Rats

deano77777

Is there anyone out there looking for rats.
Im thinking of starting a small rat and mice farm for pets and reptile food.

joyce2009

I was interested untill i read the last three words....ahhhhhnooooooo:D

Cherry Blossom

Your best bet would be just to choose one - for pets, or for reptile food, otherwise you'll have no customers.

Cherry Blossom

As a matter of interest how would these be kept, managed, killed, stored. Are there any regulations or quality standards about this sort of thing? How would you ensure your stock was free of disease or contamination?

saintsaltynuts

This a wind-up surely people let this post be the last one.

deano77777

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

As a matter of interest how would these be kept, managed, killed, stored. Are there any regulations or quality standards about this sort of thing? How would you ensure your stock was free of disease or contamination?

Ill be keeping them in 73x55x20cm tubs for breeding then single pregnant females will go into 55x35x20cm tubs to birth and raise there pups. The tubs will be housed in large racks with food hoopers and auromatic watering system.

They will be culled using co2 and then stored in food bags of 10s, 20s and 25s per bag and kept in storage freezers.

Also i have access to an endless supply of cardboard tubbing and light wooden boxes, so they will have some things to hid in, clime on and chew on.
This would give them a lot more space and stimulaition than other european rat farms.

I will be starting of with a small collony of 20 or 30 females which will be hand picked for good temperment and health from good breeders and i might also buy some lab strain ones.
All the females pups will be kept till they are 4-5 months old, then i will replace all the males and with new unrelated males.

Any one for sale to pet shops will be housed in a seperate area and in bigger tubs, they will be breed for colour, tempernent and health.

tman

Don't think you'll find many fans here tbh...
Didn't even realise that rats were bred for animal food!:mad:

deano77777

tman wrote: »

Don't think you'll find many fans here tbh...
Didn't even realise that rats were bred for animal food!:mad:

They are used as reptile food, and reptile need to eat to.
There are a lot snake owners out there who need to keep there pet fed and healthy.

Shanao

To be fair, a lot of people do buy frozen rats and mice to feed their snakes. I have reptiles myself, though only lizards now but I had a snake and had to buy frozen mice to feed him. It is a pity because rats make amazing pets, but if you keep snakes, you have no choice. Well, you can feed rats or frozen chicks but rats seem to be what most people feed. If you want to keep your snake alive, then you really dont have a choice.

deano77777

Shanao wrote: »

To be fair, a lot of people do buy frozen rats and mice to feed their snakes. I have reptiles myself, though only lizards now but I had a snake and had to buy frozen mice to feed him. It is a pity because rats make amazing pets, but if you keep snakes, you have no choice. Well, you can feed rats or frozen chicks but rats seem to be what most people feed. If you want to keep your snake alive, then you really dont have a choice.

I know rats good pets, im my oppion they make the best rodent pets coz they are effectionat to you and like to be handled and held once they are use to you.

I love rats, but sadly they also are fast breeders and produce a lot of offspring in one litter, which makes them perfect to breed as snake food, along with mice.

Lawrence1895

deano77777 wrote: »

I know rats good pets, im my oppion they make the best rodent pets coz they are effectionat to you and like to be handled and held once they are use to you.

I love rats, but sadly they also are fast breeders and produce a lot of offspring in one litter, which makes them perfect to breed as snake food, along with mice.

Did you ever try to keep two rats of the same gender? No offspring, no hassle, just two cute and adorable pets

Back in Germany, I had pet rats for over a decade and they were always a great company.

deano77777

Lars1916 wrote: »

Did you ever try to keep two rats of the same gender? No offspring, no hassle, just two cute and adorable pets

Back in Germany, I had pet rats for over a decade and they were always a great company.

I think your missing what this post is about..
Im looking to see how many people in ireland would be intersed in buying frozen reptile food(rats and mice) of me if i set up a rat farm.

Lawrence1895

deano77777 wrote: »

I think your missing what this post is about..
Im looking to see how many people in ireland would be intersed in buying frozen reptile food(rats and mice) of me if i set up a rat farm.

I got the point alright, I just didn't want to reply what others said before me...the endless debate about using rats for the sole purpose of turning them into reptile food.

SophieSakura

I don't see the problem with feeding (frozen) rats to reptiles people feed meat to dogs and cats, what's the difference really if you think about it?

EGAR

SophieSakura wrote: »

I don't see the problem with feeding (frozen) rats to reptiles people feed meat to dogs and cats, what's the difference really if you think about it?

So I presume you would have no problem if any of the Guinea Pigs you bred were fed to a snake or suchlike?

SophieSakura

EGAR wrote: »

So I presume you would have no problem if any of the Guinea Pigs you bred were fed to a snake or suchlike?

I would, because they're mine! I only want them to go to good pet homes because I care about them . . . But if someone else bred them and killed them humanely, I'd be ok with that. People eat guinea pigs in south america, they're no different to cows to me. (cos I like cows!)

Obviously if people have pet rats or like rats then they wouldn't like the thought of it. I don't like the thought of it either, but don't think it's wrong is all.

But I couldn't feed a live animal to another . . . I just couldn't watch it.

EGAR

That is no reasoning, that is hypocritical.

SophieSakura

EGAR wrote: »

That is no reasoning, that is hypocritical.

Sorry I don't really undestand why you think it's hypocritical?

I don't eat meat, but personally I see no difference between rat meat and beef or chicken or whatever. A snake has to eat meat and a cat has to eat meat.

If the rat is bred to be a feeder rat, and is kept in good conditions and humanely killed, then I don't see that as any different to the meat we feed our dogs. I don't really get what you mean, do you think it's wrong because rats are pets? I couldn't kill one myself, but where else could people get the food for their reptiles?

I think if an animals is bred by a breeder who cares about it, they obviously want it to go to a good home. I don't put all the effort in of handling the animals every day and taming them just so they can be food. I genuinely love them and it would break my heart if anything happened to them. So I would never sell them as food. That's my choice really.

I don't mean to offend, but why is it hypocritical?

SophieSakura

I think the difference is, my guinea pigs are my pets, and ones bred for feeding reptiles are basically farm animals.

I don't think you could let yourself get attached to them . . .

If I had cows or something, I wouldn't let anyone eat them

deano77777

EGAR wrote: »

That is no reasoning, that is hypocritical.

How is that hypocitical,
It would be hypocitical if she had a pet snake and said she dosent agree with animals being breed for food.

she's just saying she loves Her animals but understands that other animal have to be breed and killed for food.

Cherry Blossom

OP, do you have any qualifications or prior expierience of managing something like this? CO2 poisioning doesn't seem a humane method of culling animals. Another problem that tends to occur is reptiles getting salmonella poisioning from their food, are you talking about using domestic grade freezers? I would imagine they would have to be blast frozen and kept frozen through the supply chain. How would you know if your stock was diseased etc.? Basically how could you prove to your customers that your supply is safe if there are no quality standards that apply? Basically - I wouldn't feed anything to a pet if it wasn't of a standard that I'd eat it myself (not that I'd eat rats but I'm sure you know what I mean!)

deano77777

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

OP, do you have any qualifications or prior expierience of managing something like this? CO2 poisioning doesn't seem a humane method of culling animals. Another problem that tends to occur is reptiles getting salmonella poisioning from their food, are you talking about using domestic grade freezers? I would imagine they would have to be blast frozen and kept frozen through the supply chain. How would you know if your stock was diseased etc.? Basically how could you prove to your customers that your supply is safe if there are no quality standards that apply? Basically - I wouldn't feed anything to a pet if it wasn't of a standard that I'd eat it myself (not that I'd eat rats but I'm sure you know what I mean!)

No i have no experiance of something size, i do breed gerbils on a small scale, but these are simple for pets. I will simple learn as i go.

I do have a degree in mechanical engineering, and so undersand the production methods that i will have to use.
No blast freezing is not necessery, it is mainly use in mass production applications to freez food fast to save time. There is no no risk or problem in using domistic freezers as long as they are below 2-3c.

There is no problem with salmonella as long as the food dose not thaw out once frozen. They will be delivered in either a freezer van or using couriers with them packed in cool boxes with dry ice or normal ice, with same day delivery.

I take it you have no first hand experiance of the qaulity that is availible in some pet shops. Some are so bad they litteraly fall apart after they are thawed out.
and i already explained the quality of the animals further back.

deano77777

Also using Co2 is considered one of the more humane methods for culling small large numbers of small animals like this.

There is the option of using liquid nitrogine to freeze and kill the animal in one go.

jeepers101

Deano I would be interested in buying frozen rats for a boa but why would it be more convenient to buy from you than a local pet shop. Are you offering delivery?

Cherry Blossom

deano77777 wrote: »

I take it you have no first hand experiance of the qaulity that is availible in some pet shops. Some are so bad they litteraly fall apart after they are thawed out.

Yes I have , I have worked in a pet shop that sold frozen reptile food that was extremely questionable at best. Although this was at least 10 years ago.

deano77777

jeepers101 wrote: »

Deano I would be interested in buying frozen rats for a boa but why would it be more convenient to buy from you than a local pet shop. Are you offering delivery?

Well i will be sellling to pet shops and reptile owners for the same price.
Pet shops just charge twice the price they pay from the suppliers.
Yes i hope to do deliverys, i am hoping the price of p&p will be under 10euro.

deano77777

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

Yes I have , I have worked in a pet shop that sold frozen reptile food that was extremely questionable at best. Although this was at least 10 years ago.

well its still the same in some places. They get there food from england, so there is a long transport time. Also i think some of the english suppliers get them from other european countires. so they have been thawed and refroze a few times before they get here.

Zoundz

I would be more than happy to see somebody ethically raise and cull rats for food - as long as they weren't also infiltrating the pet market which is already full of badly bred and raised rats anyway.

Besides... the methods you're talking about would not be considered ethical by anyone who loves their rats - and no good breeder would source to you.

I'm now glad I have seen this thread, as you're a member of our forum too I believe and I now know not to home to you

xx

seaniemoylan