Cleaning dog's teeth

paultf

Just wondering how people keep their dog's teeth clean?

I have 3 dogs. One of them gets tartar on his teeth even though he only gets dry food. I bring him to the vets once a year to get them cleaned. It costs €100 so I don't really want to bring 3 dogs to the vet every year. I tried Dentastix before - the dogs like them but their stools aren't great on them.

The other 2 dogs don't have any tartar build-up on their front teeth but do on their back teeth. Would I need to bring them for the vets for that?

I have pet insurance with Allianz and they don't cover teeth cleaning. But they say if you don't get the dog's teeth checked frequently, if there is a problem in the future you might not be covered.

Bog Bunny

I've heard the same about dentastix and stool problems from a number of dog owners so have discarded this idea a while ago.

Now I regular feed fresh large knuckle bones and fresh beef ears (a kind soul from an abbatoir supplies me with them, they are dumped in the skip). The beef ears act like a giant toothbrush and the ear cartilage is excellent for a gentle massage of the gums.

Dried beef or pigs ears on the other hand are not so advisable; often they are dried so much that they become brittle and break off in shards and splinters which can injur the gums or the food pipe on the way down.

In my experience, rawhide bones are not a good idea either. They are not always safe and may contain chemicals from the processing (some say even arsenic from curing the hide!)

If your vet removes tartar and plaque I assume he also prescribes antibiotics afterwards? Inevitably the gums are injured in this procedure and the bacteria from the debris can easily enter the bloodstream. This is often the cause of heart problems later on.

Whispered

I give raw bones, pigs ears and raw crunchy veggies. I avoid things like the dentastix/ dog chews etc (my dog doesn't like them anyway and they feel sticky or sugary when you break them up).

His teeth seem super clean, but in saying that, he's only 2 so plently of time to develop problems in future.

dahat

Anyone ever try this product? seems to be a great product........

http://www.happypets.ie/store/product-info.php?plaque_off-pid84.html

boomerang

I've used the plaque off in the past. It does work, but it takes a minimum of eight weeks to see results. It's safer than giving a raw knuckle bone, but not quite as effective. Plus it's not recommended for long term use. It costs about €17 for a small tub, whereas nice nutritious marrow bones or knuckle bones are free!

There's another product called Logic, it's a toothpaste that you smear on the dog's teeth. (It has a nice taste.) I think it cost about €18 for a tube. I've used that too, but again, it was not effective as giving them a nice big raw knuckle bone once a week or so. Plus with the bones there is a theraputic effect - my dogs are so happy, relaxed and sleepy after a session with a bone! Raw meaty bones are also nutritious and the cartilage is a natural source of chondroitin, which is one of a number of supplements given to alleviate arthritis.

But with the bones there is a small risk of breaking a tooth. The dog's stomach is more acidic than ours to allow them digest bone, but it can cause a bit of constipation. (Easily remedied if it happens.) Vets tell scare stories about choking, or internal tearing, but so long as you feed a size-appropriate bone that can't be swallowed whole, and with no sharp edges, I don't think there's much risk at all. Especially seeing as dogs tend to stop gnawing on the bone once they've stripped off all the meat, cartilage and fat.

dahat

So i guess using as a once off treatment to clear any tartar/plaque is not a bad idea?

My dogs are feed a raw based diet so the teeth are pretty shiny,mainly use pork ribs,pig spine and some larger bones for teeth cleaning purpose. They do tend to lose interest when all the good stuff is taken off it as you said.

suziwalsh

Raw marrow bones from local butchers are brilliant for cleaning teeth! Also I give them frozen to my two and it works a treat.

boomerang

Dahat the one thing I would watch with feeding raw pork or pork bones is that there is a risk of roundworm infection from ingesting roundworm cysts in the muscle meat. It's a species of roundworm called trichinella spiralis. Once eaten, the larvae emerge from the cysts. These will reproduce in your dog's intestine and then spread around the body to various organs.

Pork is the one meat I don't feed raw. If you do want to feed it raw, you should put it in the deep freeze first for at least three weeks to kill the parasites, and let it thaw.

If you want to feed the pork raw and don't want to freeze it first, then I'd be worming every month and get advice from the vet on which wormer will be most effective against trichinella.

Whispered

suziwalsh wrote: »

Raw marrow bones from local butchers are brilliant for cleaning teeth! Also I give them frozen to my two and it works a treat.

I give them frozen too, but harley leaves them there until thawed. Actually, he sometimes hides them around the house until smelly. I've had to stop him having them in the sitting room because you take your eyes off him and he has it hidden under the couch or in the fire basket so he can go back to it a few days later. Now he gets them only in the crate, or if we're there to keep an eye on him.

suziwalsh

Whispered wrote: »

I give them frozen too, but harley leaves them there until thawed. Actually, he sometimes hides them around the house until smelly. I've had to stop him having them in the sitting room because you take your eyes off him and he has it hidden under the couch or in the fire basket so he can go back to it a few days later. Now he gets them only in the crate, or if we're there to keep an eye on him.

Ha ha clever pup.....mine are far too greedy!!!!

caseyann

Carrots

kylith

My two came to me as adults, but took to having their teeth brushed like ducks to water, so much so that I have to separate them or they'll quarrel over whose turn it is.

I use a mix of brushing, dental Kongs, kibble and carrots. Their teeth aren't fantastic, probably because of all the years they weren't looked after but every time in the last 3 years I've brought them to the vet I'm told that the teeth might need to be done 'next year', so that's not too bad.

daenerysstormborn3

Raw bones and whole rabbits, the fur is a great dental floss

Bog Bunny

boomerang wrote: »

Dahat the one thing I would watch with feeding raw pork or pork bones is that there is a risk of roundworm infection from ingesting roundworm cysts in the muscle meat. It's a species of roundworm called trichinella spiralis. Once eaten, the larvae emerge from the cysts. These will reproduce in your dog's intestine and then spread around the body to various organs.

Pork is the one meat I don't feed raw. If you do want to feed it raw, you should put it in the deep freeze first for at least three weeks to kill the parasites, and let it thaw.

If you want to feed the pork raw and don't want to freeze it first, then I'd be worming every month and get advice from the vet on which wormer will be most effective against trichinella.

I was under the assumption that Ireland is trichinella free? The carcasses are regularly inspected at the abbatoir.
I have friends in England who have been feeding pigs' heads <Yikes> and pigs' trotters for years without any problems (they used to raise pigs).

I think I'd draw the line here, I don't eat pork myself because it's almost on a par with eating dog meat, sorry. They are such intelligent animals, smarter than dogs and I used to have a potbelly pet.

But this would be a whole new thread.....

Bog Bunny

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Raw bones and whole rabbits, the fur is a great dental floss

Do your dogs hunt the rabbits themselves?

Here I would watch out for round worm and tape worm infestation.

daenerysstormborn3

The last two cases of trichinella in Ireland were in 2008 and were found to have originated outside of Ireland. The last report of trichinella in animals in Ireland was in 1968. All pigs and horses are sampled for trichinella as part of the post-mortem procedure. I don't think there is a huge risk or prevalence of it in Ireland.

No, rabbits are gotten from a supplier. My dog would rather play with rabbits than hunt them!

Discodog

dahat wrote: »

Anyone ever try this product? seems to be a great product........

http://www.happypets.ie/store/product-info.php?plaque_off-pid84.html

That's rather funny because it is made from seaweed. Now my three eat loads of seaweed every day on their walks & it turns their teeth green :eek:.

Whispered

pixiebean22 wrote: »

No, rabbits are gotten from a supplier.

pixiebean, can you tell me more about feeding whole rabbits. I assume you feed raw? Do you need to "start" it for him, or did he know what to do? (I can imagine harley thinking it's another cuddly toy) Is is a substitute for one meal? Does your dog finish it in a sitting? Do you feed indoors and if so is it messy?

Discodog wrote: »

Now my three eat loads of seaweed every day on their walks & it turns their teeth green :eek:.

I've been looking up supplements for dogs with a compromised immune system and apparently certain types of seaweed are very very good for them, so while it might be making their teeth look awful, it's probably doing their insides the world of good!

CabanasBoy

Interesting thread, I have a Shih Tzu and he does not like having his teeth brushed, we give him half a small dentastick a couple of times a week but I always feel they can't be that good for him. What type of bones would be suitable to give a Shih Tzu? He loves cooked rib bones (after I'm finished with them!)but they always seem to splinter into quite sharp pieces which I'm afraid will harm his gut.

boomerang

pixiebean22 wrote: »

The last two cases of trichinella in Ireland were in 2008 and were found to have originated outside of Ireland. The last report of trichinella in animals in Ireland was in 1968. All pigs and horses are sampled for trichinella as part of the post-mortem procedure. I don't think there is a huge risk or prevalence of it in Ireland.

Hi pixiebean,

Thank you for that fantastic info! I must write it down somewhere and show it to my vet, who frowns if I mention feeding raw pork. I'm such a nervous nelly myself, I still think I'd cook it before feeding though.

boomerang

I wonder is the reason you shouldn't give the Plaque Off in the long term is because you're inadvertently over-supplementing in iodine?

boomerang

CabanasBoy wrote: »

What type of bones would be suitable to give a Shih Tzu? He loves cooked rib bones (after I'm finished with them!)but they always seem to splinter into quite sharp pieces which I'm afraid will harm his gut.

I don't think the Dentastix are much good either, they're really just extra calories and the ingredients are poor. Also never give a cooked bone - the cooking removes the water content making them brittle and more prone to splinter. Here are a few ideas:

For a ShihTzu sized dog, he could have a raw chicken wing or a chicken drumstick a few times a week. These are cheap as chips! You can just buy a tray of them in the supermarket and keep them in the freezer. There's no problem giving it to him frozen, in fact it adds to the challenge! Just bear in mind they add extra calories to the diet, so you want to cut down on his regular food that day. A chicken wing gives approx. 244 calories, which is probably more than enough for a single meal for a Shih Tzu. Also never feed raw and cooked food together.

Bear in mind that bones should always be size-appropriate - ie the dog shouldn't be able to swallow them whole. So I wouldn't be giving a chicken wing or drumstick to a much bigger dog.

You could also ask your butcher for some beef marrow bones or knuckle bones. He will saw them into an appropriate size for a small dog, if you ask him nicely. Raw ribs would be ok for a Shih Tzu too. Again you can keep them in the freezer and dig them out when your dog is bored or you want some quiet time!

If you don't like the idea of feeding raw, well, my guys get their bones lying on a teatowel in their bed, which I pop in the wash when they're done. They know that they stay in their beds for "bone time" - I don't let them carry them around the house! I also don't leave the bones lying around for more than a day - by that stage they've picked them spotlessly clean anyways and have lost interest in them. I make sure to wash my hands after handling raw meat and disinfect/wash the worktop/chopping board same as I would with any raw meat.

CabanasBoy

Thanks Boomerang for your very comprehensive answer! So you reckon raw chicken drumsticks would be fine? I'm a bit OCD when it comes to food hygiene and the thoughts of raw chicken lying around gives me the heebie jeebies.

boomerang

Don't worry, he will gobble it up, it'll be gone as soon as he can manage!

Do you feed him twice a day? Then I'd give him his normal food in the morning and give him the drumstick in the evening occasionally, instead of his normal meal. Try not to feed raw soon after his normal meal - cooked food and raw food are digested at different rates, so you don't want to mix them up in the tummy.

Don't be afraid of the raw, dogs' have a shorter digestive transit and higher stomach pH than we do, designed for eating raw meat and bone. Also if the wings/drumsticks have been frozen, you've nuked all the bacteria.

I would always supervise when the dog is eating bones though, just in case of choking.

daenerysstormborn3

boomerang wrote: »

Hi pixiebean,

Thank you for that fantastic info! I must write it down somewhere and show it to my vet, who frowns if I mention feeding raw pork. I'm such a nervous nelly myself, I still think I'd cook it before feeding though.

A lot of vets are still very nervous about feeding raw unfortunately. I think a lot of the time they just haven't taken the time to read up on it. My current vet knew nothing about BARF before I rocked up with my great dane and now has two books in the waiting area on feeding raw.

Bear in mind that cooked bones may splinter and cause internal damage and cooked bones lose some of the nutrients that the dog should be getting from the bones.

@ Whispered - I started my dog on raw within one month of getting him and started off on smaller things like chicken wings and then just built him up gradually onto bigger things. The first time he had a rabbit he didn't know what to do, so i split it down the middle (unpleasant job) and once he realised there was meat inside he gobbled it up. He wasn't as quick to eat the fur, he stripped away most of the meat and bones and then went back to the skin and fur a while later. He's a hoover though so tends to eat everything pretty fast. My dog has real difficulty keeping weight on, most people think he's malnourished, so i give him the rabbit as an extra treat during the day to try and fatten him up and it does help. Wouldn't recommend the way i feed my dog to everyone because his diet is as fattening as possible but it works for him.

boomerang

Hey pixiebean,

My girly gets raw lamb mince and raw beef mince. (Sadly she can only have bones as an occasional treat now as they are really high in phosphorous and she has kidney disease.)

Don't worry, I would never feed a cooked bone - it's just the minced pork or pork medallions that I cook. Any other meat she gets raw, including green tripe, yum yum!

daenerysstormborn3

boomerang wrote: »

Hey pixiebean,

My girly gets raw lamb mince and raw beef mince. (Sadly she can only have bones as an occasional treat now as they are really high in phosphorous and she has kidney disease.)

Don't worry, I would never feed a cooked bone - it's just the minced pork or pork medallions that I cook. Any other meat she gets raw, including green tripe, yum yum!

Yeah, my dog loves all kinds of mince. I'd love to buy my own mincer but don't see that being achievable anytime soon! Tripe is very good for weight gain as well, feed my dog that as often as possible.

CabanasBoy

boomerang wrote: »

Don't worry, he will gobble it up, it'll be gone as soon as he can manage!

Do you feed him twice a day? Then I'd give him his normal food in the morning and give him the drumstick in the evening occasionally, instead of his normal meal. Try not to feed raw soon after his normal meal - cooked food and raw food are digested at different rates, so you don't want to mix them up in the tummy.

Don't be afraid of the raw, dogs' have a shorter digestive transit and higher stomach pH than we do, designed for eating raw meat and bone. Also if the wings/drumsticks have been frozen, you've nuked all the bacteria.

I would always supervise when the dog is eating bones though, just in case of choking.

Thanks again, the choking thing is a whole other issue. I'll have to learn some animal first aid.:)

ABajaninCork

CabanasBoy wrote: »

Interesting thread, I have a Shih Tzu and he does not like having his teeth brushed, we give him half a small dentastick a couple of times a week but I always feel they can't be that good for him. What type of bones would be suitable to give a Shih Tzu? He loves cooked rib bones (after I'm finished with them!)but they always seem to splinter into quite sharp pieces which I'm afraid will harm his gut.

I've stopped giving mine Dentastix as they don't agree with him. I've given him beef bones and lamb leg bones which I've cooked first (I get the stock, and he gets the bone!:D). I brush his teeth three times a week. He doesn't like it, but will tolerate me doing it.

Rib Bones are pork, and you shouldn't really give the dog these as they tend to splinter, as you've already said.

Would you not try the toothbrush again? Let him sniff it, and give him a taste of the toothpaste on your finger? Mine loves the taste of toothpaste, but hates the brush!!

HTH

CabanasBoy

I wonder is there beef or chicken flavoured toothpaste? He'd go for that!

ABajaninCork

boomerang wrote: »

I don't think the Dentastix are much good either, they're really just extra calories and the ingredients are poor. Also never give a cooked bone - the cooking removes the water content making them brittle and more prone to splinter. Here are a few ideas:

For a ShihTzu sized dog, he could have a raw chicken wing or a chicken drumstick a few times a week. These are cheap as chips! You can just buy a tray of them in the supermarket and keep them in the freezer. There's no problem giving it to him frozen, in fact it adds to the challenge! Just bear in mind they add extra calories to the diet, so you want to cut down on his regular food that day. A chicken wing gives approx. 244 calories, which is probably more than enough for a single meal for a Shih Tzu. Also never feed raw and cooked food together.

Bear in mind that bones should always be size-appropriate - ie the dog shouldn't be able to swallow them whole. So I wouldn't be giving a chicken wing or drumstick to a much bigger dog.

You could also ask your butcher for some beef marrow bones or knuckle bones. He will saw them into an appropriate size for a small dog, if you ask him nicely. Raw ribs would be ok for a Shih Tzu too. Again you can keep them in the freezer and dig them out when your dog is bored or you want some quiet time!

If you don't like the idea of feeding raw, well, my guys get their bones lying on a teatowel in their bed, which I pop in the wash when they're done. They know that they stay in their beds for "bone time" - I don't let them carry them around the house! I also don't leave the bones lying around for more than a day - by that stage they've picked them spotlessly clean anyways and have lost interest in them. I make sure to wash my hands after handling raw meat and disinfect/wash the worktop/chopping board same as I would with any raw meat.

I'd be VERY wary of giving chicken wings TBH. The bones are small and could easily cause choking. Similarly with chicken drumsticks. Although given raw, the bones can still splinter...