Moneenageisha traffic lights V old roundabout?

KevR

Dunjohn wrote: »

Hmm, that one has five exits with only three at right angles. The layout would be mental. Bad idea, I think. It may be tough to navigate but it doesn't really block up badly, does it?

The Galway Shopping Centre entrance/exit will be closing when the upgrade occurs. There's a lot more space at the Shopping Centre junction than there is at Moneenageisha so the upgraded SC junction will be a lot more high-powered than Moneenageisha.

KevR

gilberto_eire wrote: »

Only one set of lights let's people continue to turn left(coming down the Dubin Road) when the traffic from that side is going.

The lights don't repeat this for any other side though, even when it's safe to do so

There's not enough space for dedicated left-turning lanes on the other sides.

Very surprised by peoples opinion here, the lights are a disaster imo and that appears to be the general consensus from people (in real life). Ive seen traffic backed up at 8 oclock on a sunday evening no way that would happen with the roundabout. Anytime I pass through the lights i'm cursing them and asking why they got rid of the roundabout.

The fact there is less traffic on the roads due to recessionary time is blinding people into thinking its down to the lights, if we still had the roundabout coupled with lower traffic volumes things would move much better.

gbee

Roundabouts are to facilitate the free movement of traffic, where they are effective they work great.

Traffic light are designed to collect traffic and release it into another holding area.

The problem with a signalised roundabout is it's just plain nuts. A roundabout is not a holding area, it's an intersection where cars change direction.

One seriously needs to make a decision, a roundabout is perfect for a lot of use. But if signals are deemed necessary then it must be taken away and the normal four road junction created as light work best at these and the rules are simple.

Roundabouts are complex and have their own set of rules which vary locally. Traffic lights have another set of rules that don't vary locally. It was a recipe for disaster and in Cork we have a very famous example in the magic roundabout, 12 car collisions a day every day and many more on bad days. We have a flyover now [which was part of the original design element] but the roundabout still attracts one or two collisions daily.

for roundabouts to work it's essential to have a free flow of traffic. If the volume of traffic overpowers the roundabout, it simply MUST be removed and the road realigned to a simple "cross of four roads".

celtictiger

There are two rush hours during the day which neither lights nor roundabout could cope with.....during regular traffic hours the roundabout kicked traffic light butt.

dloob

celtictiger wrote: »

It's great for pedestrians - even the invisible ones that are crossing when all the cars are at a standstill waiting for them to cross. I don't know what time of the day or night some of ye are visiting the Moneenageesha but nine times out of ten I'm twiddling my thumbs polluting the air around me waiting in traffic. The roundabout was a thing of beauty compared to the system in place now. Named, shamed and sacked I say again.

Umm there isn't any point in the lights cycle where all traffic is standing still.
It goes dublin road and both left turn lanes green.
Then it's college road and dublin road left turn lane green.
Then it's wellpark road green and finally moneenageisha rd.
Then back to the start again, the pedestrain lights work around the cycle.

wet-paint

The biggest problem with the roundabout was morons not knowing how to use it, and blocking it up.

KevR

Monroe Broad Oceanographer wrote: »

Very surprised by peoples opinion here, the lights are a disaster imo and that appears to be the general consensus from people (in real life). Ive seen traffic backed up at 8 oclock on a sunday evening no way that would happen with the roundabout. Anytime I pass through the lights i'm cursing them and asking why they got rid of the roundabout.

The fact there is less traffic on the roads due to recessionary time is blinding people into thinking its down to the lights, if we still had the roundabout coupled with lower traffic volumes things would move much better.

Have heard quite a few people saying that traffic levels are down but I have yet to see any real evidence. In fact, NRA traffic counters show that traffic levels have increased on many major routes, significantly on some. I can offer an explanation as to why it has increased during a recession but won't do it now as I'm posting from a mobile..

Mr Man

I've been using this junction a few times a week for a number of years. When they first put the lights in it was a disaster.

However, I think they have found a sequencing that now works far better than the roundabout ever did.

As a few people have said, once traffic gets to a certain volume (as it does a few times daily in Galway), roundabouts create more problems than they solve.

antoobrien

gbee wrote: »

for roundabouts to work it's essential to have a free flow of traffic.

This is the real problem with all the roundabouts in Galway - the traffic exiting the roundabouts often has nowhere to go. In this sepcific case, the Dublin road has several sets of lights and pedestrian junctions between Moneenagesha and Doughiska, which all stop traffic, causing knock on delays back to and beyond this junction. As several people have mentioned, we need the bypass to make any real difference.

Because I'm working in Dublin I don't tend to be riving around Galway a lot so I don't know first hand how this juction is handling traffic. However many people tell me that they avoid it like the plague, instead going in and out Bohermore instead.

swe_fi

I think it would have worked with just making the roundabout bigger. I always avoid this junction when I can.

And don't you dare touching the Magic roundabout. It is a landmark and keeps you on your toes, very refreshing. It promotes initiative, innovation and individualism (Will i do the classic "pheripheral-vision-only-3-lane-nonsignalled-tesco-entrance-crossing" today maybe???). It is also a great sense of achievement when you come unharmed and unbeeped out of it, when you really deserved at the very least a beep.

Galway traffic is weird but funny. It has come to a point where I have gotten so mean that I know my best routes for different times of day, but i will not share them even with my close friends because I am afraid that word would get out and then then they would get clogged up. They are MY routes :-)

gbee

wet-paint wrote: »

The biggest problem with the roundabout was morons not knowing how to use it, and blocking it up.

The problem with roundabouts is people being taught to use it one way, then lanes get added which necessitate breaking the rules to allow one to get to where they want.

At one major roundabout near me a councillor made the following comments about changing lanes after a total realignment of the roadway. "everybody just shift over one lane, Simple!"

This is the type of planning we have to put up with along with bus lanes too narrow for the busses, curves too severe for them to negotiate and bus stops where the bus can't fit into.

I guess those Dinky Toy Buses are not to scale afterall?

Robbo

TheCosmicFrog wrote: »

Is there any truth to the rumor that these lights have a self-learning algorithm in them? I remember hearing a rumor that the council splashed out on lights with artificial intelligence. Not AI in the Hollywood-sense, just a traffic flow coordination algorithm. Would make a lot of sense. Might also explain why the lights were such a disaster in the beginning and seemed to gradually improve over time.

Relax, no harm can come of this Skynet system they installed.

what_traffic

KevR wrote: »

Have heard quite a few people saying that traffic levels are down but I have yet to see any real evidence. In fact, NRA traffic counters show that traffic levels have increased on many major routes, significantly on some. I can offer an explanation as to why it has increased during a recession but won't do it now as I'm posting from a mobile..

Would be very interested hearing your explanation? Do you know if the NRA traffic counters were placed just on the "NRA roads" within the city?

what_traffic

Lights are a much better solution for pedestrians, the disabled, the elderly and cyclists. Multi lane roundabouts are a major barrier to all these road users.
Galway City Council have acknowledged this in their Smarter Travel Submission documents
http://www.galwaycity.ie/SmarterTravel/index.html

KevR

what_traffic wrote: »

Would be very interested hearing your explanation? Do you know if the NRA traffic counters were placed just on the "NRA roads" within the city?

Traffic counts for Galway City are difficult to come by. I meant to say traffic 'nationally'.

People used to have a car + they had commuter rail/bus tickets also. They used the train or bus to avoid traffic going to and from work, and difficulty in finding a parking space. The car was used for journeys like going to the supermarket, journeys at the weekend, bringing the kids from A to B...etc.

Along came the pay cuts and people needed to cut costs. People were paying to keep the car running and paying for commuter rail/bus tickets. They would need to keep the car going regardless for non-work journeys so they decided to get rid of the bus/train ticket (which was a luxury for some) and use the car for work journeys also.

That's my theory anyway. Traffic on many major routes all around the country has increased, I haven't seen any evidence of a decrease in traffic levels anyhow. Galway City Council carried out huge traffic counting exercises in 2009 and 2010 (can't remember if they did it every year previous to that) but they don't publish the figures - I asked them for some figures but got nowhere. None of the NRA's counters are in the city, East of Athenry on the M6 is the nearest to the city. They have counters West of Athenry and Oranmore but the figures aren't yet availaible.

KevR

KevR wrote: »

Traffic counts for Galway City are difficult to come by. I meant to say traffic 'nationally'.

People used to have a car + they had commuter rail/bus tickets also. They used the train or bus to avoid traffic going to and from work, and difficulty in finding a parking space. The car was used for journeys like going to the supermarket, journeys at the weekend, bringing the kids from A to B...etc.

Along came the pay cuts and people needed to cut costs. People were paying to keep the car running and paying for commuter rail/bus tickets. They would need to keep the car going regardless for non-work journeys so they decided to get rid of the bus/train ticket (which was a luxury for some) and use the car for work journeys also.

That's my theory anyway. Traffic on many major routes all around the country has increased, I haven't seen any evidence of a decrease in traffic levels anyhow. Galway City Council carried out huge traffic counting exercises in 2009 and 2010 (can't remember if they did it every year previous to that) but they don't publish the figures - I asked them for some figures but got nowhere. None of the NRA's counters are in the city, East of Athenry on the M6 is the nearest to the city. They have counters West of Athenry and Oranmore but the figures aren't yet availaible.

Id have to disagree, from my experience traffic volumes have decreased a lot. I remember regularly being at a standstill the headford side of regans in cloonboo going into college and now, although I don't personally drive the road everyday at the moment, people tell me they can leave later in in the mornings due to less traffic and times I have travelled in in the morning the traffic appeared much lighter.

Mrs OBumble

KevR wrote: »

Traffic counts for Galway City are difficult to come by.

Parked-car counts in the industrial estates are one indicator.

In Jul 2009, I started doing some temping in Galway Technology Park. The car park was noticeably more empty on Thurs/Fri, people told me it due to folks on three-day weeks.

In late 2008, the car-park at HP was getting a lot more empty than it had been, as people were getting laid off. I noticed the other day that it seems to have been filling up more.

Maybe people who've been working at the one place all through can comment better than that.

Webbs

KevR wrote: »

That's my theory anyway. Traffic on many major routes all around the country has increased, I haven't seen any evidence of a decrease in traffic levels anyhow. Galway City Council carried out huge traffic counting exercises in 2009 and 2010 (can't remember if they did it every year previous to that) but they don't publish the figures - I asked them for some figures but got nowhere. None of the NRA's counters are in the city, East of Athenry on the M6 is the nearest to the city. They have counters West of Athenry and Oranmore but the figures aren't yet availaible.

In the past 2 years the delays/size of tailbacks at junctions lights etc had been getting steadily less and less.
That effect seems to have levelled off in past few months, but overall the difference in car numbers is noticeable in my opinion

KevR

Maybe it's just long distance traffic that has increased so.. Although it would be very weird (IMO) for city traffic to decrease while inter-urban traffic is increasing.

KevR

JustMary wrote: »

Parked-car counts in the industrial estates are one indicator.

That would be an indicator but only to a limited degree because people aren't necessarily off the road if they lose their job.

what_traffic

KevR wrote: »

None of the NRA's counters are in the city, East of Athenry on the M6 is the nearest to the city. They have counters West of Athenry and Oranmore but the figures aren't yet availaible.

and

KevR wrote: »

That would be an indicator but only to a limited degree because people aren't necessarily off the road if they lose their job.

Are you just basing this theory on One Traffic Counter on the "NEW" M6? Would be of far more relevance to traffic count on the road infrastructure that has not changed in the last 10 years. I.E N17 or N59. Point made earlier by JustMary re Car parks is a good rough indicator on traffic flows in the city itself. For some data on this. Galway City Council made just over €4.1million (Projection for 2010 was €4.6) on car parking in the city in 2010; but they are now projecting to earn €3.9 in 2011.
See page 32 from the following document
http://www.galwaycity.ie/AllServices/Finance/AnnualBudget/151210_01.pdf
This is for on-street car parking and surface car parks like Millstreet and Hynes Yard. Ar far as I am aware the rates have not changed from 2010 to 2011? But I could be open to correction on this.

antoobrien

what_traffic wrote: »

Are you just basing this theory on One Traffic Counter on the "NEW" M6?

He might have a point, I haven't looked at the national figures but traffic us up on the M6 & old N6 (now R446). Have a read of this post, which has some basic comparisons between 2009 and 2010 (and where to get the data).

Webbs

what_traffic wrote: »

Lights are a much better solution for pedestrians, the disabled, the elderly and cyclists. Multi lane roundabouts are a major barrier to all these road users.
Galway City Council have acknowledged this in their Smarter Travel Submission documents
http://www.galwaycity.ie/SmarterTravel/index.html

Whilst agreeing with you totally, Galway Council also have a complete aversion to over or underpasses for pedestrians etc.

A good example is the dublin road from GMIT roundabout to the Moneen.. lights. There are 6 crossing points in just about 2km thats 1 crossing every 130 metres !!
Surely that is 1. a little excessive and 2. surely some of these should have been over/underpasses.

TellTalesIrl

Given that the length of time they are in, is the City Council going to report on the new system v's the roundabout system and share their perspective of how it is working?

what_traffic

Webbs wrote: »

Whilst agreeing with you totally, Galway Council also have a complete aversion to over or underpasses for pedestrians etc.

The space an overpass takes up would be one issue here and I am sure residents in Renmore on the Dublin road would not like it and the Underpasses are problematic for anti-social behaviour. The only underpass I know of in Galway City is at the Clayton hotel under the N6 and it always has broken glass in it the odd occasion I have used it. Once came across a burnt out car under the tunnel itself. Its cleaned the week before the races - but thats about it.

Also there are only 2 pedestrian only crossing lights on this corridor(the Dawn Daries one is in a strange location mind). i.e One for GMIT and the other for the National School in Renmore.

snubbleste

A Council representative was just on the wireless there and stated that the junction saw
1449 pedestrians on 24 May
301 cyclists on 24 May
and has an average of 14000 vehicles per day

Are there cameras there or something?

darraghking22

roundabout was way better...the lights were only introduced because of some stupid drivers being unable to use the roundabout and causing crashes or delays.

only people who cant use roundabouts think the light are better, with exception of pedestrians.it was near impossible to cross the road before the lights.

but that said, i think there is only a small amount of people in this town that are able to use roundabouts correctly.9 out of ten people havent a clue what they are doing at the terryland roundabout, and this ability is not tested effectively enough in the drivers licence test. this needs to change, especially in galway where there is so many roundabouts.

johnnyk66

darraghking22 wrote: »

9 out of ten people havent a clue what they are doing at the terryland roundabout, and this ability is not tested effectively enough in the drivers licence test. this needs to change, especially in galway where there is so many roundabouts.

Not for much longer from what i hear:eek:

barbs84

bring back the roundabout at moneen