question about custody

niallith

basically i have a 3 year old girl with my ex girlfriend, who is from usa. relationship ended i have no idea when reall , but she has ben living with me and my dad for quite a while, but anyways something happened a while back and im basically kicking her out, my ex doesnt deserve to live here no more.
i am the only one who works and she just sits at home all day wit child and talking to other guys online it seems. anyways it doesnt look like she has anywhere to go, her family back in usa dont want to take her into their homes, and she has no friends here really. but i seen her looking up like homeless shelters on this site, and well my daughter deserves a better life than that. so anyone know how long and how much a custody battle would be? and what my chances of getting the child are going on the basis that my ex has no money,no job, no income and nowhere decent to go when she leaves here??
and just forthe record we were never married and my name is on the birth cert, thanks.

Morag

HAve you tried working things out? Relationship counselling?

As you are not married she has custody and legal guardianship and you don't.

Your name on the birth cert just means she can chase you for maintenance.
She can take the child and look for emergency money while she applies for lone parent and for accommodation.

If you want custody, have you looked at what child care you will need?
What is your plan you have to have a plan put together.

You will need to get legal guardianship but as it stands she can just up and take the child and move anywhere she wants.
I'd suggest going to talk to a solicitor ASAP.

metrovelvet

You should speak to a solicitor.

If you have been working than she is the primary carer.

The name on the birthcert does mean something if she is American however, it means she cant get the child a US passport through the embassy without the father's permission. Guardianship or no guardianship.

OP- Id be careful before making your child's mother homeless. Think ahead...

common sense brigade

your going to put your childs mother into a homeless shelter. thats quite frankly horrible. even if she cheated she does not deserve to be homeless or removed from her daughter.. can you elaborate on what her crime is?
is she a good mother? if so you will be doing your daughter the biggest diservice imaginable by sending her mother away homeless.
have you even thought about childcare if you kick her out? surely the best option is to share custody. and help fiancially find your ex and daughter a home. this is your childs mother.

niallith

she did move out about 2 years ago back to america and when her amily had enough of her i took them back and have ben putting up wit her for the childs sake, it is the mother of my child yes but also the person who has made my life hell, during my cancer battle she was very unsupportive and called me cancer boy at the end of each sentance... amoung other things... i dont care about wat happens to her , i obviously care about my child if i want to take her away from her mother so she can have a proper roof over her head and get the life she deserves, i can offer her alot more than the mother obviously can, a nice house and financial support or a homeless shelter , not a tough choice really.shes an ok mother i guess not spectacular. as for financially supporting them to find a new home, i aint made of money and aint in a overly well paid job, just enough to keep us going,

common sense brigade

well i hate to tell you but without you she would be entitled child support from you. so you better try and get earning more. if she is a good mother then taking your daughter from her is insane. i dont think the courts would be in your favour at all. surely shared custody is the best option for your daughter. as for her calling you names etc there are two sides to every story in relationship problems. were you a good partner to her? did you ever call her names? have you been a good partner hand on heart?

Knine

niallith wrote: »

i am the only one who works and she just sits at home all day wit child and talking to other .

So you didnt have to pay for childcare?............ and if your ex was doing nothing then the child must have been looking after itself????
You can try and apply for custody but try saying the above to a judge and you won't get too far.

You have got very good advice above, if the relationship is definitely over, then get an access and maintenance agreement in place and talk to a solictor. Also try family mediation as if you go to court the judge may make a decision that suits neither of you and certainly not the child.

The Corinthian

Niallith - As has been pointed out to you, you should seek legal advice about guardianship ASAP.

Secondly, you need to ask yourself who is your child better off with? Is she really a good mother or just capable of adequate care and really is only the primary carer because she can't hold down a job? Or is she genuinely a better carer than you would be?

If the former, then you need to collect evidence to support your case, both of her failings as a parent and of your capabilities, then apply for both guardianship and custody.

If the latter then you will need to find some way by which she can survive financially. Find out what the options are (does she have EU citizenship?) and present them to her, then apply for both guardianship and access.

However, if she has behaved as badly as you say, then there must be repercussions. It is disgusting to suggest that one may behave as anti-socially as they like or even break as many laws as they wish and be immune from consequence because they can hide behind a child.

metrovelvet

This is not going to be easy.

A lot depends on her legal status in the country. I'm assuming she is looking at homeless shelters because she is not entitled to benefits. There is a good chance she will either be deported or be forced to pay her way back to the US, and chances are as she is the primary carer the child will go with her. You will probably get some kind of visitation/shared custody in order. And she will get a child support order.

So she has been here for two years, and the child is three. Was the child born here or in the US? Is the child a dual national or just holding one citizesnship?

Name calling will not get you much headway for removal of custody. If it did every child in this country would be wards of the state, including the children of married couples. Sorry.

And childcare will cost you about E800 month until the child starts school. And the child will miss her mother desperately, even if you don't.

A solicitor and a barrister will cost a lot more.

And a family law court judge will hate your attitude.

Lose lose for everybody.

K-9

As The Corinthian said, you need to provide evidence of why you think you deserve custody. It's rare that it is granted to a single Dad.

I'd advise against just kicking her out as the chances are the whole thing will turn into a battle and they usually don't end well. Until you can get a court case, the law will back her up as regards the child.

Does the child have a passport? She could conceivably go back to the US and there is little you can do without Guardianship.

She may qualify for lone parents based on time here and the child.

The Corinthian

Quick question: has she been unfaithful?

common sense brigade

Quick question: has she been unfaithful?

OP even is she has its not punishable by taking her daughter from her.

metrovelvet

common sense brigade wrote: »

OP even is she has its not punishable by taking her daughter from her.

I'm assuming the question relates to doubts over paternity.

niallith

metrovelvet wrote: »

This is not going to be easy.

A lot depends on her legal status in the country. I'm assuming she is looking at homeless shelters because she is not entitled to benefits. There is a good chance she will either be deported or be forced to pay her way back to the US, and chances are as she is the primary carer the child will go with her. You will probably get some kind of visitation/shared custody in order. And she will get a child support order.

So she has been here for two years, and the child is three. Was the child born here or in the US? Is the child a dual national or just holding one citizesnship?

Name calling will not get you much headway for removal of custody. If it did every child in this country would be wards of the state, including the children of married couples. Sorry.

And childcare will cost you about E800 month until the child starts school. And the child will miss her mother desperately, even if you don't.

A solicitor and a barrister will cost a lot more.

And a family law court judge will hate your attitude.

Lose lose for everybody.

o im not sure wat "childcare" facilitates exactly but wat child on this planet needs 800 a month ? i havnt even ben spending that much on all 3 of us?
as for taking the child from the mother, its equally difficult for me to lose my daughter also no ?am i expected to let put up with everything and let her go talk with other guys so they can stay here? ive ben trying my best to do that for so long ive somwat forgiven the things of the past but they live long in the memory... we are currently getting child benifits were due alot of back pay beginning of nxt month, my ex has ben here for 4 years and child was born here and has both us and irish passports.my ex is on a 1 year visa which doesnt allow her to work

metrovelvet

niallith wrote: »

o im not sure wat "childcare" facilitates exactly but wat child on this planet needs 800 a month ? i havnt even ben spending that much on all 3 of us?
as for taking the child from the mother, its equally difficult for me to lose my daughter also no ?am i expected to let put up with everything and let her go talk with other guys so they can stay here? ive ben trying my best to do that for so long ive somwat forgiven the things of the past but they live long in the memory... we are currently getting child benifits were due alot of back pay beginning of nxt month, my ex has ben here for 4 years and child was born here and has both us and irish passports.my ex is on a 1 year visa which doesnt allow her to work

Fulltime creche is at least 800 a month. Thats what you will be paying in childcare if your ex is out of the picture.

If she is not EU she has no choice but to go back to the US. You will both have to go to court to sort out an international custody and child support plan. ALso- this will have to be revised again once the child starts school- because then everything changes.

If she has been here for four years and on a one year visa she has basically been an illegal immigrant? Is that what you are saying?

niallith

well shes on a 1 year visa which allows her to be here for at least a year so i dont think shell be sent home, as for her visa i will say for about 2 years she didnt have any visa, and then when she came back from the states ( she left here for 4 months then returned) she got a 3 month visa which again was overstayed and we had to go through a solicator for the 1 year visa which she is on now
and as for custody of the child im not really trying to take her from her mother because i think shes a bad mother more so because i feel my daughter deserves a house to live in etc.

The Corinthian

niallith wrote: »

o im not sure wat "childcare" facilitates exactly but wat child on this planet needs 800 a month ? i havnt even ben spending that much on all 3 of us?

OK, I don't think you've worked this out... unless you have someone (your parents) who are willing to look after the child while you're at work, you will need to pay for childcare during those hours, and that ain't cheap.

as for taking the child from the mother, its equally difficult for me to lose my daughter also no ?am i expected to let put up with everything and let her go talk with other guys so they can stay here?

No, you shouldn't have to "put up with everything", but at the end of the day you will have to find a practical solution and one that is best for your child. This may mean custody for you and the mother having access, or the other way around. Comes down to who is best equipped to do this on various levels.

As such, you're stuck with the mother either way, to some degree or other. That does not mean that she should live with you or you should even bankroll her (you have a financial obligation to your child, not her), however it may mean that you will end up partially supporting her if she has custody, because of your child.

ive ben trying my best to do that for so long ive somwat forgiven the things of the past but they live long in the memory... we are currently getting child benifits were due alot of back pay beginning of nxt month, my ex has ben here for 4 years and child was born here and has both us and irish passports.my ex is on a 1 year visa which doesnt allow her to work

Ironically, I suspect that if you have guardianship and object to your child leaving Ireland (as she would be deported) it would make it easier for her to remain long term and apply for benefits.

Seek legal advice.

common sense brigade

Fulltime creche is at least 800 a month. Thats what you will be paying in childcare if your ex is out of the picture.

I pay 750 a month for my childs minder fees. so children do cost that much OP. If you have been living off 800 a mth for all three of you then i would question whether financially you will be able to support your child if you make her mother homeless. what you are proposing doing by seperating mother and child is going to traumatise your daughter. It sounds medieveil to be frank. whether you like her personality or not you have no right to be so callous. Can you imagine in 10 years your daughter coming to you and saying Dad you made my mother homeless on the street and you took away my chance of knowing my mother as she had no choice but to return to the USA? Your going to have to try help her find seperate accomadtion from you and be a decent human being. why had you never considered marrying her when she got pregnant in order for her able to have got residancy here and then she could also work? alternatively did you ever consider marrying and moving to the usa and giving the relationship a fresh start?

metrovelvet

niallith wrote: »

well shes on a 1 year visa which allows her to be here for at least a year so i dont think shell be sent home, as for her visa i will say for about 2 years she didnt have any visa, and then when she came back from the states ( she left here for 4 months then returned) she got a 3 month visa which again was overstayed and we had to go through a solicator for the 1 year visa which she is on now
and as for custody of the child im not really trying to take her from her mother because i think shes a bad mother more so because i feel my daughter deserves a house to live in etc.

Look, if you want her out of the house, this is what will happen.

When her Visa runs out, she will be deported or have to voluntarily return home.

You will both have to go to court to work out an international custody plan.

If the child stays with you, you will be paying a lot of money in childcare.

If she returns to the US with the child, she will be paying a lot of money in childcare.

Until the child is of school age.

Enforcement is next to impossible internationally for either access or maintenance.

Either way, you both have rights to the child and no court will take that away from either of you. No one party can write off the rights of the other. So accept that and work with it.

It doesnt matter whether you think the child is 'better off.' You picked her at the end of the day, and you cant turn around and change your mind about her. No court will buy it.

The Corinthian

common sense brigade wrote: »

if you make her mother homeless.

I'd have to question this line of logic. If there was no child involved and he kicked the same woman out on the street to fend for herself, would you be so sympathetic?

what you are proposing doing by seperating mother and child is going to traumatise your daughter. It sounds medieveil to be frank.

Separating father and child would also be quite medieval, TBH. It comes down ultimately to which parent the child is best off in the care of and in my view, just because she has been 'primary carer' (officially, in practical terms, for all we know, his father could have been lumped with the work while she surfed the Web) does not mean that she represents the best custodian for the child in the long term.

why had you never considered marrying her when she got pregnant in order for her able to have got residancy here and then she could also work?

What kind of idiot marries someone because they get them pregnant? Great basis for a lifelong commitment...

niallith - just talk to a solicitor about your options, ASAP.

common sense brigade

can i also add that a child is not a pawn to be played between parents, your little girl has a bond with her mother and however much u might hope it wouldnt happen, your child will be devastated at losing her mother. she will carry the pain throughout her life take it from me i know as i lost my own mother at a very young age. hand on heart does the mother love the child? and treat her with love. if the answer to that is yes then you should rethink your plans and quickly.

metrovelvet

The Corinthian wrote: »

I'd have to question this line of logic. If there was no child involved and he kicked the same woman out on the street to fend for herself, would you be so sympathetic?

Separating father and child would also be quite medieval, TBH. It comes down ultimately to which parent the child is best off in the care of and in my view, just because she has been 'primary carer' (officially, in practical terms, for all we know, his father could have been lumped with the work while she surfed the Web) does not mean that she represents the best custodian for the child in the long term.

What kind of idiot marries someone because they get them pregnant? Great basis for a lifelong commitment...

niallith - just talk to a solicitor about your options, ASAP.

But there is a child involved. You cant erase that factor.

It only has partially to do with who 'performs better as a parent' and no one can really judge that bar cruelty.

Its about attachment and the child's security. I don't want to get into a an argument about this.

niallith

well ex was seperated from her mother at the age of 3 i think(she just got up and left) so she was raised by her grandparents, and never really showed to be scarred by it all tho they did get in contact over the phone and are building a friendship again.. and yes m yex does love her child and treats her right, but am i to continue going to work supporting her even do shes takin the piss and chatting with other guys, its happened twice beforre and i forgave for those times and just tried to forget but then i find out once again shes off with some other guy , really why would i want her herer any longer, its not a big issue for me but still somthing to think about how ill ever move on and find another girl:? saying ""oh i still live with my ex" conversation over... anyways ill havto give it alot of thought and maybe it might be best to just bite the bullet and allow her to stay and continue to be unhappy for ever but for the sake of my daughters happyness.

common sense brigade

What kind of idiot marries someone because they get them pregnant? Great basis for a lifelong commitment...

i only said this as the OP is moaning that she sits at home all day not working. so in the real world without romance and flowers a simple marriage contract would have enabled her to work. child needs food etc i would marry a man if it enabled me to support my family.
also the child is better off with both parents. shared custody.
and i would be totally unsympathetic if the OP was making someone homeless over name calling. yes i would.i think making someone homeless is the lowest of the low. esp the mother of your child.

metrovelvet

The kinds of idiots who marry someone they get pregnant are the smart idiots. Its the stupid idiots who dont. The smart idiots get to raise their kids and be part of their lives. No better reason to marry than a child, bar cruelty.

common sense brigade

and yes m yex does love her child and treats her right

OP that says it all really , and i raise my hat to you for being man enough to admit that.
no one wants you to be unhappy forever OP. And if your both exes now the best option is to try get your ex working and her own place or perhaps ring social welfare and see can she get rent allowance and loan parents payment?.
if i met you and you told me ur story and i could see yeah your in a crap situation but you didnt want to make ur ex homeless i would think you a better man for doing that. making her homeless could have and would have devastating effects.

The Corinthian

metrovelvet wrote: »

But there is a child involved. You cant erase that factor.

It only has partially to do with who 'performs better as a parent' and no one can really judge that bar cruelty.

Actually a lot of it comes down to who 'performs better as a parent' - who will be better for the child in the long term. Avoiding short term 'cruelty' in favour of long term 'cruelty' is actually the worst thing that can be done. And as things stand the relationship has ended, so the child will suffer either way - unless someone wants to suggest they stay together for "the good of the child", which is the dumbest thing that anyone could suggest.

Unfortunately in this case it is impossible to say if the child would be better off with the mother or niallith - the picture painted of the mother has not been very good, but some of niallith's responses have left a lot to be desired too.

However, I do think it ridiculous how a child is so often used as a means to absolve, or even reward, a mother for whatever wrongs she's committed.

Ultimately, my gut feeling is that if he gets guardianship he will have a legal right to block the mother returning to the US if she has custody. This would result in her ability to remain in Ireland and, likely, apply for social assistance.

If I were him I would consult a solicitor on this and other options and then present them to her when things are clearer and, ideally, tempers have settled a little.

common sense brigade wrote: »

i only said this as the OP is moaning that she sits at home all day not working. so in the real world without romance and flowers a simple marriage contract would have enabled her to work. child needs food etc i would marry a man if it enabled me to support my family.

No doubt you would, because that man would then be legally obligated to support you financially, not just his child. Very convenient.

also the child is better off with both parents. shared custody.

I agree.

and i would be totally unsympathetic if the OP was making someone homeless over name calling. yes i would.i think making someone homeless is the lowest of the low. esp the mother of your child.

We don't really know the full story, but I would imagine there's more to it than simple name calling. Overall though, I just get the feeling that you're looking after the interests of the mother over those of the child in your responses.

metrovelvet

You are wrong in EVERYTHING you posted above.

The Corinthian

niallith wrote: »

and yes m yex does love her child and treats her right,

You need to then ask yourself honestly whom is your daughter best off with? Because, financial stability aside (and that can be sorted out) you seem to be suggesting perhaps her.

but am i to continue going to work supporting her even do shes takin the piss and chatting with other guys, its happened twice beforre and i forgave for those times and just tried to forget but then i find out once again shes off with some other guy

Is or has she been actually unfaithful or are you simply upset at her talking to other guys. If it's the latter, I think you're being unreasonable.

The Corinthian

metrovelvet wrote: »

You are wrong in EVERYTHING you posted above.

Then argue why or just don't bother commenting.

common sense brigade

No doubt you would, because that man would then be legally obligated to support you financially, not just his child. Very convenient.

What i think thats wholly insulting. i meant if they married she could work and get her own place not sponge off him. that is all i meant. ur extremely offensive . for the record i have never claimed welfare have full time career and am a mother and married. and have supported my husband in times of his umeployment. happily as i love him very much.
i have always supported fathers rights on here. i myself was raised by men with no mother. and my mother was no good. but i get the feeling the OP partner is a good mother and am trying to suggest alternatives than seperating mother child and father.