Japanese earthquake / tsunami discussion

Turtwig

Fallschirmjager wrote: »

http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/RS_Progress_by_on-site_workers_1703111.html

more here...

In fairness, that site has by far been the best source of information during this whole Fukushima scenario. Updates are usually sparse, but when they come they're usually vivid, detailed and reliable.:)

Topper Harley01

Hi-res satellite photo of the plant taken today-

http://static.reuters.com/resources/assets/?d=20110317&t=1&i=fukuaerial1&w=&q=

Turtwig

gargleblaster wrote: »

not sure what the procedure is, but the radioactive material cools as it comes into contact with the material below it, so it seems unlikely that any of it would reach the sea.

Radioactive substances will contaminate the sea, but better the sea than circulating in the atmosphere.

Rob A. Bank

Overheal wrote: »

And thats when the disaster starts taking on wider repercussions

What about the people who might still be alive in the rubble? I hope they would at least wait until the Search and Rescue phase is complete. Recovery/Cleanup can wait but if people are still alive, they need to be found.

The reactors are about to start claiming an indirect death toll.

The reactors started claiming an indirect death toll from the very beginning, when acutely needed manpower and assets were diverted away from the needs of tsunami victims.

Also there has been little or no 'search and rescue' in the exclusion zone since it was declared.

BBC has maps showing the numbers of evacuees from various areas, which gives an idea of the extent of human misery from the natural and nuclear disasters.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12775846

Thrill

On Wednesday night, Mr. Jaczko reiterated his earlier statement and added that commission representatives in Tokyo had confirmed that the pool at No. 4 was empty. He said Tokyo Electric and other officials in Japan had confirmed that, and also emphasized that high radiation fields were going to make it very difficult to continue having people work at the plant.

Those statements made by Jaczko on Wednesday were disputed by Japaneses officials and still are.

Jaczko says that commission reps in Tokyo confirmed that the pool at No. 4 was empty and Jaczko says that Tokyo Electric and other officials in Japan had confirmed this, but the Japaneses still maintain that there is water in reactor No.4 and that Jazcko is mistaken.

Metallitroll

Raskolnikov wrote: »

Temperatures in Japan have been below zero for a few days now. Also, it's nearly a week after the initial wave, so it's unlikely anyone is still alive at this stage with starvation and cold.

we should also recognize those rescue efforts have mostly been only serving to recover bodies as they have frozen to death for the most part as well as wet, trapped, crushed, fractures - general discomfort the efforts can never cease but they're increasingly serving as recovery efforts. this is the grim reality. it is too cold


good news in that Yu Lynch who is stationed here but from Miyagi has accounted for all of her relatives, at least. small mercies but that relieves the tension on her family in law here, too

maquiladora

Thrill wrote: »

Those statements made by Jaczko on Wednesday were disputed by Japaneses officials and still are.

Jaczko says that commission reps in Tokyo confirmed that the pool at No. 4 was empty and Jaczko says that Tokyo Electric and other officials in Japan had confirmed this, but the Japaneses still maintain that there is water in reactor No.4 and that Jazcko is mistaken.

Well, that has since changed from "there is water" to "we don't know if there is water".

From the same NYT article :

Later, a spokesman for Japan’s Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, Yo****aka Nagayama, was more equivocal, saying, “Because we have been unable to go to the scene, we cannot confirm whether there is water left or not in the spent fuel pool at Reactor No. 4.”

Fremen

BBC news: "Reuters is reporting that the IAEA says that Japan plans to reconnect power to unit 2 of the Fukushima's nuclear plant once the spraying of water on unit 3 has been completed."

Wooh!

Thrill

maquiladora wrote: »

Well, that has since changed from "there is water" to "we don't know if there is water".

From the same NYT article :

I'm just saying that as of yet, there is no confirmation of exactly what amount of water, if any, exists in no.4, which the quote in your post shows.

Fallschirmjager

Fukushima Daiichi
The reactors at the Fukushima Daiichi plant are in stable condition and are being cooled with seawater, but workers at the plant continue efforts to add cooling water to fuel pools at reactors 3 and 4.

The status of the reactors at the site is as follows:

Reactor 1’s primary containment is believed to be intact and the reactor is in a stable condition. Seawater injection into the reactor is continuing.

Reactor 2 is in stable condition with seawater injection continuing. The reactor’s primary containment may not have been breached, Tokyo Electric Power Co. and World Association of Nuclear Operators officials said on Thursday.

Access problems at the site have delayed connection of a temporary cable to restore off-site electricity. The connection will provide power to the control rod drive pump, instrumentation, batteries and the control room. Power has not been available at the site since the earthquake on March 11.

Reactor 3 is in stable condition with seawater injection continuing. The primary containment is believed to be intact. Pressure in the containment has fluctuated due to venting of the reactor containment structure.

TEPCO officials say that although one side of the concrete wall of the reactor 4 fuel pool structure has collapsed, the steel liner of the pool remains intact, based on aerial photos of the reactor taken on March 17. The pool still has water providing some cooling for the fuel; however, helicopters dropped water on the reactor four times during the morning (Japan time) on March 17. Water also was sprayed at reactor 4 using high-pressure water cannons.

Reactors 5 and 6 were both shut down before the quake occurred. Primary and secondary containments are intact at both reactors. Temperature instruments in the spent fuel pools at reactors 5 and 6 are operational, and temperatures are being maintained at about 62 degrees Celsius. TEPCO is continuing efforts to restore power at reactor 5.


some good news in there and some bad...the collapsing wall for example..

bit it looks as if in 1 and 2 and 3 the steel containment vessel has held...

http://www.nei.org/newsandevents/information-on-the-japanese-earthquake-and-reactors-in-that-region/

Rob A. Bank

http://www.weather-forecast.com/locations/Iwaki/forecasts/latest

A 9 day forecast for Iwaki, a city on the coast 43 km south of the reactors, suggesting that the wind will have a mainly onshore component from sunday until tuesday.

Not good...

TheZohanS

BBC News is on now, reporting that people are starving to death in some of the hospitals as there is no food.

yammycat

they might be hungry but it takes a long long time to starve to death

gbee

yammycat wrote: »

they might be hungry but it takes a long long time to starve to death

Several have died at evacuation centres, old age and other illnesses compounded the cold and lack of food.

Donal Og O Baelach

yammycat wrote: »

they might be hungry but it takes a long long time to starve to death

That'll cheer them up no end. You should fly out there and tell them the good news.

Run_to_da_hills

yammycat wrote: »

they might be hungry but it takes a long long time to starve to death

Not that long for the very young and elderly particularly in those areas avoided by the emergency services.

Also reported in CNN that many emergency relief workers are stuck in Tokyo unable to make it up the North Coast to assist because of the exclusion zone, some may have to return to their home countries again.

A British relief team has already been forced to turn back to the UK over red tape.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1366871/Japan-tsunami-earthquake-UK-aid-workers-foiled-British-Embassy-red-tape.html

Overheal

Donal Og O Baelach wrote: »

That'll cheer them up no end. You should fly out there and tell them the good news.

I don't see you on a plane full of canned chicken either.

No point in scoring points. We're all behind keyboards doing **** all but talking about it.

3ndahalfof6

the thread has lost its way, all the carnage and yis are still bickering

easy to see its not on your door step.

Donal Og O Baelach

Overheal wrote: »

I don't see you on a plane full of canned chicken either.

No point in scoring points. We're all behind keyboards doing **** all but talking about it.

Now now, lets not bicker.

Overheal

Donal Og O Baelach wrote: »

Now now, lets not bicker.

I accept your apology.

Donal Og O Baelach

Overheal wrote: »

I accept your apology.

Thanks.

(you don't need to respond to every comment in the thread you know)

Topper Harley01

Japanese authorities have informed the IAEA that engineers were able to lay an external grid power line cable to unit 2. The operation was completed at 08:30 UTC

http://www.iaea.org/newscenter/news/tsunamiupdate01.html

andrew

Guys guys, take a chill pill. No need to have a meltdown here too.

Topper Harley01

As a side note, I wonder if the accident will increase public support for military action against Iran and North Korea's nuclear weapons programme? The public previously had a laissez faire attitude towards the two countries, perhaps now they might realise that things could be 1000 times worse if the nuclear programmes of 2 hostile nations are allowed to go unchecked.

opinion guy

vibe666 wrote: »

no it isn't and it never will be.

the real disaster is that 5600 people are confirmed dead and many thousands more are still missing, a significant number of which may well have been people who actually survived the quakes & tsunami but were trapped and who have since died waiting to be rescued of either their injuries, starvation or hypothermia whilst the world is waiting for something exciting to happen in fukushima.

anyone who was in this position has almost certainly died since then unless they had access to at least water & a source of heat, so the chances that any of those people have survived this long are almost zero.

even if every worst case scenario possible in fukushima happened all at once, meltdowns & explosions and all, it would still pale into significance compared to the pain and suffering that has already happened and that continues to happen in the rest of japan. many thousands are homeless and have lost everything and its going to be a very long time before they are even able to get back on their feet and years before japan as a nation recovers from what happened.

the one thing chicken little had going for him was that he wasn't looking at the sky shouting whilst at the same time the ground was swallowing people up and the sea was washing them away.

Do you people even read the freaking thread ????

Its only the biggest disaster and biggest news story of well.....ever!

I said this when someone came on and said 'oh is this thread still going'. I meant it in reference to the whole thread and thus the whole event - not the nuclear aspect of it. Its funny you said chicken little because I've been using the thread myself telling people to calm down - including about two posts down from the one I said this in.

Read the freakin thread before you jump down people's throat would you ? Especially when that person is saying the same thing you are. Seriously read my posts back the last 5 pages.

Edit: this one for example - the one you thanked. that says more or less exactly what you said:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=71214120&postcount=3823
Pay attention please!!!!

Overheal

Topper Harley01 wrote: »

As a side note, I wonder if the accident will increase public support for military action against Iran and North Korea's nuclear weapons programme? The public previously had a laissez faire attitude towards the two countries, perhaps now they might realise that things could be 1000 times worse if the nuclear programmes of 2 hostile nations are allowed to go unchecked.

You're saying we should use the military to stop the weapons Nuclear programs to prevent radioactive pollution?

I meant it in reference to the whole thread and thus the whole event

In all objectivity I think there have probably been worse disasters, this is just being handled reasonably well and has been prepared for exceptionally. the 2004 India disaster claimed over 200,000 lives and was still only the 6th deadliest quake since records began.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_natural_disasters#Earthquakes

Micky Dolenz

andrew wrote: »

Guys guys, take a chill pill. No need to have a meltdown here too.

I was just going to say that, Stealer :P

tuxy

Does anyone else think that with out the nuclear incident most of us would have lost interest and stopped posting here. I don't remember this much interest in the earthquake in Haiti, even though from a humanitarian aspect it was much much worse than Japan.

opinion guy

Overheal wrote: »

You're saying we should use the military to stop the weapons Nuclear programs to prevent radioactive pollution? In all objectivity I think there have probably been worse disasters, this is just being handled reasonably well and has been prepared for exceptionally. the 2004 India disaster claimed over 200,000 lives and was still only the 6th deadliest quake since records began.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_natural_disasters#Earthquakes

Holy Jesus. The size of the story is not the point. I was exaggerating for effect to make the point that the thread was still open because the story was kind of a little bit maybe out of the ordinary. <- That was sarcasm right there in case anyone is confused:rolleyes:. OBVIOUSLY things like WW2 were bigger stories. This point that people are quoting out of context having not read the surrounding posts isn't even important.

Turtwig

tuxy wrote: »

Does anyone else think that with out the nuclear incident most of us would have lost interest and stopped posting here. I don't remember this much interest in the earthquake in Haiti, even though from a humanitarian aspect it was much much worse than Japan.

Oh no doubt. Part of the reason I got caught up in this thread was the tonnes of irrationality and fear mongering that was going on. I'n neither pro nor anti nuclear but this thread was becoming rife with speculation and conjecture. Something I'm not the biggest fan of.:)