Health Insurance - talk to Joe (me)

tommy21

Hey fellow Corconians - doing an article on health insurance and wondered would anyone be interested in giving their opinion here or in person (coffee/baked goods be your reward matie in that case) for a local newspaper (screen name/real name will be annoymised) - its really just to get an idea of how the recent increases have affected Cork people.

Has it affected you? Have you abandoned it altogether or never had it in the first place? Alternatively see the attached poll.

Many thanks for considering helping a fellow boardsie out

edit: Poll is private by the way.

mariebeth

Hiya, I have always had health insurance, first with the family and then on my own. It's something that some years I just wonder why bother because I hardly go to the doctor & thankfully haven't had much use of hospitals over the years. But then two years ago I got an awful run of tonsilitis, ended up getting them out in the October of that same year, which made me glad I'd kept up the GP cover because I made enough money back that year from the GP & consultant visits to pay for my health insurance the next year.

Growing up the folks always had us VHId, when I started working after college I got VHI as a BIK at work, when I went self employed it's something I kept up paying and will continue to do so, may well shop around for a cheaper provider come renewal time though.

I'd be afraid to be without it to be honest given the two tier health system we currently have.

tommy21

Thanks for the responses guys and gals, I will contact anyone to seek permission if I use your quotes - keep them coming!

Cadyboo

I never had VHI growimg up, now my job pay for it but if they didnt I dont know would I bother. Only difference I have ever seen is that you get to see consultants quicker. You get the same treatment as those not covered.

Cadyboo

Cadyboo wrote: »

Only difference I have ever seen is that you get to see consultants quicker. You get the same treatment as those not covered.

Unfortunately that could well be the difference between life and death. As you say the treatment will be the same but to get into the system is often quicker for those with private health care, which is a disgrace.

Cadyboo

RoverJames wrote: »

Unfortunately that could well be the difference between life and death. As you say the treatment will be the same but to get into the system is often quicker for those with private health care, which is a disgrace.

Yes I know it is, and it is a total disgrace. I do think it is very expensive now, especially for families and many will give up because of not being able to afford it any longer. I like the way Canada do healthcare.

tommy21

Cadyboo wrote: »

Yes I know it is, and it is a total disgrace. I do think it is very expensive now, especially for families and many will give up because of not being able to afford it any longer. I like the way Canada do healthcare.

Have you seen Michael Moore's Sicko? Great overview of US healthcare versus Canada, France, Cuba and Guantanemo Bay(!)

opus

Had VHI for years after leaving college cause of work but now working somewhere that doesn't provide it. Paid for it myself with Quinn cause they had a deal giving you three years free house/travel insurance if you had car & health insurance with them, runs out this year so will shop around then. Did manage to get the 10% discount last year by asking them for the corporate version of the plan mind you.

murphym7

Same as Rover - my folks had us VHI'd growing up too. Then got VHI myself when working, company discount, then did not have health insurance for 4/5 years and have to admit I was pretty nervous. Maybe it was a real fear, or a fear imposed by a broken health service, fear all the same though.

I then joined a company 9 years ago and have had free health insurance since, when I got married my wife was covered for free too, if I have kids they also will be covered. It is a benefit I consider when I think about leaving my current company though, it does not keep me here obviously, but it is one factor I do consider seriously.

I would never contemplate not having private health insurance, if it was in my power to have it. Again as Rover said, it can be, and is, the difference between life and death. A disgusting system we have where patients suffer further illness and death because they have to wait to see a specalist.

Every previous government this country has had over the past 30 years is at fault here, not just the clowns leaving office in 3 weeks.

Judes

Hi Tommy,

I'm also with VHI. I changed my scheme last year from Healthsteps Gold to First Plus Level 2. It's now gone up to €90.00 a month (was €78.00). I'm annoyed because for years on the VHI scheme I was able to claim for a lot of Doctors and physio visits - it was €30.00/€35.00 a visit. But now I can only claim for 7 Doctors, 7 Dentists, 7 Physio sessions per year which is a hell of a drop.

What angers me most about Private Medical Insurance in Ireland is the following, picture scenario:

UK - 11 years - Private Medical - Paid by Company.
Doctors visits FREE
Physio visits BILLS STRAIGHT TO INSURANCE COMPANY
Hospital stay STRAIGHT INTO A PRIVATE HOSPITAL - ALL BILLS STRAIGHT TO INSURANCE COMPANY
Prescriptions - MINIMAL COST

Basically no worries and no costs - upfront or otherwise.


IRELAND - 11 years - Private Medical - Paid by me.
Doctors visits €50 PAY UPFRONT
Physio visits €45 PAY UPFRONT
Rheumatologist visits €100 PAY UPFRONT
Dentist visits WHATEVER WORK I GET - PAY UPFRONT
Hospital stay - ARGUE/PLEA/BEG FOR A PRIVATE/SEMI-PRIVATE ROOM BECAUSE I'M PAYING FOR IT - BUT ANYTIME I'VE HAD TO GO TO THE HOSPITAL THERE ALWAYS SEEMS TO BE SOME TYPE OF BUG SO NO PRIVATE/SEMI PRIVATE ROOMS AVAILABLE - OCCUPIED BY THOSE IN SOME FORM OF ISOLATION. BUT AT LEAST I DON'T HAVE TO FACE THE BILL!
Prescriptions - I PAY UPFRONT FOR THE FIRST €120 EACH MONTH.

So in Ireland I now pay €90.00 a month for Private Medical - I pay all my bills upfront and then I have to go through all the process of claim forms to get back part of my money, a year later. Yes, I can claim the rest back through tax - well, after you've paid the first so much access and then the Government reduced the claim level from being able to claim 41% to only being able to claim back 20% (I may be a percentage off each time).

So somebody in Ireland/HSE/Private Medical - whoever/wherever is making a lot of money out of me and everyone else. But in the UK, I felt stress free whenever there was an issue. With the constant made up taxes that are being imposed on us, the fact that everything is rising in cost - there really are times when I think I'm working to pay a mortgage and medical bills - and don't have the money to live a life! Sometimes I may be in pain and would would really like to the see the physio - but find I can't afford/justify the cost - if budget is tight because of utility bills.

So in Ireland if you're physically ill - then the pressure of worrying about the cost of being ill - will add mental stress - which in turns makes you more ill. Not the "circle of life" but the "path to pain".

Wow, I've just realised that's some rant above but when writing your article - maybe somebody somewhere will think, aaaaah, there's something in what she has to say!

Good luck.

tommy21

opus wrote: »

Had VHI for years after leaving college cause of work but now working somewhere that doesn't provide it. Paid for it myself with Quinn cause they had a deal giving you three years free house/travel insurance if you had car & health insurance with them, runs out this year so will shop around then. Did manage to get the 10% discount last year by asking them for the corporate version of the plan mind you.

Had you any trouble getting this corporate version opus - or was it a case of simply asking? Will the fact that Quinn Insurance is still under administration colour any decision you might make to stay with them (presuming they have the cheapest quote in your search)?

Malari

I've had cover under my family plan with Quinn (BUPA) for years and now I have my own. I stopped it for several years while I lived abroad, but wouldn't be without it here. There's no way I could handle waiting on those public lists to see a consultant when I can afford to be bumped up the list.

I've not been seriously ill, but I did spend about a week in hospital having tests maybe 8 years ago or so. Also I had outpatient visits to a specialist paid entirely by my insurance. He was charging about €150 a pop and I had to see him at least half a dozen times so that in itself was worth it.

I don't go to the doc that often, but I have been to a physio with sports injuries, so I can claim on that too.

tommy21

Malari wrote: »

I've had cover under my family plan with Quinn (BUPA) for years and now I have my own. I stopped it for several years while I lived abroad, but wouldn't be without it here. There's no way I could handle waiting on those public lists to see a consultant when I can afford to be bumped up the list.

I've not been seriously ill, but I did spend about a week in hospital having tests maybe 8 years ago or so. Also I had outpatient visits to a specialist paid entirely by my insurance. He was charging about €150 a pop and I had to see him at least half a dozen times so that in itself was worth it.

I don't go to the doc that often, but I have been to a physio with sports injuries, so I can claim on that too.

So would it be fair to say (and I'll throw this out to anyone else who wants to answer too as the poll is fairly one-sided at the moment) that you would sacrifice other areas of financial spend in your life to keep your insurance? What areas?

tommy21

Judes wrote: »

Hi Tommy,

I'm also with VHI. I changed my scheme last year from Healthsteps Gold to First Plus Level 2. It's now gone up to €90.00 a month (was €78.00). I'm annoyed because for years on the VHI scheme I was able to claim for a lot of Doctors and physio visits - it was €30.00/€35.00 a visit. But now I can only claim for 7 Doctors, 7 Dentists, 7 Physio sessions per year which is a hell of a drop.

What angers me most about Private Medical Insurance in Ireland is the following, picture scenario:

UK - 11 years - Private Medical - Paid by Company.
Doctors visits FREE
Physio visits BILLS STRAIGHT TO INSURANCE COMPANY
Hospital stay STRAIGHT INTO A PRIVATE HOSPITAL - ALL BILLS STRAIGHT TO INSURANCE COMPANY
Prescriptions - MINIMAL COST

Basically no worries and no costs - upfront or otherwise.


IRELAND - 11 years - Private Medical - Paid by me.
Doctors visits €50 PAY UPFRONT
Physio visits €45 PAY UPFRONT
Rheumatologist visits €100 PAY UPFRONT
Dentist visits WHATEVER WORK I GET - PAY UPFRONT
Hospital stay - ARGUE/PLEA/BEG FOR A PRIVATE/SEMI-PRIVATE ROOM BECAUSE I'M PAYING FOR IT - BUT ANYTIME I'VE HAD TO GO TO THE HOSPITAL THERE ALWAYS SEEMS TO BE SOME TYPE OF BUG SO NO PRIVATE/SEMI PRIVATE ROOMS AVAILABLE - OCCUPIED BY THOSE IN SOME FORM OF ISOLATION. BUT AT LEAST I DON'T HAVE TO FACE THE BILL!
Prescriptions - I PAY UPFRONT FOR THE FIRST €120 EACH MONTH.

So in Ireland I now pay €90.00 a month for Private Medical - I pay all my bills upfront and then I have to go through all the process of claim forms to get back part of my money, a year later. Yes, I can claim the rest back through tax - well, after you've paid the first so much access and then the Government reduced the claim level from being able to claim 41% to only being able to claim back 20% (I may be a percentage off each time).

So somebody in Ireland/HSE/Private Medical - whoever/wherever is making a lot of money out of me and everyone else. But in the UK, I felt stress free whenever there was an issue. With the constant made up taxes that are being imposed on us, the fact that everything is rising in cost - there really are times when I think I'm working to pay a mortgage and medical bills - and don't have the money to live a life! Sometimes I may be in pain and would would really like to the see the physio - but find I can't afford/justify the cost - if budget is tight because of utility bills.

So in Ireland if you're physically ill - then the pressure of worrying about the cost of being ill - will add mental stress - which in turns makes you more ill. Not the "circle of life" but the "path to pain".

Wow, I've just realised that's some rant above but when writing your article - maybe somebody somewhere will think, aaaaah, there's something in what she has to say!

Good luck.

Thanks for sharing your experience. That is certainly a startling contrast - what do you think is behind this difference? A poorly run system or a completely different system (to the NHS)? Do you think the incoming government can get it right in the future or is the issue even on the political radar? Don't you pay for this through other means in the UK?

Judes

Check out Fine Gael's Fair Care Policy for improving the health system.

I have been complaining for years - I can't understand why I can't claim back the full amount for a doctor's visit etc. it makes no sense to me.

I do feel that people with private medical health insurance should be automatically put into a private hospital - should they require any surgery etc. And public hospitals for public patients.

I always remember my first hospital stay after back surgery, the Blackheath AMI Hospital in the 90's (an old country house converted into private hospital) I had a room to myself, with colour television etc. and the menu's - there were things like "smoked halibut with lime sauce" as a starter. Now compare that with anything you would get in a hospital here.

I don't know how the system works over in the UK - but I didn't have the constant fear as most people do re. paying over the odds for "what?".

And yes, we are all sacrificing something else to pay for our Medical Insurance - but with interest rates being raised another 1% - how much longer can we keep paying these hikes.

Wish I could tell you more - but I never had to think about it - until I returned home.

But do let us know when the article is printed so we can all read it. J

Malari

tommy21 wrote: »

So would it be fair to say (and I'll throw this out to anyone else who wants to answer too as the poll is fairly one-sided at the moment) that you would sacrifice other areas of financial spend in your life to keep your insurance? What areas?

Hhmm, not really. Well, it would otherwise go into savings I guess. So I don't think it's a sacrifice.

tommy21

Malari wrote: »

Hhmm, not really. Well, it would otherwise go into savings I guess. So I don't think it's a sacrifice.

I suppose what I'm saying is that if it becomes difficult for you to afford the premium, what other areas would you cut-back on in your life ahead of cancelling your insurance?

Malari

tommy21 wrote: »

I suppose what I'm saying is that if it becomes difficult for you to afford the premium, what other areas would you cut-back on in your life ahead of cancelling your insurance?

Ok, about a quarter to a third of my salary right now is saved, so it's hard to think what I might cut, but I guess just frivolous stuff like clothes or something. I mean I don't think I would cut down on eating out or holidays or move house to live in a cheaper rent area before health insurance, but maybe I would. I suppose it would be a joint decision with my boyfriend too, as he is on the policy. I just pay a year in advance to get it done with.

dextero

I am struggling financialy at the moment but there is no way I am giving up my health insurance. If the mortgage rates go up something else will have to go first, I hadnt thought about what until I read your post but I suppose maybe my serious illness/life insurance or I might reduce to a lower cover. I havent used my health cover but my husband has a few times. It was more comfortable to start with, public wards in the south infirmary in cork for example have a lot of people in them, not the nicest when you are ill. If you go private you tend to get a room to yourself. The waiting times to see a consulant are much quicker. I had to go for an mri a few years ago, I was waiting 6months on the public list and I still hadnt been called, the life insurance company wouldnt give me the go ahead for my mortgage until I had it done so I decided to pay to go private, I was seen in less than 2 weeks.

tommy21

dextero wrote: »

I am struggling financialy at the moment but there is no way I am giving up my health insurance. If the mortgage rates go up something else will have to go first, I hadnt thought about what until I read your post but I suppose maybe my serious illness/life insurance or I might reduce to a lower cover. I havent used my health cover but my husband has a few times. It was more comfortable to start with, public wards in the south infirmary in cork for example have a lot of people in them, not the nicest when you are ill. If you go private you tend to get a room to yourself. The waiting times to see a consulant are much quicker. I had to go for an mri a few years ago, I was waiting 6months on the public list and I still hadnt been called, the life insurance company wouldnt give me the go ahead for my mortgage until I had it done so I decided to pay to go private, I was seen in less than 2 weeks.

Thanks for that - have you been forced to cut-back on other areas already if you don't mind me asking, like not being able to enjoy yourself as much when you go out, or go out at all to keep your cover so far?

dextero

Dont go out much at all anymore other than taking our child to the cinema. I dont know how people can afford to go out. The main things that I have had to stop since Christmas are the after school activities, they are very expensive, I do feel bad that our son is missing out though. Although he hasnt complained. I dont buy new clothes anymore, I shop in second hand shops as much as possible. I buy food in Aldi instead of tesco. Typing these things it seems a bit ridiculous to keep on the cover but I still dont think I am at the stage where I should give it up.

dextero

One thing that I really dont understand is why even really good health cover doesnt fully cover maternity. You still have to pay €3000 for the consultant!

Delphi91

Just got my renewal notice today....Total premium for the year has gone up 45%!! I'm with VHI and I'm on Plan B with Options and in a group scheme through my workplace.

But given that I have a specific medical condition, I need the cover that the insurance provides, so I have no other option but to pay. Despite salary decreases over the last year, increased taxes and deductions and increases like the one above, going without medical insurance (in my case at least) is not an option.

tommy21

Delphi91 wrote: »

Just got my renewal notice today....Total premium for the year has gone up 45%!! I'm with VHI and I'm on Plan B with Options and in a group scheme through my workplace.

But given that I have a specific medical condition, I need the cover that the insurance provides, so I have no other option but to pay. Despite salary decreases over the last year, increased taxes and deductions and increases like the one above, going without medical insurance (in my case at least) is not an option.

I think as the renewals hit the door-mat, people are going to become increasingly vocal about this. Have you looked into switching to another provider or would you be afraid to switch to a cheaper insurer even if they accept your medical condition (e.g. the rule being that if you switch insurer and they are happy to take you, they must take you "worts and all") - that is would you be fearful of getting poorer service and treatment despite the contrasting policies appearing to be what you need on paper?

tommy21

RoverJames wrote: »

Unfortunately that could well be the difference between life and death. As you say the treatment will be the same but to get into the system is often quicker for those with private health care, which is a disgrace.

RoverJames - what would say to the fact that if your generally young and in good health, your more likely to make contact with the health service through an (generally uncovered depending on your plan) visit to the A & E? Does it still make it worth having from your perspective?

opus

tommy21 wrote: »

Had you any trouble getting this corporate version opus - or was it a case of simply asking? Will the fact that Quinn Insurance is still under administration colour any decision you might make to stay with them (presuming they have the cheapest quote in your search)?

None at all, I just asked for the cost of the corporate version & confirmed it was exactly the same benefits. What's going on with Quinn wouldn't really bother me too much & I'll stick with them once they are competitive when it's time to renew.

tommy21

Hey Jude (succinct Beatles reference), I just sent you a pm there. Thanks

Cadyboo

tommy21 wrote: »

RoverJames - what would say to the fact that if your generally young and in good health, your more likely to make contact with the health service through an (generally uncovered depending on your plan) visit to the A & E? Does it still make it worth having from your perspective?

Can I jump in there, as this would be my situation (thank god). No I dont think I would pay for health insurance now, if my job were not paying for us.

dextero wrote: »

One thing that I really dont understand is why even really good health cover doesnt fully cover maternity. You still have to pay €3000 for the consultant!

Yes that really is annoying. 3 grand is an awful lot to pay out as well as having to buy everything for the baby.

tommy21

tommy21 wrote: »

RoverJames - what would say to the fact that if your generally young and in good health, your more likely to make contact with the health service through an (generally uncovered depending on your plan) visit to the A & E? Does it still make it worth having from your perspective?

I reckon it's worthwhile in case I needed to see a specialist due to possible cancer or something like that.

I've been paying my own health insurance for the last 4 years since becoming self employed. Even when you are employed and work pay for it most folks still end up paying alost 50% of it as it's BIK.

I had a visit to the A&E about 3 years ago due to abdominal pains which were severe enough to have the GP reckoning I was going into shock. One night there (ambulanced to the hospital), ECG, X ray, blood tests, shot of morphine etc etc, iirc the charge to the VHI was less than €40. Having VHI made no difference whatsoever to my treatment there.

scuby

dextero wrote: »

One thing that I really dont understand is why even really good health cover doesnt fully cover maternity. You still have to pay €3000 for the consultant!

i'll prob get into trouble for this :0)
afaik maternity is not considered a medical condition, so thats why the insurance companies do not cover maternity in full