N40 - New route number for Cork South Ring Road?

spacetweek

MYOB wrote: »

N60 would be a secondary AM. N90 is available if we want to give a secondary designation to a ringroad (and I've seen the number mentioned for the leinster outer ring before).

Can I ask where you saw that?

spacetweek

I've created a new page on my roads site for the N40, and removed references to the Cork Southern Ring on the N25 page.

L1011

spacetweek wrote: »

Can I ask where you saw that?

An absolute age ago there was a dead tree exhibition of a route proposal in Lucan Library. Why Lucan, I've no idea, as it was never going to go near it.

Amtmann

spacetweek wrote: »

I've created a new page on my roads site for the N40, and removed references to the Cork Southern Ring on the N25 page.

On that page, do a CTRL + F and search for Jack Lee. Replace with Jack Lynch

Carawaystick

KCAccidental wrote: »

The airport road will eventually be upgraded to at least 2+2, so it's probably better for it to stay as the N27

Then you still have the R600 going from Cork Airport to Kinsale.
The R132 is being made into a Dual carriageway around Dublin Airport, no need to make it N
it's Dual carriageway again for a decent way from Swords to Donabate again without making it an N route.

The geographical nature of our N roads network is a fairly good thing, and shouldn't be broken at a whim. The N10 and N30 are fairly unimportant routes ( in the national scheme of things), round number routes are nothing special.

If you've ever looked at the A2 from Newry up the coast to Derry, and followed the road numbering scheme on it and off it, you'll see why the system on N roads is better.

KCAccidental

Carawaystick wrote: »

Then you still have the R600 going from Cork Airport to Kinsale.
The R132 is being made into a Dual carriageway around Dublin Airport, no need to make it N
it's Dual carriageway again for a decent way from Swords to Donabate again without making it an N route.

The geographical nature of our N roads network is a fairly good thing, and shouldn't be broken at a whim. The N10 and N30 are fairly unimportant routes ( in the national scheme of things), round number routes are nothing special.

If you've ever looked at the A2 from Newry up the coast to Derry, and followed the road numbering scheme on it and off it, you'll see why the system on N roads is better.

The R132 is the secondary route to Dublin airport though, the N27 is the primary route to Cork Airport, it is an important road especially for first time visitors and business in the airport park. The R600 goes from Cork Airport to Kinsale already and has done for the past 15 years.

Also it's a matter of maintenance and funding. The N27 is extremely busy (it also includes the South Link dual carriageway into the city from the Kinsale Road Roundabout) The NRA maintain the National routes, if the N27 were to be detrunked then it would be in the hands of Cork City/County council which already struggles to maintain the existing 'R' network in Cork.

I really couldn't care less what N number the South Ring road takes, but to detrunk one of the busiest routes in Cork City area just for cosmetic reasons is ridiculous.

Amtmann

Rennicks out in force today at N22 junction 3 (Ovens/EMC). They've erected new signage poles at the junction roundabouts.

Typewriter

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/dual-carriageway-to-get-1m-6-month-revamp-190230.html

Wild Bill

Jayuu wrote: »

And if time does overtake your plan then is putting in an "A" junction number such a big deal.

It's no deal at all :cool:

Bar the failure to predict the NX as J2 I'd have no quibbles with the NRA on this.

Wild Bill

Irish and Proud wrote: »

The N40 is now shown on openstreetmap!

That's the M4 - not the N40

Wild Bill

MYOB wrote: »

N60 would be a secondary AM. N90 is available if we want to give a secondary designation to a ringroad (and I've seen the number mentioned for the leinster outer ring before).

N and M already sound too similar and are often mixed up by RTE types.

M45 for the DOOR would be clearly distinguishable from M50 in a way that M40 isn't.

I know about this; I once phoned the Pat Kenny show (circa 2006) when they were talking about litter to complain that the section of the M50 passing through South Dublin CoCo was a linear tip (as it was back then).

When Pat read out my comment he went:

"Someone has commented that the M40 road to the Airport is....M40?....where is that? Isn't that a motorway in England? Maybe he means the M1 - that goes to the airport"

This is a true story!

L1011

Wild Bill wrote: »

That's the M4 - not the N40

Its just a link to the site in general, it'll go to wherever you had open last.

Hogzy

€1,000,000 to change 2 numbers on signs for 10 junctions.

Thats €100,000 per junction to change 25 to 40. Its not as if all the signs have to be replaced. All they have to do is etch out 25 and replace it with 40.


Why the F is this costing one million euro?

Wild Bill

Hogzy wrote: »

Why the F is this costing one million euro?

I assume it's part of a general signs upgrade. Badly needed. Speaking as a Dub, the signage on the N25 Cork South Ring was cr*p :cool:

Kevwoody

Hogzy wrote: »

€1,000,000 to change 2 numbers on signs for 10 junctions.

Thats €100,000 per junction to change 25 to 40. Its not as if all the signs have to be replaced. All they have to do is etch out 25 and replace it with 40.


Why the F is this costing one million euro?

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about
Of course all the signs need to be replaced, there are signs mounted on poles which are not safe to be on a road with a 100k limit, so they will be installing passively safe poles.

The timing of this now with the new flyovers being built is spot on, at least the NRA got it right.

Hogzy

Kevwoody wrote: »

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about
Of course all the signs need to be replaced, there are signs mounted on poles which are not safe to be on a road with a 100k limit, so they will be installing passively safe poles.

The timing of this now with the new flyovers being built is spot on, at least the NRA got it right.

Thanks for enlightening me. No need to be such a dick about it. Try calm down a bit. Its just a road :rolleyes:

charlemont

I could have swore they erected new signage on the SSR in the last 6 months.

Wild Bill

Hogzy wrote: »

No need to be such a dick about it.

Lads...lads....:rolleyes:

Amtmann

charlemont wrote: »

I could have swore they erected new signage on the SSR in the last 6 months.

They erected two new gantries and a few cantilevers late last year, none of which will be replaced by the signs in this current upgrade.

In my opinion, the signage upgrade is very badly needed.

spacetweek

Amtmann wrote: »

In my opinion, the signage upgrade is very badly needed.

Agreed. The M50 has been greatly improved since it got its signage overhaul during the 2006-2010 rebuild.

Solair

Why not just call it the M40 ?
Once the flyovers are done, it has no interrupting junctions from Dunkettle to the far side of Ballincollig and seems to all be to motorway standards.

Hogzy

Solair wrote: »

Why not just call it the M40 ?
Once the flyovers are done, it has no interrupting junctions from Dunkettle to the far side of Ballincollig and seems to all be to motorway standards.

Lack of a hard shoulder at the Douglas flyover

AugustusMinimus

Hogzy wrote: »

Lack of a hard shoulder at the Douglas flyover

Is this technically a requirement for motorways.

Plenty of German autobahn without a regular breakdown lane.

L1011

No H/S on the M1 Broadmeadow bridge, M50 DPT, etc. Also smaller discontinuities on the M18 and M7 that I'm aware of.

However the road in general isn't really up to standard in many places.

Wild Bill

MYOB wrote: »

However the road in general isn't really up to standard in many places.

Agreed. But that doesn't prevent the Germans from classing many shoulder-less sections as Autobahns.

Folk here would have a hysterical fit is the NRA were to treat 'European norms' with such disdain :cool:

They'd probably cite Germany as the sort of organized joined-up country we should be! :rolleyes:

etchyed

Wild Bill wrote: »

Agreed. But that doesn't prevent the Germans from classing many shoulder-less sections as Autobahns.

Folk here would have a hysterical fit is the NRA were to treat 'European norms' with such disdain :cool:

They'd probably cite Germany as the sort of organized joined-up country we should be! :rolleyes:

What is your point here? I mean that in two ways, first of all the syntax is not very clear, so I don't know whether you're referring to the Germans as having the "European norms" or everyone else. Secondly, what exactly are you condemning, who would have hysterical fits and why are you rolling your eyes? What exactly are you getting at? This seems to be a bit of a hobby horse for you.

niloc1951

etchyed wrote: »

What is your point here? I mean that in two ways, first of all the syntax is not very clear, so I don't know whether you're referring to the Germans as having the "European norms" or everyone else. Secondly, what exactly are you condemning, who would have hysterical fits and why are you rolling your eyes? What exactly are you getting at? This seems to be a bit of a hobby horse for you.

I can't follow Wild Bill's comment either,
BUT having over 60,000 kms experience on European roads of all classifications in recent years alone, IMHO the NRA really do seem to be 'paddling their own canoe' and not providing best practice standards at times.
Perhaps they should get out from behind their desks a bit more and take the ferry to Europe on a few fact finding missions.

The only country I have seen 'new' roads degrading so quickly is Italy, where the road building sector is among those where corruption is rumoured to be rife.

etchyed

niloc1951 wrote: »

I can't follow Wild Bill's comment either,
BUT having over 60,000 kms experience on European roads of all classifications in recent years alone, IMHO the NRA really do seem to be 'paddling their own canoe' and not providing best practice standards at times.
Perhaps they should get out from behind their desks a bit more and take the ferry to Europe on a few fact finding missions.

The only country I have seen 'new' roads degrading so quickly is Italy, where the road building sector is among those where corruption is rumoured to be rife.

Although I didn't fully understand Wild Bill's point, I understood enough to know that it was aimed at comments like yours. Bill doesn't like when we compare practice in Ireland to best practice abroad.

Unfortunately on this occasion I'm going to have to side with him, as you're suggesting that the NRA haven't bothered to look into best practice at all and that driving around in Europe makes you some kind of expert. Weren't you the guy who missed the four signs warning you about the M7/M8 diverge and then came on here to say it was the NRA's fault?

Ludo

niloc1951 wrote: »

I can't follow Wild Bill's comment either,
BUT having over 60,000 kms experience on European roads of all classifications in recent years alone, IMHO the NRA really do seem to be 'paddling their own canoe' and not providing best practice standards at times.
Perhaps they should get out from behind their desks a bit more and take the ferry to Europe on a few fact finding missions.

And if they did exactly that, people would probably be on here berating them for wasting tax payers money on junkets to europe!!!!
Can't win really with some people.

spacetweek

I would say that as far as the new signage we're seeing nationwide goes, it's clear that it has indeed been copied from Europe. The motorway gantries look very German, the font used in the speed limit changeover is Swiss/German, and the new regional flag signs are French/UK style.

I think Wild Bill was saying that if anyone compared European norms unfavourably to Ireland that that would upset everyone.