need a cert

johnjoe 123

i need a cert for a new agri shed iv just completed i am qualified iv used all ip rated stuff bonded all steel etc and done a good tidy job.

MOD edit, removed contact details

086lavey

anyone that is registered with reci or ecssa will not hand out certs for work they have not done , its against there rules of been registered , your better off contacting ecssa or reci , they will call out and go through your work , and cert it for around 300 euro , which if you ask me, is far too little ,

M cebee

ya-it's not allowed


hopefully this thread gets locked

2011

There is a simple "legal" way around this.

You can phone the ECSSA or RECI and pay for an inspector to come out and inspect. If they are satisfied they will certify the installation for a fee.

paddy147

2011 wrote: »

There is a simple "legal" way around this.

You can phone the ECSSA or RECI and pay for an inspector to come out and inspect. If they are satisfied they will certify the installation for a fee.

How much would calling out an inspector to issue a cert cost?

2011

No idea. Ring them. I did it 20 years ago.

Randyleprechaun

€250.

See form below

http://www.ecssa.ie/includes/tiny_mce/plugins/filemanager/files/Application_for_Certification.pdf

086lavey

Way to cheap

paddy147

Cert for a domestic house is 300 euro,according to that form.

I wouldnt call that way too cheap,especially in the current economic climate.

2011

I wouldnt call that way too cheap,especially in the current economic climate.

The point is that often the people requesting these certs are doing "nixers". Although they have to fork out €300 for a cert they can undercut registered contractors by thousands as they don't bother paying tax. Result: legitimate contractors go to the wall.

Randyleprechaun

paddy147 wrote: »

Cert for a domestic house is 300 euro,according to that form.

I wouldnt call that way too cheap,especially in the current economic climate.

If you read the original post, the original poster was talking about an agricultural shed!!!!

liveandnetural

2011 wrote: »

The point is that often the people requesting these certs are doing "nixers". Although they have to fork out €300 for a cert they can undercut registered contractors by thousands as they don't bother paying tax. Result: legitimate contractors go to the wall.

this is so true at the moment a lot of the lager firms have dumped out lots of half arsed tiger sparks(aaaagh bud i don't do bonding or another great one......i am only a domestic sparks cant do threephase bud.)now there all out there competing for the same work as the legit contractors only working for cash ......no tax .....no vat......no insurance .....and as from the rea(pay rates)phhhhhhhhh
the nixer culture is killing contracting so i totally agree with 2011 totaly

2011

so i totally agree with 2011 totaly

Thanks!

M cebee

no tax no vat no insurance and no VAN!

you don't even know who the competition is these days:)

mind you i heard there was an increase in RECI membership-dunno by how much


i assume the rest are buying certs off unscrupulous contractors

Bruthal

liveandnetural wrote: »

this is so true at the moment a lot of the lager firms have dumped out lots of half arsed tiger sparks(aaaagh bud i don't do bonding or another great one......i am only a domestic sparks cant do threephase bud.)now there all out there competing for the same work as the legit contractors only working for cash ......no tax .....no vat......no insurance .....and as from the rea(pay rates)phhhhhhhhh
the nixer culture is killing contracting so i totally agree with 2011 totaly

No wonder there are so many cowboys:D

Randyleprechaun

While i agree that this is bad for the industry, I have to take exception with the idea that ECSSA or RECI allowing you to pay for a cert is reason that there are so many cowboys out there.

The reason that there are so many cowboys is that too many sparks served their time house bashing and got no experience in steel conduit, steel trunking, wiring in same, 3 phase power & control wiring, fire alarm, data, BMS, etc etc the list goes on. These guys were able to learn a few circuits and a bit of the theory and pass an exam based on that. Alot of these guys dont even understand the theory behind what they are doing when house wiring. They couldn't tell you why you use a certain size cable for sockets and protect it using a certain breaker etc etc. They just know that that's how it's done.

Now they are out there trying to do all sorts of jobs, and what they don't know...sure they can find out on the "net".

The guys who get certs from RECI/ECSSA at least have to have an inspector pass it.

I could stay typing here all day about all the problems affecting the electrical industry.....it's doomed I thinks!!!!

Bruthal

Randyleprechaun wrote: »

The reason that there are so many cowboys is that too many sparks served their time house bashing and got no experience in steel conduit, steel trunking, wiring in same, 3 phase power & control wiring, fire alarm, data, BMS, etc etc the list goes on. These guys were able to learn a few circuits and a bit of the theory and pass an exam based on that. Alot of these guys dont even understand the theory behind what they are doing when house wiring. They couldn't tell you why you use a certain size cable for sockets and protect it using a certain breaker etc etc. They just know that that's how it's done.

Well plenty of cowboys came from industrial sites too, because on a site a fella could be years just putting up unistrut and tray, trunking etc and never wire a thing during apprenticeship. So many sparks and apprentices were needed during the building boom that anyone that could drill holes would do at times.

There would probably always be a percentage of cowboys no matter how good the apprenticeships were, and with such large numbers of electrical apprentices in recent years there will be more cowboys, and probably a higher percentage because of all the above points including yours, and more.

indie armada

i allways thought there were 2 ends to the spectrum when it came to sparks, thats the way it seems to me that you have one type that specialises in heavy industrial work and at the other end is the domestic type, some lads meet in the middle who do a bit of both.
we have certain lads that come into us to buy 1st and 2nd fix stuff and others that buy a lot of unistrut and tray. i thought it was perfectly acceptable for a sparks to specialise in one area, from my point of view i dont think one electrician could know or do it all. if a sparks has to do a job that is outside of his usual day to day stuff should he/she have to go back to school or could he/she not do the job and have it inspected or supervised, if not how elese would they learn.

pieface_ie

I always looked on it as a sparks coming from an industrial/commercial back ground could work on houses no problem, but a sparks who has only ever worked in housing would have a difficult time trying to do industrial. Theres just so much stuff in the industrial that would never be in the housing side of it.

Bruthal

Sort of works both ways though, on a site you have supervisors and foremen, management etc, where as on houses the sparks might be on his own with apprentice most of the time and so would need to know what he is at.

But i think plenty of sparks can be very competent in both the industrial/commercial and the house wiring. The industrial/commercial itself has lots of different areas in the electrical area.

Stoner

pieface_ie wrote: »

I always looked on it as a sparks coming from an industrial/commercial back ground could work on houses no problem, but a sparks who has only ever worked in housing would have a difficult time trying to do industrial. Theres just so much stuff in the industrial that would never be in the housing side of it.

Well IMHO that is usually the opinion of an electrician with an industrial/commercial background and little experience of large scale domestic projects (not directed at pieface_ie, just a general comment) , there is always a little bit of snobbery between electricians with different experience. I think a quality electrician will be capable of doing both once they get into the swing of it.
What a good "house basher" electrician has is speed, efficiency and an understanding of a system that saves the most time and material.
The industrial electrician may understand the circuits and the theory of wiring a house, and would indeed to a fine job given the time, but he/she would have to get their speed and efficiency up a few gears to survive in a "house bashing crew" .
I know guys who could tell the time of day by monitoring their progress in a house, I also know guys who will admit to being able to wire a house without understanding the circuits, they were simply thought a system.

Domestic wiring is often underestimated, most electricians think they can do it and some think it is beneath them, however many struggle with speed and final quality, it is usually costly to try to rectify an incorrectly wired house.

That said a good trades-person is a good trades-person both types will struggle in a new environment for a while but if they are good electricians they will in time get the hang of it, but the conduit side of things would take some practice from the domestic electrician alright.

johnjoe 123

jazus only needed a cert not a lecture. . any how i got 1 of a local contracter for e100 and no i wont be paying a penny in tax and he was happy enuf!!


johnjoe 123, read the charter about discussing prices without tax included please.

meercat

johnjoe 123 wrote: »

jazus only needed a cert not a lecture. . any how i got 1 of a local contracter for e100 and no i wont be paying a penny in tax and he was happy enuf!!

unfortunately its a sign of the times
he is probably desperate for a few bob
not allowed at all

M cebee

people like 'johnjoe' and his supplier are part of the reason the trade is ****ed up

meercat

M cebee wrote: »

people like 'johnjoe' and his supplier are part of the reason the trade is ****ed up

agree 100%

meercat

M cebee wrote: »

people like 'johnjoe' and his supplier are part of the reason the trade is ****ed up

agree 100%

M cebee

sparkies have no self-respect

working for half-nothing-panic all day

even during the boom years

customers can divide and conquer

086lavey

Whats the point been registered and paying insurance and tax with that **** going on , trade is well ****ed if you ask me ,

Stoner

going to lock this thread,

not a satisfactory outcome, but I've changed the charter to ban such requests in the future

So from now on unregistered tradespeople looking for someone else to certify their work will receive a ban.