The Official Cavan GAA Discussion thread.

Tom Joad

Prop Joe wrote: »

Read in Oísin McConville's article today that Cavan have 2 league's - 1 with county players and one without - How does this work?

It doesn't to be honest. Like a lot of ideas the intentions were good. Idea was that their would be football for non county players when otherwise there would be none. It developed into a farce though with games being forfeited for no apparent reason - apparently one team gave a walkover in the Breffni League and went to Dublin to play a challenge match.

But it's not as good as spending a fortune on a report on the state of club football in the county (which is shockingly bad) which reported that there were too many senior clubs in the county (14). County board accepted the report, voted to implement it - after the clubs got a hold of it guess how many senior clubs we have - 17!! Only in Cavan

And now some of our top players are leaving the county to play football in Dublin - it's no wonder why.

Hammar

Tom Joad wrote: »

It doesn't to be honest. Like a lot of ideas the intentions were good. Idea was that their would be football for non county players when otherwise there would be none. It developed into a farce though with games being forfeited for no apparent reason - apparently one team gave a walkover in the Breffni League and went to Dublin to play a challenge match.

But it's not as good as spending a fortune on a report on the state of club football in the county (which is shockingly bad) which reported that there were too many senior clubs in the county (14). County board accepted the report, voted to implement it - after the clubs got a hold of it guess how many senior clubs we have - 17!! Only in Cavan

And now some of our top players are leaving the county to play football in Dublin - it's no wonder why.

To be honest,there are too many clubs in the county in the first place.
We have 40 clubs for 72,000 people,Donegal have 39 football clubs and a population of 135,000 people.
I don't know what you can do about it though,you can't just order clubs to amalgamate.

Hammar

celt262 wrote: »

Anyone know when club championships are starting?

Senior Preliminary
Friday 25th
Cavan Gaels/Gowna
Sat 26th
K'shandra/K'garry
Sun 27th
C'rahan/Kingscourt


Intermediate Preminary
26th
Swanlinbar/B'bridge
27th
Cootehill/Cavan Gaels B

All in Breffni AFAIK

Tom Joad

Hammar wrote: »

To be honest,there are too many clubs in the county in the first place.
We have 40 clubs for 72,000 people,Donegal have 39 football clubs and a population of 135,000 people.
I don't know what you can do about it though,you can't just order clubs to amalgamate.

True but in Cavan it's particularly bad - only Leitrim and Laois have more senior clubs per head of population than Cavan (that was when their was 14 btw). Given our clubs performances in Ulster something needs to give in my view. I think this is the big limiting factor for Cavan GAA.

Clubs can still keep their identity and play at their level but amalgamate to play in the senior championship.

Hammar

Tom Joad wrote: »

True but in Cavan it's particularly bad - only Leitrim and Laois have more senior clubs per head of population than Cavan (that was when their was 14 btw). Given our clubs performances in Ulster something needs to give in my view. I think this is the big limiting factor for Cavan GAA.

Clubs can still keep their identity and play at their level but amalgamate to play in the senior championship.

17 clubs in the Senior championship this year is beyond ridiculous.
As per the recommendations,
10 Stand alone senior clubs and 6 Amalgamations made up of the Junior and Intermediate clubs is the way to go.
We will of course have a higher quality Intermediate and Junior championship also as a result.

Tom Joad

Hammar wrote: »

17 clubs in the Senior championship this year is beyond ridiculous.
As per the recommendations,
10 Stand alone senior clubs and 6 Amalgamations made up of the Junior and Intermediate clubs is the way to go.
We will of course have a higher quality Intermediate and Junior championship also as a result.

Agreed but I would say 10 is too high even. At most 8 for me!!

celt262

Tom Joad wrote: »

True but in Cavan it's particularly bad - only Leitrim and Laois have more senior clubs per head of population than Cavan (that was when their was 14 btw). Given our clubs performances in Ulster something needs to give in my view. I think this is the big limiting factor for Cavan GAA.

Clubs can still keep their identity and play at their level but amalgamate to play in the senior championship.

Greetings all.

How will this help clubs performances in Ulster?

That's alot of matches in the park on the one weekend I hope the weather keeps good for the sake of the pitch.

baconsarnie

celt262 wrote: »

Greetings all.

How will this help clubs performances in Ulster?

That's alot of matches in the park on the one weekend I hope the weather keeps good for the sake of the pitch.

A good few people would feel that having too many clubs dilutes the quality that teams can put out, which leads to less competition and poorer teams & ultimately weaker teams coming out of Cavan.

That is what i assume. Fewer teams= more competitive squads? Isn't that what the report suggested?

I know, the problem is that the clubs will be like turkeys voting for Christmas and very few will voluntarily amalgamate due to parish identity, history, pride etc. But for the long-term development of county football, something needs to happen

Tom Joad

celt262 wrote: »

Greetings all.

How will this help clubs performances in Ulster?

That's alot of matches in the park on the one weekend I hope the weather keeps good for the sake of the pitch.

Peter Quinn put it well in the report when he said.

Rightly or wrongly, the majority opinion was that the current situation and the
current structures detract from the value of club football as a nursery for
county football, as well as from the development of potentially good players.
The ultimate result is that clubs in Cavan are losing out, just as much as the
county team is.

In it's simpliest form the senior championship is weak and there are too many junior level teams playing. Only a few teams have a realistic chance of winning the championship and you are left with one sided games and some god awful football. Once a team gets out of the county they are destroyed in Ulster.

celt262

baconsarnie wrote: »

A good few people would feel that having too many clubs dilutes the quality that teams can put out, which leads to less competition and poorer teams & ultimately weaker teams coming out of Cavan.

That is what i assume. Fewer teams= more competitive squads? Isn't that what the report suggested?

I know, the problem is that the clubs will be like turkeys voting for Christmas and very few will voluntarily amalgamate due to parish identity, history, pride etc. But for the long-term development of county football, something needs to happen

Yes but amalgamated teams cannot enter the Ulster Championship so it will still only be the likes of Cavan Gaels, Ballinagh and Kingscourt who can enter it anyway.

There are to many clubs I would agree with that but unless some naturally fall away due to lack of numbers I can't see that changing.

Amalgamations will improve the standard of club football for sure though and maybe this will improve the stand alone Clubs like the Gaels.

Tom Joad

Obviously amalgamations can't enter the Ulster championship but if the quality is better overall the team coming out of the county is better for it. The Gaels/ Mullahoran/ Kingscourt winning a county championship that has strong teams in it will be a better team for it and more fit to play in Ulster - the gap is too big at the minute. A better club championship also is better for the county team.

Look at how many of the county players over the years who never got an opportunity to play senior championship but would if clubs were to amalgamate to play senior.

I know it is a bit like asking turkeys to vote for christmas but sometimes the clubs have to remove the blinkers and see the benefits and the bigger picture rather than the threat to them. No-one is asking any club to fold or dissolve itself here.

Lemlin

Tom Joad wrote: »

I know it is a bit like asking turkeys to vote for christmas but sometimes the clubs have to remove the blinkers and see the benefits and the bigger picture rather than the threat to them. No-one is asking any club to fold or dissolve itself here.

The clubs need to wind their necks in a bit in fairness. The problem with rushing players back isn't just with the county team, it's with the clubs as well. Some representatives were actually happy to see Cavan lose on Saturday because the club championship can now start.

We seem to have a club vs county problem that very few other counties have.

celt262

They can't force them to amalgamate and we all know of certain clubs who wouldn't be to keen of joining up with their neighbors.

It would improve the standard of club football without a doubt, I don't know how many games i have seen in the Park and around the county over the last few years which were like challenge games until the knock out stages.

It would improve the standard of player going onto the county team also if we could get it of the ground but then would they be allowed play football within the county setup or is it rugby league players we should be developing?

Prop Joe

In Kerry they split the county into districts North,West,South,East and Mid..Take West Kerry for instance

5 clubs

Dingle
Lispole
Annascaul
Castlegregory
An Gaeltacht

Dingle compete in the Senior Championship on there own while the other 4 amalgamate for the Senior Championship and play under the banner of West Kerry.

All of the other 4 teams play in the Intermeidate/Junior championship.

At the end of the season all 5 play in the West Kerry championship and each team proceeds to kick 7 different shades of sh1te out of each other.No love lost between any club but they stand together in the Senior Championship under West Kerry.

It's a great system IMO

Tom Joad

celt262 wrote: »

They can't force them to amalgamate and we all know of certain clubs who wouldn't be to keen of joining up with their neighbors.

It would improve the standard of club football without a doubt, I don't know how many games i have seen in the Park and around the county over the last few years which were like challenge games until the knock out stages.

Plenty of clubs play together as amalgamations/ divisional sides at underage level with great success so why can't it be done at senior level?

I really don't understand the objections/ attitudes of some clubs in this to be honest.

Tom Joad

Prop Joe wrote: »

In Kerry theY split the county into districts North,West,South,East and Mid..Take West Kerry for instance

5 clubs

Dingle
Lispole
Annascaul
Castlegregory
An Gaeltacht

Dingle compete in the Senior Championship on there own while the other 4 amalgamate for the Senior Championship and play under the banner of West Kerry.

All of the other 4 teams play in the Intermeidate/Junior championship.

At the end of the season all 5 play in the West Kerry championship and each team proceeds to kick 7 different shades of sh1te out of each other.No love lost between any club but they stand together in the Senior Championship under West Kerry.

It's a great system IMO

This is exactly the system I would love to see in Cavan - I'm in Kerry a fair bit and the championship down there is fantastic and a million miles ahead of where Cavan is at.

Boom__Boom

celt262 wrote: »

They can't force them to amalgamate and we all know of certain clubs who wouldn't be to keen of joining up with their neighbors.

Give clubs a choice -
1) be of a good enough standard to take part on your own
2) if your club isn't strong enough to take part on it's own, you can amalgamate
3) if you don't like those options GTFO

Amalgamations in the GAA are tricky to manage, but in the long-term it's better for players and clubs, as opposed to having uncompetitive games no-one shows up which eventually leads to 1) more people on the pitch playing than are watching 2) players giving up the game because of a lack of decent opposition.

Prop Joe wrote: »

At the end of the season all 5 play in the West Kerry championship and each team proceeds to kick 7 different shades of sh1te out of each other.No love lost between any club but they stand together in the Senior Championship under West Kerry

the lads in north kerry board will be on to you about mentioning kicking 7 different shades of sh1te out of each other and not mentioning the north kerry championship

Boom__Boom

Prop Joe wrote: »

At the end of the season all 5 play in the West Kerry championship and each team proceeds to kick 7 different shades of sh1te out of each other.No love lost between any club but they stand together in the Senior Championship under West Kerry.

It's a great system IMO

It can also even improve the local derbies - when you see lads who've battled together for a divisional side, turn around and go head-to-head for their own club a week or two later.

It's almost similar to watching the inter-county lads take on county colleagues at club level.

Lemlin

The vultures seem to be circling.

It's not unknown that there's an anti Hyland brigade operating in the county, even before recent results might I add, and apparently one interested party, who is a member of the GAA media, has already shown an interest in replacing him.

Has anyone else heard this rumour?

celt262

Mr Hyand will have that job for at least one more year.

Hammar

It would be ridiculous to replace the management team.
This year's championship campaign was a disaster,but they have already shown the ability to get this group of players to an AIQ.
They deserve time to steady the ship.

KeepTheFaith

If we are to discard Terry Hyland, the man who has brought so much to Cavan in his tenure, after a year in which he has reached an AIQF, a McKenna Cup Final, an unbeaten League run and League Final, then there is something seriously, seriously wrong within Cavan. The very very least he deserves is one more year. And after that period I would like to see Peter Reilly or another Cavan man appointed. Great counties don't appoint outside managers and we should never look outside of the Breffni borders for a manager.

Who's the TV pundit reported to be interested?

Tom Joad

I could be wrong but this all sounds like b***x to me and a rumour started by someone. Canavan's name was always going to be mentioned because of his job with the Gaels.

It will never happen though.

celt262

I don't think it's peter the great. I heard a story after Armagh and it wasn't him.

Frankie Lee

McStay?

celt262

I heard McHugh was interested.

Tom Joad

celt262 wrote: »

I heard McHugh was interested.

If he gets the job I will wear a Meath jersey for a month and sign every post I make on Boards with An Mhí Abú for a month.

Boom__Boom

Tom Joad wrote: »

I could be wrong but this all sounds like b***x to me and a rumour started by someone. Canavan's name was always going to be mentioned because of his job with the Gaels.

It will never happen though.

After his stint with Fermanagh I'm a bit surprised he managed to get a club job so quickly.

How has he got on with Gaels?

celt262

Tom Joad wrote: »

If he gets the job I will wear a Meath jersey for a month and sign every post I make on Boards with An Mhí Abú for a month.

The position is filled anyway so nothing is going to happen.

Tom Joad

Boom__Boom wrote: »

After his stint with Fermanagh I'm a bit surprised he managed to get a club job so quickly.

How has he got on with Gaels?

Yes I was very surprised by the appointment too.

Really can't say how he has got on as the league so far has been a fiasco - Some one more in the know might correct me but I think they have forfeited more games than they have played.

Championship only starts next week so can only judge him on that. County championship and at least two games in Ulster is the minimum required.