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Sony Laptop no longer working, out of warranty by 45 days

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    #32
    Elara: Kin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Elara: Kin


    ch750536 wrote: »
    Situation 2:
    Laptop sorted by manufacturer, new mobo added.

    Situation 2 - return to the retailer can't happen as this was not what they sold you, you have tampered with the item (in effect).

    That is incorrect.


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    #33
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Interesting, & I stand to be corrected.

    However, reversing the situation, are you saying you would expect a retailer to honour the SOGA when you have opened the unit & replaced parts?


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    #34
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Boggles wrote: »
    A consumer is entitled to take up a manufacturers guarantee or warranty, it does not replace a consumers legal rights.

    A warranty or guarantee is sold with the product, i.e. at the point of sale the retailer effectively gives permission for the consumer to deal directly with the manufacturer under warranty or guarantee.

    Your contract with the retailer remains.
    Your missing my point, see post below.


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    #35
    Elara: Kin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Elara: Kin


    ch750536 wrote: »
    However, reversing the situation, are you saying you would expect a retailer to honour the SOGA when you have opened the unit & replaced parts?

    No the retailer generally would not, but one is an unknown entity and the other a authorised repair centre assigned by the people that built the unit in the first place.


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    #36
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,228 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    ch750536 wrote: »
    Interesting, & I stand to be corrected.

    However, reversing the situation, are you saying you would expect a retailer to honour the SOGA when you have opened the unit & replaced parts?
    ch750536 wrote: »
    Your missing my point, see post below.

    I'm not missing your point at all.

    Your saying if I get an item repaired under manufacturers guarantee or warranty without been told to do so by the retailer, the original contract is null and void. Correct?

    This is 100% incorrect. A warranty or guarantee does not replace your statutory rights, it's actually written in bold print in most warranty T&Cs.

    As for your question about me opening up a product or tampering with it in some way, that's a completely separate issue.


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    #37
    miccy203
    Registered Users Posts: 64 ✭✭miccy203


    Hiya,

    I had the exact same prob with my sony vaio vgn-cs11s laptop... I bought it in jan 2009 and the fan went in it from over heating... The laptop broke in feb 2010 and I had the same issue that it was out of warranty in the end i just paid myself for the fan cause i didnt have the time to wait to go through the courts....

    But have a look at this report that was published in july 2010....


    http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/tech-news/sony-laptops-recalled-owing-to-overheating-issue_100389104.html


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    #38
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Boggles wrote: »
    I'm not missing your point at all.

    Your saying if I get an item repaired under manufacturers guarantee or warranty without been told to do so by the retailer, the original contract is null and void. Correct?

    This is 100% incorrect. A warranty or guarantee does not replace your statutory rights, it's actually written in bold print in most warranty T&Cs.

    As for your question about me opening up a product or tampering with it in some way, that's a completely separate issue.
    Sorry, you are getting wires crossed. I care nothing for warranty or guarantee, disregard them.
    My issue is that if you go through the retailer you have a fresh start on either the whole thing or the replacement parts (mobo). If you go direct to manufacturer there is no way the retailer will honour the fresh start as it is no longer anything to do with them, you would have no choice but to go to the manufacturer where SOGA does not apply, as they were not the retailer.


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    #39
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,228 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    ch750536 wrote: »
    Sorry, you are getting wires crossed. I care nothing for warranty or guarantee, disregard them.

    How can I disregard something that is central to the point? :confused:
    ch750536 wrote: »
    My issue is that if you go through the retailer you have a fresh start on either the whole thing or the replacement parts (mobo). If you go direct to manufacturer there is no way the retailer will honour the fresh start as it is no longer anything to do with them, you would have no choice but to go to the manufacturer where SOGA does not apply, as they were not the retailer.

    It's not really an issue.

    What's the difference between you going to the manufacturer and the retailer going to the manufacturer?

    In fact in reality you have more of right to deal with the manufacturer than the retailer does, as the guarantee legally applies to you.

    The manufacturer has expressly promised certain redress for a period of time under a written guarantee.

    Your consumer rights and entitlement to after care from the Retailer is completely separate to this. But legally you are entitled to exercise your rights with the manufacturer under the guarantee they offered you.

    When the period of the guarantee is up. The retailer still has a duty of care stemming from your original contract, it doesn't matter if the manufacturer replaced every part of the product.


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    #40
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Declan Carey wrote: »
    Rang laptopsDirect and they said that if I get an independent engineer to take a look at the laptop and they instruct that it was caused by a defect then "they will take a look at the laptop".

    Edit - Sony also not interested. They dismiss any EU directive that states it should work for 24 months.
    Currys and Smyths toys also tried this independant engineers report rubbish but were shot down! if a product develops a fault it is up to the retailer to get it sorted through repair replace or refund and it is up to them to have the unit assessed and if found to be customer damage then they can if they like try to charge the customer after the assessment.
    ch750536 wrote: »
    Situation 1:
    Laptop sorted by manufacturer at the retailers request, new mobo added.

    Situation 2:
    Laptop sorted by manufacturer, new mobo added.

    6 months later something is wrong with the laptop:
    Situation 1 - return to the retailer with the issue, no problem
    Situation 2 - return to the retailer can't happen as this was not what they sold you, you have tampered with the item (in effect).
    the manufacturer is an authorised repair agen and also any warrenty or guarantee provided by either shopor manufacturer can not dimish or supercede your statutory rights with the shopkeeper.


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    #41
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,228 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    ch750536 wrote: »
    Guarantee & Warranty have no value in the eyes of the law.

    Again this is wrong.


    9. (1) A guarantee shall be legally binding on the offerer under the conditions laid down in the guarantee statement and the associated advertising.
    ch750536 wrote: »
    Law states contract is with the retailer, it's they who have to resolve the issue.

    This is correct. One doesn't diminish or prejudice the other though.


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    #42
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Correct, as part of a contract it holds value however that part of the contract is worthless as SOGA trumps it.


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    #43
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,228 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    ch750536 wrote: »
    Correct, as part of a contract it holds value however that part of the contract is worthless as SOGA trumps it.

    Forgive me, that doesn't really make any sense, it holds value but it is worthless? :confused:

    You made 2 incorrect statements which are very misleading.
    ch750536 wrote: »
    Guarantee & Warranty have no value in the eyes of the law.
    ch750536 wrote: »
    2. If you deal with the manufacturer, you have just broken your contract with the retailer. Any future issues are nothing to do with them.

    Just to clarify that we are on the same page, you do now fully accept that both these statement were wrong?


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    #44
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Boggles wrote: »
    Forgive me, that doesn't really make any sense, it holds value but it is worthless? :confused:
    Worthless as in holds no value. You would be in exactly the same position in the eyes of the law whether you have a guarantee or not. SOGA applies regardless.
    Boggles wrote: »
    You made 2 incorrect statements which are very misleading.
    Just to clarify that we are on the same page, you do now fully accept that both these statement were wrong?
    I'm not persuaded on the point about work being carried out without the retailers remit and the retailer being liable for any future issues. Sounds wrong to me, would need to be part of a case where this has happened to appreciate it.


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    #45
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Thing is, a guarantee (in products not banking) is a relatively new thing. I believe the first one to be formalised was around 1940 in US. Until this point it was a case of 'it's broken, what are you going to do about it.'
    It was down to the 3 parties involved to come to an agreement on the way forward, within the law.
    The manufacturers introduced a guarantee under a guise of giving the consumer something when actually they were taking it away. Its all about %ages. Consider that by 1950 when the guarantee had expired only 50% sought replacement rater than 90%, the manufacturer and retailers had just generated themselves 40% more sales.
    We are so far down the line most people no longer seek replacement \ repair outside the guarantee, its probably about 90% that simply bin & buy another. A clever move on the part of manufacturers and retailers....
    So from my perspective, I never ever look at a guarantee or warranty unless it is something special. Things should last as long as I fell they should, if they dont then we have an issue to resolve. Most of the time, if you put in the effort, companies are happy to do anything for the 5% that get to the end of the process because actually there are 95% that don't.
    This is the reason I see it as worthless, the law comes first.


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    #46
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 40,228 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    ch750536 wrote: »
    Worthless as in holds no value. You would be in exactly the same position in the eyes of the law whether you have a guarantee or not. SOGA applies regardless.

    Again it is not worthless, you really need to stop saying it is. As has been pointed out to you it is a legally binding document that can offer you added protections and in no way shape of form prejudices your consumer rights and vice versa.

    Also SOGA can only protect you up to a point. If for instance a retailer goes out of business and your product develops afault, SOGA is pretty worthless to you. In fact the only real remit you have is through the manufactorer, still think a guarantee or warranty holds no value and is worthless?
    ch750536 wrote: »
    I'm not persuaded on the point about work being carried out without the retailers remit and the retailer being liable for any future issues. Sounds wrong to me, would need to be part of a case where this has happened to appreciate it.

    Your still not persuaded? :confused:

    Forgot my attempts of explaining it to you.

    A Rep from a major online retailer has told you what you are saying is incorrect.

    If that doesn't presuade you nothing I say will.


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    #47
    ch750536
    Registered Users Posts: 3,736 ✭✭✭ch750536


    Boggles wrote: »
    Again it is not worthless, you really need to stop saying it is. As has been pointed out to you it is a legally binding document that can offer you added protections and in no way shape of form prejudices your consumer rights and vice versa.

    Also SOGA can only protect you up to a point. If for instance a retailer goes out of business and your product develops afault, SOGA is pretty worthless to you. In fact the only real remit you have is through the manufactorer, still think a guarantee or warranty holds no value and is worthless?
    That isnt the OP's situation, but I take it on board.
    Boggles wrote: »
    Your still not persuaded? :confused:
    Forgot my attempts of explaining it to you.
    A Rep from a major online retailer has told you what you are saying is incorrect.
    If that doesn't presuade you nothing I say will.
    I'm often wrong in my professional capacity too, sometimes with things I was damn sure of, it happens. Again, appreciate your perspective on this but I am firmly in the 'I would have to see this to appreciate it' camp. You don't have to persuade me of anything, the purpose of this thread is to educate the OP with their issue, which we have done. Opposing views, yes, but then maybe that is the real world situation, maybe I'm just plain wrong. Either way, job done for the OP.


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    #48
    Tayla
    Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭Tayla


    Sorry to hear that you haven't had any luck with this OP, I posted a few days ago that my dryer broke after 13 months and I emailed power city and basically said I wasn't paying for any repairs as I was confident it must have been faulty, they said that they would fix it and Beko rang me today to book a day to come out.

    Don't give up though, they are just hoping you will accept what they have said without taking it any further!


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