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Organic food

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    #32
    El_Dangeroso
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 5,620 ✭✭✭El_Dangeroso


    jh79 wrote: »
    Pesticides have been tested for their impact on human health and are regulated by the EU. Risk assesments would have to be done on anything that enters the food chain. Testing is not very expensive and could be done in any IT or university lab. New testing methods are not needed for each pesticide, its the same five or six different instruments that are used for all chemical analysis. Pesticides have been in use for a long time now and as time goes bye are even safer and more effective making the organic vs non-organic argument less of an issue. Look at the study done in Denmark I posted the link for, how can you just ignore it?

    As with most "Green" types all science is evil until ye get sick

    This post is so full of fail I don't know where to start. How do they test the pesticides? Do they take once group of 1,000 people and feed them pesticide-covered vegetables all their life and 1,000 people organic vegetables and follow them for their entire lives and then measure the difference in overall health? No? Oh right, then tell me, how do they know there is no substantial impact on human health? Don't give me 'Oh well the EU said it was ok' appeal-to-authority rubbish. Show me the actual research.

    As for being a "Green" type. LOL. Studying for a masters in medical science at the moment, that's why I know what the evidence can and cannot assert. I'm not saying that non-organic food is automatically bad. I'm just saying we do not currently have the evidence to assert that pesticide residue has no impact on human health.
    Seaneh wrote: »
    Buying local and well procuded is far more important than buying organic.

    I totally agree with this. You can have eggs from chicken fed organic grain and nothing else, or you can have eggs from chickens that are allowed to rummage for food on pasture such as greens and bugs and then supplemented with some non-organic grain. The latter will have a far higher vitamin content that the former but will not have the magic organic label.


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    #33
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    El_Dangeroso wrote: »

    I totally agree with this. You can have eggs from chicken fed organic grain and nothing else, or you can have eggs from chickens that are allowed to rummage for food on pasture such as greens and bugs and then supplemented with some non-organic grain. The latter will have a far higher vitamin content that the former but will not have the magic organic label.


    exactly. The same would equally be true of the meat.


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    #34
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,968 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Pretty sure that Mr Beans in Eyre Square centre does organic stuff, too.


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    #35
    Seaneh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,300 ✭✭✭✭Seaneh


    JustMary wrote: »
    Pretty sure that Mr Beans in Eyre Square centre does organic stuff, too.
    He does. Sells a lot of stuff from the green earth organics farm too.


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    #36
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,273 ✭✭✭jh79


    El_Dangeroso wrote: »
    This post is so full of fail I don't know where to start. How do they test the pesticides? Do they take once group of 1,000 people and feed them pesticide-covered vegetables all their life and 1,000 people organic vegetables and follow them for their entire lives and then measure the difference in overall health? No? Oh right, then tell me, how do they know there is no substantial impact on human health? Don't give me 'Oh well the EU said it was ok' appeal-to-authority rubbish. Show me the actual research.

    As for being a "Green" type. LOL. Studying for a masters in medical science at the moment, that's why I know what the evidence can and cannot assert. I'm not saying that non-organic food is automatically bad. I'm just saying we do not currently have the evidence to assert that pesticide residue has no impact on human health.


    You should know better than anyone the amount of data thats needed for any chemical to be approved by the EU. C'mon the regulations are unreal in the EU and even more so for the FDA. All the pesticides used would have an LD50, partition coeffiecient etc determined in vitro with some tox done on animals (necessary evil) of course and EU would set a maximum residual level allowed. Pesticides have been used for 60 years or more (DTT) and do more god than bad. it depends what you consider "an impact on human health" .

    If there are only trace levels in veg then its not possible for them to have an impact on health. The processing and washing on the veg removes most of the pesticides leaving minor levels in the veg


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    #37
    inisboffin
    Registered Users Posts: 4,391 ✭✭✭inisboffin


    All the OP asked is where they could get organic veg in Galway...

    People going on about 'green hippies' or whatever, and how extremist they are. Ha ha.

    Now there's 3 pages of (mostly) off topic stuff judging their request..

    :rolleyes:


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    #38
    El_Dangeroso
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 5,620 ✭✭✭El_Dangeroso


    jh79 wrote: »
    You should know better than anyone the amount of data thats needed for any chemical to be approved by the EU. C'mon the regulations are unreal in the EU and even more so for the FDA. All the pesticides used would have an LD50, partition coeffiecient etc determined in vitro with some tox done on animals (necessary evil) of course and EU would set a maximum residual level allowed. Pesticides have been used for 60 years or more (DTT) and do more god than bad. it depends what you consider "an impact on human health" .

    If there are only trace levels in veg then its not possible for them to have an impact on health. The processing and washing on the veg removes most of the pesticides leaving minor levels in the veg

    I definitely do know what needs to be submitted to a competent authority in order to approve a chemical and it's transported in about 10 boxes of paper. Toxicology is tested from many angles, but only the angles and metabolic pathways we know about.

    As someone mentioned earlier the science of the endochrine disruptive effects of pesticides is very much in it's infancy, and we don't have any validated techniques of testing that. There are 'natural' toxins in plants that are in much higher quantities but we've had millenia to evolve and adapt to them.

    So it's a gamble. I'm perfectly willing to accept some pesticides don't affect us in any significant way, but some of those chemicals do make it into our bloodstream in significant quantities (Google the environmental chemicals found in umbilical cords in the US).

    I hedge my bets and go with local and organic where I can, sometimes the difference in price is pennies. I do eat non-organic food too and hope for the best.


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