Refereeing In The Premier League

Paully D

Surely it's time for something to be done about it? Poor decision after poor decision is being made week in, week out and it's costing clubs millions of pounds.

The ''ah sure it evens itself out of the course of a season'' myth isn't true either.

It's amazing how they can be classed as ''professionals'' when if someone in another profession made as many mistakes as they did, they'd be unemployed fairly quickly. If they can't handle the pressure of such as job then they should look for alternative employment.

JPA

Mistakes will always exist. Why? Because they are human.
Refereeing is no better or worse than ever, it's just scrutinised more.

happyoutscan

Paully D wrote: »

If they can't handle the pressure of such as job then they should look for alternative employment.

It's a difficult job, mistakes are always going to happen especially when you consider he's trying to keep an eye on 22 players. If you ask me I think the majority of refs handle the pressure brilliantly.

ArmaniJeanss

They generally do a really difficult job very well, getting the vast majority of decisions absolutely spot on.
This is despite coming under ridiculous pressure from the 22 under-educated yobs they are trying to control.

Helix

Paully D wrote: »

It's amazing how they can be classed as ''professionals'

not really, considering its their job and they get paid for it

profession al =/= good

adox

Really if you want to have a look at referees performances, you have to look at the bigger picture and the behavior of the people they are refereeing and the culture of cheating that is now common place in the game.

The refs, for all their faults are easy targets, and singling them out for criticism is a lazy way of trying to right perceived wrongs in the game.

Paully D

adox wrote: »

Really if you want to have a look at referees performances, you have to look at the bigger picture and the behavior of the people they are refereeing and the culture of cheating that is now common place in the game.

The refs, for all their faults are easy targets, and singling them out for criticism is a lazy way of trying to right perceived wrongs in the game.

Perhaps it's time to give them more help and introduce technology?

adox

Paully D wrote: »

Perhaps it's time to give them more help and introduce technology?

I`d be all for that.

Dont be at yourself

They're doing the best job under difficult circumstances.

Players cheating. Diving, committing cynical fouls, waving imaginary cards. In their face protesting every decision.

Managers complaining, blaming every defeat on the referee.

Media scrutinising every decision, picking them apart in super slow-motion.

Their life would be made so much easier with three things:

- allow only the capain to speak to the referee. Anybody else complaining to the ref gets an instant yellow.

- retroactive punishment for dives, gamesmanship etc.

- video technology for disputed goals, penalties and sending offs.

dreamers75

I would be more worried about the defending. Schoolboys would make better attempts.

Paully D

Has a game being shown on MOTD tonight without blatant refereeing mistakes being shown up in the post-match analysis?

ctrl-alt-delete

If you want something to be done to a professional standard, it needs to be made a profession first of all.


I don't know if it is due to be a fully professional job, but it needs to be that way for the referees at least.


They need to be as fit and committed to the game as the players, it's alright for a manager to be fat - but seeing fat referees running around trying to keep up with the pace of the modern game is a failure.



At the same time, as they are humans and there is no way to eliminate human error without the aid of technology and it needs to be adopted. Not just goaline technology but also retrospective technology too, any help that can be given should be given to insure the integrity of the game.


Respect is also a big issue that is lacking, the way players managers and media hound referees is unacceptable, but it can be understood at times. However too many use officials as the first excuse for poor performances and results these days.

Smokerkl

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

They're doing the best job under difficult circumstances.

Players cheating. Diving, committing cynical fouls, waving imaginary cards. In their face protesting every decision.

Managers complaining, blaming every defeat on the referee.

Media scrutinising every decision, picking them apart in super slow-motion.

Their life would be made so much easier with three things:

- allow only the capain to speak to the referee. Anybody else complaining to the ref gets an instant yellow.

- retroactive punishment for dives, gamesmanship etc.

- video technology for disputed goals, penalties and sending offs.

And then call it rugby?? I know what your saying and I sort of agree but the fact is and what stands is Football is an ols fashioned game and the bereaucrats and pen pusherrswont change the rules(goal line technology,only captain talkin to ref etc etc) because its the fact that its the only popular(dare i say world famous) sport in the world with the original rulings still in place..
But Im with you even saying that like..
S..

DH2K9

Even with technology decisions will never be perfect. Close offsides are debated, tackles are debated. No matter how many angles you look at certain decisions, you can't decide if the ref got it right or wrong. Live with it.

Pauleta

The one thing im very critical of refs is the type of fouls they give against strikers for minimal fouls on defenders but its ignored when its the other way around. I accept refs get it wrong sometimes. I watched a bit of the EPL highlights for the Spurs game on RTE earlier and they spend about a minute complaining that the ref gave a peno but changed his mind because the lino said it was rightfully offside. Its nonsensical ****e like that, that make refs look stupid. It was the most pointless minute ive ever spent watching TV. The TV companies should cop on but at least their biggest serial offender is now out of a job.

Dont be at yourself

Smokerkl wrote: »

And then call it rugby?? I know what your saying and I sort of agree but the fact is and what stands is Football is an ols fashioned game and the bereaucrats and pen pusherrswont change the rules(goal line technology,only captain talkin to ref etc etc) because its the fact that its the only popular(dare i say world famous) sport in the world with the original rulings still in place..
But Im with you even saying that like..
S..

Rugby. Cricket. Tennis. Ice hockey. NFL. Almost every major sport uses technology of some sort.

Football may be a universal game, and though its beauty is in it's accessibility and low barrier of entry, there's no reason why the top level of the sport can't be refereed with technology.

I mean, as it is, the local kick about in the park doesn't have a professional ref, 2 linesmen and 2 more assistant referees in the penalty box, as in some competitions, so that argument doesn't hold much water. Seeing games and tournaments decided by cheating is turning more kids away from the sport than the introduction of technology ever will.

eagle eye

The big problem with Premier League referees is that there is no consistency. The likes of Chris Foy doesn't blow if you get hacked down and the likes of Mike Dean will blow up for something soft.

dagdha

The way the referee has control in a rugby game should be the way it is in football. The amount of respect shown to the referee in rugby is great, what he says goes and its only the captain that can talk to him and even then the captain has to show respect while talking to him. I think 2 or 3 games of a referee showing yellow cards to players for diving, showing imaginery cards, back chat and unprofessional behaviour would stamp alot of the badness out of the game but this will not happen because in football alot of decisions seem to be up to the refs discretion and there seems to be alot of "buddy loyalty" between some refs and players and it will not change until refs stand back and and make decisions without being influenced by players who they might have built up a relationship with by refereeing them so much.... They should treat every situation professionally and not let any player friendship get in the way.

Degag

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

They're doing the best job under difficult circumstances.

Players cheating. Diving, committing cynical fouls, waving imaginary cards. In their face protesting every decision.

Managers complaining, blaming every defeat on the referee.

Media scrutinising every decision, picking them apart in super slow-motion.

Their life would be made so much easier with three things:

- allow only the capain to speak to the referee. Anybody else complaining to the ref gets an instant yellow.

- retroactive punishment for dives, gamesmanship etc.

- video technology for disputed goals, penalties and sending offs.

This post *1000

My big problem with football is that the player taking his shirt off celebrating a goal that could take his club into the Champions League for the first time will get a yellow card and get sent off, missing the next game, while a player who dives in the box gets away scot free.

IMO, a player who dives or cheats (especially in the box) should get a straight red card. They are cheating plain and simple. We send off players who make bad (but innocent) tackles, why not send off the cheats?

As well as that, how many times has a referee sided with a defender and not given the statutory yellow card to the attacker for diving? It sickens me to see players dive and get away scot free. There are too many examples, and it's time FIFA got off their arses and thought about it instead of players taking their shirts off.

dfx-

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

Rugby. Cricket. Tennis. Ice hockey. NFL. Almost every major sport uses technology of some sort.

Technology is only as good as the person looking at it. There are elements of cricket the camera provides no help to...like low catches.

Sevilla v Real Madrid last week....still depends on who is looking at it whether Albiol cleared the ball.

No problem with referees - there's no need for equality or consistency because it's very rare that two tackes etc are the exact same or levelling out or bias biased on whether there's millions at stake. Any decision can go either way..so don't put millions on a 50/50 decision. No camera can add weather, a first offence, a covering defender factors into decisions, it always depends on the official on the conditions on the day in that particular match.

Wolfe Tone

Lads I think its great the way it is, adds an extra dimension and level of excitement and unpredictability to the game.

Paully D

Another week of Premier League fixtures, and yet again more poor decisions.

Drumpot

Degag wrote: »

This post *1000

My big problem with football is that the player taking his shirt off celebrating a goal that could take his club into the Champions League for the first time will get a yellow card and get sent off, missing the next game, while a player who dives in the box gets away scot free.

IMO, a player who dives or cheats (especially in the box) should get a straight red card. They are cheating plain and simple. We send off players who make bad (but innocent) tackles, why not send off the cheats?

As well as that, how many times has a referee sided with a defender and not given the statutory yellow card to the attacker for diving? It sickens me to see players dive and get away scot free. There are too many examples, and it's time FIFA got off their arses and thought about it instead of players taking their shirts off.

I agree with your principle although we have already seen what happens when UEFA try to punish players for cheating. In many cases its subjective when trying to ascertain whether or not somebody is cheating.

I think of the likes of Ronaldo. In most season at United he was the most fouled player. Yes, he dived, but even when he didnt dive people accused him of it. Having a reputation for diving means that in many cases he didnt actually get free's he deserved.

The only kind of cheating that is easy to identify is when a player lunges to the ground on minimal contact and when players show imaginary yellows to players. That should be automatic 1 game suspension at least.

If a team was allowed 2 calls (like in tennis) in a match, it would certainly reduce the impact that Sh*tty decisions had in games. I can think of two United v Chelsea games that could of been very differant had United been allowed to question awful reffing! This would allow games to continue with few interuptions and would significantly reduce games being decided by human error.

While I agree with the concept that it adds to the drama, I dont think any sport should be decided by poor officiating as it can mean a team winning because of an error decision instead of deserving and at its core sport is supposed to be about the better performer, not the lucky one.

SK1979

Maybe if some offences could be retrospectively punished that would discourage players from doing them. Things like diving, waving imaginary yellows, harassing the referee etc could all be punished by yellow's etc after the game finished. Its complete nonsense that just because "the ref doesn't mention it in his report" they cant do anything about it.

There will always be bad decisions but if some things were dealt with outside of the game then it would maybe take a bit of the pressure off the ref's.

dsmythy

Is the refereeing in other leagues better or something?

TacT

bring on the video

GLaDOS

dsmythy wrote: »

Is the refereeing in other leagues better or something?

Watch LOI, at least one blatant handball ignored per match guaranteed!

matrim

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

- retroactive punishment for dives, gamesmanship etc.

I agree with it for obvious ones where there is no-one near someone when they fall.

But part of the problem with this kind of punishment is what constitutes a dive. Different people have different perspectives. Just look at a match thread where there is disputed \ minimal contact for a peno. If there was minimal contact how can you say that it didn't cause the player to lose his balance and fall rather then them jumping to the ground. E.g. take someone like Ashley Young, he very rarely just falls to the ground without contact, but will go down under the slightest contact and will try to draw contact so he can go down. We all know he's looking for the free when he does it but as there's contact it can be harsh to punish him for it.

Or even cases where a player jumps \ moves to avoid a tackle but then falls. The tackle caused him to have to avoid it but if he falls without contact he's probably technically cheating to make sure he gets the free. In some of these cases it should be a free even if he avoided the contact, so even though it should have been a free will he get punished for falling without contact?

It would also help if refs were willing to call frees without a player going to ground. You will often see if a player tries to stay up and play the ball they won't get the free but if they go to ground they will.

Paully D

Paully D wrote: »

Another week of Premier League fixtures, and yet again more poor decisions.

A similar story this week.

A penalty for West Ham that was actually a foul outside the box, a disallowed goal that should have been allowed for Everton and the referee then trying to make up for it by giving Everton a controversial penalty against Aston Villa, and I'm sure many Blackburn fans will be unhappy with the decision to send N'Zonzi off against Arsenal.

YouTookMyName

Mason Bottling it TWICE to send off Vidic.

d22ontour

YouTookMyName wrote: »

Mason Bottling it TWICE to send off Vidic.

No mention of the 2 incorrect penalty decisions he gave, one to each team just incase you didn't realize ? The one on one was 50/50 with both players pulling jerseys but don't let that cloud your mind, yeah it was foul but not a red card offense which by the letter of the rulebook should have been a free out as the Hammer player pulled jerseys first, no ? :pac:

Drumpot

YouTookMyName wrote: »

Mason Bottling it TWICE to send off Vidic.

Actually, the first yellow was correct as the keeper was getting the ball before the West Ham player and as previously stated there were other errors from the ref.

There have been plenty of poor decisions by refs in many many games this season. The reason many remember Uniteds ones is because they , more then any team, take advantage of these mistakes.

Paully D

Plenty of shouts again today in the Chelsea V Spurs game!

Paully D

More shocking decisions today. In all honesty this could have been bumped every week of the season so far. Awful stuff.

Maybe if Phil Dowd wasn't the size of a small island he'd have been able to keep up with play and could have made the right decision in the Manchester United V Wigan game. How the fuck does he pass a fitness test?

Mars Bar

Paully D wrote: »

More shocking decisions today. In all honesty this could have been bumped every week of the season so far. Awful stuff.

Maybe if Phil Dowd wasn't the size of a small island he'd have been able to keep up with play and could have made the right decision in the Manchester United V Wigan game. How the fuck does he pass a fitness test?

A heavy-ish person can be fit.

Paully D

Mars Bar wrote: »

A heavy-ish person can be fit.

I understand that, but he looks out of breath every time the camera is on him and he can't keep up with the speed of a Premier League game.

G.K.

If we had technology stuff would be so much better. The refs will make mistakes, but we should help them. With technology, plenty of innocent but wrong decisions (like Everton's penalty today, Spearing's red vs fulham etc...)

AdamD

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

Lads I think its great the way it is, adds an extra dimension and level of excitement and unpredictability to the game.

Absolutely despise this argument.

mosstin

Paully D wrote: »

More shocking decisions today. In all honesty this could have been bumped every week of the season so far. Awful stuff.

Maybe if Phil Dowd wasn't the size of a small island he'd have been able to keep up with play and could have made the right decision in the Manchester United V Wigan game. How the fuck does he pass a fitness test?

His weight had nothing to do with him giving Sammon a red card. That was all about his stupidity.

DB10

The likes of Dowd and Mike Dean are just ****e referees in general, and heavily biased towards United.


Mark Halsey, now there is a good referee.

YouTookMyName

Howard Webb is a crap ref.

Giggsy11

DB10 wrote: »

The likes of Dowd and Mike Dean are just ****e referees in general, and heavily biased towards United.


Mark Halsey, now there is a good referee.

Oh yeah. Can we list out the decisions that went against us also? With Webb in charge.

SantryRed

G.K. wrote: »

If we had technology stuff would be so much better. The refs will make mistakes, but we should help them. With technology, plenty of innocent but wrong decisions (like Everton's penalty today, Spearing's red vs fulham etc...)

Not a chance. Technology will never be used for penalty calls and red cards instances. The only thing technology will ever be used for will be for the goal line. Sure even American Football doesn't use replay footage for penalties so there's no chance in Football doing it.

shangri la

If a ref makes a lot of blunders in a string of matches what happens to him? Who judges refs ability? Why cant managers publicy condem a ref who cost them the game?

chris foy was the difference between spurs losing to stoke or getting at least a draw. That might cost them a champo league place and £20m but harry cant complain?

smokedeels

Football is broken. Nobody is singing from the same hymn sheet. The governing bodies are completely out of touch with the fan-base and what we want. The folk playing and managing in the sport (the most important people) are actively discouraged from discussing it.

Video technology and refs who can explain decisions post-match are required, most of us feel that way. The people who play the game need to stand up - they can't ban and/or fine a sizeable majority of them - and fight for it. Unless they are happy to play dumb and collect their paychecks while the sport suffers.

Drumpot

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Oh yeah. Can we list out the decisions that went against us also? With Webb in charge.

You are pissing against the wind on that one. In two out of the last 3 games Man city have been the recipient of some very favourable decisions that ultimately helped ease them to victory, but there was little said of it. If it had been United there would of been uproar.

At this stage, people dont even think about what they are saying in relation to United, refs and Penos at Old Trafford, they just presume because a majority of the bitter ABU's concur with them, then they must be right.

Heres an example. The season Liverpool challenged Man United for the league, teams against them had more red cards and Liverpool got more penalties then any team. If that had been United, there would of been the usual "typical United", but little was made of it.

Theres as much consistancy in the views of an ABU as there is in the refereeing in the EPL.

dfx-

Paully D wrote: »

More shocking decisions today. In all honesty this could have been bumped every week of the season so far. Awful stuff.

I'm going to gamble that there were more terrific decisions every week. If there's 10 games a week, 900 minutes, you'll find plenty of minutes where great players get it wrong, the 'great' pundits get it wrong, the fans claiming for thousands of dubious and wrong handballs and boo referees for getting decisions right, but not to their liking and surprise surprise referees get it wrong too..

I saw player of the week, best player in the world Gareth Bale horribly skew a one-on-one chance very high, wide and very horribly wrong.

Iang87

to be honest my main issue with referees is lack of consistency. If a ref is crap thats fine but jesus keep making the same decisions thats my main problem

dfx-

Very few decision-making incidents are identical though. All sorts of contributing factors.

Benimar

I just saw the Milijas tackle there for the first time. If that's a sending off, we might as well take tackling out of the game. Shocking decision from the ref, and as bad from the FA for not overturning it.

That_Guy

*awaits Paully's rant about the Sunderland equaliser being offside*