BA joint major final GPA question

meathawk

I was just wondering, I'm only in second year but this question perplexes me and every time I hand in an essay I find myself thinking about this more and more.
Basically, I am doing Geography and Sociology. I am doing so much better in Geography than Sociology. I was wondering when you get your final GPA is it split with respect to your subject streams or is it just a total for all the modules taken in stage 2?
If a masters requires a 1.1 or a 2.1, is that your final result for the joint major or just the subject related to the masters? For example, BA Geography - Msc Climate Change.

Any feedback is greatly appreciated.

Rosita

You have two different subjects and there is no connection between the grades in them. Anyone who has a joint major in a BA will have two separate results/grades/GPAs. That said (and sorry for the ambiguity this creates) sometimes when people are applying for courses there can be an artificial average calculation of an Arts degree and in those situations the grades in the unrelated subject might matter. I would be surprised if anyone was blocked doing a Masters related to one subject in their degree because of a mark in an unrelated subject.

dyl10

Sorry to say, but your GPA is not split.
Arts leaves you with an aggregated degree grade and looking at my transcripts now, there is no breakdown for your individual subject's GPA.

You can always bring it to the attention of whoever you are applying to though, that there is a significant difference between your subject grades.

On another note, if climate change is what you are interested in you should have a chat with Gerald Mills and ask him for advice, he's a great guy.

parker kent

dyl10 wrote: »

Sorry to say, but your GPA is not split.
Arts leaves you with an aggregated degree grade and looking at my transcripts now, there is no breakdown for your individual subject's GPA.

You can always bring it to the attention of whoever you are applying to though, that there is a significant difference between your subject grades.

+1 It used to be prior to Horizons, but now there is one final grade.

Rosita

Apologies for the wrong information. When I graduated in 2007 there were two separate subjects with two separate grades. I find it utterly bizarre and ludicrous that this has changed considering someone could be doing two utterly different disciplines with Arts.

parker kent

Rosita wrote: »

Apologies for the wrong information. When I graduated in 2007 there were two separate subjects with two separate grades. I find it utterly bizarre and ludicrous that this has changed considering someone could be doing two utterly different disciplines with Arts.

An Arts degree is completely different now though. People can do majors and minors, have added an extra subject through electives (i.e maybe 10 credits each year on a language) etc. I'm jealous of Arts students now since I graduated in 2007 and missed out on the flexibility of horizons. There are less people doing 2 subjects in a joint major (hence the OPs confusion since they will probably know people doing all sorts of combinations), so it makes sense to have one overall result.

I've worked in UCD and people get confused when they hear about the old system where people got 2 distinct results. It has been known to cause confusion for employers too as they want to know the "actual overall result". People have had transcripts posted to them and employers don't accept them as they don't have any final overall result. I've even had to send an email to employers explaining why there are two different results.

Oasis_Dublin

I was speaking to Professors in History last week. They said that your overall GPA will be the first consideration in deciding your Masters (MA). That said however, and in typical ambiguous UCD style, they also said that if you are particularly strong in one of your undergraduate subjects and you want to do a MA in that subject, this will be considered. This was countered with the fact that if the MA is oversubscribed then the best GPAs will be considered first before further confusion was added into the mix by the suggestion that a good application/contacting the MA course coordinator will increase your chances.

Your best bet is to get a 2.1 (3.2 GPA) which should be a morning toss for someone from your family!

Rosita

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

I was speaking to Professors in History last week. They said that your overall GPA will be the first consideration in deciding your Masters (MA). That said however, and in typical ambiguous UCD style, they also said that if you are particularly strong in one of your undergraduate subjects and you want to do a MA in that subject, this will be considered. This was countered with the fact that if the MA is oversubscribed then the best GPAs will be considered first before further confusion was added into the mix by the suggestion that a good application/contacting the MA course coordinator will increase your chances.

Your best bet is to get a 2.1 (3.2 GPA) which should be a morning toss for someone from your family!

I would welcome that ambiguity as it seems ludricous that a grade from someone's other subject would prevent them doing a post-grad in a subject they did very well at given the wide variety of subjects an Arts student could have. If you want to do a post-grad in Irish or French why should your performance in Maths or History matter? This overall GPA seems to me to be a case of trying to 'regularise' an Arts degree and it's inappropriate/downright stupid in joint majors.

parker kent

Rosita wrote: »

I would welcome that ambiguity as it seems ludricous that a grade from someone's other subject would prevent them doing a post-grad in a subject they did very well at given the wide variety of subjects an Arts student could have. If you want to do a post-grad in Irish or French why should your performance in Maths or History matter? This overall GPA seems to me to be a case of trying to 'regularise' an Arts degree and it's inappropriate/downright stupid in joint majors.

But as I said above, joint majors are not the only things available now for Arts students. They will always take into account the difference between the two subjectsas the poster above says, but the current system allows that ambiguity whilst also giving people one overall result.

Oasis_Dublin

Rosita wrote: »

I would welcome that ambiguity as it seems ludricous that a grade from someone's other subject would prevent them doing a post-grad in a subject they did very well at given the wide variety of subjects an Arts student could have. If you want to do a post-grad in Irish or French why should your performance in Maths or History matter? This overall GPA seems to me to be a case of trying to 'regularise' an Arts degree and it's inappropriate/downright stupid in joint majors.

Well I would much rather they counted just History results. That would not be a degree though, I wouldn't have earned enough credits. The most annoying thing is that they tell you a 2.1 (3.09 GPA) is fine to go to MA level but then they tell you they want a GPA of 3.2. Highly misleading.

Powerhouse

parker kent wrote: »

But as I said above, joint majors are not the only things available now for Arts students.

This not a reason for not giving a grade in a specific subject where someone has worked up the credits.

parker kent

Powerhouse wrote: »

This not a reason for not giving a grade in a specific subject where someone has worked up the credits.

You will have your transcripts, what you got in that subject will be evident. You can now split your results into your subjects or else use the overall result depending on the situation. Read my earlier post for clarification as to why it makes sense to give arts students an overall grade (i.e Not the one you just quoted).

parker kent wrote: »

An Arts degree is completely different now though. People can do majors and minors, have added an extra subject through electives (i.e maybe 10 credits each year on a language) etc. I'm jealous of Arts students now since I graduated in 2007 and missed out on the flexibility of horizons. There are less people doing 2 subjects in a joint major (hence the OPs confusion since they will probably know people doing all sorts of combinations), so it makes sense to have one overall result.

I've worked in UCD and people get confused when they hear about the old system where people got 2 distinct results. It has been known to cause confusion for employers too as they want to know the "actual overall result". People have had transcripts posted to them and employers don't accept them as they don't have any final overall result. I've even had to send an email to employers explaining why there are two different results.

It would be a nightmare arranging results into different brackets. So you would give joint Majors getting 2 different final results. What about other Arts students doing a major and a minor? What about Arts students who have 10 credits each year in a language? Do they get 3 different GPAs? What about people who took random electives throughout? Are those 20 credits just ignored in their final results? The only logical solution is to give an overall GPA. If people want to emphasize one subject in an application or on their CV, then so be it.

Powerhouse

parker kent wrote: »

It would be a nightmare arranging results into different brackets. So you would give joint Majors getting 2 different final results. What about other Arts students doing a major and a minor? What about Arts students who have 10 credits each year in a language? Do they get 3 different GPAs? What about people who took random electives throughout? Are those 20 credits just ignored in their final results? The only logical solution is to give an overall GPA. If people want to emphasize one subject in an application or on their CV, then so be it.

This is simply an argument that everything must be subservient to the 'system'. If someone has two joint majors there is no reason not to give a result that reflects this. Not sure why someone doing something else in Arts should impinge on the simple logic of giving someone doing two subjects of equal weight (as in the OP's situation) - and quite likely unrelated subjects at that - two separate marks.

Clearly the information is there, it's not like it synthesies into one within the system and cannot be separated. It's simply a matter of presenting the information in a certain way. Why that should be a bureacratic 'nightmare' beats me. Horizons makes a virtue of its flexibility so it's odd that it's so inflexible in the end.

parker kent

Powerhouse wrote: »

This is simply an argument that everything must be subservient to the 'system'. If someone has two joint majors there is no reason not to give a result that reflects this. Not sure why someone doing something else in Arts should impinge on the simple logic of giving someone doing two subjects of equal weight (as in the OP's situation) - and quite likely unrelated subjects at that - two separate marks.

Clearly the information is there, it's not like it synthesies into one within the system and cannot be separated. It's simply a matter of presenting the information in a certain way. Why that should be a bureacratic 'nightmare' beats me. Horizons makes a virtue of its flexibility so it's odd that it's so inflexible in the end.

That is not my point. My point is that is people from the same degree should not have different forms of final results. It is not that it is bureaucratic nightmare. That is not what I am saying. My point is that for the integrity of the degree, there should be just one form of result. Also, there are very few people who finish an Arts degree now with a 50/50 split in subjects. Most have at least 1 elective per semester from another subject. Even one outside elective means it is different from the Arts Degree I did where all my subjects were within 2 subjects.

The current system allows people to differentiate their grades into different subjects. There has already been an example given of where that is the case when applying to postgraduate courses. And in borderline cases, they will also show consideration to your overall GPA. What is wrong with that? I don't get what is apparently ludicrous about the new system. You can still do what people did pre-2008 and separate your results. The only difference is that you now have one final overall GPA.

meathawk

The thing I find annoying is, why can't SIS include the breakdown of results. Sure they give you the final GPA, but why can't they offer you the two streams' final GPAs aswell as the all-encompassing final GPA. Seems foolish to the leave this out. I've been to MA meetings where they have said that it is your final GPA in one subject that we look for, but UCD don't offer this result. You have to calculate it yourself to see if you're in with a shot. I think there should be some breakdown at the end regarding results like this:

1. Major/Major (with minor)/ joint Major
2. Other Major/ Minor
3. In Subject electives
4. Out of subject electives

Doesn't seem like it's too much to ask for...

Oasis_Dublin

meathawk wrote: »

The thing I find annoying is, why can't SIS include the breakdown of results. Sure they give you the final GPA, but why can't they offer you the two streams' final GPAs aswell as the all-encompassing final GPA. Seems foolish to the leave this out. I've been to MA meetings where they have said that it is your final GPA in one subject that we look for, but UCD don't offer this result. You have to calculate it yourself to see if you're in with a shot. I think there should be some breakdown at the end regarding results like this:

1. Major/Major (with minor)/ joint Major
2. Other Major/ Minor
3. In Subject electives
4. Out of subject electives

Doesn't seem like it's too much to ask for...

It's not all that difficult to work out though. Bump it up a bit sure, the lecturer is not going to check the individual grades and GPAs of every student who applies to his (or hers, lol) MA.