hr meeting- what should i do ?

martin451

i had a meeting with a chap workng ( indirectly )for me where i shouted at him. I did not say not say any bad language

i basically told him to stop complaining ( not paid enough wans't be promoted , doing more than anyone else......he is very ambitous and a good worker)
and that i was tired of his complaints

Today my boss has said

1) the chap then went to HR to complain
2) My boss said he and hr had met the accuser and now they want to meet me next week about this "incident"( he did;t tell me what the accuser has said)

I rarely have much to do with the accuser and this has never happened before ( talk to him 5/6 times in last year - usually about his "complaints")

This is an office based environment

questions
1) Should i ask for someone else to be with me, i have no friends in the company so do i need a lawyer to attend this meeting or am i being over the top?

2) shoud i say i want to know what is happening before i agree to attend the meeting?


3) Could one shouting incident be bullying?

4) The chap is coloured so i am a little bit afraid he may play race card . what do i do if he does?

edellc

martin451 wrote: »

i had a meeting with a chap workng ( indirectly )for me where i shouted at him. I did not say not say any bad language

i basically told him to stop complaining ( not paid enough wans't be promoted , doing more than anyone else......he is very ambitous and a good worker)
and that i was tired of his complaints

Today my boss has said

1) the chap then went to HR to complain
2) My boss said he and hr had met the accuser and now they want to meet me next week about this "incident"( he did;t tell me what the accuser has said)

I rarely have much to do with the accuser and this has never happened before ( talk to him 5/6 times in last year - usually about his "complaints")

This is an office based environment

questions
1) Should i ask for someone else to be with me, i have no friends in the company so do i need a lawyer to attend this meeting or am i being over the top?

2) shoud i say i want to know what is happening before i agree to attend the meeting?


3) Could one shouting incident be bullying?

4) The chap is coloured so i am a little bit afraid he may play race card . what do i do if he does?

er the chap is coloured wtf is that and play the race card omg for that you need a slap
how dare you shout at anyone in a work environment i hope they give you the warning you deserve

martin451

thanks for ur unhelpful edllc comment

bbam

Firstly as a manager you should know the HR department enough to the extent if you need someone with you..

I would suggest you go it alone and ask for the meeting to be stopped if you feel it's not going to your liking.

I wouldn't particularly give in straight away that you are all at fault.
Did you raise your voice in the conversation in reaction to him doing the same or did you just fly off the handle..
If the former I'd be standing my ground as it can be a good way of getting control of a situation, if the latter I'd be going in hands up and offer an apology immediately, in writing.

I must say I've had an occasion where I went off on a rant at an employee but it was in private and no proof (it did work in that case). Perhaps you should have denied it happened at all (it's not always good to have too many morals)

This will likely end in a warning for yourself at this stage, not the end of the world..

As for race... you shouldn't notice an employee's colour when dealing with them, this would be a terrible time to mention it..

Stheno

edellc wrote: »

er the chap is coloured wtf is that and play the race card omg for that you need a slap
how dare you shout at anyone in a work environment i hope they give you the warning you deserve

martin451 wrote: »

thanks for ur unhelpful edllc comment

Edellc has a point.

In this instance however if the employee you shouted at and have previously talked to five/six times about their "complaints" and been negative about it, if he is the only person that you have behaved towards in this manner, he may have a case for both bullying and racism.

As a manager you should know that:
a. in most cases where you are under investigation by HR and asked to attend a meeting such as you describe, you are entitled to have someone with you, lawyers are usually excluded though.

You know what the meeting is in relation to, which is about as much as you have to be told.

One shouting incident could be bullying based on previous interactions you have had with this person, regardless of whether or not you shouted in those, bullying is in the eyes of the person being bullied, not the bully.

wmpdd3

You will need a witness, if you choose not to bring a witness you may be asked to declare you are waiving your right to a witness, at the start of the meeting.

If you are in a union bring a union member or shop steward with you. The will know what to take note of. You say this guy is working for you, if you are a manager you may not be in a union so I'd say bring in another manager, some one trustworthy if not your friend.

I don't see this as being bulling but the first meeting is just for you to tell you story and for the complaint to be made to you so both stories can be compared.

Do not mention anything personal about this employee at all only comment on his work and if asked any other personal details about say you could not answer this as you have only spoken to him on 5/6 occasions.

mrsbyrne

having read and reread the op, i think wmpdd3 gives you the most excellent advice. further to that, reading between the lines, i think you would be someone who would definitely benefit from an interpersonal skills course. for example, http://fetac.ie/doc/WelcomeServlet?DocId=0901df9e80002203there is no room now for managers shouting at employees, whatever the circumstances. i dont think you had any real malice intent, just a basic loss of control. not acceptable and will get you into trouble down the line from now on if you dont get to grips with it now.

Mrs OBumble

bbam wrote: »

I would suggest you go it alone and ask for the meeting to be stopped if you feel it's not going to your liking.

I wouldn't particularly give in straight away that you are all at fault.
Did you raise your voice in the conversation in reaction to him doing the same or did you just fly off the handle..
If the former I'd be standing my ground as it can be a good way of getting control of a situation, if the latter I'd be going in hands up and offer an apology immediately, in writing.

I think this is the best advice here, and that the distinction is important.

OP, I think that how you should play this depends also on whether you are a manager or not. You say that the other man reports indirectly to you: it may be that he was whinging to you about something that's totally outside of your control, and is irrelevant to anything he should be discussing with you.

Are you his manager's manager? (in which case the other posts about your relationship with HR are spot on)

Or are you a senior / technical type person, who doesn't have direct reports? (in which case, I'd be inclined to go with the I'm-sorry-one-off-incident-won't-happen-again approach).

Also, you need to think about whether there are any witnesses, and what they may have seen. (Remember, what they think they saw/heard and what actually happened are not always the same thing.)

martin451

thanks for advice cannot sleep for last few nights
its awful

bbam

mrsbyrne wrote: »

there is no room now for managers shouting at employees, whatever the circumstances. i dont think you had any real malice intent, just a basic loss of control.

It may not be PC but I actually don't agree... I refuse to be shouted down by an employee, I will reason things down as best as possible but sometimes a sharp blast back can bring things to a halt and stamp your authority on a devolving situation.. You need to be able to read the situation and the employee to know what will work best...

Some employees whine and moan on about the most ridiculous stuff....

mrsbyrne

Some employees whine and moan on about the most ridiculous stuff....like want ing to be paid....and getting a payslip....and holidays.....and a 15 minute break after 41/2 hours....i could go on....:rolleyes:

bbam

mrsbyrne wrote: »

i could go on....:rolleyes:

<<edited out to avoid the reported post that I could just feel coming my way!>>

bbam

bbam wrote: »

<<edited out to avoid the reported post that I could just feel coming my way!>>

Thanks..
Sometimes I just can't help myself :rolleyes:

mrsbyrne

bbam wrote: »

Thanks..
Sometimes I just can't help myself :rolleyes:

....so it would seem....saw the now deleted post...just not witty enough for someone like me to be bothered replying too...here, you have the last word...you do like to go on, and on, and on.....:p:p:p