Farming Chit Chat

Bizzum

reilig wrote: »

I hope he's lucky for you.

I believe the biggest problem with cross bred bulls is consistency. One cow could have a nice handy calf and the next could need a section. One could bring shapely calfs and the next poor quality. Inconsistency is often a problem with Docility too - of the bull himself and of the calves. I think the more crosses in the mix, the more there is a chance of inconsistency?

Have often thought about crossing an easy calving BB with an easy calving pedigree cow to see what result I might get and to see if he would be suitable for breeding.

But I suppose, when you look at it, don't we take the same gamble with a pedigree bull all the time too. He could be better than any pedigree bull.

One question, if he's off a PB CH Heifer, is he not 50% CH? I assume his sire is a Lim x BA?

Here's a pic of the Dam. She is by Landais the BA out of a PB CH heifer by NWK. The bull we are keeping is off her and by the Lim bull Ambertaine brigadeer (ABI). So he's 50% Lim 25%Ba 25%CH (I have to get it right this time:)).
He is a well bred bull albeit different breeds. We are used to calving the CH so i'd be thinkimg this chap shouldn't be any harder than the CH?
After that I've no idea how it'll go. I am optimistic though because Landais and Brigadeer bred well for us in the past, but maybe it's misplaced optimism! He is not that much different from them INRA bulls, whether that's a good or a bad thing, I dont know. ? Time will tell!

just do it

Bizzum wrote: »

Here's a pic of the Dam. She is by Landais the BA out of a PB CH heifer by NWK. The bull we are keeping is off her and by the Lim bull Ambertaine brigadeer (ABI). So he's 50% Lim 25%Ba 25%CH (I have to get it right this time:)).
He is a well bred bull albeit different breeds. We are used to calving the CH so i'd be thinkimg this chap shouldn't be any harder than the CH?
After that I've no idea how it'll go. I am optimistic though because Landais and Brigadeer bred well for us in the past, but maybe it's misplaced optimism! He is not that much different from them INRA bulls, whether that's a good or a bad thing, I dont know. ? Time will tell!

Have you put his tag number into ICBF? Given his bloodlines are known it should give you some guide, albeit with low realiability figures.

Best of luck with him. Unlike most other crosses used like this, you've a good knowledge of his bloodlines which have proven successful on your farm. Another new breed which is based on a 3 or 4 way cross is the Stabiliser breed. If your bull is successful we may well have a new Bizzum breed of cattle on our hands!

pakalasa

Bizzum,
Will you try him on the whole herd, or maybe just a few for the first year?

just do it

Bizzum
Any chance of a picture of the bull? And the CH you're unhappy with out of interest! Has he different breeding to the CH heifer that the Xbred bull is from?

Bizzum

just do it wrote: »

If your bull is successful we may well have a new Bizzum breed of cattle on our hands!

God forbid:D

pakalasa wrote: »

Bizzum,
Will you try him on the whole herd, or maybe just a few for the first year?

Generally the CH bull ran with the spring calving cows. So I suppose that's where he'll start off.

just do it wrote: »

Bizzum
Any chance of a picture of the bull? And the CH you're unhappy with out of interest! Has he different breeding to the CH heifer that the Xbred bull is from?

I will put up a picture of him at some stage. He got lame a month ago and the shine went off him, but when he's looking good again I'll get a pic!

The young CH is in the Photo thread and is by Alcazar (AZA). He is just ok looking. I suppose time will tell with the calves he leaves after himself!

Thanks for the good wishes!

pakalasa

Anyone go to the PB Limousin Heifer sale in Roscommon Mart? 63 Heifers were up for sale.
http://www.irishlimousin.com/

redzerologhlen

I bought a new stihl 181 chainsaw with a tungsten tipped chain yeastrday for €325. I have a lot of hazel to cut for the burren life and the husky is a bit big for it. Seems like a right good little saw, anyone have one and what do ye think of it?

whelan1

went out doing cattle this morning, left 11 year old in charge. When i came back there was a trail of paint- not kids paint- on floor around table and in to living room:eek::eek: no one knew anything:mad::mad: but the youngest has paint on his trousers:rolleyes: so spent the last hour on my hands and knees scrubing the floor and the tv is off for the rest of the day....

bob charles

forecast looks good on the weather front, might get my first cut silage done this week!!! Might have a taster of the maize next weekend.

Seen smoke rising bang on straight last night, old time tale of settled weather on the way, i have my doubts about that myth

reilig

bob charles wrote: »

f


Seen smoke rising bang on straight last night, old time tale of settled weather on the way, i have my doubts about that myth

That's a theory around here too!

A dry week could mean that I will get cattle home across a river for housing that have been stuck there for the last 6 weeks.

Luckily they have fodder, but they are mucking a lot.

Black Smoke

reilig wrote: »

That's a theory around here too!

A dry week could mean that I will get cattle home across a river for housing that have been stuck there for the last 6 weeks.

Luckily they have fodder, but they are mucking a lot.

I put last of my cows in today. Probably on the sunniest warmest day since first week June in these parts. No choice. Meadows poached like I never saw before.

freedominacup

bob charles wrote: »

! Might have a taster of the maize next weekend.

When did yiu harvest it. Only one crop left in my locality and it's looking badly frost damaged at this stage.

pakalasa

Anyone ever have a beast that couln't bawl. I have a weanling heifer that can only bawl in a low pitch, inaudible way. You can barely hear her. Never seen it before.

mf240

pakalasa wrote: »

Anyone ever have a beast that couln't bawl. I have a weanling heifer that can only bawl in a low pitch, inaudible way. You can barely hear her. Never seen it before.

Have seen one go hoarse from roaring to get back to cow.
Is that what you mean or is she like that all the time?

pakalasa

She does sound like she is hoarse, but she is that way the whole time.

Charlie Charolais

Lads, what is the form number/name to change the sex of bullock on his card?

bob charles

Charlie Charolais wrote: »

Lads, what is the form number/name to change the sex of bullock on his card?

there was a big march for this in Dublin today, allow the bullock equal rights is the fairest thing. say nothing is the easiest form to fill;)

bob charles

pakalasa wrote: »

She does sound like she is hoarse, but she is that way the whole time.

I used to have a cat that couldnt meow

Bizzum

bob charles wrote: »

there was a big march for this in Dublin today, allow the bullock equal rights is the fairest thing. say nothing is the easiest form to fill;)

bob charles wrote: »

I used to have a cat that couldnt meow

Careful now Bob, you'll be sitting down to take a p1ss next:D

freedominacup

pakalasa wrote: »

Anyone ever have a beast that couln't bawl. I have a weanling heifer that can only bawl in a low pitch, inaudible way. You can barely hear her. Never seen it before.

Speaking of bawling. One of the neighbours was at Dungarvan mart last week and was speaking to a dept. inspector there. This inspector was walking down through the pens taking down the numbers of weanlings who were bawling excessively. I don't know the ins and outs of it but there's some sort of scheme for "approved" weanlings where they must be properly weaned and eating meal a certain period before sale. Is there some form of extra apyment for it? Anyway the inspector was taking numbers and the farmers where these cattle originated were going to get an inspection of some sort.

My neighbour was delighted to see this as he had spent the previous week gathering up stray weanlings that had spent the week bawling and breaking out into neighbouring farms. Two of these travelled across 3 farms before they stopped, all of them were supposed to have been managed in accordance with this scheme.

just do it

freedominacup wrote: »

Speaking of bawling. One of the neighbours was at Dungarvan mart last week and was speaking to a dept. inspector there. This inspector was walking down through the pens taking down the numbers of weanlings who were bawling excessively. I don't know the ins and outs of it but there's some sort of scheme for "approved" weanlings where they must be properly weaned and eating meal a certain period before sale. Is there some form of extra apyment for it? Anyway the inspector was taking numbers and the farmers where these cattle originated were going to get an inspection of some sort.

My neighbour was delighted to see this as he had spent the previous week gathering up stray weanlings that had spent the week bawling and breaking out into neighbouring farms. Two of these travelled across 3 farms before they stopped, all of them were supposed to have been managed in accordance with this scheme.

Suckler cow welfare scheme. tthhee key point of it is weanlings are properly weaned to prevent stress related sickness like pneumonia and behaviour like this

reilig

bob charles wrote: »

there was a big march for this in Dublin today, allow the bullock equal rights is the fairest thing. say nothing is the easiest form to fill;)

A bull trapped in a cow's body!

reilig

freedominacup wrote: »

Speaking of bawling. One of the neighbours was at Dungarvan mart last week and was speaking to a dept. inspector there. This inspector was walking down through the pens taking down the numbers of weanlings who were bawling excessively. I don't know the ins and outs of it but there's some sort of scheme for "approved" weanlings where they must be properly weaned and eating meal a certain period before sale. Is there some form of extra apyment for it? Anyway the inspector was taking numbers and the farmers where these cattle originated were going to get an inspection of some sort.

My neighbour was delighted to see this as he had spent the previous week gathering up stray weanlings that had spent the week bawling and breaking out into neighbouring farms. Two of these travelled across 3 farms before they stopped, all of them were supposed to have been managed in accordance with this scheme.

Bit late inspecting them when they are sold!!

leg wax

reilig wrote: »

Bit late inspecting them when they are sold!!

no its not if they are in the system and have animals at the mart bawling and take down tag numbers then next day take a visit to farm inspect mothers of weanlings they should be nice and happy,if not ,every cent they got over the years for this should be taken back.

farawaygrass

funny how every heifer on done deal would make ideal breeding stock or is show quality!

Manoffeeling

leg wax wrote: »

no its not if they are in the system and have animals at the mart bawling and take down tag numbers then next day take a visit to farm inspect mothers of weanlings they should be nice and happy, :(if not ,every cent they got over the years for this should be taken back. :rolleyes:

wesleysniper38

leg wax wrote: »

no its not if they are in the system and have animals at the mart bawling and take down tag numbers then next day take a visit to farm inspect mothers of weanlings they should be nice and happy,if not ,every cent they got over the years for this should be taken back.

I buy in 3 pens of weanling heifers this time of year and I can safely say that the SCWS is a total load of boll**ks. So far I've 22 bought in marts and only 4 of them acted like they were weaned in the days that followed me bringing them home. Yet the sellers board states otherwise at the mart.
As for the "show quality" stock on Donedeal....I've wasted a lot of time and fuel on some of those ads. The mart is the lesser of the two evils by comparison. Who said the camera never lies? He never saw some of the stock on Donedeal !

Bodacious

leg wax wrote: »

no its not if they are in the system and have animals at the mart bawling and take down tag numbers then next day take a visit to farm inspect mothers of weanlings they should be nice and happy,if not ,every cent they got over the years for this should be taken back.

Have to agree with you here ... I know lads that neither dehorn or creep feed yet alone wean for 2 weeks prior to sale and the E40 is almost an entitlement in their eyes

moy83

Bodacious wrote: »

Have to agree with you here ... I know lads that neither dehorn or creep feed yet alone wean for 2 weeks prior to sale and the E40 is almost an entitlement in their eyes

Thats a fact Bodacious , I was talking to a lad the other day that said he would never wean a calf until the morning of the sale because they never look aswell as when they are on the cow . I asked him was he in the SCWS and he said "thats for sure and dont we need every penny of it ":rolleyes:

reilig

We have never sold a calf that wasn't weaned during the time of the SCWS. Last year, a couple of days after I put it in on agfood that they were weined, we had an inspection from a dep of ag official. All was hunky dory with us but he had the same spiel about a lot of animals in the marts that were supposed to be weined but weren't. He said that once they leave the farm, they cannot go to that farm to inspect as a calf bawling in the mart is not enough evidence for them to prove that the calves weren't weined. He said that there was a legal judgement on it.

L driver

moy83 wrote: »

Thats a fact Bodacious , I was talking to a lad the other day that said he would never wean a calf until the morning of the sale because they never look aswell as when they are on the cow . I asked him was he in the SCWS and he said "thats for sure and dont we need every penny of it ":rolleyes:

All his scws money should be taken off him.

farawaygrass

Bodacious wrote: »

Have to agree with you here ... I know lads that neither dehorn or creep feed yet alone wean for 2 weeks prior to sale and the E40 is almost an entitlement in their eyes

the scws is the best thing the department could have brought into the country imo, if done right of course. put weanlings into slats sat, they were weaned out on fields according to guidelines, and there wasnt a pip outta them. other years they would roar the house down for 2-3 days. dont go to marts very often but must be terrible if just weaned that day. whatever about looking good straight off the cow, the stress in the mart environment can only set them back.

moy83

L driver wrote: »

All his scws money should be taken off him.

I fully agree with you , and I think if these people started feeding a bit of nuts to their calves they would be pleasantly surprised with the improvement in the animal when it comes to selling

Bodacious

moy83 wrote: »

Thats a fact Bodacious , I was talking to a lad the other day that said he would never wean a calf until the morning of the sale because they never look aswell as when they are on the cow . I asked him was he in the SCWS and he said "thats for sure and dont we need every penny of it ":rolleyes:

Scheme is a very good idea but very badly managed/followed up

Some boys gettin away with murder and other what I would call good farmers that have always dehorned , creep fed and weaned end up getting fed up over a slight paperwork mistake/ non payment and pulling out of it as a result

Charlie Charolais

bob charles wrote: »

there was a big march for this in Dublin today, allow the bullock equal rights is the fairest thing. say nothing is the easiest form to fill;)

I love them all equally, regardless of their orientation....
But the other girls are giving him/her some stick over her big balls?;)

moy83

Bodacious wrote: »

Scheme is a very good idea but very badly managed/followed up

Some boys gettin away with murder and other what I would call good farmers that have always dehorned , creep fed and weaned end up getting fed up over a slight paperwork mistake/ non payment and pulling out of it as a result

Unfortunately thats this country all over , the honest hard working person gets away with nothing while the chancer is rarely pulled up on anything

saranac1

moy83 wrote: »

Unfortunately thats this country all over , the honest hard working person gets away with nothing while the chancer is rarely pulled up on anything

I totally agree with you there moy83

vanderbadger

tanko wrote: »

I had calves of PAM last year, didnt think much of them to start with but they really filled out once they reached 6 months old. Have kept a couple of the heifers for cows. Never used CWI but he has a calving difficulty of 8%, dont forget to set the alarm clock!!

calf arrived this morning..bit of a pull alright not too bad, he seems lively anyway trying to get up

simx

vanderbadger wrote: »

calf arrived this morning..bit of a pull alright not too bad, he seems lively anyway trying to get up

had calves off PAM last year was impressed enough 2 heifers in calf to him this year,only 2 because they were the last straws ai man had,had another "easy" calving lim last year too turned out a disaster ai man said lot of lads got caught out with him,used mainly rhf this year on ch heifers and sh on couple of lm heifers just in hope of heifer calf was always told sh cows are meant to be great sucklers

simx

reilig wrote: »

We have never sold a calf that wasn't weaned during the time of the SCWS. Last year, a couple of days after I put it in on agfood that they were weined, we had an inspection from a dep of ag official. All was hunky dory with us but he had the same spiel about a lot of animals in the marts that were supposed to be weined but weren't. He said that once they leave the farm, they cannot go to that farm to inspect as a calf bawling in the mart is not enough evidence for them to prove that the calves weren't weined. He said that there was a legal judgement on it.

ill admit it we done it years ago straight off cow and on to mart but that was before scws,cows on to outfarm no listening to upset cows but alot of it was lack of space etc. all done according to book now

tanko

vanderbadger wrote: »

calf arrived this morning..bit of a pull alright not too bad, he seems lively anyway trying to get up

Thats good news.

just do it

vanderbadger wrote: »

calf arrived this morning..bit of a pull alright not too bad, he seems lively anyway trying to get up

Good stuff, it was a bull calf?

just do it

simx wrote: »

had calves off PAM last year was impressed enough 2 heifers in calf to him this year,only 2 because they were the last straws ai man had,had another "easy" calving lim last year too turned out a disaster ai man said lot of lads got caught out with him,used mainly rhf this year on ch heifers and sh on couple of lm heifers just in hope of heifer calf was always told sh cows are meant to be great sucklers

what shorthorn did you use?

vanderbadger

just do it wrote: »

Good stuff, it was a bull calf?

he is ya, not a bad calf i think, he was as stubborn as any char i ever had to get sucking but once he got going he had some appetite

simx

just do it wrote: »

what shorthorn did you use?

CZB

Richk2012

Has anyone bought any of the Maternal Test Straws through Gene Ireland for 5Eur ?????
Ordered 50 of them this morning .
The main Limousin Bull i wanted had sold out already though :rolleyes:

tanko

Richk2012 wrote: »

Has anyone bought any of the Maternal Test Straws through Gene Ireland for 5Eur ?????
Ordered 50 of them this morning .
The main Limousin Bull i wanted had sold out already though :rolleyes:

Havent ordered any myself, the straws are good value but who knows what the calving difficulty of these bulls will turn out to be. Suppose trying them on cows should be ok. Elite Flag is a bull that caught my eye. Can you tell us which bull you ordered the 50 straws off?

Richk2012

tanko wrote: »

Havent ordered any myself, the straws are good value but who knows what the calving difficulty of these bulls will turn out to be. Suppose trying them on cows should be ok. Elite Flag is a bull that caught my eye. Can you tell us which bull you ordered the 50 straws off?

20 Elite Flag Limousin

15 Elite Forever Limousin

10 Villablues Empire Belgian Blue

5 Goulding King Angus

Was looking for Brooklands Limousin but all his straws dispersed already

tanko

Good choices, hope they're lucky for you. EFZ looks to have milk and muscle in his breeding, hopefully he wont be too hard calved. WLZ has some serious breeding in him. I think he was bought for 30 thousand pounds.

Do icbf only weigh and linear score the calves of the Gene Ireland bulls or will they weigh and score all calves that a farmer has?

just do it

I got some a few as well:

• LM bull Elite Flag (EFZ) x12 straws
• CH bull BALLYLANNON FRANKEY (FYB) x10 straws

I wonder is a cheap gene ireland straw a false economy? Saving a fiver/straw and possibly ending up with an animal worth €100 less:(. I hope they're selecting them because they feel they will be good bulls!

I've a few due next Spring from the 2011 catalogue to the CH DZP and Simmental APZ. I missed out on the my first two choices from that catalogue so this year I ordered the day after the catalogue arrive ensure I got the ones I wanted;)