Denis Brinicombe Fro-But Antiseptic tubby

johngalway

Anyone know if these are available in Ireland? Just sent the company off and email, wondering if anyone here has seen/used them. They're supposed to be quite good for Orf.

http://www.brinicombe-equine.co.uk/agriculture/products/animal_health/tubby_range.php

Username John

Hi John,

No - but am interested in if they are, let us know what they say. I see on the British Farming forum people speak well of em...

I vaccinated young lambs for Orf there a few weeks ago, and most are ok, but a few have gotten a nasty enough dose of it. Bloody horrible disease...

johngalway

This is the reply I got earlier:

"Our contact in Ireland is Tim McMullan of CM Animal Health. Tim can be contacted on either 028 2766 4466 or 07860 144718"

LostCovey

johngalway wrote: »

Anyone know if these are available in Ireland? Just sent the company off and email, wondering if anyone here has seen/used them. They're supposed to be quite good for Orf.

http://www.brinicombe-equine.co.uk/agriculture/products/animal_health/tubby_range.php

Looks like snake oil.

There is no treatment for orf.

The only thing that works for orf is prevention - vaccination and thistle control.

Very clever marketing strategy for that stuff though - hint heavily at a role in orf on the website (but never actually say it, cos it's untrue....just go on about "thistle prick"), then get the rumour out by word of mouth.

Orf cures are like diets.

There will always be a new one every year, because last year's one DIDN'T WORK!!!!!!!

LostCovey

Username John

LostCovey wrote: »

Looks like snake oil.

There is no treatment for orf.

The only thing that works for orf is prevention - vaccination and thistle control.

Very clever marketing strategy for that stuff though - hint heavily at a role in orf on the website (but never actually say it, cos it's untrue....just go on about "thistle prick"), then get the rumour out by word of mouth.

Orf cures are like diets.

There will always be a new one every year, because last year's one DIDN'T WORK!!!!!!!

LostCovey

Probably very true LC, but when you get a dose of orf, you'd be willing to try out most things then...

On thistle control - is this accepted as a major cause for spreading of orf?
Reason I ask is we have orf now, but its too early for any thistles. So maybe while they might help it along, it seems to do feckin all right without em too...

johngalway

Username John wrote: »

On thistle control - is this accepted as a major cause for spreading of orf?
Reason I ask is we have orf now, but its too early for any thistles. So maybe while they might help it along, it seems to do feckin all right without em too...

Thistles, gorse, etc. can all break the skin, broken skin allows nasty things a way inside the animal. I've declared war on all those things and believe it'll all help.

Username John

johngalway wrote: »

Thistles, gorse, etc. can all break the skin, broken skin allows nasty things a way inside the animal. I've declared war on all those things and believe it'll all help.

Other than orf, what else is there to get inside... Just wondering now, as maybe I am not aware of the potential my f'ecking crop of thistles are truely causing...

I agree that its better not to have thistles & gorse (or furze as we call it ) But what about the whitethorn that everyone has planted in hedges as part of REPS?
I have seen some stabs, which I have put down to Blackthorn (as we have that here too) We have lots of fecking briars too... On the stab-y plant side of things, we're doing very good...

johngalway

Not entirely sure UJ, but, I do not like the idea of any type of open wounds, regardless of size. Intact skin is the first level of defense. Orf is a virus AFAIK and pricks from thorns is one way of it getting in.

Oh yeah, we call them furze too, am too used to decoding local terms for users of other sites :pac:

According to "The Veterinary Book for Sheep Farmers" (David C. Henderson):

"The virus penetrates through small abrasions of the skin, such as are caused by nosing amongst thistles, brambles and hedgerows or against troughs or feeders. Even very minor damage to skin may allow the virus enter"

Username John

johngalway wrote: »

Not entirely sure UJ, but, I do not like the idea of any type of open wounds, regardless of size. Intact skin is the first level of defense. Orf is a virus AFAIK and pricks from thorns is one way of it getting in.

True, best to have none of em.

That book is good then - got it myself last year off ebay. Handy to have.

johngalway

Username John wrote: »

True, best to have none of em.

That book is good then - got it myself last year off ebay. Handy to have.

He made a good lambing DVD as well, some of it now wouldn't be that doable maybe outside of a Teagasc outfit but good demonstration of lamb warming boxes, revival techniques, and glucose injections.

Oh yes, salt licks are also supposed to aid the healing process. Must get a couple and try them.

crofter

Having used these tubbys in Scotland and had success I know that they lick the surface and get coated around the mouth with the antiseptic and the high levels of zinc taken internally help repair damaged skin with healthy new growth. These are not sugary sweet tubs that disappear in a day, but last for a good while. The Denis Brinicome company have a freephone helpline for advice 0800 374325 I know its a bit late this year but I have only just joined.

snowman707

crofter wrote: »

Having used these tubbys in Scotland and had success I know that they lick the surface and get coated around the mouth with the antiseptic and the high levels of zinc taken internally help repair damaged skin with healthy new growth. These are not sugary sweet tubs that disappear in a day, but last for a good while. The Denis Brinicome company have a freephone helpline for advice 0800 374325 I know its a bit late this year but I have only just joined.

Hi welcome to boards

I have been dealing with orf for almost 40 years, have listened to all the fancy sales talk about cures and tried a good few of different varieties,

now days I just buy a bottle of Jameson ,and the lambs heal every bit as fast and make a fully recovery































BTW, I drink the whiskey my self, actually had a drop earlier,

5live

snowman707 wrote: »

Hi welcome to boards

I have been dealing with orf for almost 40 years, have listened to all the fancy sales talk about cures and tried a good few of different varieties,

now days I just buy a bottle of Jameson ,and the lambs heal every bit as fast and make a fully recovery































BTW, I drink the whiskey my self, actually had a drop earlier,

Just dont drink and post;).

i remember hearing long time ago that it gets less dangerous with time as the sheep build up a small level of immunity and those with poorer immunity dont thrive as well and are culled or dont have as many replacements. Also the virus mutates and killing the host reduces its chances of survival as a dead host wont pass it on to as many other hosts.
Chronic survives better than acute:(

johngalway

crofter wrote: »

Having used these tubbys in Scotland and had success I know that they lick the surface and get coated around the mouth with the antiseptic and the high levels of zinc taken internally help repair damaged skin with healthy new growth. These are not sugary sweet tubs that disappear in a day, but last for a good while. The Denis Brinicome company have a freephone helpline for advice 0800 374325 I know its a bit late this year but I have only just joined.

I'll be getting a tub for next year. I was too late (was doing it every week...) for it this year. Had a few lambs with orf, it does clear up, but anything which will encourage faster healing is worth a punt.

LostCovey

johngalway wrote: »

I'll be getting a tub for next year. I was too late (was doing it every week...) for it this year. Had a few lambs with orf, it does clear up, but anything which will encourage faster healing is worth a punt.

I am with Snowman 100% on this. Nothing works for Orf except time.

Buckets & licks will only spread the virus around the lambs. Treating Orf with topical treatments, are an excellent way to catch Orf yourself and it is a painful nasty slow thing to clear. However, this product fulfils the same need as "Orfoids", it satisfies the need to be busy and feel you are doing something for them.

Unfortunately its like our old doctor used to say about the common cold - "you can leave it untreated and you will suffer the misery of it for seven days, but if you take a course of antibiotics it'll be gone in a week".

LostCovey

Western Pomise

Have treated lambs with scabivax for last few years which has worked about 98%......prior to that we would always have around 10 lambs a yr with bit of orf around the mouth...if u are soft look away..... best cure...scrape the orf with a brillo pad... dab it with petrol...light it for a second ...put it out.....and after about a week lamb returns to thriving and remaining orf falls off.

The_Conductor

Western Pomise wrote: »

Have treated lambs with scabivax for last few years which has worked about 98%......prior to that we would always have around 10 lambs a yr with bit of orf around the mouth...if u are soft look away..... best cure...scrape the orf with a brillo pad... dab it with petrol...light it for a second ...put it out.....and after about a week lamb returns to thriving and remaining orf falls off.

Err- there are perfectly acceptable veterinary treatments out there.
Please keep in mind that this is a public forum- and you are going to get bad reactions from the public at large when they hear of brillo pad and petrol solutions.
We have enough trouble trying to keep our end customers reassured about our farming practices and the welfare and wellbeing of farm animals- please think twice before posting solutions such as the one you've detailed above.

For the benefit of those unfamiliar with 'Orf'- its a viral infection of sheep and goats, related to the pox family. It is highly infectious- and indeed can spread to humans quite readily. Normally the sores scab over and heal, often without any visible tissue damage, within a 1-to-3 week period. The big problem tends to happen at this time of the year, when secondary bacterial infections can occur. It is entirely normal for the scab to fall away of its own accord- this can happen within 1 to 3 or 4 weeks. Yes- it can look pretty horrible, and cause significant discomfort to the animal- but by god- your idea is horrendous.

Regarding 'orf'- its almost impossible to erradicate 'orf' from a flock- the fallen scabs on grassland can remain viable infectors 15-20 years later. It is however, very possible to vaccinate flocks- and in the US there is a current vaccination rate of ~22-23% among newborn lambs.

Orf is not normally treated- if the mouth scabs crack and there is a suspicion that a bacterial infection may take hold- most vets will prescribe an antibiotic cream that you can rub into the mouth.

Orf, in an Irish context, is most frequently treated by vets, in goat rather than sheep herds (and indeed it appears to be more infectious in goats, and more readily communicable to humans, via goats than via sheep).

Less of the homemade remedies please- I don't care whether you've been doing it for decades or not- wholly aside from animal welfare considerations- comments such as yours can do significant damage to consumer confidence in 30 seconds- and the way our little country is- we *need* the Irish consumer on our side........

Western Pomise

Only joking about the petrol solution!....jeez lighten up....on a serious note Scabivax works very well.

The_Conductor

Western Pomise wrote: »

Only joking about the petrol solution!....jeez lighten up....on a serious note Scabivax works very well.

Its all well and good saying I should lighten up- a number of people reported your post, unfortunately its very difficult to convey humour on the internet- and in this instance, it certainly wasn't obvious to several people.

Western Pomise

Grand,point taken....