Ban on Fox Hunting

Discodog

homerhop wrote: »

Is there a blue moon

You mean that you're a Man City fan - now it's war

homerhop

Yes

Discodog wrote: »

You mean that you're a Man City fan - now it's war

Worse again, when I did follow that sport It was Liverpool. Havent watched a soccer match since the 16th april 1991. Will stick to shouting at the telly when the tribesmen are on.

pokertalk

well get your red jeresy out for next season
never walk alone
is this slightly off topic:D

gozunda

Yes

:cool:

Discodog wrote: »

But your ability is not shared by all shooters. I have seen & rescued literally dozens of foxes with gunshot wounds. I find it astonishing that one needs a license of competence to drive a car but that one can carry a gun with no proof that you know how to use it.

DD Where a shooter is well trained shooting is an excellent method of dispatching a fox that is predating domestic livestock

However shooting as a method of dispatch in the hands of non competant shooter is not the mantra the anti fox hunting brigade always let on

On the other hand Hounds will kill quickly and efficiently - it is in their nature

pokertalk wrote: »

i realise the fox is going to suffer but colse to an instant kill would be humane, not bein ripped apart or left to suffer.and having a fox collapse from near exhaustion would nor be humane

PT - Hounds will kill a fox instantaneously by breaking the neck ... there is no chance of the fox crawling off to die or left to suffer. What happens after is not pretty but is largely immaterial ie "ripped apart"

Btw foxes don't collapse "from near exhaustion" they average 'run' is 15/20 minutes much of the time the fox may duck and dive but in my experience rarely run at speed for any period of time. Healthy Foxes use their cunning to avoid the large party of of hounds, horses and people (noisey and to the fox smelly). Fox hunting is perhaps the only method of control that allows the fox a good chance of escape and many hunts end with no kill being made. The numbers of kills is unimportant to fox hunting. Fox hunting concentrates on the targeting of those foxes that predate domestic livestock and a dispatch in a way that has resulted in a healthy and large fox population

Hunting with hounds is the nearest thing to "an instant kill" you will get with the exception of a good marksman with the correct weapon and ammunition.

Discodog

gozunda wrote: »

The numbers of kills is unimportant to fox hunting. Fox hunting concentrates on the targeting of those foxes that predate domestic livestock and a dispatch in a way that has resulted in a healthy and large fox population

You're right hunting does not control numbers so it is purely killing for pleasure. The hunt is not targeted - were are talking about a bunch of men on horseback not a cruise missile. The hunt goes where it is allowed & sometimes where it isn't, so it hunts whatever foxes have the misfortune to be there at the time.

gozunda wrote: »

DD Where a shooter is well trained shooting is an excellent method of dispatching a fox that is predating domestic livestock

Much easier to secure the livestock as another fox will soon come along to fill the vacant territory.

gozunda

Yes

Discodog wrote: »

You're right hunting does not control numbers so it is purely killing for pleasure. The hunt is not targeted - were are talking about a bunch of men on horseback not a cruise missile. The hunt goes where it is allowed & sometimes where it isn't, so it hunts whatever foxes have the misfortune to be there at the time.

DD sadly thats where your grasp of the 'facts' lets this argument down...Who here has ever claimed FH is about wiping out foxes???? Why do you think there is a healthy and large fox population in the counrtyside? The "bunch of men" (and please dont forget many women become involved in FH as well) know what they are doing and where such foxes are likely to be. Hunts will always make its best effort to stay where they are supposed to be, however hounds will be hounds. As for hunting a healthy young fox will rarely ever get caught.

Discodog wrote: »

Much easier to secure the livestock as another fox will soon come along to fill the vacant territory.

A throw away solution that is virtually impossible to implement in the countryside. Most farmers do not wish to eradicate foxes - just control those that predate livestock. They do this with the help of the hunt in a way that has worked for generations.

This may offend surburban sensibilities but then so does spreading slurry...

flutered

Yes

gozunda wrote: »

:cool:



DD Where a shooter is well trained shooting is an excellent method of dispatching a fox that is predating domestic livestock

However shooting as a method of dispatch in the hands of non competant shooter is not the mantra the anti fox hunting brigade always let on

On the other hand Hounds will kill quickly and efficiently - it is in their nature



PT - Hounds will kill a fox instantaneously by breaking the neck ... there is no chance of the fox crawling off to die or left to suffer. What happens after is not pretty but is largely immaterial ie "ripped apart"

Btw foxes don't collapse "from near exhaustion" they average 'run' is 15/20 minutes much of the time the fox may duck and dive but in my experience rarely run at speed for any period of time. Healthy Foxes use their cunning to avoid the large party of of hounds, horses and people (noisey and to the fox smelly). Fox hunting is perhaps the only method of control that allows the fox a good chance of escape and many hunts end with no kill being made. The numbers of kills is unimportant to fox hunting. Fox hunting concentrates on the targeting of those foxes that predate domestic livestock and a dispatch in a way that has resulted in a healthy and large fox population

Hunting with hounds is the nearest thing to "an instant kill" you will get with the exception of a good marksman with the correct weapon and ammunition.

gozunda, my compliments on an excellent version of the truth, rarely have i seen it put so correctly.

gozunda

Yes

kerash wrote: »

Are there statistics that we can look at stating the population of foxes and what effect the hunting has?

It has been estimated that there are between 150,000 and 200,000 foxes in ireland.

From the available data it would appear that hunting (all types of hunting) as it exists today would appear to have only a localised effect only eg the targeting of those foxes that predate on domestic livestock

The National Biodiversity Data Centre states that with reference to Conservation Status it is a species of "Least Concern" meaning that it is not endangered in any way.

LK_Dave

Yes

Nothing against fox hunting in general. I just hate the horse hunting community who think they have to God given right to trespass my land during the wettest time of the year tearing up the ground and making gaps in the ditches. And don’t get me started in their attempt to mend the gaps in the ditches they leave behind. **** the lot of them IMO.

LK_Dave

Yes

I got this PM from a user, I won't disclose his/her name. It does show that some hunts try and respect landownes wishes which is good to hear and i thank them for taking time to write to me. As I said I have no problem with hunting sports, it should be know that i hunt my land with rifle and shotgun plus some ather land with the owners permission plus i have been know to take up a fishing rod.

?? wrote:

Hi LK_D

Sounds like you have had a rough experience of your local hunt and they are completly out of order.

Wouldn't happen in our area tbh. Can you contact the local pack and advise then to your wishes or are you saying that they havnt contacted you. If I fields that I dont want the hunt to go through - they dont.

Not all hunts are like this I know

?

My reply...

"Yes I have contacted them on many occasions and they are well aware of my grievance. I have relayed this to many of the hunt members as well as the Master of the Hounds, as well as confronting them during the hunt on my land- when there could be as many as 30/40 horses, riders plus dogs it can be very intimidating. The cheeky <snip> even get new members who known me ask for permission. One of my neighbours is a major player in the hunt but they never go across his land. I know this for a fact as I have observed this and have asked many of the hunt members, plus he is not shy to use a track machine to double up his ditches.
As for mending the gaps in the ditches, who showed these guys how to fence? Cutting a small tree or bush and lobbing it in the hole is not fencing. How is that supposed to grow?

If there was a vote tomorrow to ban fox hunting I would be the first in line to vote yes. "

HollyRichter

Hunting is disgusting. I have been horseriding for 13 years and never once did I have any desire to participate in this horrible blood sport.

gozunda

Yes

HollyRichter wrote: »

Hunting is disgusting. I have been horseriding for 13 years and never once did I have any desire to participate in this horrible blood sport.

HR I take it that you are including all forms of hunting in this statement? shooting, fox hunting etc? It is also important to remember that many people who support hunting dont necessarily ride. However neither the fact that because a person rides means that they necessarily have a real insight to what hunting is about either. What is true is that hunting is legal, follows a code agreed by those involved and helps to control a predatory animal in a local context. Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion and if you dont find that it is something you wish to partake in then that is of course your decision to make.

pokertalk

this thread is awake again:mad:

Cherry Blossom

HollyRichter wrote: »

Hunting is disgusting. I have been horseriding for 13 years and never once did I have any desire to participate in this horrible blood sport.

Please don't bump up old threads, this has well and truely run it's course.