N40 - New route number for Cork South Ring Road?

Chris_5339762

M40 would be nicer from the point of view of a blue line, but also less stupidity with putting shopping centers at each junction. Preventing inappropriate development is very important.

charlemont

SeanW wrote: »

*Cough* *cough* M50 ...

M50 was originally planned as a motorway and Dublin is the capital anyway so as all major routes converge there its only right they are connected by motorway.

AugustusMinimus

charlemont wrote: »

M50 was originally planned as a motorway and Dublin is the capital anyway so as all major routes converge there its only right they are connected by motorway.

And this means that the N40 shouldn't be classified as motorway because......

It would link the M8 with the M20 and potentially with the M25. Why is there such a prevailing thought in this country that Dublin is the only city allowed to have certain things. I was shocked for instance when there was finally a stretch of motorway built outside of Leinster.

charlemont

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

And this means that the N40 shouldn't be classified as motorway because......

Because if you actually read my previous posts you would see my reasons, Or can you not read properly ?

AugustusMinimus

charlemont wrote: »

Because if you actually read my previous posts you would see my reasons, Or can you not read properly ?

Why the person abuse ?

I have read your previous posts. Why for instance do you not trust drivers if the SRR would be reclassified as motorway. No one here has said anything about putting a 120kph speed limit on the SRR if it were reclassified as motorway.

If anything it would make it safer as it would finally stop tractors, learner drivers, cyclists and even pedestrians from using it. I can see no issue at all with making the N40 the M40. There are no alternative route issues and a 100kph limit can be applied where warranted.

I also have no idea why you are bringing the size of both cities into the arguement. What does that have to do with anything ?

charlemont wrote: »

The M50 was build as a motorway and Dublin is a large city whereas Cork is really only a regional city, The SRR as it is has too many junctions and also has the Douglas viaduct with no hard shoulders, I travel that road a lot and no I wouldn't trust a lot of the drivers there if it was a motorway, I'v no problem with the speed limit being increased but I just couldn't see it as a motorway, Too much local traffic and lets face facts all the vehicles barred from a motorway would still use it anyway.

charlemont

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Why the person abuse ?

I have read your previous posts. Why for instance do you not trust drivers if the SRR would be reclassified as motorway. No one here has said anything about putting a 120kph speed limit on the SRR if it were reclassified as motorway.

If anything it would make it safer as it would finally stop tractors, learner drivers, cyclists and even pedestrians from using it.

OK I apologise for that.. Makes no real difference to me what the road becomes but reclassifying it as a motorway and keeping 100km as the speed limit kind of defeats the purpose of making it a motorway in the first place. Lots of motorists won't obey the speed limit of 100km once the blue signs are up.

Learner drivers, Construction vehicles, Cyclists are still going to use it anyway regardless of the law.

AugustusMinimus

I personally think the primary driver towards any reclassification as a motorway should be to get cyclists, pedestrians and tractors off the SRR.

As you have already noted, the Douglas flyover is 2+2 with no hard shoulder. This is no place for a cyclist and yet I have passed them there. I've also encountered tractors caused major tailbacks.

My view is that it's up to the Minister for Transport in conjunction with the NRA to reclassify roads where it is deemed correct to. Having cyclists, pedestrians and tractors using the SRR if it were reclassified, is a policing issue and IMO, should bare no part in the decision process.

munchkin_utd

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

I personally think the primary driver towards any reclassification as a motorway should be to get cyclists, pedestrians and tractors off the SRR.
<snip>

see, thats were theres already a solution across the world to that problem without having a motorway.

You can have a "Limited Access Road" (/expressway / motor road etc) which has the much the same rules as a motorway but isnt one, i.e. only motor traffic allowed and pedestrians, dogs, cattle, cyclists, elephants, marching bands etc not allowed

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited-access_road

SeanW

And this is better than a motorway because?

AugustusMinimus

munchkin_utd wrote: »

see, thats were theres already a solution across the world to that problem without having a motorway.

You can have a "Limited Access Road" (/expressway / motor road etc) which has the much the same rules as a motorway but isnt one, i.e. only motor traffic allowed and pedestrians, dogs, cattle, cyclists, elephants, marching bands etc not allowed

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited-access_road

The wiki link says that the Limited-access road type in Ireland is HQDC. This makes no sense.

HQDC is a motorway standard road without any limitations to tractors, pedestrians or cyclists. The very opposite and what we'd be trying to achieve on the SRR.

The only Irish example I can think of is the Jack Lynch Tunnel itself which has restrictions placed on it using local by-laws. Now, I personally think this is unacceptable for the entire SRR. The SRR is a National Route under the control of NRA and yet it would be Cork County Council (and City Council as part of the SRR falls within City boundaries) which would have to tandem together to put though necessary legisaltion. Madness.

niloc1951

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

....................Why for instance do you not trust drivers if the SRR would be reclassified as motorway. No one here has said anything about putting a 120kph speed limit on the SRR if it were reclassified as motorway.

If anything it would make it safer as it would finally stop tractors, learner drivers, cyclists and even pedestrians from using it. I can see no issue at all with making the N40 the M40. There are no alternative route issues and a 100kph limit can be applied where warranted.....................

Consider the madness of the 120 km/h speed limits on sections of the N25 & N22 where unlimited access is allowed
It's not unusual to see learner drivers, cyclists, hitch-hikers, slow moving agricultural and construction machinery and static electronic message signs sharing the same road space with traffic travelling at 120 km/h.

pigtown

Does anyone know why it's going to be the N40? Will Limerick's bypass be renamed the N30 in a similar way?

AugustusMinimus

pigtown wrote: »

Does anyone know why it's going to be the N40? Will Limerick's bypass be renamed the N30 in a similar way?

When eventually the NRR get's done, it would be incredibly confusing to have 2 seperate route numbers to represent the one ring road.

pigtown

Is that the official reason? As it stands the Limerick Southern bypass includes some M7 and N18 and the Northern Bypass will have a different name again so I'd imagine they will do the same in Limerick so.

nordydan

pigtown wrote: »

Is that the official reason? As it stands the Limerick Southern bypass includes some M7 and N18 and the Northern Bypass will have a different name again so I'd imagine they will do the same in Limerick so.

I'd imagine they won't tbh.

There isn't a major junction with another National Primay route on the Cork SRR like there is on the Limerick bypass (M7/M20/N18)

pigtown wrote: »

Does anyone know why it's going to be the N40? Will Limerick's bypass be renamed the N30 in a similar way?

The N30 runs from New Ross to Enniscorthy

Storm2

pigtown wrote: »

Does anyone know why it's going to be the N40? Will Limerick's bypass be renamed the N30 in a similar way?

Ah! :eek: You obviously haven't checked a map. There's an N30 in County Wexford that runs from New Ross to Enniscorthy. Correct me if I'm wrong but that was the N79 before becoming the N30.

Sponge Bob

pigtown wrote: »

Does anyone know why it's going to be the N40? Will Limerick's bypass be renamed the N30 in a similar way?

Limerick will get the N45 ( as in Colt 45) if they ever bother finishing the northern bypass that is.

spacetweek

charlemont wrote: »

OK I apologise for that.. Makes no real difference to me what the road becomes but reclassifying it as a motorway and keeping 100km as the speed limit kind of defeats the purpose of making it a motorway in the first place.

No it won't. Higher speeds aren't the only reason for motorways.

charlemont wrote: »

Lots of motorists won't obey the speed limit of 100km once the blue signs are up.

Learner drivers, Construction vehicles, Cyclists are still going to use it anyway regardless of the law.

Far too fatalistic. They are either bloody well barred or they are not. You should be calling the police when you see this type of thing. I never see it in Dublin.

Carawaystick

Storm2 wrote: »

Ah! :eek: You obviously haven't checked a map. There's an N30 in County Wexford that runs from New Ross to Enniscorthy. Correct me if I'm wrong but that was the N79 before becoming the N30.

yep, twas alright.


I think using N40 is a bad move, it breaks the geographical system of N routes ( which only the n26 really breaks at present)

A simpler way would be to use N27 for the ring road and have the N28 running from Ringaskiddy to the SRR and then up to the airport; and de trunk the roads inside the south ring

The N52 already runs along the M6, so there's a precedent for overlapping routes.

Or designate the Kinsale road as whatever R road it is south of the Airport.

Storm2

Carawaystick wrote: »

yep, twas alright.


I think using N40 is a bad move, it breaks the geographical system of N routes ( which only the n26 really breaks at present)

A simpler way would be to use N27 for the ring road and have the N28 running from Ringaskiddy to the SRR and then up to the airport; and de trunk the roads inside the south ring

The N52 already runs along the M6, so there's a precedent for overlapping routes.

Or designate the Kinsale road as whatever R road it is south of the Airport.

Problem there as well: both of those exist!:eek:

AugustusMinimus

Carawaystick wrote: »

yep, twas alright.


I think using N40 is a bad move, it breaks the geographical system of N routes ( which only the n26 really breaks at present)

A simpler way would be to use N27 for the ring road and have the N28 running from Ringaskiddy to the SRR and then up to the airport; and de trunk the roads inside the south ring

The N52 already runs along the M6, so there's a precedent for overlapping routes.

Or designate the Kinsale road as whatever R road it is south of the Airport.

That would be insanely confusing. You would have two branches of the N28 heading south off the SRR.

spacetweek

Carawaystick wrote: »

I think using N40 is a bad move, it breaks the geographical system of N routes ( which only the n26 really breaks at present)

Yes. They could have killed two birds with one stone by renaming the N26 with a National Secondary number (since I'm not convinced it has a primary strategic purpose) and calling the Cork South Ring the N26 (which would keep all Cork city roads in the form N2x while maintaining the separation of N25 from South Ring).

The only explanation I can think of for assigning it N40 is to mirror Dublin's numbering of its ring road.

L1011

Carawaystick wrote: »

The N52 already runs along the M6, so there's a precedent for overlapping routes.

The N52 also runs along the N4 and, going on the signage, an R road briefly.

Carawaystick wrote: »

Or designate the Kinsale road as whatever R road it is south of the Airport.

R600.

Carawaystick

MYOB wrote: »

The N52 also runs along the N4 and, going on the signage, an R road briefly.



R600.

yep.



Re the N28, yeah I'd just get rid of the N27 to Airport, it only need a plane sign really, no road numbers or anything. The R600 seems important ( round number) to be used for the south link.

Kevwoody

Would it not be a better priority to spend what limited cash there is on fixing (re-fixing the recent crap attempt) the surface disintegration of the westbound carriageway of this section than putting the money in the pocket of Mr Rennick for a project which will do nothing for the driving experience along the said stretch of roadway.[/Quote]



Why is it every time a new sign refurbishment contract takes place you have idiots giving out that the money should be spent on fixing pot holes?

Road signage is a major part of any road, and I'm sure that "mr. Rennicks" was the best value contractor who bidded for the job.

Most of the signage on the N25 is over 10years old, in some places 15 or more, so any allocation of funds should be appreciated.

Messed up there with quote, original was by Nilac1951

KCAccidental

The airport road will eventually be upgraded to at least 2+2, so it's probably better for it to stay as the N27

AugustusMinimus

Can't understand the complaints about using N40 for the SRR.

No body seems to be complaining about the M50 designation eventhough it's completely out of whack with the roads around it.

IMO, it's a pity that the other round numbers such as N20, N30 and N60 weren't reserved for other city ring roads.

Irish and Proud

The N40 is now shown on openstreetmap!

L1011

N60 would be a secondary AM. N90 is available if we want to give a secondary designation to a ringroad (and I've seen the number mentioned for the leinster outer ring before).

niloc1951

Kevwoody wrote: »

Would it not be a better priority to spend what limited cash there is on fixing (re-fixing the recent crap attempt) the surface disintegration of the westbound carriageway of this section than putting the money in the pocket of Mr Rennick for a project which will do nothing for the driving experience along the said stretch of roadway.

Posted by Kevwoody
Why is it every time a new sign refurbishment contract takes place you have idiots giving out that the money should be spent on fixing pot holes?

Road signage is a major part of any road, and I'm sure that "mr. Rennicks" was the best value contractor who bidded for the job.

Most of the signage on the N25 is over 10years old, in some places 15 or more, so any allocation of funds should be appreciated.

Messed up there with quote, original was by Nilac1951[/QUOTE]



BUT, the existing signs aren't broken but the roads are.

And BTW the locations of the places mentioned on the signs haven't changer either.