What is a farmer?

Thisonebetr

In terms of 20years tax free premia for farmers and 15years for non-farmers for forestry grants in Ireland, how do you qualify for the 20year premia (therefore being classed as a farmer)? I was thinking it had something to do with a majority of income derived from agriculture, or maybe something to do with the possession of a green cert?

whelan1

Thisonebetr wrote: »

In terms of 20years tax free premia for farmers and 15years for non-farmers for forestry grants in Ireland, how do you qualify for the 20year premia (therefore being classed as a farmer)? I was thinking it had something to do with a majority of income derived from agriculture, or maybe something to do with the possession of a green cert?

does it say qualified farmer ?

Thisonebetr

No, it says grant premia are available to farmers and non-farmers. Every website i've been on does not specify the difference.

Many thanks.

djmc

I think if you have a herd number or flock number and be actively farming you would be considered a farmer.
So might be worth just keeping a few cattle or sheep to fatten or for the deep freeze.

EcoplanMan

To qualify for the farmers rate you must be actively farming. There is now no percentage of income required; if you have a herd number, are renting/leasing land, or even selling a few bales, you should be ok. Alternatively, if you have a direct relation who is a farmer, you can enter into a Joint Management Consent agreement and receive the farmers rate that way.

JohnBoy

c) An applicant for the farmer rate of premium must supply evidence of farming activity in the one of the following forms:

i) An active REPS registration number, Herd number or registration under the Bovine Tuberculosis Eradication Scheme or another Department of Agriculture and Food Scheme. For the purposes of the sub-paragraph, an ‘active’ registration means an applicant has been a beneficiary under the particular scheme in the year of the forestry plantation’s completion or in one of the three preceding years.

OR

ii) Documentary evidence that at least 25% of an applicant’s income was derived from farming in the State in the year of the forestry plantation’s completion or in one of the three preceding years, drawn up in accordance with sub-paragraph d) of this paragraph.

That's from the 2007 Afforestation grant document.

Essentially you must have an active herd or flock number. It is not enough to be selling a few bales, you must have had a herd test within the year you're getting the grant.*

Initally we heard that just having a herd number was enough, then that we'd have to show movements on the register, then we discovered that as new entrants/reactivating a dormant number that we actually have to buy cattle and pass a herd test, and as we're new entrants we'll actually be restricted from doing that for a number of weeks/months.

My hands are in bits from fencing all weekend I need to harden to f*ck up



*I am in no way qualified to hand out advice, merely passing on what we've learned.

Mordy

JohnBoy wrote: »

That's from the 2007 Afforestation grant document.

.

The rules have changed since 2007. Therefore, while interesting, this is not currently valid.

JohnBoy

True, however my experiences are very much current, planting work/prep will commence this week.

EcoplanMan

Sometimes the level and usefulness of advice can be very different depending on whether you're getting it from the Dept of Forestry or Agriculture; one encourages planting, the other doesn't. I've heard a lot of cases of applicants who received info that was out-dated or worse.

agcons

EcoplanMan wrote: »

To qualify for the farmers rate you must be actively farming. There is now no percentage of income required; if you have a herd number, are renting/leasing land, or even selling a few bales, you should be ok. Alternatively, if you have a direct relation who is a farmer, you can enter into a Joint Management Consent agreement and receive the farmers rate that way.

If all that actual farming is too much like hard work you could just buy a few SPS entitlements and claim them so as to qualify as a farmer. The rules are designed in such a way now that almost all individuals can qualify for the farmer rate and the investor rate is for funds, companies etc.

JohnBoy

Hi Agcons,

Do you have a copy of these new rules?

because I'm getting constantly conflicting advice.

In the space of an hour yesterday I was told that we didnt have to buy cattle, and then that we did.

our forester says we do, the DVO says we dont, teagasc says we do, you say we dont.

agcons

The scheme document and the terms and conditions have been removed from their website so presumeably there are changes afoot, however below is quote received in writing from the Forest service in answer to a query last year. I checked with two foresters today and both were adament that as things stand being in receipt of SPS, REPS, AEOS etc payments is enough to have your herd number classified as active. One of them is currently planting a farm based on this definition.
If an farmer has an active herd number is that sufficient in all cases to qualify him/her for the farmer premium ?

Answer: A farmer who is relying on a herd number must have either cattle or sheep at the time of premium release.

Sometimes the record may show active but the applicant has no animals or may last had cattle several years ago in such situations the applicant would not be entitled to farmer rate.

Also if applicant is in receipt of payments from the department under say, Reps, SPS, Area Aid, etc then yes he/she would be entitled to farmer rate.

Please note we use the description of:
An active herd number with either no payments recorded against it or no animals recorded is no different that having a bank account with no funds in it.

Below in red is the definition of active taken from the scheme document.

"An active REPS registration number, Herd number or registration under the Bovine Tuberculosis Eradication Scheme or another Department of Agriculture and Food Scheme. For the purposes of the sub-paragraph, an ‘active’ registration means an applicant has been a beneficiary under the particular scheme in the year of the forestry plantation’s completion or in one of the three preceding years."

Thisonebetr

So, currently in terms of 20 years compared to 15 years for non-farmers, what are the criteria?

JohnBoy

Ok,

After much varied advice I got in contact with the forestry approvals section in johnstown castle.

If you have been in receipt of any payment scheme in the year of planting then you qualify for the farmer rate.

As per agcons advice.