The Official Cavan GAA Discussion thread.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

It would be hard to name a man of the match for either team.
The Cavan defence were good, some good blocks. The short hand-passing game is hard to watch at times i.e. 10 short passes and ending up going backwards in order to keep possession. The number of back passes was unbelievable. Oisin Minagh no. 4 was good I thought and Barkey no. 6. Conor Madden (22) won some great ball but did a lot of fumbling. Barry Reilly (11) was always available but his shooting in the first half was poor. He did score a few long-range frees in the 2nd half though.
Louth were 2 ahead with 12 mins remaining but Cavan reeled off 4 in a row.

How did Turloc Mooney do at full back? Hyland seems to be trying him there but it appears (from the Twitter feed) that he was taken off early in the second half so perhaps the experiment didn't work.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

How did Turloc Mooney do at full back? Hyland seems to be trying him there but it appears (from the Twitter feed) that he was taken off early in the second half so perhaps the experiment didn't work.

Didn't even notice him going off as i was in the clubhouse doing a wee job.
Louth had a big full forward, Eoin O'Connor, who was causing a lot of problems to the smaller Cavan backs but they doubled up on him.. It was probably a tactical change.

Lemlin

Cavan play Mayo in a challenge tomorrow in Mayo. Will be interesting to see how the lads fare against a team I'd see as one of the top 4, if not 3, in the country.

Lemlin

Cavan were leading Mayo 1-5 to 0-9 at half time but Mayo got a second goal at the start of the second half and its now 2-6 to 0-10.

Seems to be a decent game from what people are posting on Twitter.

Lemlin

Gone to pot second half. Mayo now have 5-12. Cavan 0-16.

Extremely poor to allow 5 goals, even in a challenge game.

Syferus

Cavan played a new 15 for the second half and were 0-10 to 1-5 up at HT. It'd be wrong to read much of anything into the FT score.

Lemlin

Syferus wrote: »

Cavan played a new 15 for the second half and were 0-10 to 1-5 up at HT. It'd be wrong to read much of anything into the FT score.

Thanks for that. Wasn't aware of it. I looked for the teams on Twitter but there was no mention of them anywhere.

Hammar

Teams with a few blanks

1st half
O Mara
McLoughlin
Dunne
Tighe
McEnroe
A Clarke
F Flanagan
D McKiernan
????????
M Reilly
J Brady
R Flanagan
Tierney
Dunne
?????

2nd Half
Millar
K Clarke
??????
??????
??????
Meehan
Podge
McCutcheon
D Reilly
Murray
B Reilly
M McKeever
N McDermott
Givney
Keating

Lemlin

Hammar wrote: »

Teams with a few blanks

1st half
O Mara
McLoughlin
Dunne
Tighe
McEnroe
A Clarke
F Flanagan
D McKiernan
????????
M Reilly
J Brady
R Flanagan
Tierney
Dunne
?????

2nd Half
Millar
K Clarke
??????
??????
??????
Meehan
Podge
McCutcheon
D Reilly
Murray
B Reilly
M McKeever
N McDermott
Givney
Keating

Seems like neither were the definitive starting 15 and both were a mash up of players you'd expect to start against Fermanagh.

To be honest that's what I'd expect at this stage. The team have been very secretive so far with only two challenge matches so nothing is given away.

Canavan does his homework so keeping him guessing is the way to go.

Lemlin

Start of a big week for Cavan GAA.

The juniors play Longford on Wednesday. Sadly, Ross Sheridan is out of the game and it appears that Chris Conroy, who scored 1-2 in the Louth game and was MOM in the Ulster U21 final this year, may also miss out.

For the seniors, the game is going to go ahead in Brewster and there'll be multiple checkpoints along the way. Most people I've spoken to are aiming to be in Enniskillen at least an hour before throw in.

It doesn't look like Mossie Corr will make it which is a pity. We could have done with his physical presence at midfield.

I think Hyland will stick to probably the same starting 15. There's only a kick of the ball between the two teams and I think home advantage has to make Fermanagh favourites.

My only changes would probably be Killian Clarke into midfield and Damien Reilly into the back line so basically switch those two, which is just a positional change, and then start Jack Brady ahead of McDermott in the only player change.

People are calling for Martin Reilly to start but he and his namesake Barry could be good impact subs to have. I also wouldn't mind seeing Mark McKeever start as I expect a physical game.

scoopmine

First of all with all the disruptions for fans I really this game should have been moved out of Brewster.

There has been very little talk of Fermanagh which worries me and even though few Cavan fans are expecting a easy game there is a sense we are better than Fermanagh.

We need a big game from midfield and more primary possession. I would start with the same 15 bar injuries as the lads deserve their chance. I expect to see Barry Reilly come on as the type of game should should him. Also Declan McKiernan should feature coming on as his style and strength will be a bonas with Corr not likely to play. A lot depends on Keating as our ball winner in the final third he has really become a top class player but needs to be more aware of what is around and maybe stop the Hollywood shots.

Half backs McEnroe,A Clarke, F Flanagan we could not have 3 better players ready for a dogfight. Also with Martin Reilly, Mckeever and the previous mentioned players I would be confident.

Read on another site that Miller and Mooney dropped of the panel? Could just be rumours and I hope so.

celt262

scoopmine wrote: »

First of all with all the disruptions for fans I really this game should have been moved out of Brewster.

There has been very little talk of Fermanagh which worries me and even though few Cavan fans are expecting a easy game there is a sense we are better than Fermanagh.

We need a big game from midfield and more primary possession. I would start with the same 15 bar injuries as the lads deserve their chance. I expect to see Barry Reilly come on as the type of game should should him. Also Declan McKiernan should feature coming on as his style and strength will be a bonas with Corr not likely to play. A lot depends on Keating as our ball winner in the final third he has really become a top class player but needs to be more aware of what is around and maybe stop the Hollywood shots.

Half backs McEnroe,A Clarke, F Flanagan we could not have 3 better players ready for a dogfight. Also with Martin Reilly, Mckeever and the previous mentioned players I would be confident.

Read on another site that Miller and Mooney dropped of the panel? Could just be rumours and I hope so.

Cormac Reilly is referee for this game i would not be happy with that. You say there is no talk of Fermanagh well there is less of Cavan. All that is coming out of the Fermanagh camp is the amount of "Injuries" they have.

scoopmine

I would not be listening to the injury talk Peter will have every trick in the book used.

Not happy with that ref. My memories of him are the u21 semi and an awful performance..

Lemlin

celt262 wrote: »

Cormac Reilly is referee for this game i would not be happy with that. You say there is no talk of Fermanagh well there is less of Cavan. All that is coming out of the Fermanagh camp is the amount of "Injuries" they have.

I really don't understand that. There are referees all over the country so why appoint one from a neighbouring county where there is a well known rivalry.

Reilly gave us nothing in the U21 semi last year and I wouldn't be surprised to see the same this Sunday. It's a joke of an appointment.

celt262

Lemlin wrote: »

I really don't understand that. There are referees all over the country so why appoint one from a neighbouring county where there is a well known rivalry.

Reilly gave us nothing in the U21 semi last year and I wouldn't be surprised to see the same this Sunday. It's a joke of an appointment.

Have we had him in a Senior game since then?

Lemlin

celt262 wrote: »

Have we had him in a Senior game since then?

Not that I can remember but then I generally only attend the home league games or those in counties fairly close.

celt262

I see G8 protests going on in London at the minute, Enniskillen could be mental come Sunday.

tayto lover

Lemlin wrote: »

I really don't understand that. There are referees all over the country so why appoint one from a neighbouring county where there is a well known rivalry.

Reilly gave us nothing in the U21 semi last year and I wouldn't be surprised to see the same this Sunday. It's a joke of an appointment.

Some of my Kingscourt friends are not happy at all that Cormac Reilly is refereeing this game. They feel he has it in for Cavan.
Anyone know if a county can object to a particular referee being appointed to their game?

Hope Cavan win this.

Lemlin

tayto lover wrote: »

Some of my Kingscourt friends are not happy at all that Cormac Reilly is refereeing this game. They feel he has it in for Cavan.
Anyone know if a county can object to a particular referee being appointed to their game?

Hope Cavan win this.

Most of the county of Meath has it in for Cavan! There's always been a big rivalry there. It just doesn't make sense.

Referees from bordering counties shouldn't be refereeing games.

Hammer Archer

Lemlin wrote: »

Most of the county of Meath has it in for Cavan! There's always been a big rivalry there. It just doesn't make sense.

Referees from bordering counties shouldn't be refereeing games.

I think that's a bit of an exaggeration. I've no doubt that there's a big rivalry between Cavan and people from, say, Oldacastle or Kells (I won't mention the stones) due to these places being close to the border.

But for most Meath fans further south and east, especially younger ones who wouldn't have witnessed Cavan at their peak, they wouldn't consider Cavan as rivals. For me, Dublin and Kildare would be the main rivals due to my proximity to both followed closely by Louth and then Westmeath. Those down towards Ballinabrackey would probably consider Offaly as rivals as well. As far as I know, Cormac is from the Donore area where Louth and Dublin would be the main two rivals I'd say. He may have been poor in the U21 semi final but I doubt it if it was because it was Cavan, especially seeing as ye were playing Cork.

And in a perfect world, referees from bordering counties wouldn't referee games. But in reality, this would put far too many constraints on appointing referees. For example, for Tipperary this would mean referees from nine counties (Tipp and the eight counties it borders) wouldn't be allowed referee their games, and that's without taking their opponents' bordering counties into account.

Lemlin

Hammer Archer wrote: »

I think that's a bit of an exaggeration. I've no doubt that there's a big rivalry between Cavan and people from, say, Oldacastle or Kells (I won't mention the stones) due to these places being close to the border.

But for most Meath fans further south and east, especially younger ones who wouldn't have witnessed Cavan at their peak, they wouldn't consider Cavan as rivals. For me, Dublin and Kildare would be the main rivals due to my proximity to both followed closely by Louth and then Westmeath. Those down towards Ballinabrackey would probably consider Offaly as rivals as well. As far as I know, Cormac is from the Donore area where Louth and Dublin would be the main two rivals I'd say. He may have been poor in the U21 semi final but I doubt it if it was because it was Cavan, especially seeing as ye were playing Cork.

And in a perfect world, referees from bordering counties wouldn't referee games. But in reality, this would put far too many constraints on appointing referees. For example, for Tipperary this would mean referees from nine counties (Tipp and the eight counties it borders) wouldn't be allowed referee their games, and that's without taking their opponents' bordering counties into account.

There's a huge rivalry in all the border areas. And, to be honest, I have plenty of friends from Dunboyne and Clonee who would speak of a big rivalry with Cavan, mainly due to the amount of people hailing from Cavan in those areas.

It was last year's U21 final that Reilly referreed against Roscommon. Not this year's against Cork. I believe the official count was 54 frees given to Roscommon and 16 to Cavan. Cavan aren't a dirty team so there was no need for it.

He also had a great view of a blatant pulling down of Jack Brady in the square and didn't even give a free, let alone a penalty. The local paper ran stills showing it.

I don't agree with your point re bordering counties and it being too tough to find a referee. Even if Tipp who border nine counties are playing, you've still 22 counties worth of refs to pick from. There'll surely be one available from a county not bordering either.

Tom Joad

Would agree with Hammer that the rivalry is overplayed on this one - no offence but he is a sh1te referee who just happens to be from Meath.

Re the game itself I think the G8 and the discussion around the venue have taken the spotlight and pressure of Terry and the lads which is a good thing - pity Corr is not ready as it would be good to have him back in midfield as I don't rate Damien O'Reilly and feel his temperament could leave us a man shy at a crucial point. Canavan will be playing the injuries card all week but its fooling no-one.

I seen that even Terry Hyland felt the need to comment today on arrangements for the game and the confusion around security.

Its a shame as the focus should be on the game especially as the two teams are evenly matched and Ulster is the only province that is competitive this season. But that's the dinosaurs that are the Ulster Council for you :rolleyes: - they make Peter Robinson seem like a amenable broad and open minded chap.

I for one will be watching the game from the comfort of my sitting room as I have no interest losing a day getting into a match especially with a young child and I know an awful lot of Cavan and Fermanagh people feel the same.

Lemlin

Starting 15 named:

1. Conor Gilsenan (Bailieborough Shamrocks)
2. Jason McLoughlin (Shannon Gaels)
3. Rory Dunne (Redhills)
4. Killian Clarke (Shercock)
5. James McEnroe (Ramor United)
6. Alan Clarke (Kingscourt) Captain
7. Ronan Flanagan (Castlerahan)
8. Damien O'Reilly (Belturbet)
9. David Givney (Mountnugent)
10. Cian Mackey (Castlerahan)
11. Jack Brady (Ramor United)
12. Feargal Flanagan (Butlersbridge)
13. Niall McDermott (Ballinagh)
14. Martin Dunne (Cavan Gaels)
15. Eugene Keating (Saint Sylvesters)

It's the 15 that were named to start against Armagh. Only change was Killian Brady in for Jack due to injury. Jack came on for last ten minutes.

Tom Joad

Lemlin wrote: »

Starting 15 named:

1. Conor Gilsenan (Bailieborough Shamrocks)
2. Jason McLoughlin (Shannon Gaels)
3. Rory Dunne (Redhills)
4. Killian Clarke (Shercock)
5. James McEnroe (Ramor United)
6. Alan Clarke (Kingscourt) Captain
7. Ronan Flanagan (Castlerahan)
8. Damien O'Reilly (Belturbet)
9. David Givney (Mountnugent)
10. Cian Mackey (Castlerahan)
11. Jack Brady (Ramor United)
12. Feargal Flanagan (Butlersbridge)
13. Niall McDermott (Ballinagh)
14. Martin Dunne (Cavan Gaels)
15. Eugene Keating (Saint Sylvesters)

It's the 15 that were named to start against Armagh. Only change was Killian Brady in for Jack due to injury. Jack came on for last ten minutes.

It was inevitable that the same 15 would be named and barring injuries I would expect that this is the team that will take the field. Will be interesting to see the Fermanagh team and to see if all them injuries have healed .

Lemlin

The closer the weekend gets the more worried I'm getting to be honest. Bookies have Cavan at 4/5, Fermanagh at 11/8 so we're favourites. Looking at the Pools thread most people expect us to win. The game this weekend just seems to have an air of the Louth Wexford game about it. Everyone expected Louth to win and they didn't.

Putting the poor referee and sending off after eight minutes to one side, Fermanagh were the better team in the League match back in March. I know the scoreboard showed they were two points better at the end but we never looked like winning that game and were lucky that their forwards were poor in the second half or it could have been a significant loss. Last year against us they were the better team for most of the game until a Gearoid McKiernan wondershow allowed us to score 3-2 or 3-3 in the space of ten minutes and win the match. Gearoid isn't there this year and Fermanagh won't be as naive again.

I'd expect Fermanagh to play the same way this Sunday as in the League game. They will literally pack out the backline and there'll be plenty of cynical fouling and niggling at players. There'll be very little or no room to move for our forwards. If you're a neutral, I wouldn't be expecting much of a game to watch. I think Jack Brady could be key. He's capable of a huge performance but he hasn't produced it in a senior jersey for Cavan yet.

The whole issue re the G8 is a farce as well. I know people who haven't missed a Cavan game in years that won't be attending because of the travel arrangements. There's talk of 4 to 5 checkpoints along the way and supporters have been told to allow at least an extra hour for travelling. When the game is on television, its put plenty of people off. Fair enough Fermanagh were due a home game so it should have been moved to a different weekend.

dxhound2005

Lemlin wrote: »

The closer the weekend gets the more worried I'm getting to be honest. Bookies have Cavan at 4/5, Fermanagh at 11/8 so we're favourites. Looking at the Pools thread most people expect us to win. The game this weekend just seems to have an air of the Louth Wexford game about it. Everyone expected Louth to win and they didn't.

Putting the poor referee and sending off after eight minutes to one side, Fermanagh were the better team in the League match back in March. I know the scoreboard showed they were two points better at the end but we never looked like winning that game and were lucky that their forwards were poor in the second half or it could have been a significant loss. Last year against us they were the better team for most of the game until a Gearoid McKiernan wondershow allowed us to score 3-2 or 3-3 in the space of ten minutes and win the match. Gearoid isn't there this year and Fermanagh won't be as naive again.

I'd expect Fermanagh to play the same way this Sunday as in the League game. They will literally pack out the backline and there'll be plenty of cynical fouling and niggling at players. There'll be very little or no room to move for our forwards. If you're a neutral, I wouldn't be expecting much of a game to watch. I think Jack Brady could be key. He's capable of a huge performance but he hasn't produced it in a senior jersey for Cavan yet.

The whole issue re the G8 is a farce as well. I know people who haven't missed a Cavan game in years that won't be attending because of the travel arrangements. There's talk of 4 to 5 checkpoints along the way and supporters have been told to allow at least an extra hour for travelling. When the game is on television, its put plenty of people off. Fair enough Fermanagh were due a home game so it should have been moved to a different weekend.

I agree that the game should have been postponed for a week. But now that it is going ahead I don't know why you would describe the arrangements as a farce. Maybe they will turn out to be in retrospect but asking people to allow an extra hour and to expect to walk for about 15 minutes seems reasonable enough to me in the circumtances.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/cavan-urge-fans-not-to-let-g8-stop-them-travelling-for-enniskillen-clash-29337973.html

http://ulster.gaa.ie/2013/06/fermanagh-v-cavan-event-ticketing-info/

Lemlin

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I agree that the game should have been postponed for a week. But now that it is going ahead I don't know why you would describe the arrangements as a farce. Maybe they will turn out to be in retrospect but asking people to allow an extra hour and to expect to walk for about 15 minutes seems reasonable enough to me in the circumtances.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/cavan-urge-fans-not-to-let-g8-stop-them-travelling-for-enniskillen-clash-29337973.html

http://ulster.gaa.ie/2013/06/fermanagh-v-cavan-event-ticketing-info/

I meant the situation is a farce in that the game should have been moved or alternative arrangements made. The G8 is lasting four or five days so the game could have happened on a different weekend.

The juniors lost 12 points to ten to Longford in Longford this evening. We made the Leinster final the last three years running so its a pity.

Tom Joad

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I agree that the game should have been postponed for a week. But now that it is going ahead I don't know why you would describe the arrangements as a farce. Maybe they will turn out to be in retrospect but asking people to allow an extra hour and to expect to walk for about 15 minutes seems reasonable enough to me in the circumtances.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/cavan-urge-fans-not-to-let-g8-stop-them-travelling-for-enniskillen-clash-29337973.html

http://ulster.gaa.ie/2013/06/fermanagh-v-cavan-event-ticketing-info/

I think farce is quite a mild word to describe this. I will be shot down for this but am going to nail my colours to the mast here.

1. Fermanagh are blameless in this matter - they were quite willing to change weekends and even were willing to concede home advantage on the game. This had been discussed prior to the Cavan Armagh game.

2. The Ulster Council have refused to be budged on this and they are notoriously stubborn on issues such as this. Flexibility is not part of their lexicon.

3. The game is in the six counties where you don't exactly have a police force sympathetic to the GAA which adds to the issue and to be quite frank on this you can't really blame them - they need this game like a hole in the head - its quite a risk hosting the G8 in the North and they don't need this added workload - another masterful PR exercise by the GAA. :rolleyes:

4. Brewster is not the best located ground on the best of days - its always a bit of a walk on the best of days - a lot of Fermanagh support and the majority of Cavan support will be funnelled in the one route and as a concession they will open the gates at 10;45 am with nothing happened till throw in at 2 pm - gee thanks lads and you want 25 lids for an uncovered stand for the privilege..:eek::eek: Anyone that thinks an extra hour will cover this is simply deluded - this is going to be a clusterfúck of the highest order will huge tailbacks and people abandoning cars everwhere. Already I have heard of disruptions around Enniskillen from people only going up to do the shopping and its only Wednesday and security is only ramping up.

5. I for one won't be going and I know a lot of good Cavan and Fermanagh GAA people that feel the same way and I wouldn't be surprised if this game is abandoned or forced to be called off by a power greater than the GAA but I wonder is this what the Ulster Council want.

Rant over!!

Lemlin

Talking to a few Fermanagh folk today and they reckon the game going ahead is madness. Apparently Enniskillen is basically going to be a closed town at the weekend. All the shops are closing etc.

There's talk of about 15,000 protestors turning up as around that number generally turns up but the locals are expecting around 4,000 to 5,000 as Enniskillen isn't near the size of the cities the G8 would normally occur in.

To have the game going ahead there in that sort of environment is madness. Anyway, let the Ulster council press ahead.

Have to say I'm disappointed about the juniors. I didn't expect them to perform as well this year as they've lost players like Martin Reilly, Martin Dunne, Joshua Hayes, Declan McKiernan and Killian Brady but I was still hopeful they'd make the final.

It's a great competition and I can't understand why Ulster don't start a junior championship. It's certainly helped younger Cavan players make the transition from U21 to senior.

keane2097

Lemlin wrote: »

The closer the weekend gets the more worried I'm getting to be honest. Bookies have Cavan at 4/5, Fermanagh at 11/8 so we're favourites. Looking at the Pools thread most people expect us to win. The game this weekend just seems to have an air of the Louth Wexford game about it. Everyone expected Louth to win and they didn't.

Putting the poor referee and sending off after eight minutes to one side, Fermanagh were the better team in the League match back in March. I know the scoreboard showed they were two points better at the end but we never looked like winning that game and were lucky that their forwards were poor in the second half or it could have been a significant loss. Last year against us they were the better team for most of the game until a Gearoid McKiernan wondershow allowed us to score 3-2 or 3-3 in the space of ten minutes and win the match. Gearoid isn't there this year and Fermanagh won't be as naive again.

I'd expect Fermanagh to play the same way this Sunday as in the League game. They will literally pack out the backline and there'll be plenty of cynical fouling and niggling at players. There'll be very little or no room to move for our forwards. If you're a neutral, I wouldn't be expecting much of a game to watch. I think Jack Brady could be key. He's capable of a huge performance but he hasn't produced it in a senior jersey for Cavan yet.

Yeah the overreaction to the Armagh game has been lol from bookies and fans alike. Fermanagh were 7/4 for this at one stage which is an absolutely outrageous price for the home team in a game between two teams there's very little to suggest are operating on different levels.

Considering the vast gulf between the tactics Armagh employed last time out and those Fermanagh are likely to employ at the weekend the Armagh game is for all intents and purposes irrelevant. This should be a very close fought game, if you're a betting man there's no doubt Fermanagh are the value at the prices available.

Tom Joad

Lemlin wrote: »

Talking to a few Fermanagh folk today and they reckon the game going ahead is madness. Apparently Enniskillen is basically going to be a closed town at the weekend. All the shops are closing etc.

There's talk of about 15,000 protestors turning up as around that number generally turns up but the locals are expecting around 4,000 to 5,000 as Enniskillen isn't near the size of the cities the G8 would normally occur in.

To have the game going ahead there in that sort of environment is madness. Anyway, let the Ulster council press ahead.

Have to say I'm disappointed about the juniors. I didn't expect them to perform as well this year as they've lost players like Martin Reilly, Martin Dunne, Joshua Hayes, Declan McKiernan and Killian Brady but I was still hopeful they'd make the final.

It's a great competition and I can't understand why Ulster don't start a junior championship. It's certainly helped younger Cavan players make the transition from U21 to senior.

would agree with everything you said there Lemlin.

correct me if I am wrong but I thought there was talk of Leinster also scrapping the junior championship recently!

cavan4sam

looking forward to the game on sunday nervously optimistic of cavans chances

we really need a big game from givney in midfield

i wont make due to work commitments but will be watching closely

Best of luck to all involved , Lets hope we get a rattle at the noisy neighbours its been a while!!!!!

Lemlin

The closer this game gets, the more worried I'm getting to be honest. Fermanagh have named a very strong team with Barry Owens full back. I'd expect him to pick up Keating. As much as I admire Terry Hyland, Canavan is a better tactician and Fermanagh have a more experienced team and are at home. I didn't hear it myself but Kevin McStay tipped Fermanagh this morning on RTE and I'd have to agree with him.

This will be a totally different game to the Armagh one. Having spoken to people I know who attended the junior game on Wednesday evening, they were very worried about the lack of a plan B for Cavan. The blanket defence and breaking from our own backline wasn't working but the sideline seemed reluctant to change it. This is a criticism that was often levelled at Val and Terry in the past - that our system works well at times but, when it doesn't, we're too slow to make changes and have no alternative.

For me, ever since our first McKenna Cup game this year, we've been too slow to turn defence into attack. We have a blanket defence but the players don't get forward quickly enough. Fermanagh are going to drop bodies back and, when the two teams played a similar system in the league match, they were the better team at securing scores. I'm just hoping the key difference is that we were a man down in that match due to the sending off and won't be this time round (fingers crossed everyone keeps their heads - on our side of it anyway!).

celt262

Lemlin wrote: »

The closer this game gets, the more worried I'm getting to be honest. Fermanagh have named a very strong team with Barry Owens full back. I'd expect him to pick up Keating. As much as I admire Terry Hyland, Canavan is a better tactician and Fermanagh have a more experienced team and are at home.

Keating will get the better of Owens.


On what basic do you think Canavan is a better tactician ?

Tom Joad

I can understand where you are coming from Lemlin but this was never going to be anything other than a tight game between two evenly matched teams - yes Fermanagh have named a strong team but Owens has lost a lot of pace and would still fancy Keating to give him a tough time. Quigley at 14 will be a handful but the lads did handle Jamie Clarke well and will be well alerted to the size of the task against Quigley. McCluskey is the danger man for me as if he is given the time and space he cann run the game.

Of course it will be different to the Armagh game and will be a tight dour game.

One thing I would disagree with you on is this myth that Canavan is a better tactician - I've heard this been thrown out there this week but what's it based on - he took charge of a Division four team who won promotion but hardly beat the cream of the crop in Division four (and were never a division 4 team tbh). What did they do in the championship last year with Canavan in charge - well beaten by Down and blitzed by Cavan when they should have put us away.

Hyland has to be frank achieved a hell of a lot more as a manager but probably will never get that credit nationally because he's not a media darling. Seriously expected Matt Cooper to have an orgasm on air some night from chuckling along to Canavan's pearls and witty repartee:rolleyes:. - I should probably stop now

I agree that we can be slow to have a back-up plan but key for me on Sunday is Cavan keeping 15 on the field for as long as possible and showing discipline - it will be tight and not for the faint hearted but I believe we will put this off..

celt262

Good to see you agree with me Tom.

Come on Cavan

Lemlin

celt262 wrote: »

Keating will get the better of Owens.


On what basic do you think Canavan is a better tactician ?

Basing it on the two games with both men as managers: last year's qualifiers and this year's league game.

Last year Fermanagh were on top for most of the game but for our ten minute blitz which, for me, was as much about them switching off as us pulling ourselves back into it. Alot of it was also down to an outstanding display by Gearoid McKiernan who grabbed the game by the scruff of the neck.

In the league game earlier this year, we struggled badly. I posted here at half time about how there wasn't a hope of us winning. Yes, we were without a man for most of the game but, again, Canavan got his tactics right when Reilly was obviously targeted. He also had plenty of homework done on the Cavan team - Mackey not being able to move 5 foot without being fouled, Dunne being double marked, Keating barely being let onto the pitch!

For me, Canavan was the better tactician on the night as he seemed to have alot more homework done and knew alot more about the Cavan team and what made us tick.

eamonpk

Tom Joad wrote: »

I can understand where you are coming from Lemlin but this was never going to be anything other than a tight game between two evenly matched teams - yes Fermanagh have named a strong team but Owens has lost a lot of pace and would still fancy Keating to give him a tough time. Quigley at 14 will be a handful but the lads did handle Jamie Clarke well and will be well alerted to the size of the task against Quigley. McCluskey is the danger man for me as if he is given the time and space he cann run the game.

Of course it will be different to the Armagh game and will be a tight dour game.

One thing I would disagree with you on is this myth that Canavan is a better tactician - I've heard this been thrown out there this week but what's it based on - he took charge of a Division four team who won promotion but hardly beat the cream of the crop in Division four (and were never a division 4 team tbh). What did they do in the championship last year with Canavan in charge - well beaten by Down and blitzed by Cavan when they should have put us away.

Hyland has to be frank achieved a hell of a lot more as a manager but probably will never get that credit nationally because he's not a media darling. Seriously expected Matt Cooper to have an orgasm on air some night from chuckling along to Canavan's pearls and witty repartee:rolleyes:. - I should probably stop now

I agree that we can be slow to have a back-up plan but key for me on Sunday is Cavan keeping 15 on the field for as long as possible and showing discipline - it will be tight and not for the faint hearted but I believe we will put this off..

I won't say that Canavan is a master tactician but it must be remembered that he got the Fermanagh job as the NFL was about to start so had very little time to put his stamp on it. Yes the Cavan match was disappointing to be cruising 5 points ahead and hit with 3 goals. But the Down match was over when Keenan got sent off before the first score - it was a bit unjust to be sent off for striking when the guy that hit him got nothing.

I think this season has shown more what Canavan can do - Meath were very lucky to beat them in the last game to deny promotion.

celt262

In the game last year the Cavan lads had dropped the heads and were just going through the motions and showing no fight bar 10 minutes at the start until the first goal. Whether the reason for that is that their manager is tactically better is debatable. I though that the introduction of Declan Mckiernan to midfield and the moving of Niall McDermott out around the middle and his willingness to win breaking ball had a big effect in the comeback. I don't think that the tactical genius Canavan had an answer to those switces made by Hyland.

This year in the league obv been a man down led to it been easier for them to double mark and get players around our danger men. As for targeting O'Reilly i don't think he was delibertly targeted as that Shane McCabe would wind you up if you passed him on the street.

Tom Joad

eamonpk wrote: »

I won't say that Canavan is a master tactician but it must be remembered that he got the Fermanagh job as the NFL was about to start so had very little time to put his stamp on it. Yes the Cavan match was disappointing to be cruising 5 points ahead and hit with 3 goals. But the Down match was over when Keenan got sent off before the first score - it was a bit unjust to be sent off for striking when the guy that hit him got nothing.

I think this season has shown more what Canavan can do - Meath were very lucky to beat them in the last game to deny promotion.

They still got promoted in the league though so not sure what your point is

This is a game all about results and in 2012 in the Championship they played two and lost two and haven't played this yeah and yet the media darling Canavan gets lauded by the media as a great tactician.

Terry Hyland has brought underage success to Cavan from nothing. He got Cavan a victory over Fermanagh in the qualifiers and this season we have beaten Meath, Monaghan and Armagh.

Canavan may well turn out to be one of the great managers but so far has done absolutely nothing so to be putting him up as some kind of master tactician (the media not you obviously) is typical of some elements of the media - Today FM were at it again this evening all lauding Peter the Great manager. In the same piece our danger man is some lad called Keenan - can't wait to see him cause he must be a late transfer in.

Tom Joad

Lemlin wrote: »

Basing it on the two games with both men as managers: last year's qualifiers and this year's league game.

Last year Fermanagh were on top for most of the game but for our ten minute blitz which, for me, was as much about them switching off as us pulling ourselves back into it. Alot of it was also down to an outstanding display by Gearoid McKiernan who grabbed the game by the scruff of the neck.

In the league game earlier this year, we struggled badly. I posted here at half time about how there wasn't a hope of us winning. Yes, we were without a man for most of the game but, again, Canavan got his tactics right when Reilly was obviously targeted. He also had plenty of homework done on the Cavan team - Mackey not being able to move 5 foot without being fouled, Dunne being double marked, Keating barely being let onto the pitch!

For me, Canavan was the better tactician on the night as he seemed to have alot more homework done and knew alot more about the Cavan team and what made us tick.

Re last year Celt262 put it well.

The league this year - obviously we'll never know but Damien O'Reilly getting sent off changed the whole landscape of that game as Cavan played for 60 minutes with 14 men.

Mackey was injured going into the league game and visibly ran out of steam, they had a spare man to double up on Dunne and Keating had the jersey ripped off him in the first ten seconds off him being on the pitch - he did still cause them trouble.

No-one of the above was about better tactics in my view

Lemlin

I wasn't aware of any media lauding of Canavan tbh. I'm basing my assertion of his tactics on the League performance in March.

He had Cavan down to a tee. For example, Dunne had only played well in one league game against Antrim and the McKenna Cup game against Armagh yet Canavan knew he was the man to watch and had two men on him from the start.

We were struggling in the first half yet Terry didn't change anything. It was clear changes to tactics had to be made but he didn't seem to have a plan B.

Now I rate Terry highly and have always said that but Canavan outwitted him that evening.

eamonpk

Tom Joad wrote: »

They still got promoted in the league though so not sure what your point is

This is a game all about results and in 2012 in the Championship they played two and lost two and haven't played this yeah and yet the media darling Canavan gets lauded by the media as a great tactician.

Terry Hyland has brought underage success to Cavan from nothing. He got Cavan a victory over Fermanagh in the qualifiers and this season we have beaten Meath, Monaghan and Armagh.

Canavan may well turn out to be one of the great managers but so far has done absolutely nothing so to be putting him up as some kind of master tactician (the media not you obviously) is typical of some elements of the media - Today FM were at it again this evening all lauding Peter the Great manager. In the same piece our danger man is some lad called Keenan - can't wait to see him cause he must be a late transfer in.

They weren't promoted - they came 3rd

If you are referring to the promotion in NFL that finished 15 months ago and then to say its a results business and they achieved nothing in 2012 seem to contradict each other - Anyway I don't think either will have much relevance on this summer for Fermanagh

The point I made that you didn't get - someone dismissed him as tactician/manager - There is no basis for that point. He hasn't proved himself as a great manager but he is doing OK so far.

Terry Hyland has proven himself at U21 defo - but similarly not enough evidence to prove how great he is or not at senior level.

Does anyone really believe the media who go over the top with many things in GAA - most of the journalism in GAA media is lazy and like easy sound bites - Peter the Great and all that stuff is ignored n
by anyone with half a brain.

celt262

eamonpk wrote: »

The point I made that you didn't get - someone dismissed him as tactician/manager - There is no basis for that point. He hasn't proved himself as a great manager but he is doing OK so far.

I don't think anyone said that.

tayto lover

Well done Cavan and despite Spillane's spite I enjoyed the game.
Hope they hammer Monaghan.

Tom Joad

Fantastic result today - made hard work off it but the hunger and honesty in the Cavan defending was unbelievable - they really frustrated Fermanagh. Toasty, Mackey, and Dunnie in particular were magnificent - was impressive for the first time with Damien O'Reilly and he kept his discipline well today.

We will have to raise our game again if we are to get over Monaghan but once again this team have come out the right side off a tight result and you can see the belief that they have - could have panicked when Fermanagh got level but stuck with it.

One thing that shocked me today being one of the few times I have seen a Cavan game live on TV is how bad and 2nd rate RTE coverage is compared to the BBC. Spillane and O'Rourke are still trotting out the same crap about Ulster football and it's really tired at this stage. Compare that to the BBC who analysed the game and were actually informed and knew a bit about both teams. From what I could see Spillane and O'Rourke spent less than a minute analysing the game at half time but spent their time making sweeping generalising about the state of football - keep that for your well paid columns in the paper lads and actually analyse the game being played.

But good thing is that Cavan will again go under the radar and Monaghan will be hot favourites for Semis.

Fireball07

I thought both your corner-backs were excellent, and Flanagan. The number 24 O'Reilly was very good aswell, as were Keating and McDermott.

Dunne was double-marked, didn't make a huge impact in the first half but grew into the game and his last score was spectacularly good, he's great off both feet.

Mackey was the standout though, outstanding player. All-round you seemed the better team though, should have won by more to be quite honest. Fermanagh were very close to pulling in front at one stage, and if they had, I think they'd have held on....but you just managed to halt the momentum in time.

MANUTD99

Fair play to Cavan. Really should of made the game far easier than what it was at the end.

RTE anaylsts only seem interested in hyping up Dublin, Cork, Kerry, Mayo, Donegal, Tyrone. Any other game in the Championship is worthless ****e in their opinion

Enjoyable game as a neutral. ( Dublin fan btw)

Lemlin

Fantastic result today. Glad to say I was wrong about Canavan vs Hyland.

The RTE analysis was annoying. Part of the reason Fermanagh didn't score for 25 minutes was because Cavan were so good at the back yet that was largely ignored.

Dunne and Keating were super again. I know people will say Dunne didn't have a good first half but, if nothing else, he tied up two of their men. In the second half when they had to push on, he got the space he needed and took advantage.

We'll go into the game against Monaghan as underdogs and that'll suit us down to the ground. Really looking forward to it now.

12 years of not winning two games in Ulster is over now, we've nothing to lose against Monaghan and hopefully can push on.

dxhound2005

Tom Joad wrote: »

I think farce is quite a mild word to describe this. I will be shot down for this but am going to nail my colours to the mast here.

1. Fermanagh are blameless in this matter - they were quite willing to change weekends and even were willing to concede home advantage on the game. This had been discussed prior to the Cavan Armagh game.

2. The Ulster Council have refused to be budged on this and they are notoriously stubborn on issues such as this. Flexibility is not part of their lexicon.

3. The game is in the six counties where you don't exactly have a police force sympathetic to the GAA which adds to the issue and to be quite frank on this you can't really blame them - they need this game like a hole in the head - its quite a risk hosting the G8 in the North and they don't need this added workload - another masterful PR exercise by the GAA. :rolleyes:

4. Brewster is not the best located ground on the best of days - its always a bit of a walk on the best of days - a lot of Fermanagh support and the majority of Cavan support will be funnelled in the one route and as a concession they will open the gates at 10;45 am with nothing happened till throw in at 2 pm - gee thanks lads and you want 25 lids for an uncovered stand for the privilege..:eek::eek: Anyone that thinks an extra hour will cover this is simply deluded - this is going to be a clusterfúck of the highest order will huge tailbacks and people abandoning cars everwhere. Already I have heard of disruptions around Enniskillen from people only going up to do the shopping and its only Wednesday and security is only ramping up.

5. I for one won't be going and I know a lot of good Cavan and Fermanagh GAA people that feel the same way and I wouldn't be surprised if this game is abandoned or forced to be called off by a power greater than the GAA but I wonder is this what the Ulster Council want.

Rant over!!

Lemlin wrote: »

Talking to a few Fermanagh folk today and they reckon the game going ahead is madness. Apparently Enniskillen is basically going to be a closed town at the weekend. All the shops are closing etc.

There's talk of about 15,000 protestors turning up as around that number generally turns up but the locals are expecting around 4,000 to 5,000 as Enniskillen isn't near the size of the cities the G8 would normally occur in.

To have the game going ahead there in that sort of environment is madness. Anyway, let the Ulster council press ahead.

Have to say I'm disappointed about the juniors. I didn't expect them to perform as well this year as they've lost players like Martin Reilly, Martin Dunne, Joshua Hayes, Declan McKiernan and Killian Brady but I was still hopeful they'd make the final.

It's a great competition and I can't understand why Ulster don't start a junior championship. It's certainly helped younger Cavan players make the transition from U21 to senior.

I left Dundalk at 11 oclock and was at the pitch, where I had a parking pass, shortly after 12.30. Three policemen at the roundabout in the middle of Lisnaskea and just a few police vehicles in traffic from Maguiresbridge into Enniskillen is all I saw. Nobody directing traffic in the town. No sign of any protestors.

Timed my passage from the pitch to the Belfast road after the match 35 minutes. I was surprised that there were no police at the junctions directing traffic, this would have speeded things up significantly. Maybe the GAA didn't want them involved.

Anyway the whole thing went off without a hitch from my point of view and the ones that stayed away needn't have done so. And Cavan won so it was all good.