The Bus to keep or not to keep?

matt-dublin

hamstervision wrote: »

So I'm not angry at the decision itself if it's what people want. I am, however, very angry about how it was done. And I'm frustrated that it seems to be too late to do anything about it.

I agree, I am somewhat against the decision myself as a bus user, but at the same time i also feel aggrevated that i have to pay for it out of my management fees.

but i would feel more aggrevated if i didn't use the bus and contributing towards it i would feel like i was paying for someone else to get to work.

the arguement would be something like what should i pay for your dart fare? or, why should 1500 people pay for your dart fare

hamstervision

matt-dublin wrote: »

the arguement would be something like what should i pay for your dart fare? or, why should 1500 people pay for your dart fare

Maybe, but it's what people signed up for and were fully aware of to begin with. It's quite frustrating to have that decision made for me without having been consulted.

I think I'm going to have to unfollow this thread as we're going around in circles and all this anger isn't good for my health.

audreyp

matt-dublin wrote: »

but i would feel more aggrevated if i didn't use the bus and contributing towards it i would feel like i was paying for someone else to get to work.

A lot of people have posted here saying they don't use it but like to have it. Matt-Dublin if you are involved in the committee could you tell me how to contact them? I haven't gotten any replies to my emails.

phnyo

from what ive read on this thread

Cost of bus.....70-80,000
number of homes....1,500
Saving per home...80-220 euro

It doesnt add up. Perhaps a flat rate of €50for each dwelling would work.

I dont use the bus and correct me if i'm wrong but its got to be worth a euro a week.

P.s. A bus operator responds to the thread and offers to meet an E.G.M. and people tell him get lost. Thats genius. Perhaps its easier to complain than to try to solve the issue.

matt-dublin

phnyo wrote: »

P.s. A bus operator responds to the thread and offers to meet an E.G.M. and people tell him get lost. Thats genius. Perhaps its easier to complain than to try to solve the issue.

Actually a "dail candidate" canvassing for election posted on this thread, he's looking to extend his vote count futher than his immediate family

Plastik

How do you go about getting an EGM called?

matt-dublin

contact your management agents and your local committee members

phnyo

matt-dublin wrote: »

Actually a "dail candidate" canvassing for election posted on this thread, he's looking to extend his vote count futher than his immediate family

Well we could pretend to vote for him and then use him. Then when were
in our little booths we could vote for who ever we want. it'll be our secret.

matt-dublin

voting for a bus for a bus in a booth? kinda inceptiony

phnyo

phnyo wrote: »

from what ive read on this thread

Cost of bus.....70-80,000
number of homes....1,500
Saving per home...80-220 euro

It doesnt add up. Perhaps a flat rate of €50for each dwelling would work.

I dont use the bus and correct me if i'm wrong but its got to be worth a euro a week.

Hmmm O.K., but what do you think of the above Matt

matt-dublin

It does make sense, but again now you're looking for a completly separate charge, either integrated to management fees or not.

you're now relying on 1500 people to spend €50 specifically on a bus service.

what happens if you only get 200 people who are willing to directly pay for the bus? up their subscription to €375?

i think finnegan's here might be able to provide us with a pay as you go service but wether he's willing to do that is another thing.

I', dam sure though if he gets a contract he'll do the work but not willing to risk a paid service.

I suspect that if people had to pay say 80c per journey it would also deter them from using the service. even though 300 passangers daily would return in excess of 60k on a 52 week service.

However, i would also argue that extending the service to eden gate, blacklion and delgany wood could potentially provide a big return, albiet a less regular service.

It might not meet ever train, but could make an hourly service or a half hourly service etc.

The bus has been under scrutiny for the last 4 or 5 years by CORC and a lot of options have been looked into and it remained one of the single biggest expenses of the overall estate.

CORC requested dublin bus provide a service, they said no, there was already a private service in place amongst other services.

there was also an attempt by alpine and TD (i think) to apply for a pay as you use service but wicklow co co said they wouldn't award it because there was enough services in operation.

approaching all the available providers at the time and there was no interest.

phnyo

You seem to have done your research and know what your talking about.
I doubt a coach company would risk a pay as you go for 60,000 a year at 100% occupancy when they are quoting 70-80,000 for contract.


Just a shame about the short notice by CORC

audreyp

I was talking to the management company and they said that the decision could be overturned if there was a huge swell in people asking for the service back. We would need a petition or a vote of some kind and even with that he said it wouldn't be easy.

My fees were reduced by 60€ and as I pay by quarter, a decrease of 15€ per quarter. And thanks to the change in price the first payment was defered two months so now I have to pay for two quarters in a row. Not good!!

JanneG

audreyp wrote: »

I was talking to the management company and they said that the decision could be overturned if there was a huge swell in people asking for the service back. We would need a petition or a vote of some kind and even with that he said it wouldn't be easy.

I have a feeling that such a change would need a 100% backing from all households as otherwise I could nearly guarantee that anyone not being in agreement of having the bus service and paying for it would potentially stop paying their management fee and the management companies would be in an even more dire situation than what they are already in?

I agree that it has been done in a somewhat sly way, but I also believe that it has been done with the financial health of the management companies in mind.

I would personally prefer to see the grounds etc kept in a nice condition than have a bus service that a majority of the people in Charlesland may only have used once or twice in the last five years?

Once again, I do feel for the people that have been relying on the service so far, but as a lot of people have mentioned previously, I would think that it would be fairer to the community as a whole (ie Charlesland) if a pay as you go service could be established, no matter what company manages to start it...

Finnegan Bray

matt-dublin wrote: »

Finnegan,

i think you will find that there were no obligations/conditions set around a bus service but however there were observations made around the bus service by both an bord pleanala and wicklow planning authority

there's some references made to it here:
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/126750.htm
http://www.wicklow.ie/ePlan41/FileRefDetails.aspx?file_number=014910&LASiteID=0

i thought you guys had a pay as you go license issued by wicklow co co, why don't you offer up a pay as you use service?

you've seen all of the information posted previously about how many people use it, how much money it potentially could turn over etc.

or are you just using this thread to get a local vote and a bit of business from us.

Just to quickly respond to this post

Hello Matt,

You may be right about this, but it is my understanding there were more than just observations made. That said, I'm sure the management company looked into this, and are aware of their legal obligations.

We do have route licences issued by the Dept. of Transport. This does not mean we can collect fares anywhere in Wicklow. We would have to apply for and be granted a licence for this specific route.

I have seen the amount of information posted before, and the amount of people who use the bus. That is why I posted on this thread, and am willing to meet with the CORC to discuss wether there's a viable solution.

garden_snapper

I am an owner in Charlesland and I love it and about 12 months ago I took offence to a taxi man dropping me home who shared his opinion that within 10 years Charlesland would be one of Europes biggest kips.

I genuinely laughed his insight into the future off but I think that the termination of the shuttle will have a huge affect on both rents and property values in the estate.

Young professional couples commuting to work will not see Charlesland as good value anymore and with rents dropping closer to town I feel that other towns on the DART line will become more attractive.

I know this seems severe but the Dublin bus minimum fare is €1.20. Assuming a five day work week at €1.20 each way over a 48 week working year the additional cost to commuters is €576 per annum. That is a serious bang in an environment of declining wages! Now add your weekly ticket to connolly at €30.50 a week over a 48 week period which is €1464 so suddenly a commute to the city centre from Charlesland is €2040 and that is per person! Charlesland doesn't seem such a good option now and all the clean greens and varnished doors in the world wont improve the fact that to a couple a commute to the city centre would be in excess of €4k!!

Sad day for Charlesland and with far greater implications than we realise. I hope the committee know what they have done as we have all invested in a beautiful estate here but we might be about to committ Fianna Fail style suicide here.

If I had my money in my pocket now to buy a property and there was no shuttle bus I would not move to Charlesland. It was the USP for the estate and reason I didn't buy in Seabourne when it came down to it.

mikedragon32

Seabourne funded the shuttle also, Garden Snapper.

matt-dublin

Adult 7 Day Short Hop €36.00

Valid for unlimited travel for 7 consecutive days
Valid on Dublin Bus scheduled services including Xpresso (excluding Airlink, Nitelink, Tours, Special Events and Private Contract services) and on DART and Suburban Rail services

thats 264 euros a year. if you're working, you can claim that back of your paye through your employer, see here: http://www.taxsavers.ie/ I think that with the taxsaver ticket it costs like 40/60 euro a month on the higher tax band for unlimited travel on the dart.

ranopano

garden_snapper wrote: »

I know this seems severe but the Dublin bus minimum fare is €1.20. Assuming a five day work week at €1.20 each way over a 48 week working year the additional cost to commuters is €576 per annum. That is a serious bang in an environment of declining wages! Now add your weekly ticket to connolly at €30.50 a week over a 48 week period which is €1464 so suddenly a commute to the city centre from Charlesland is €2040 and that is per person!

Adult Annual Short Hop €1190.00

Valid for unlimited travel for 12 consecutive months
Valid on Dublin Bus scheduled services including Airlink, Nitelink and Xpresso (excluding Tours, Special Events and Private Contract services) and on DART and Suburban Rail services

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Fares--Tickets/Tickets/2-Journey-Daily-Weekly/Bus--Rail-Tickets/

dubsgirl

garden_snapper wrote: »

If I had my money in my pocket now to buy a property and there was no shuttle bus I would not move to Charlesland. It was the USP for the estate and reason I didn't buy in Seabourne when it came down to it.

So where would you buy? Where else has this "free" shuttle bus service running alongside Dublin bus?

Sure Seabourne are part of Charlesland overall and contribute their share to to shuttle bus and all other communal area fees.

ranopano

matt-dublin wrote: »

CORC requested dublin bus provide a service, they said no, there was already a private service in place amongst other services.

there was also an attempt by alpine and TD (i think) to apply for a pay as you use service but wicklow co co said they wouldn't award it because there was enough services in operation.

approaching all the available providers at the time and there was no interest.

Could ya clear this up a bit? What other services, plural, are dublin bus referring to? The aircoach?

matt-dublin

there was the charlesland bus, the aircoach and dublin bus limited services in place at the time.

IntheWood

dubsgirl wrote: »

So where would you buy? Where else has this "free" shuttle bus service running alongside Dublin bus?



That's the whole point ... in having this service there it is something above and beyond what you find elsewhere, i.e. it makes the area more attractive.

Taking this away emphasises one of Charlesland's downsides being its distance from Dublin city centre. It is absolutely not the case that the air coach or Dublin bus can plug the gap this will leave behind.

I don't even use the service at the moment, but cancelling it for a €60 saving per year is madness. By withdrawing this in a single stroke it makes Charlesland less attractive and we will all end up paying for that in terms of falling house prices and rents and general attractiveness of the location in the long run.

matt-dublin

IntheWood wrote: »

I don't even use the service at the moment, but cancelling it for a €60 saving per year is madness. By withdrawing this in a single stroke it makes Charlesland less attractive and we will all end up paying for that in terms of falling house prices and rents and general attractiveness of the location in the long run.

don't really think that applies because barely anyone can get a mortgage and houses aren't selling.

have you seen a "SOLD" sign anywhere in charlesland recently?

falling house price wiill happen in the current economy regardless. sure you can buy a 3 bed semi d in glenageary for similar prices to charlesland at the moment. (http://www.daft.ie/searchsale.daft?id=558187)

The Bishop Basher

People will still pay a premium to buy in Burnaby Pk or parts of Delgany so access shouldn't be a major issue. And i don't get it. What's wrong with the Dublin Bus service that the rest of the greater Dublin area relies on.

judy1

I think that we have all gone around in a full circle here with this shuttle and other things.:(
The fact is we our have lost our bus service, yes our bus service. Not a lot of other estates can say that. For the price we were paying I thought that was very little to have a great service like ours.

As for the Aircoach, it does what it says. Airport Direct, that means no picking up at charlesland or dropping off at the train station. Now if people want to take a chance and hope that the bus lets them off... well best of luck.
As for the Aircoach company their policy is pick up only at the stops and drop off at the Airport. Sackable offence for the Driver to anything else. And load up at the Airport and only drop of at the outbound stops.:(

And for Dublin Bus, we really only have one bus that does a half decent job thats the 184. But we cant rely on the time tables etc,etc. As for the 84 its a long walk to get that. And the 84x thats great if you are using every 4th or 5th stop unless your lucky to have that stop out side your job.:rolleyes:

Best of luck getting the Dublin Bus to stop for you while your running after it. Or when your only half way down the green and we see it driving past the rounabouts. :eek:

Lets stop giving out on this board and get a real vote on this Our Shuttle Bus. And if we still loose our bus, at least it was a fair way. lets get our committee knocking on doors and get a real number for the bus. Thats what we got them elected for. To work on our behalf.:mad::)

I give up on this now. I cant wait to put my car back on the road:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

The_Wrecker

judy1 wrote: »

And for Dublin Bus, we really only have one bus that does a half decent job thats the 184. But we cant rely on the time tables etc,etc. As for the 84 its a long walk to get that. And the 84x thats great if you are using every 4th or 5th stop unless your lucky to have that stop out side your job.:rolleyes:

The 184 is getting revamped with the 84X, timetables not written by Stephen king! The new timetable will be possible and reliable, theres a dozen heads in on the act this time and most are drivers instead of 59's finest!

The_Wrecker

On another note, Bus shelters.

Whos job is this in Charlesland?

Management, council or adshell?

matt-dublin

The_Wrecker wrote: »

On another note, Bus shelters.

Whos job is this in Charlesland?

Management, council or adshell?

Dublin bus

Charlie-Bravo

The_Wrecker wrote: »

On another note, Bus shelters.

Whos job is this in Charlesland?

Management, council or adshell?

But with the permission of the land owner. The SAR from Kiloole Roundabout to Swimming Pool Roadabout is still a private road.

Next question: is there any money left to turn on the pedestrian crossing lights down at the Swimming pool roundabout? I shouldn't say it, but there will be a tragic accident because they are there and not working.....