Returning to Ireland?

Caribs

Think it boils down to some maths in the end.

By the sounds of things you are both Irish so you know the advantages/disadvantages of living in Ireland. Economy is in the toilet and our government are at best half witted clowns and in reality should be shot with balls of their own sh*te. Taxes are high compared to where they were and public services are not exactly in tip top condition.

On the plus side you have a company willing to pay you to relocate so assume that includes house contents etc, factor that into walking straight into a job versus a point in time moving back with potentially no guaranteed job and no relo. A plus is that house prices are way down from their peak (not saying they've reached bottom) but if you were to look to purchase now you would most likely have less of a mortgage than you would have had when the market was at its peak so could off set the lack of income that will hopefully be a relatively short term thing for your husband. IT is pretty good in Galway just now, plenty of big names companies here.

I am biased, moved here from Dublin 6 years ago, have a stable job as does my wife but love it here.

Not sure this serves to confuse or help but there you go!

Xiney

Caribs wrote: »

our government are at best half witted clowns and in reality should be shot with balls of their own sh*te

BostonB

There is no way of knowing whats going to happen in Ireland in the next 12 months.

majiktripp

tscall wrote: »

What does Ireland have that NZ doesn't? Besides loved ones and the ability to leave the country as a family of 3 for under $1000? Try houses with central heating, double glazing, and insulation! Seriously, if you had survived 4 Wellington winters in Kiwi made houses, you'd understand. You've got in easy in Auckland!

Those points I can understand, mould appearing on shoes in our closets and condensation on the windows in the mornings can be shocking at times especially during winter. The housing is by far sub-standard here compared to home, I think they believe the amount of average sunshine and heat in someway makes up for it.

As for loved ones, this is also one of the hardest things we have had to deal with when being here. It's not so bad though, $2 for an hour's call to a landline in Ireland anytime of the day is pretty good from a mobile, and we have skype et al as well so never far from touch. Not sure if we're here for the long haul just yet but I can assure you we wont be returning home in the near future, not with the state the place is in. Even people here at work ask how we managed to get ourselves into the position we're in! Can't say much to defend the state of the country really, we voted them in so are some way responsible I guess (although I never voted FF)

Do what you feel is right, above all have no regrets, we came here and are giving it a shot, may be you should do the same and see how it plays out by returning back to Ireland.

Interceptor

OP, there is a global economic shakeup and Ireland is caught up in it as a result of internal and external factors - it could take years to work out and no-one knows whats going to happen. Galway is not a good place to be if you are an electrician, contract cleaner, used car salesman or wealth manager but then again neither are lots of places. A friend of mine who is originally from NZ claims that there is a looming wave of recession due to hit there in the next year or so as a result of overdependance on Chinese investment (maybe he's deluded!)

The doom and gloom here are heavily media-fed and if you avoid it you can get on with your life and be quite happy. I am very lucky, both my wife and I work so our standard of living hasn't deteriorated over the last few years. Our two kids are in a country national school with 120 pupils in a four-teacher shared class setup, they couldn't be happier and there is no 'my iPods bigger that your iPod' in the school. We bought a new house last year (yeah - mad, I know!) but we took a while looking and picked one with serious build quality on an acre with no neighbours either side and the peace and quiet is lovely. We have dogs and chickens, we don't lock our cars at night and apart from the odd fox, no-one is watching what we have.

There are jobs here and while wage rates are falling, I think they are probably 'readjusting' and will stabilise in a while once demand normalises. My brother moved to Auckland last year with his wife and they both got residency but it took them a good while to get (not very well paid) jobs too. It sounds like a nice place to live but I'm not sure I'd fit in over there - I'd like to see Invercargill simply because I admire Burt Munro.

In the end it boils down to quality of life - we moved here from a flat on the northside of Dublin fifteen years ago with the intention of staying two years. Once your daughter hits school and makes a few buddies you'll find it harder to pull up roots.

The weather in the West of Ireland does my head in a lot of the time but the people are good and crime rates are low. Let us know how you get on.

'cptr

dafunk

ilovesleep wrote: »

All I have wanted to do for a months now is protest. Protest at anything. Its not happening. I really hate the attitude of lying down rolling around in the abuse.

Well why don't you then? You attitude is typical of everyone in this country (myself included), we complain about the government and how they've bent us over and ****ed us up the ass and then we complain about taking it but we don't do what the French do and start smashing things. Every man woman and child in this country should be standing on Kildare street while we pull those thieving, greedy, devious pricks out by the hair and beat them black and blue but do we do it? No. Our ancestors must be turning in their graves.

celty

It's too easy to blame the media for the current wave of negativity. Since the start of the New Year alone, in Galway city, Cuba, The Cellar, Zhivago Records, The N17 superstore, and Tom Dempsey carpets have all closed down. They were all local businesses, and that's just off the top of my head.

Each of us who works here took a massive hit on our pay last month, because our stupid Government decided to bail out banks who were totally out of control. We could be paying for this for generations, because the fools in the Dept of Finance really hadn't a clue about how much debt the banks had got into.

Interest rates are really low, but anyone who bought a house after 2004 is in serious negative equity. Wait until the interest rates start going up. What am I saying, they already are. In 2011 and 2012 there will be a wave of people who will have to default on their mortgages.

Ireland is a sad place right now and Irish people are sadder, because as the previous poster said, we allow these rotten, corrupt politicians to s--te all over us. TDs promise to fix roads and footpaths for votes, because either they haven't a clue or they just don't care about the economy.

If you have a good lifestyle in NZ, I think you'd be mad to move home right now.

danbohan

celty wrote: »

It's too easy to blame the media for the current wave of negativity. Since the start of the New Year alone, in Galway city, Cuba, The Cellar, Zhivago Records, The N17 superstore, and Tom Dempsey carpets have all closed down. They were all local businesses, and that's just off the top of my head.

Each of us who works here took a massive hit on our pay last month, because our stupid Government decided to bail out banks who were totally out of control. We could be paying for this for generations, because the fools in the Dept of Finance really hadn't a clue about how much debt the banks had got into.

Interest rates are really low, but anyone who bought a house after 2004 is in serious negative equity. Wait until the interest rates start going up. What am I saying, they already are. In 2011 and 2012 there will be a wave of people who will have to default on their mortgages.

Ireland is a sad place right now and Irish people are sadder, because as the previous poster said, we allow these rotten, corrupt politicians to s--te all over us. TDs promise to fix roads and footpaths for votes, because either they haven't a clue or they just don't care about the economy.

If you have a good lifestyle in NZ, I think you'd be made to move home right now.

if your thinking of getting a mortgage this happened yesterday , shows what a mess irish banking is and will be for foreseeable future

ptsb
RFixed Rate Old Rate New Rate
2 year Fixed 5.25% 7.25%
5 year Fixed 5.75% 8.75%
7 year Fixed 6.10% 9.10%
10 year Fixed 6.10% 9.10%

BostonB

Welcome to the 80's.

dafunk

As someone who could never afford to buy in boom I have no concept of what those increases mean? Suppose you're paying 1200 a month on a mortgage (would that be a good estimate as an average) what will you pay now with the increase in rates?

Sorry OP for totally jacking your thread.

BostonB

If you were paying 4.5% and it cost you 1200. 9% would double it. 2400.

celty

BostonB wrote: »

Welcome to the 80's.

At least in the 1980s, we knew no better. There were no jobs at home and we accepted it, because there never had been. People in school in Galway expected to end up in London, New York, or Boston. That was just 'normal' life in the West of Ireland.

The difference now is that we had a chance and FF, the bankers, and the developers f--ked it all up. How sad that emigration is back again.

I know two couples who moved back from the US during the boom. They've gone back again, even though they wanted to stay here to raise families.

Right now, so many people want to leave ... it's unusual to hear from an emigrant who wants to return.

Webbs

BostonB wrote: »

If you were paying 4.5% and it cost you 1200. 9% would double it. 2400.

No it wouldnt, as mortgages are made up of capital and interest

BostonB

Webbs wrote: »

No it wouldnt, as mortgages are made up of capital and interest

I was being simplistic, as a blunt example.

yeehaw

BostonB wrote: »

I was being simplistic, as a blunt example.

You were being simple rather than simplistic, because your post is just plain wrong.

If you don't understand, just ask.

BostonB

Correct it, rather than name calling.

225000 @ 5% over 30yrs is 1207.85
225000 @ 9% over 30yrs is 1810.40
225000 @ 13% over 30yrs is 2488.95

225000@ 5% over 20yrs is 1484.90
225000@ 9% over 20yrs is 2024.38
225000@ 13% over 20yrs is 2636.05

400000 @ 5% over 30yrs is 2147.29
400000 @ 9% over 30yrs is 3218.49
400000 @ 13% over 30yrs is 4424.80

http://www.propertyfile.net/tools.htm

And a multitude of variations. Go crazy with the figures.

yeehaw

BostonB wrote: »

Correct it, rather than name calling.

225000 @ 5% over 30yrs is 1207.85
225000 @ 9% over 30yrs is 1810.40
225000 @ 13% over 30yrs is 2488.95

225000@ 5% over 20yrs is 1484.90
225000@ 9% over 20yrs is 2024.38
225000@ 13% over 20yrs is 2636.05

400000 @ 5% over 30yrs is 2147.29
400000 @ 9% over 30yrs is 3218.49
400000 @ 13% over 30yrs is 4424.80

http://www.propertyfile.net/tools.htm

And a multitude of variations. Go crazy with the figures.

You shouldn't respond to posts when you have either not read what was asked or have no understanding of the subject matter.

pleasant Co.

yeehaw wrote: »

You shouldn't respond to posts when you have either not read what was asked or have no understanding of the subject matter.

Well then, correct him! quit acting superior and nip it in the bud.

Interceptor

Mactard wrote: »

quit acting superior.

Did I miss a meeting? I thought thats why boards.ie was invented...

LOL

'cptr

SinewaveSurfer

JustMary wrote: »

The funniest bit of this statement is the vast majority of Irish people have no understanding of the concept of ethnicity, and aren't bi-lingual (English/Irish), much less having another European language.

And there's nothing funny about this statement. Talk about generalising. We're talking in the GALWAY CITY forum after all. And if you're circle of friends is restricted to those you condescend to on forums then I'm not surprised moving here was one of the worst decisions of your life.

You miss my point anyways. You seem to have a very myopic outlook on the whole question. So you want to reduce culture to language, sure language falls under the 'culture' umbrella term, but it's not the be-all and end-all...otherwise every english speaking country would be culturally the same. Which they ain't. Not by any stretch of the imagination. Besides, even focusing on language issues, you're talking out of your poop-chute still as Galway and the west in general is the strongest location for gaelic speaking. Gaeltacht much ?

You also seem a little too motivated on hammering YOUR point of view home, while it's so obviously a polarized topic that there is no universal 'right' or 'wrong' but you seem to think there is.

biko

yeehaw and BostonB, make nice.

Anyway, let's get back to whether OP should leave NZ to come back to Ireland.

Mrs OBumble

SinewaveSurfer wrote: »

And there's nothing funny about this statement. Talk about generalising. We're talking in the GALWAY CITY forum after all. And if you're circle of friends is restricted to those you condescend to on forums then I'm not surprised moving here was one of the worst decisions of your life.

It wasn't me that said that, and I have no idea how you can make inferences about my circle of friends!

And of course we're generalising: we don't know the OPs exact situation, on either side the water. But we can draw some general thoughts about features of living here vs elsewhere.

SinewaveSurfer wrote: »

You miss my point anyways. You seem to have a very myopic outlook on the whole question. So you want to reduce culture to language, sure language falls under the 'culture' umbrella term, but it's not the be-all and end-all...otherwise every english speaking country would be culturally the same. Which they ain't. Not by any stretch of the imagination. Besides, even focusing on language issues, you're talking out of your poop-chute still as Galway and the west in general is the strongest location for gaelic speaking. Gaeltacht much ?

I think your post makes my point very nicely. You've totally missed the point about ethnicity, I guess because you don't have the concept. And if you think that English here is the same as it in in England, the USA, Australia, etc then the politest thing I can say is that you obviously haven't travelled much.

In terms of culture and ethnic diversity, the OP will encounter different groups of people in NZ and RoI. There's not more or less culture in either, it's just different. In NZ, there's more focus on sports and the outdoors, and kids in school may meet kapa-haka (= Maori traditional performance and song) instead of Irish-trad diddley-eye.

IMHO, though, she (and her kid) will experience far less overt racism, and thus broader cultural understanding and acceptance, there. For example, in NZ the idea of not getting into a taxi because the driver isn't white died with my parents generation. Here, some folks are still proud so say on boards that this is the way they operate.

majiktripp

JustMary wrote: »

IMHO, though, she (and her kid) will experience far less overt racism, and thus broader cultural understanding and acceptance, there. For example, in NZ the idea of not getting into a taxi because the driver isn't white died with my parents generation. Here, some folks are still proud so say on boards that this is the way they operate.

There is still an undertone of racism here, but not on the same level as back in Galway/Ireland.
People won't pick and choose a taxi driver over the colour of their skin for sure, but I have heard comments about Polynesians and their affinity for KFC (when they're returning home, it's their carry on baggage....etc) but it is very minor indeed compared to the generally 'accepted' amount back home.

There is a flipside for us white Europeans, as here, sometimes we are referred to as Pom's (we're all English don't you know) and Pakeha, which is pretty much a term covering any non-Maori white New Zealander.
It's not meant to serve as a derogatory remark by any means, but is used as a dividing word, sort of forming an "us and them" mentality at times, at least that's how it appears to me.

Sorry to go off there a bit, but still even after the points made, there's times when comparing Ireland to NZ, I just felt more racist for being back in Galway, and for this I can give no real reason.

Anyways - Has the OP any further input into this? Have our varied thoughts swayed them in any way?

tscall

Who knew I would spark such a heated debate. After all the comments, I would have to say that I am leading more towards staying in NZ. It is not that our family is unhappy here. I do worry that I would regret not going back to Ireland, but I would regret even more taking my family away from a place that they are happy into the unknown which is Ireland at the moment, and risk all of us being miserable.

I think the best bet (unless and amazing job comes up for hubby) would be to get a feel for how things are whilst there on holiday in April, if we decide it is where we want to be, then maybe we can come back in 6 months or so. It would cost us more in the long run, but can one really put a price on piece of mind?

Thanks everyone for all the input!

dafunk

BostonB wrote: »

If you were paying 4.5% and it cost you 1200. 9% would double it. 2400.

Couldn't be, unless you were on interest only and that would suck because you'd never be able to pay a penny off the capital.

Amhran Nua

majiktripp wrote: »

Sorry to go off there a bit, but still even after the points made, there's times when comparing Ireland to NZ, I just felt more racist for being back in Galway, and for this I can give no real reason.

Possibly you're just imagining it? Ireland in general has done quite well in terms of accepting migrants and immigrants from other countries, I think, none of the race riots or other unpleasantness you see in our European neighbours, and nary a sign of a right wing party in sight, when the right is on the rise all over the EU.

Purely anecdotally, the only places I've actually noticed any overt racism are among students new to the city (any city) for the first time, and funnily enough among some immigrants from Eastern Europe who've come out with some jaw dropping 1950s-type stuff. Not all of them by any means, but some. And having been involved for a while on the steering committee for the city intercultural forum as well as being married to a very non-caucasian immigrant I do have a clue what I'm talking about.

inisboffin

There's plenty of racism alive an kicking here I'm sad to say. You have to look no further than the taxi driver threads on here to see it rear its ugly head
While I don't agree with JustMary that it a majority that are culturally insensitive here, it is still an unsettling amount. I think it is more noticable when you've lived abroad and move back. I also think Ireland is still reeling from immigration, so to compare it equally to a country that's been substantially multi-racial for a while won't be accurate. Things will get better, and until that happens we have to challenge racism when we see it. I notice more and more it shows up accompanied by lack of education, and sometimes lack of travel/exposure as a stranger in someone else's country.

There's wonderful things about living here OP, and that's why people want to come home. Be sensible, but let your heart have a say too

Amhran Nua

inisboffin wrote: »

There's plenty of racism alive an kicking here I'm sad to say. You have to look no further than the taxi driver threads on here to see it rear its ugly head

Taxi drivers are in a bit of an unusual position though, in that they organsie into a few companies, and their industry has received a lot of immigrants. And in fairness most taxi drivers are alright with it, its the bad apples that give everyone else a bad name.

inisboffin wrote: »

I also think Ireland is still reeling from immigration, so to compare it equally to a country that's been substantially multi-racial for a while won't be accurate.

Its been longer since the IBC-based start of large amounts of immigration, compared to when the UK started getting a flood of Commonwealth immigration - result in the UK, race riots, result in Ireland, not a peep.

Mrs OBumble

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Possibly you're just imagining it? Ireland in general has done quite well in terms of accepting migrants and immigrants from other countries

Purely anecdotally, the only places I've actually noticed any overt racism are among students new to the city (any city) for the first time, and funnily enough among some immigrants from Eastern Europe who've come out with some jaw dropping 1950s-type stuff. Not all of them by any means, but some. And having been involved for a while on the steering committee for the city intercultural forum as well as being married to a very non-caucasian immigrant I do have a clue what I'm talking about.

Maybe people remember to watch their mouths when you're around. Irish people tend to forget that I'm foreign, even though I sound different, I think because I work on fitting in. So I've heard some fascinating conversations from middle-class Irish folk. And I also know some African people who've been told not to go to church in certain places because they're just not welcome here.

But actually ... I was originally talking about understanding of different cultures, rather than explicit racism. Even those Irish who aren't racist (and I don't have any idea what the proportion is), have very little sense of this. The obvious starting place would be settled vs traveller Irish.

Amhran Nua

JustMary wrote: »

Maybe people remember to watch their mouths when you're around.

Its not like I go around with badge and a hat, I'm just another private citizen lending a hand.

JustMary wrote: »

Irish people tend to forget that I'm foreign, even though I sound different, I think because I work on fitting in. So I've heard some fascinating conversations from middle-class Irish folk. And I also know some African people who've been told not to go to church in certain places because they're just not welcome here.

If you could PM me the details, I'll informally check it out.

JustMary wrote: »

But actually ... I was originally talking about understanding of different cultures, rather than explicit racism. Even those Irish who aren't racist (and I don't have any idea what the proportion is), have very little sense of this. The obvious starting place would be settled vs traveller Irish.

Would this have anything to do with the recent AH thread? Of course people understand different ethnicities, but there is a lot of history with travellers in Ireland, going back a long, long time. It's a process of education on both sides, and I'm glad to say that people working on it are doing a sterling job. The emphasis is being placed on educating people and changing behaviour, not getting rid of them.