anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

Scotty #

PauloMN wrote: »

Meh, protest voters, and the disenfranchised who believe SF will help them... :rolleyes: wouldn't worry about it, as when we get out of this recession, SF's vote will be back to its usual level for the next election. If that's the best the extreme left can do in a deep recession when FF have gifted them a pile of seats, I'm happy with that. Good - or rather common sense - did prevail in the end with 90% of voters when it comes to SF.

Delighted with the results overall, as even FF in tatters will be the majority party in opposition and SF will be treated with the same contempt as usual in Dáil Éireann, and we now have a strong, stable government that won't be held to ransom by the likes of Healy-Rae. I don't agree with some of Labour's policies, but I believe they are reasonable people with the country's interests at heart and FG will be able to negotiate with them.

FF will rebuild dramatically for the next election, hopefully getting rid of the old ways in the process and will be a much stronger force next time, pinning back SF as they do. This will have been a huge wake-up call for FF.

Agree 100%. FF will recover somewhat by the time the next GE comes around and those votes will be taken back from SF and given to FF. FG will become the bad guys over the next few years and suffer the same fate FF did this time. that's if they don't implode first.

celtictiger32

not a bad result all in all 13 with likely to be 15 by declaration, and it has to be said a few at the nearly point aswell. i think the seeds have been sown with some of the younger candidates also, bodes well for next election.

insight_man

celtictiger32 wrote: »

not a bad result all in all 13 with likely to be 15 by declaration, and it has to be said a few at the nearly point aswell. i think the seeds have been sown with some of the younger candidates also, bodes well for next election.

Spot on. SF well set for next election as lab will be ruined by the FG policies and all the cuts they will impose on ordinary people. SF will show them up for the bunch of sell out power grabbing wasters that they are.

mccoist

sinn fein at long last move foward
they ensure a decent leftwing nationalist representation in the new dail
they also now have their one of their biggest assets G ADAMS in the dail
fianna failures still i believe have not realised where they are
This rebuilding project will not be as easy as you think
personally i hope gerry and co really get stuck into riiding the 26 counties of this civilwar politics which the right wing cionservative voters of all persuasions seem quiet happy to lead and sway opinion on how and what we are as people
the most important project now is national unity
if you want to bitch and worry about history take a hike
we all now have a common goal
clean up the fianna failures mess
the result reflected the mood of the country
they want and have voted for teh country to tidy up the mess

dsmythy

I don't like Sinn Féin whatsoever but good result for them to build on. I'd have no problem with them being the main opposition but stay away from government please

Gypsies

mccoist wrote: »

sinn fein at long last move foward
they ensure a decent leftwing nationalist representation in the new dail
they also now have their one of their biggest assets G ADAMS in the dail
fianna failures still i believe have not realised where they are
This rebuilding project will not be as easy as you think
personally i hope gerry and co really get stuck into riiding the 26 counties of this civilwar politics which the right wing cionservative voters of all persuasions seem quiet happy to lead and sway opinion on how and what we are as people
the most important project now is national unity
if you want to bitch and worry about history take a hike
we all now have a common goal
clean up the fianna failures mess
the result reflected the mood of the country
they want and have voted for teh country to tidy up the mess

There are a lot of us who will never feel that SF will do what's right for this country, as long as G Adams is at the helm..

wee truck big driver

Scotty # wrote: »

Agree 100%. FF will recover somewhat by the time the next GE comes around and those votes will be taken back from SF and given to FF. FG will become the bad guys over the next few years and suffer the same fate FF did this time. that's if they don't implode first.

your probably right fianna fail will regain votes but it will be at fine gaels expense because realistically it was fine gael who gained most from fianna fails demise. also when fine gael reign over even more misery on the irish people they will at the next election have no option they have turned right and right again and again they are basicaly going round in circles.they where afraid to turn left at this election a fear instilled by the biggest parties and the media. when they see that there is no difference between f.g and f.f and lab (due to their support of f.g) they will have only one option that is a sinn fein goverment the party will be where they rightly belong

Dan_Solo

3ndahalfof6 wrote: »

SF have now been excepted by the electorate

"excepted" means pretty much the exact opposite of "accepted".
Just, ya know, saying...
The "number of people who didn't vote for" thing is a total crock of an argument though. It doesn't say anything at all about people's opinions on their policies except they prefer someone else's.

Hannibal

Sinn Fein are going into this new Dail as 0.2% behind what Labour had in the last Dail, SF's vote has been steadily increasing in the last number of elections and by returning 15 TD's and making very good inroads into other constituencies with many young candidates shows its a good vote as opposed to a one off. FG and Labours vote is a disenfranchised FF vote, SF's vote only went up 3% whereas FF's collapsed by 24% so I dont think its correct to say SF's vote is only a FF vote.
Like FF's national vote is only 2% behind Labour whereas Labour at the moment have 18 more seats, I think looking ahead SF could eat into Labours vote as opposed to FF. I still think FF and FG will stay ahead in general with SF and Labour fighting behind them for the large swing vote and scraps, the days of FF and FG dominating are gone as FG will never produce this performance again as people will soon see them making big cuts and hard decisions and the swing vote will defect somewhere else and probably to a non government party.

mccoist

wake up wake wake up the people who think ireland is only in a recession wakeup
the ff have put us in bondage to who ever
stop your carping on with your oldstyle civil war politics
this country was formed by war rebellion terrorists ,so what they are labels put on people who you are just happy to see do their duty and then turn your silly heads away with your hypocritical stance
i vote sinn fein and very proud to have done so even though my vote transferred to elect a labour candidate
the main problems facing this country is the way fianna fail sold all the national asset ,privatised evrything and still managed to leave us with a 150 billion debt mountain to our supposed european partners
we are never in our lifetimes going to get rid of that debt as we stand at present
1/there will be hidden debt somewhere thre failre shave been hiding alot of secrets
2/people still belivee the right wing capitalist model of politics suits ireland
3/europe is really about france germany axis of powerref britian attitude and considre why they are so reluctant to wrap their arms around european ideal
this election was about change we took a step in the right direction
hopefullythe politicians can now act like politicans and start giving this country a political path and ideal in which suits and which we can follow

PauloMN

Dan_Solo wrote: »

The "number of people who didn't vote for" thing is a total crock of an argument though. It doesn't say anything at all about people's opinions on their policies except they prefer someone else's.

Damn democracy eh?

Can't really say anything else about that!

Dan_Solo

PauloMN wrote: »

Damn democracy eh?

Can't really say anything else about that!

Well you can say something else. That you have no idea why people vote for or against SF. Maybe they don't like Gerry Adams' beard, who knows. But to say they don't vote for them because they are "disgusted" or some other nonsense is pure fantasyland stuff. You simply don't know.

Nodin

PauloMN wrote: »

Meh, protest voters, and the disenfranchised who believe SF will help them... :rolleyes: wouldn't worry about it, as when we get out of this recession, ...................

Heard it all before, when SF started overtaking the SDLP. 'flash in the pan', 'foolish young people', 'protest vote'.....Facts are that good solid work on the ground got those seats, and more work will consolidate a good portion, if not all of that vote. And the same again, year in, year out. Theres an energy there that the rest don't have.

sharkie66

Great result for SINN FEIN and above all a great result for Ireland. Now I hope all the SF bashers will accept our mandate and let US do the real work to bring Ireland back from the brink.

FG/LAB I hope will do the right thing and put it up to the IMF/EU. Lets hope they get balls and stand up for the people.

SF to put forward a motion regarding a referendum about the Bankers' debt.

What a great great great result.:):):):):D:):):)

PauloMN

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Well you can say something else. That you have no idea why people vote for or against SF. Maybe they don't like Gerry Adams' beard, who knows. But to say they don't vote for them because they are "disgusted" or some other nonsense is pure fantasyland stuff. You simply don't know.

How is it fantasyland? Read peoples' posts on here for the last month. Many are disguisted about the SF terrorism links, seems like a pretty valid reason for me that people have given not to vote SF. Many think SF policy are populist nonsense spouted by those who will never be in a position where they have to come good with their promises - seems like another pretty valid reason people don't vote for SF. Many think that even though they like some of their ideals, they are too far left of centre for them - they vote Labour.

Stick your head in the sand if you want as to why 9 out of 10 people still don't vote SF in a deep recession while FF gifted them seats - personally I don't give a hoot as I don't care, but it's up to SF to figure it all out and act upon it if they ever want to be a real force in Irish politics.

It doesn't say anything at all about people's opinions on their policies except they prefer someone else's.

Is that not what democracy is? To me it says everything about peoples' opinions of SF if 90% of the population don't vote for them.

caseyann

sharkie66 wrote: »

Great result for SINN FEIN and above all a great result for Ireland. Now I hope all the SF bashers will accept our mandate and let US do the real work to bring Ireland back from the brink.

FG/LAB I hope will do the right thing and put it up to the IMF/EU. Lets hope they get balls and stand up for the people.

SF to put forward a motion regarding a referendum about the Bankers' debt.

What a great great great result.:):):):):D:):):)

Welcome back sharkie
Still three seats waiting last time i checked

The Brigadier

sharkie66 wrote: »

Now I hope all the SF bashers will accept our mandate and let US do the real work to bring Ireland back from the brink.

Surely you must see that 10% of the vote is not a mandate?

If FG and Labour enter into government they will do so with 55% of the national vote. Will Sinn Fein let them get on with things?

outandabout

"Theres an energy there that the rest don't have."
...
Congratulations to Sinn Fein on a very good result but I'd suggest that the energy shown by Fine Gael, Labour and independent candidates matched if not surpassed that of Sinn Fein in some instances.

FG and Labour achieved record seat numbers and the indendents will also have their highest representation in the next Dail.

Of course the hard work starts now and I think the results of the next general election will give a clearer picture of the direction that Irish politics will take in the future.

caseyann

The Brigadier wrote: »

Surely you must see that 10% of the vote is not a mandate?

If FG and Labour enter into government they will do so with 55% of the national vote. Will Sinn Fein let them get on with things?

Adams said Sinn Féin would not be opposing Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny for the sake of it and would support positive policies. ‘‘But we will be working tooth and nail for working families," he said.
http://www.sbpost.ie/news/ireland/sinn-fein-on-course-to-double-dail-representation-54801.html
Good to know there isnt a bunch of yes men in all opposition parties.
What does FG intend to cut off the ministerial wage?Or said they would.

Hannibal

The Brigadier wrote: »

Surely you must see that 10% of the vote is not a mandate?

If FG and Labour enter into government they will do so with 55% of the national vote. Will Sinn Fein let them get on with things?

10% voted for Sinn Fein's policies alone, how many people voted for a joint FG/Labour government though?? FG voters voted for FG, and Labour voters voted for Labour. Nobody voted for a coalition as theyre seperate parties pursuing seperate policies. Its hardly a ringing endorsement of Labour when they only got 2% more of the vote than FF.. If SF went in with FG thats 46% but it doesnt make SF any more/less acceptable. But you cant get away from the fact that SF trebled its Dail representation and made big inroads into other constituencies. In Adams and Doherty SF had the third and forth highest vote getters in the state.

PauloMN

Dotsey wrote: »

Its hardly a ringing endorsement of Labour when they only got 2% more of the vote than FF..

So what does that say about SF, who got 7.5% less than FF?

I agree with you about Labour in any case, just shows that the left vote isn't as strong as it might have been, even in recession when a left vote will always be stronger. FG alone got substiantially more votes than SF and Labour put together. The left can only get so strong as can be seen by Labour, and even as they stand, most SF supporters would consider Labour too far centre for their liking.

eoinoleary

yup...220,000 of us...

Dan_Solo

PauloMN wrote: »

How is it fantasyland? Read peoples' posts on here for the last month. Many are disguisted about the SF terrorism links, seems like a pretty valid reason for me that people have given not to vote SF. Many think SF policy are populist nonsense spouted by those who will never be in a position where they have to come good with their promises - seems like another pretty valid reason people don't vote for SF. Many think that even though they like some of their ideals, they are too far left of centre for them - they vote Labour.

Ah, the three already roundly trounced allegations about SF we've heard here for the last while.

1. Anecdotes ≠ evidence.
(don't feel special, you're not the first to confuse that)
2. "Populist" can be used to describe anything, including 99% of FG and Labour policy.
3. If SF "don't want to be in government" then why are they happy to be in government in NI?

All disproven many times already. Saying them all at the same time doesn't make any of them right I'm afraid!

EDIT: Look at it this way, 63.8% of Ireland voted AGAINST Enda Kenny (by your interpretation of what that means), and he's still going to be Taoiseach...

Hannibal

PauloMN wrote: »

So what does that say about SF, who got 7.5% less than FF?

I agree with you about Labour in any case, just shows that the left vote isn't as strong as it might have been, even in recession when a left vote will always be stronger. FG alone got substiantially more votes than SF and Labour put together. The left can only get so strong as can be seen by Labour, and even as they stand, most SF supporters would consider Labour too far centre for their liking.

How long are Labour and FF participating in elections in this state? SF are coming from much further back and are only 0.2% away from where Labour were 4 years ago so this in itself is monumental. If SF got 40% of the vote you and people like you would say well what about the other 60%, you suffer from scatched-record syndrome making the same point over and over and over and over......

PauloMN

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Ah, the three already roundly trounced allegations about SF we've heard here for the last while.

1. Anecdotes ≠ evidence.
(don't feel special, you're not the first to confuse that)
2. "Populist" can be used to describe anything, including 99% of FG and Labour policy.
3. If SF "don't want to be in government" then why are they happy to be in government in NI?

All disproven many times already. Saying them all at the same time doesn't make any of them right I'm afraid!

EDIT: Look at it this way, 63.8% of Ireland voted AGAINST Enda Kenny (by your interpretation of what that means), and he's still going to be Taoiseach...

#1: Are you denying that certain SF party members have never been members of the IRA?
#2: Not really. FG stated before the election that "everyone" will have to share the burden of pain in fixing Ireland. Doesn't sound populist to me. Sounds like realism. Terms like "wealth tax" and "super rich", and upping welfare payments and bonuses in a recession is populist nonsense to appeal to a narrow base.
#3: NI is a different situation as it's funded by British taxpayers. I wonder would the SF supporters here be happy with the levels of welfare that a SF government in NI have?

Seeing as they are an "all Ireland" party, I'd love to see the reaction of the SF voters here when the welfare is dropped like a stone to achieve parity with NI. Funny how they want VAT parity but no mention of welfare parity. :rolleyes:

Well done to SF on successfully appealing to that narrow base. The trouble is, that's all it is - a narrow base. Until SF drop the terrorism links, and soften their policies, they won't appeal to a larger base. And if they do the above, well they'll basically be Labour.

Oh and by the way, I never said SF "don't want to be in government". I said they knew they wouldn't be, my point being that they can promise the sun, moon and stars and will never be held to account when it doesn't happen.

the_syco

Nodin wrote: »

Heard it all before, when SF started overtaking the SDLP. 'flash in the pan', 'foolish young people', 'protest vote'.....Facts are that good solid work on the ground got those seats, and more work will consolidate a good portion, if not all of that vote. And the same again, year in, year out. Theres an energy there that the rest don't have.

I take it you speak of Norn Iron. SF up there seem to be well regarded, and have done great work. The ones "down here" are seen as the looney left by some, Garda murdering terrorists by others, and the saviours of our once great nation by a few. The fact that FF, after f**king up the country still got more than SF is laughable, but shows that people prefer the policies of FF rather than the policies of SF.

And this is what it comes down to. The policies. Young people getting motivated can only get the party so far, but if the policies smell like corporate suicide, they won't get that many seats.

Nodin

Time will tell on that one. If I'm still kicking, it will be interesting to see the position in ten years time.

Zubeneschamali

Dotsey wrote: »

How long are Labour and FF participating in elections in this state?

Hey, you mean this isn't the same Sinn Féin party from 1922? They just swiped the name?

I feel cheated!

maccored

the_syco wrote: »

but shows that people prefer the policies of FF rather than the policies of SF.

that says more about the voter in the south than it does about the parties

sharkie66

The Brigadier wrote: »

Surely you must see that 10% of the vote is not a mandate?

If FG and Labour enter into government they will do so with 55% of the national vote. Will Sinn Fein let them get on with things?

Mandate:
the authority to carry out a policy or course of action, regarded as given by the electorate to a candidate or party that is victorious in an election

Sorry but 10% is indeed a mandate! The people who voted for Sinn Fein expect their party to go into the Dail and do the job they were voted in for!
It will be nice to see FG/Lab go to Europe and do something for Ireland!

Hannibal

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Hey, you mean this isn't the same Sinn Féin party from 1922? They just swiped the name?

I feel cheated!

Its the same Sinn Féin as Arthur Griffith founded in 1905

Zubeneschamali

Dotsey wrote: »

Its the same Sinn Féin as Arthur Griffith founded in 1905

Then why ask "How long are Labour and FF participating in elections in this state? SF are coming from much further back and are only 0.2% away from where Labour were 4 years ago so this in itself is monumental."

By that logic, SF have been in it longer than any other party, and their 4th place is rubbish.

Hannibal

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Then why ask "How long are Labour and FF participating in elections in this state? SF are coming from much further back and are only 0.2% away from where Labour were 4 years ago so this in itself is monumental."

By that logic, SF have been in it longer than any other party, and their 4th place is rubbish.

You obviously dont know a lot of history, same about the people who thank your post.
Cumann na nGaedheal (later Fine Gael) was formed by the pro-treaty members of SF in 1922 which included Collins, Griffith, Cosgrave to show they were a distinct and seperate party. DeValera left SF in 1926 when he left to form Fianna Fail who have been in government for 61 of 85 years since. Labour were formed in 1914 as the political wing of ICTU by James Connolly and Jim Larkin.
Sinn Fein have only been participating in elections in this state since the 80's so the other parties have a 60 year head start on them in that respect. Although SF were the last government of a united Ireland which is point worth remembering. But none of them parties trebled their representation in this election.

Dan_Solo

PauloMN wrote: »

#1: Are you denying that certain SF party members have never been members of the IRA?

No, and honestly I don't care if they were. Right now they're as law abiding as any other party.
Anyway, that wasn't my point at all. You're claiming that anti-SF posters here "prove" some sort of national disgust with SF manifest in theit c.10% at the polls. This is not evidence. Look it up.

PauloMN wrote: »

#2: Not really. FG stated before the election that "everyone" will have to share the burden of pain in fixing Ireland. Doesn't sound populist to me. Sounds like realism. Terms like "wealth tax" and "super rich", and upping welfare payments and bonuses in a recession is populist nonsense to appeal to a narrow base.

Both FG and Labour have called for "bonus tax" and Labour wanted a "super tax" of 48%. Both "populist" policies by your own definition. Promising people basic services and economic stability (nevermind prosperity) when we will shortly be bankrupted by IMF/EU loan repayments is also "populist" by your own defintion.
So, what policy that promises to make the country better *isn't* "populist" then?

PauloMN wrote: »

#3: NI is a different situation as it's funded by British taxpayers. I wonder would the SF supporters here be happy with the levels of welfare that a SF government in NI have?

And The Republic Of Ireland is funded (until FF/FG/GP/Lab brought the IMF in) by the Irish taxpayer. No idea what your point is here.

PauloMN wrote: »

Seeing as they are an "all Ireland" party, I'd love to see the reaction of the SF voters here when the welfare is dropped like a stone to achieve parity with NI. Funny how they want VAT parity but no mention of welfare parity. :rolleyes:

And if we had UK prices there wouldn't be too many complaints. Or UK prosperity as they get a decent cut of their natural resources and international banking trade. Here we just give everything away for a fat envelope in the back pocket.

PauloMN wrote: »

Oh and by the way, I never said SF "don't want to be in government". I said they knew they wouldn't be, my point being that they can promise the sun, moon and stars and will never be held to account when it doesn't happen.

And, yet again, you could say the same about every party except FG and Labour. Those two parties have also promised plenty they cannot deliver, so I don't see what the difference is in your eyes!

Athlone_Bhoy

Paul from the years on this website your clearly anti-SF. For what reason nobody knows.

I voted for SF myself and must say they done really well. I really like Pearse Doherty. he's young and actually knows what he is talking Mary Lou on the other hand seems to do them more bad than good.

Loved the fact Pearse said he wanted to cut ministers and TD's pay by 40% no surprise FG said they would oppose it, amazing they got elected to be honest their so called 5 point plan it's not actually a plan it's a load of **** created to gain votes.

I really believe FF didn't want to be in government. I must say I never liked FF but I think Micheal Martin is a very good speaker and hammered Eamon Gilmore in the debate. Labour were against this and that and now all for it nobody knows where they stand with them but thankfully FG didn't get overall majority. I'd rather Labour in with them than them alone.

What makes me sick is you see them all laughing. The so many promises made will be the past as the new TD's will become millionaires and have a great job for the next few years.

As Declan Ganly said, Labour, FG and FF had posters up for Lisbon treaty vote yes for recovery and jobs it's the only way. They lied that's why they didn't get my vote.

PauloMN

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

Paul from the years on this website your clearly anti-SF. For what reason nobody knows.

If you read my posts you'd know why. And what do you mean for years? I've only dropped by here since the election campaign was on.

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

I voted for SF myself and must say they done really well. I really like Pearse Doherty. he's young and actually knows what he is talking Mary Lou on the other hand seems to do them more bad than good.

Loved the fact Pearse said he wanted to cut ministers and TD's pay by 40% no surprise FG said they would oppose it, amazing they got elected to be honest their so called 5 point plan it's not actually a plan it's a load of **** created to gain votes.

I really believe FF didn't want to be in government. I must say I never liked FF but I think Micheal Martin is a very good speaker and hammered Eamon Gilmore in the debate. Labour were against this and that and now all for it nobody knows where they stand with them but thankfully FG didn't get overall majority. I'd rather Labour in with them than them alone.

What makes me sick is you see them all laughing. The so many promises made will be the past as the new TD's will become millionaires and have a great job for the next few years.

As Declan Ganly said, Labour, FG and FF had posters up for Lisbon treaty vote yes for recovery and jobs it's the only way. They lied that's why they didn't get my vote.

Pearse Doherty is a definite success for SF, again if you read my posts I have said this a few times. I gave him the due credit but of course the SF crew on here overlook that. FF made a complete balls of the by-election and he jumped all over it. Fair play to him. I also said that maybe when there's more new blood like him and the old guard types like Ferris etc. eventually go, SF might get stronger.

Micheal Martin will do a good job rebuilding FF. SF gained a lot of working class FF votes, and protest votes imo, and when we get out of this recession I suspect they'll drop off again a bit. Like I say, unless SF totally cut themselves off from this IRA stuff (including the members still there) and soften up their hard left outlook, they won't grow. If they do, they'll just be Labour.

What's the Lisbon Treaty got to do with this? This is a problem of bad banking practices, no regulation, over-heating in the property market combined with a normal cyclic recession. This is primarily an Irish problem and we have to get ourselves out of it. Telling Europe and the IMF to go away is not the way to solve this, we have to work with them. Do you think things would be better if we had not ratified the Lisbon Treaty?

Athlone_Bhoy

PauloMN wrote: »

If you read my posts you'd know why. And what do you mean for years? I've only dropped by here since the election campaign was on.



Pearse Doherty is a definite success for SF, again if you read my posts I have said this a few times. I gave him the due credit but of course the SF crew on here overlook that. FF made a complete balls of the by-election and he jumped all over it. Fair play to him. I also said that maybe when there's more new blood like him and the old guard types like Ferris etc. eventually go, SF might get stronger.

Micheal Martin will do a good job rebuilding FF. SF gained a lot of working class FF votes, and protest votes imo, and when we get out of this recession I suspect they'll drop off again a bit. Like I say, unless SF totally cut themselves off from this IRA stuff (including the members still there) and soften up their hard left outlook, they won't grow. If they do, they'll just be Labour.

What's the Lisbon Treaty got to do with this? This is a problem of bad banking practices, no regulation, over-heating in the property market combined with a normal cyclic recession. This is primarily an Irish problem and we have to get ourselves out of it. Telling Europe and the IMF to go away is not the way to solve this, we have to work with them. Do you think things would be better if we had not ratified the Lisbon Treaty?

I agree with a lot of what your saying. The fact is most loyalists haven't decommissioned so truth be told the IRA will never go away, it will always be there in the background, the deal they would decommission. I honestly couldn't care if they will be around for the next thousand years they put down the gun they should be given credit and SF are the party that got them to do that. The war was wrong but it wasn't the IRA who started it. The British army murdering people in 71, bloody Sunday innocent people were been burnt out of their houses simply because they were Irish that's why the IRA started up.

I agree Micheal will be the man to rebuild FF in 8 years we may see them back I wouldn't like to see them back though. The corruption is there for us to see. 30% of FF money came from property developers. They might get the blame but the fact is the government brought in the tax brakes and the banks were just throwing money at them. They could easily get 100 million over breakfast.

The Lisbon treaty is the parties lied. THey said the only way out of this was to vote yes. Yes for recovery, yes for jobs. Where are they?

Where not in the bond market and won't be for some time so why not burn the bond holders? Why is it in the last two weeks 750million has been paid to bond holders who were never under any type of guarantee. That's nearly 1 billion gone for nothing what so ever.

Burn the bond holders go to Japan/China for the loan of money. Even though we burned the bond holders we will still get people to lend to us.

We can't afford this debt. Then what will happen? The EU can't afford for us the default. Your wrong this sin't a Irish problem it's a EU problem, Spain, Portugal will be ****ed. We should play hard ball with the EU not bending over and taking it in the ass.

danger man

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

I agree with a lot of what your saying. The fact is most loyalists haven't decommissioned so truth be told the IRA will never go away, it will always be there in the background, the deal they would decommission. I honestly couldn't care if they will be around for the next thousand years they put down the gun they should be given credit and SF are the party that got them to do that. The war was wrong but it wasn't the IRA who started it. The British army murdering people in 71, bloody Sunday innocent people were been burnt out of their houses simply because they were Irish that's why the IRA started up.

I agree Micheal will be the man to rebuild FF in 8 years we may see them back I wouldn't like to see them back though. The corruption is there for us to see. 30% of FF money came from property developers. They might get the blame but the fact is the government brought in the tax brakes and the banks were just throwing money at them. They could easily get 100 million over breakfast.

The Lisbon treaty is the parties lied. THey said the only way out of this was to vote yes. Yes for recovery, yes for jobs. Where are they?

Where not in the bond market and won't be for some time so why not burn the bond holders? Why is it in the last two weeks 750million has been paid to bond holders who were never under any type of guarantee. That's nearly 1 billion gone for nothing what so ever.

Burn the bond holders go to Japan/China for the loan of money. Even though we burned the bond holders we will still get people to lend to us.

We can't afford this debt. Then what will happen? The EU can't afford for us the default. Your wrong this sin't a Irish problem it's a EU problem, Spain, Portugal will be ****ed. We should play hard ball with the EU not bending over and taking it in the ass.

yes you hit the nail on the head europe is our main problem.they raped our fishing fleet,oil and gas.then they gave us the euro and look where that is going down the tubes ,lisbon treaty what a joke ff stood up and called us gobsh1ts and made us vote again.owell thats what you get when you vote in europe yes men.we need leadership not a bunch of yes men.

Athlone_Bhoy

danger man wrote: »

yes you hit the nail on the head europe is our main problem.they raped our fishing fleet,oil and gas.then they gave us the euro and look where that is going down the tubes ,lisbon treaty what a joke ff stood up and called us gobsh1ts and made us vote again.owell thats what you get when you vote in europe yes men.we need leadership not a bunch of yes men.

WE can't pay the debt it's that simply. We will default in two years time it really is very scary what could happen. Fair enough FG might get/will get a 1% cut but that is nothing. What will happen then? We'll have to sell off everything every resource we have. Our forests like the UK were doing will have to be sold off and that's only the start. Look it up the Swiss are rubbing their hands waiting to get in.

USA put 20 trillion into banks! Imagine what could have happened with that money. Millions die of starving .The world would never have to count on oil. Amazing something comes up like Iraq war the oil price goes up. The USA so called freed Iraq therefore now Iraq's oil is on the market wouldn't that make the cost go down? Not drive it up.

We're ****ed but not just us I believe the world is ****ed. The world system isn't working.

Anyone IMO who earns over a million a year paid by the government should be cut by 60% until we get things working again. Why is it the ESB can make huge money every year, why not cut the costs for the people who use it, oh yeah I forgot the oil price. It's all crap IMO.

I really wish every person elected the best of look they all seemed to talk the talk but this happens everytime once their there they seem to do little.

Zubeneschamali

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

Look it up the Swiss are rubbing their hands waiting to get in.

Great, those guys really know their numbers.

3ndahalfof6

we will go back to the punt, to many countries are involved in this now, it is like a good case of the gangrene spreading like crazy,

the EU is about to tip into the bucket of ****te it created,

FG would like a united states of Europe, how would that sit with yis.

the other option is to join the sterling, become part of the British monetary system, sure nobody will mess with them.

The Brigadier

sharkie66 wrote: »

Mandate:
the authority to carry out a policy or course of action, regarded as given by the electorate to a candidate or party that is victorious in an election

Sorry but 10% is indeed a mandate! The people who voted for Sinn Fein expect their party to go into the Dail and do the job they were voted in for!
It will be nice to see FG/Lab go to Europe and do something for Ireland!

That doesn't really fit with your first comment.

sharkie66 wrote: »

Great result for SINN FEIN and above all a great result for Ireland. Now I hope all the SF bashers will accept our mandate and let US do the real work to bring Ireland back from the brink.

You and the other Nationalist-Socialists seem to think that you have somehow received a mandate to govern. You haven't.

The Brigadier

3ndahalfof6 wrote: »

we will go back to the punt, to many countries are involved in this now, it is like a good case of the gangrene spreading like crazy,

the EU is about to tip into the bucket of ****te it created,

FG would like a united states of Europe, how would that sit with yis.

the other option is to join the sterling, become part of the British monetary system, sure nobody will mess with them.

My wife had a dream a few months ago about the government secretly printing punts. She is of the opinion there is a secret stash of punts ready to be issued.

Zubeneschamali

3ndahalfof6 wrote: »

FG would like a united states of Europe, how would that sit with yis.

I've been voting for Europe and against the various gombeen nationalist 19th century throwbacks since 1983.

sharkie66

The Brigadier wrote: »

That doesn't really fit with your first comment.



You and the other Nationalist-Socialists seem to think that you have somehow received a mandate to govern. You haven't.

Who said anything about 'Govern'?

And you and your fellow apologists for Franco fascists are trying to say that the party we voted for doesn't have a right to be in the Dail! The people who voted for Sinn Fein gave the mandate to pursue democratic means to further the Republican ideals.

Get used to it. You might not like what we are about but by God you will have to put up with us. Get over it my friend.:P

sharkie66

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I've been voting for Europe and against the various gombeen nationalist 19th century throwbacks since 1983.

Then you are partly to blame for this fcuking mess we are all in now!:eek:

God help us all!

caseyann

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I've been voting for Europe and against the various gombeen nationalist 19th century throwbacks since 1983.

I think you will find nationalists are in every country in the world and some wow wow wow you would have your head knocked off you if you tried to take that away from them.
Nationality is who they are and their flag and their country name means more to them than anything.
You think Irish nationalists are like the new breed or the only old breed of their kind.You are not as old as you let on to be.Its not going away anytime in the distant future.

Capt'n Midnight

3ndahalfof6 wrote: »

SF have now been excepted by the electorate

I think the word you are looking for is accepted.

Capt'n Midnight

Scotty # wrote: »

Over 90% of the electorate did not vote for Sinn Fein.

Actually it's more like 93% of the electorate as turnout was 70%

danger man

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I've been voting for Europe and against the various gombeen nationalist 19th century throwbacks since 1983.

god can you not see were europe is heading.give it two years bye bye E.U just like the ussr