyway and I can't see him ever becoming an irreplaceable game changer for us.

j8wk2feszrnpao

frostie500 wrote: »

does a third string QB with so little job security really warrant what has been posted?

It's Tebowmaina dude :P

As you say, he's going to be a 3rd string QB, after sitting out 2012, and not wanted by 31 other teams (or least it's seems that way).
It's fair to say that Tebow may not get a single snap this year. Actually that's probably close to a 95-99% certainty.

And yet this make huge headlines, front page coverage, and massive debate.

Either:

• Tebows fans are right
• or 31 teams (and 1 team that only sees him as a 3rd choice QB) and non-fans of Tebow are wrong.

Either way, BB doesn't give a crap what anyone else thinks, he's gonna do it his way. I think we all knew how the press conferences were/are gonna go

frostie500

OTA/training camp holdouts don't tend to work out too well for Pats players...and that's even some of their top guys so I don't see how someone like Spikes really is doing himself any favours. He's a decent linebacker but not the type of irreplaceable guy that could get away with trying to make a stand against Bill. These OTAs might be optional but given the changes to the CBA and the restrictions on players it's pretty clear that players are expected to turn up and learn the new instalments to playbooks.

Son Of A Vidic

I just love Belichick's press conferences. I know some people think he's trolling the press or whatever, but I don't think it's that simple. Just watch him next time, when someone asks him a real good football question (which can be rare). You'll will see that glint of interest in his eye and he will make an effort with that reporter.

But lets be honest though, generally a lot of reporters do ask some pretty stupid questions. And then the next three reporters will then go and ask the virtual same question again. I just think Bill has really no tolerance for this sort of bullshít and I think he gives what a lot of them deserve. So who can blame him for it. I find his approach really refreshing and honest.

Goose_Hyypia

I dont know has this been mentioned but is there a chance one of the main reasons BB took in Tebow is to get some insight to the Jets playbook ? Granted its only the 'Jets' but they play them twice in 2013 and we all know BB willingness to gain an advantage he can. He has also commented a lot regarding how smart Tebow is.
Reminds me of when Woodhead was picked up, again I realise Woodhead proved to be a very productive player.

TO.

Goose_Hyypia wrote: »

I dont know has this been mentioned but is there a chance one of the main reasons BB took in Tebow is to get some insight to the Jets playbook ? Granted its only the 'Jets' but they play them twice in 2013 and we all know BB willingness to gain an advantage he can. He has also commented a lot regarding how smart Tebow is.
Reminds me of when Woodhead was picked up, again I realise Woodhead proved to be a very productive player.

Mentioned before but for the most part when the Pats swoop up Jets players its after camp and just before pre-season or regular season. If the Jets make changes to their system in the next couple of Months having Tebow's insight will be pointless. At most they will get the stuff the Pats have already studied of the Jets and how they call their plays and audible sets. But I just can't see them taking Tebow for that reason alone.

Son Of A Vidic

Goose_Hyypia wrote: »

I dont know has this been mentioned but is there a chance one of the main reasons BB took in Tebow is to get some insight to the Jets playbook ? Granted its only the 'Jets' but they play them twice in 2013 and we all know BB willingness to gain an advantage he can.

As you know, we play the Jets twice a year, every year. So the two games in 2013 is the normal routine. And as TO said, it would be pointless taking a player this early since so much can change. But regardless, why would Bill even need to go to such an extreme. Especially against a rival we usually dominate anyway.

j8wk2feszrnpao

I've seen it written on a few articles that Tebow will help with jersey sales.
Will it? I just don't see New England fans going nuts for Tebowmania and rushing out to buy a Tebow jersey.
I'm sure there will be some jerseys that ship with Tebow on it, but I don't envisage too many turning up at Foxborough (and naturally won't result in greater tickets sales due to sellouts).

I see that Big Vince has come in at 30 (+51 positions since 2012) in the Top 100.
Gronk is at 25 (-4 positions since 2012). Pity that his video is all about Jimmy Graham.

I really hope that Gronk is given the time to come back 100% fully fit, even if it's mid-season.
A fit Gronk is the difference between Bill & Tom having two more SB rings in the last two years.

Son Of A Vidic

Ya, I think we're all on the same page about Gronk. Give us a fit and healthy Gronk for the business end of the season, because having him in September/October means nothing to me. We all know that a fully fit and performing Gronk would have put that 4th ring on Brady's finger in 2011. So we've had to unlucky end to the seasons now in a row. Let's hope it's third time lucky this year.

The one positive I'm taking from all this is our preparation. If we can start the season with some good new options at WR and get our offensive train rolling along. Then having Gronk back will be a luxury. So adding a couple of good new WR's with Gronk, could also make the offense more devastating. Providing Brady can get these newbies up to speed.

No QB has ever had to go through the sheer volume of turn over at the WR position down the years than Brady has. Then when you consider the level and standard he plays at, it really makes him stand alone. So if he could pull this off and get this new group of WR's game ready and keep us as a top offense like he normally does. Then that would be just a phenomenal acheivement inlight of all the change and disruption.

TO.

Odin Brief Watchband wrote: »

I've seen it written on a few articles that Tebow will help with jersey sales.
Will it? I just don't see New England fans going nuts for Tebowmania and rushing out to buy a Tebow jersey.
I'm sure there will be some jerseys that ship with Tebow on it, but I don't envisage too many turning up at Foxborough (and naturally won't result in greater tickets sales due to sellouts).

Apparently they sold a fair few thousand in Gillette the first couple of days the jersey went on sale. Kids and teens mainly. No surprises the younger generation of Pats fans would by Tebow jerseys.

I see that Big Vince has come in at 30 (+51 positions since 2012) in the Top 100.
Gronk is at 25 (-4 positions since 2012). Pity that his video is all about Jimmy Graham.

Great to see Vinny get his recognition in that pole and the constant comparing of Graham and Gronk gets annoying very quickly. I like Jimmy Graham, like Gronk cracking Tight end but its annoying some shows and pundits can't talk about one without the other.

I really hope that Gronk is given the time to come back 100% fully fit, even if it's mid-season.
A fit Gronk is the difference between Bill & Tom having two more SB rings in the last two years.

Here here.

TO.

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

There are NE fans and then there are Tebow fans - and the Tebow fans are all about Tebow - they lead Tebowmania, they go where Tebow is and they want to see Tebow walk on water. Like I said they are already shouting that NE should trade Mallett and install Tebow as the back-up to Brady.

I use a lot of Pats forums as do the lads here and I also use a lot of coaching forums and none of what you just said about shifting Mallet out has come up in any of them. In fact I haven't seen it anywhere on any football forum or media. As for the Tebowmania crap its getting old at this point. Talk about an obsession for you at this point and good to see you listen to mods though.

TO.

Anyways getting this back on track since the disruption. Mini Camp ended today with no real changes but the interesting note is Dobson is the only one of our 7 draft picks who has yet to sign a contract which I thought was interesting. Roll on full camp.

Son Of A Vidic

TO. wrote: »

Anyways getting this back on track since the disruption. Mini Camp ended today with no real changes but the interesting note is Dobson is the only one of our 7 draft picks who has yet to sign a contract which I thought was interesting. Roll on full camp.

Crap, I totally forgot abut Dobson not having singed yet. I hope he's not acting the príck. Because I know he's now on the sidelines, but I haven't heard anything about him bneing injured. So is it injury or punishment? Because if it's punishment, it's also gonna hurt us because we need him out there.

TO.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Crap, I totally forgot abut Dobson not having singed yet. I hope he's not acting the príck. Because I know he's now on the sidelines, but I haven't heard anything about him bneing injured. So is it injury or punishment? Because if it's punishment, it's also gonna hurt us because we need him out there.

Its hard to say and I find it weird that none of the beat writers who are watching camp have said anymore about Dobson other than he has struggled a times and that his contract is not done yet. I really do hope he signs gets his ass into gear and performs. Dude has bags of potential.

Son Of A Vidic

So Belichick gave the lads yesterday off, following up on last year. When he also gave them the last day of mini camp off. Apparrently he's pretty pleased with progress so far. But here's the head scratcher for me. Since our WR's are all over the place right now, surely he can't be pleased with their progress? That's why I think it was a total waste to give them yesterday off. Let everyone else go, but please keep the WR's out there. Because I think they need all the extra work they can get.

Son Of A Vidic

Gronk's back surgery has been scheduled for next Tuesday. All going well, they expect a 12 week recovery period. Personally I would take that estimation and add at least 6 weeks on to it. I really, really hope they'v learned from all the recent crap he's been through and don't rush him back.

Not a pats fan so I'm speaking as an outsider but I think tebow will play some special teams but his main role will be as a read option qb for the defence to practise with ala Dennis Dixon for the ravens last year

Gain I don't know the pats roster inside out so it's just a guess but Tom Brady is not coming off the pitch for any offensive plays and god forbid If something happens him I'm a big fan of Ryan mallet

With regards the playing te I dont buy it the guy is big but he has never played the position a far as I know you would get a far better player as a free agent to cover that position and frankly the pats have insane depth at ye so I think it's silly

With regards any other position just see above there's more to being a fullback than athleticism

TO.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Gronk's back surgery has been scheduled for next Tuesday. All going well, they expect a 12 week recovery period. Personally I would take that estimation and add at least 6 weeks on to it. I really, really hope they'v learned from all the recent crap he's been through and don't rush him back.

Sadly I do think Gronks return to action will depend on how well our Recieving corp do. If we can't find a solid bunch of WR you just know Gronk will be rushed back on to the field again. Here is hoping they rest him until January

Son Of A Vidic

TO. wrote: »

Sadly I do think Gronks return to action will depend on how well our Recieving corp do. If we can't find a solid bunch of WR you just know Gronk will be rushed back on to the field again. Here is hoping they rest him until January

They way things have been going, I really fear you could be right. But it would be such a stupid thing to do. And ya resting him until January if at all possible, sounds real good to me.