USA to win world cup within 20 years

losthorizon

The problem lies within the US itself and where they are concentrating. I havent read up on it in a few years but the complaint was that most of the coaches were either British or from the college system while all the best players (and fans) were from the hispanic areas. Both were being excluded. There is enermous potential there but the USSF havent a clue how to devlope their footbal, who to aim it at and who to bring through their system. They also need to stop playing British style football when those most interested in the game are of hispanic origin.

Panthro

partyndbs wrote: »

the 1990 team was all college players, fast forward 20 years and our players are playing for solid european clubs with the exception of donovon but hes the exception he is our world class player and plays at home.

in another 20 years our team will prob be made up of players playing for elite clubs with a much greater strength and depth becoz the mls will be prob at least same level as ligue 1 by then i think.

If thats the case, Ireland should be dominating world football by 2026 I'm predicting, given the amount of talented players we have who are plying their trade in Engerland these days.(wouldn't bank on it though)

Jesus Wept

Heard the same 20 years ago, guess that one didn't come off.

Dempsey

OP, your evaluations of Landon Donovan & Clint Dempsey shows that you are clearly over estimating your current players. Also MLS is nowhere near the championship level in England and whilst the MLS continues in its current structure it wont get far, never mind being on par with Ligue 1.

If you cannot be realistic with where you currently are then you definately are well wrong even dreaming up of the notion of winning a WC within 20 years.

partyndbs

the only problem we have is that bit of flair needed and a world class striker, i thought jozy would be the man but doesnt look too likely anymore. agudelo looks to have real promise tho, scored against argentina as someone already mentioned and is only 18. also i still havent ruled freddy out but he needs to get back to the mls FAST!!

TerryTibbs!

You have alot to learn kid.

eagle eye

As regards actually winning it, well thats very hard to predict but I voted yes. I really voted more that I expect them to be serious contendors and among the favourites by the time we have another three world cups.

As far as the present bunch are concerned. Just think about it for a second and think how much they have improved since they hosted the tournament in '94. I really do think that in ten years time they will be one of the strongest sides in international football.

Agree that Agudelo looks very promising and having Henry to mentor him for a short while is going to be very helpful imo. The youth system is changing over there now. It used to be the case that all footballers went through the college system but now the best are brought into the MLS at a younger age. Those years between the age of 16 and 20 are so crucial in the development of a footballer.

The current team has a lot of players that went through the college system. The younger players though have been signed up to teams from a younger age and you would expect their football development to be better because of that.

SeantheMan

Spain, Holland and Germany for the next 12years (3WC's) at least.

They seem to have the right systems of bringing through youths and amazingly gifted players.

I know England recently have been churning out some quality...but I don't want to entertain the thought.

doncarlos

partyndbs wrote: »

i think in 20 years usa will be at least the level of the dutch team for example.

Maybe Dundalk's champion league winning team might have a couple of US internationals on it!

cardwizzard

I don't think the Yanks will win it in the next 20 years. While they are devolping fast, very other team is still improving also. So they will probably close the gap, but never likely to overtake the top tier teams IMO.


I lived in the U.S for years and football is at best the 5th most popoular sport. I know they have a huge population, but so does Brazil, Russia, China etc. Landon Donovan and Dempsey are mid table team players, thats why they play for mid table teams.

As far as getting lucky and doing a Greece in the world cup, I don't think so. Look at all the great teams who have never won it, the Dutch spring to mind numerous times.

Le King

Dotsey wrote: »

Their best players over the last 20 years: Landon Donovan, Clint Dempsey, Jozy Altidore, DaMarcus Beasley, Brian McBride, Cobi Jones, Eric Wynalda, Joe Max Moore, Brad Friedel, Kasey Keller

Wow, huge omissions there for players who have been much better for the national team.

No John Harkes? Claudio Reyna? Eddie Pope? Thomas Dooley? Tim Howard? Oguchi Onyewu? Michael Bradley? Carlos Bocanegra? Steve Cherundolo?

Pretty funny man.

cardwizzard

Le King wrote: »

Wow, huge omissions there for players who have been much better for the national team.

No John Harkes? Claudio Reyna? Eddie Pope? Thomas Dooley? Tim Howard? Oguchi Onyewu? Michael Bradley? Carlos Bocanegra? Steve Cherundolo?

Pretty funny man.

Think his point is that they are all average players by international standards....

eagle eye

cardwizzard wrote: »

I don't think the Yanks will win it in the next 20 years. While they are devolping fast, very other team is still improving also. So they will probably close the gap, but never likely to overtake the top tier teams IMO.


I lived in the U.S for years and football is at best the 5th most popoular sport. I know they have a huge population, but so does Brazil, Russia, China etc. Landon Donovan and Dempsey are mid table team players, thats why they play for mid table teams.

As far as getting lucky and doing a Greece in the world cup, I don't think so. Look at all the great teams who have never won it, the Dutch spring to mind numerous times.

5th most popular sport on tv maybe but in real life its played by more kids than any of the top 4 sports.

The Seattle Sounders average attendance grew by 6k from 2009 to 2010 up to 36k. The LA Galaxy passed the 20k mark in 2009 and grew by another 5% in 2010, they are expected to have over 23k for 2011. Phildelphia Union started out with 19k average in 2010 and they are expected to jump to 25k this coming season.

The MLS average attendance is now 3rd among American sports having passed both the NHL and the NBA. The sport is growing all the time over there and the population of the USA is over 300 million so there is plenty of room for it go keep growing.

5starpool

eagle eye wrote: »

The MLS average attendance is now 3rd among American sports having passed both the NHL and the NBA.

This is a bit misleading as both of these are played at indoor arenas around small playing areas.

Good to see that it is growing and seems to be succeeding over there at that level, but I think most of the young real sports talents there will still be groomed for other sports over football in most cases.

premierstone

Some extremely arrogant and condesending posts on here, the OP has asked a very reasonable question and if people cant see the huge potential, and improvement already, then they need to expand their minds just a little past the Premier league.

Whether they can win a world cup is I would say unlikely as someone else pointed out that is only 5 world cups to do it in, but I would fully expect them to be within the top tier of International football by then.

Someone also sneered at the OP's assertion that the US currently have a better team than Ireland, I agree with him, and even if you think Ireland are a better team, there is very little in it. And also Clint Dempsey has been well above 'average' this season, but he doesnt play for one of the big 4 so maybe alot of the snipers here havent seen him play

Pepe LeFrits

The current US team really isn't all that much better than the 94 team.

cardwizzard

eagle eye wrote: »

5th most popular sport on tv maybe but in real life its played by more kids than any of the top 4 sports.

The Seattle Sounders average attendance grew by 6k from 2009 to 2010 up to 36k. The LA Galaxy passed the 20k mark in 2009 and grew by another 5% in 2010, they are expected to have over 23k for 2011. Phildelphia Union started out with 19k average in 2010 and they are expected to jump to 25k this coming season.

The MLS average attendance is now 3rd among American sports having passed both the NHL and the NBA. The sport is growing all the time over there and the population of the USA is over 300 million so there is plenty of room for it go keep growing.

Forgot about Nascar so that pushes football down even futher, and what about WWF. As far as figures in attendance I see you didn't mention Nascar or college football. NCAA college basketball dwarfs football there. Ask your average yank who won the MLS last year and I bet less than 10% would know.

Your figures about numbers at games is so screwed up man:):):) 18000 once a week or 17000 indoors 3-4 times a week for NHL, NBA.

eagle eye

5starpool wrote: »

This is a bit misleading as both of these are played at indoor arenas around small playing areas.

Good to see that it is growing and seems to be succeeding over there at that level, but I think most of the young real sports talents there will still be groomed for other sports over football in most cases.

I get what you are saying but at this time its a case of NBA and NHL attendances dropping while the MLS grows.

eagle eye

cardwizzard wrote: »

Forgot about Nascar so that pushes football down even futher, and what about WWF. As far as figures in attendance I see you didn't mention Nascar or college football. NCAA college basketball dwarfs football there. Ask your average yank who won the MLS last year and I bet less than 10% would know.

Your figures about numbers at games is so screwed up man:):):) 18000 once a week or 17000 indoors 3-4 times a week for NHL, NBA.

No team plays four home games in a week in either of those sports. Yes NASCAR is also popular. I think it just shows the diversity in sporting interests and with a population of that size its no surprise. As I said with such a huge population the popularity of other sports is not such a big issue although when you see attendances dropping at some sports and increasing in the MLS it does show that its gaining ground.

Le King

cardwizzard wrote: »

Forgot about Nascar so that pushes football down even futher, and what about WWF. As far as figures in attendance I see you didn't mention Nascar or college football. NCAA college basketball dwarfs football there. Ask your average yank who won the MLS last year and I bet less than 10% would know.

Your figures about numbers at games is so screwed up man:):):) 18000 once a week or 17000 indoors 3-4 times a week for NHL, NBA.

We are talking 20 years. You do understand that?

Soccer is extremely popular amongst Children now-a-days. But it suffers in High School as both soccer and American Football are played in the Fall. This needs to be changed. However, during the Winter period soccer is growing extremely fast in places with warmer climates in the US, more and more soccer is being switched on peoples TV's compared to Winter Sports.

It's always going to be dwarfed in the next 20 years by the big four. One reason being that Ice Hockey, Football, Basketball and Baseball are the highest leagues in their respective sports. The MLS is not. Time will tell but we will definitely have a very strong team in the next 20 years. Too many kids are playing soccer to not have a team. Problem is that the best will go towards the NFL. But a lockout could help soccer loads.

cardwizzard

Le King, yeah I agree with you with most of what you are saying. But when kids go to highschool football is usally dropped like a hot snot.

I hope the U.S get better and push on. This in turn will raise the water mark across the world. However IMO I can't see them winning the world cup in the next 20 years. They may have a strong team in the future, but they will never be a Brazil, Italy, Germany, Argentina etc. These teams usually win it with other European nations after that. No offence.

Fromvert

I'm nearly sure I read somewhere that American Universities are starting to drop their American Football and Wrestling programs and are supposedly starting to side with football and golf programs.

This would surely improve their chances of improving over the next 20 years.

Mister men

Lived and worked in the US for years and i'm afriad it's not going to happen for them. Football is a sport played by the well off and their kids. If the game ever became popular on the street corners and the basketball courts where swapped for 5 a side pitches in the working class areas then they would become a world force.

They may well do good in the odd World Cup because of their amazing fighting spirit but win it, never.

GavRedKing

Wont happen. Although USA are improving some of the stuff been said here is mad. In 20 years they will be as good as the Dutch national team??

:eek:

cardwizzard

eagle eye wrote: »

No team plays four home games in a week in either of those sports.


I was in Boston for a 10 days in January and i'm pretty sure their ice hockey team did. Most look it up.

Backstreet Moyes

Mister men wrote: »

Lived and worked in the US for years and i'm afriad it's not going to happen for them. Football is a sport played by the well off and their kids. If the game ever became popular on the street corners and the basketball courts where swapped for 5 a side pitches in the working class areas then they would become a world force.

They may well do good in the odd World Cup because of their amazing fighting spirit but win it, never.

I cant understand how you can say they will never win it unless your nostradamus. Look at their population. All it can take is them getting a good draw and getting to a semi's of a world cup for people to take much more of an interest in it. But right now they are way behind to all other sports, unless they find a way to raise the interest in the sport, its hard to see them winning it any time soon. Signings like Beckham and Henry etc will raise the attendances. But they are only going for a big wage packet before they retire. With all the wages they are splashing out on these big name players, they could maybe pump this money in raising the awareness and make the game more appealing to youngsters. Use the money to build good facilities to encourage young players to take up the game. But those big signings have probably been the main reason for the increase in attendances so maybe thats the way to keep going.

eagle eye

cardwizzard wrote: »

I was in Boston for a 10 days in January and i'm pretty sure their ice hockey team did. Most look it up.

Well it wouldn't be normal but I went and checked it and they actually played 3 in one week in January.

cardwizzard

5 games monday to monday. 4 at home. Anyways it's a mute point.

pickarooney

The likes of Belgium, Bulgaria, Sweden, Uruguay, Croatia and (I know I already mentioned them) Turkey and South Korea have made the semis in the last 25 years. The outsiders always seem to come up just short but IMO it's only a matter of time before there's a major upset and the US has as good a chance as anyone of doing it.

parker kent

pickarooney wrote: »

People would have laughed at the idea of South Korea or Turkey in the semis or Greece and Denmark winning the Euros. They were one of a few teams playing positive football lat year so I'd welcome a US side challenging for honours.

That Danish team was pretty good. Not their 1986 peak, but far removed from Greece, Turkey etc. Only 8 teams qualified for the Euros in 1992, so lots of good teams missed out. Yugoslavia would have gone far based on the players they had and how Croatia performed 4 years later.

But your point is right. A decent draw and good luck mean any team can progress in a tournament. Extremely rare though for one to win the whole thing.

The USA will need to move beyond hard working players and get creative players. Their players compliment some club teams, bit as a whole the USA are still not producing "natural" footballers.

parker kent

gavredking wrote: »

Wont happen. Although USA are improving some of the stuff been said here is mad. In 20 years they will be as good as the Dutch national team??

:eek:

Well you don't know either way. Dutch football was amateur not long before Cruyff et all arrived, You would have been called mad if you suggested they would reach 2 consecutive World Cup finals.

Nobody can say one way or the other. But a country with the money and population of the USA always stand a chance of getting very good.

cardwizzard

Nobody can say one way or the other. But a country with the money and population of the USA always stand a chance of getting very good.[/QUOTE]


So by that rational(spelling) Saudi Arabia should be just about to win the world cup in Qatar.

FatherTed

First off, I'm surprised non of the Prem experts have mentioned Stuart Holden.

The US has come a long way since the 1990 World Cup. Back then they had I think 2-3 professional players on the WC squad, the rest were college players. Since then, a ton of good players(not world class, the term is objective anyway) have been produced and they are getting better. They easily rank in that middle tier of teams such as S.Korea, Croatia, Turkey, Russia etc. The "bigger" teams always have problems with them e.g. England in the last WC(draw), Spain(won 2-0) and Brazil(lost 3-2 after leading 2-0) in the last Confed Cup, Italy(draw) in 2006 WC, Portugal(3-2) and Germany(lost 1-0, shoulda won) in 2002 WC. They do have problems putting away teams they should beat like we saw in the last 2 World Cups(Ghana) but I think bad tactics on the day has a lot to do with that, especially last year.

As for MLS, I watch a lot, ticket holder for NY but I'm not one for comparing with other leagues. All I can say is that we beat Man City last year at home in the Summer:p I just go to have fun. A lot of people consider the Premier League to be the best but what has England done? The league is getting better, although I'm a bit worried that the rapid expansion in the last few years might dilute the talent a bit. They have brought in the DPs like Beckham and Henry but I could care less. They haven't exactly shone so far.

But the biggest change in MLS that is starting to bear fruit is the academies. A few years ago they simply didn't exist. NY started one and now most teams have them. One of the problems they had for years here is that only the richer kids who could afford elite coaching would ever make the step up. Either that or they go play college soccer with has it's problems with poor coaching and other issues. Now the academies like the one NY has is making it affordable for kids with some talent from the poorer communities get some decent coaching at a younger. I think long term this will have a big impact on how the US will do. One such kid is Juan Agudelo already mentioned here, came from the NY academy, scored against Argentina last week.

cardwizzard

Thats all well and dandy fatherted but other nations are not standing still either. While the yanks may get closer to the top teams, they won't win a world cup in the next 20 years, imo.

partyndbs

will be legit contenders tho

cardwizzard

partyndbs wrote: »

will be legit contenders tho

Could see them getting to maybe numer 8/10/12 something like that. So close but no cigar. I suppose in a few years you could drag this back up and slaughter me.:eek::eek::eek:

I should also say you really need that one player to carry you that bit futher than just a very good team. A Zidane, Messi, Xavi,Maradonna, Mattehus, Ronaldo(the fat one) etc

dsmythy

I think they should be regularly looking at a quarter final place over the coming tournaments and from there the world class players will have to come through their college system to progress to the next level.

I think opening up the MLS from it's various caps on money would help a lot.

partyndbs

cardwizzard wrote: »

Could see them getting to maybe numer 8/10/12 something like that. So close but no cigar. I suppose in a few years you could drag this back up and slaughter me.:eek::eek::eek:

I should also say you really need that one player to carry you that bit futher than just a very good team. A Zidane, Messi, Xavi,Maradonna, Mattehus, Ronaldo(the fat one) etc

just waiting on freddy to blossom

cardwizzard

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Kidchameleon

Has anyone mentioned that they got to the final of the Confederations Cup in 2009? Not exactly the greatest tournament in the world, but if you can get to the final of that, you can do anything. Euro 2004 showed that anyone can win a big tournament...

FatherTed

There are rumors of the USSF hiring Marcelo Bielsa as Technical Director.

Hazys

I see the OP's point.

In the mid 80's in the US there were 500,000 registered youth players in the US when the majority of the current US team played (probably 5 years later, but only stat i could find)

Current day there are over 4,000,000 youth soccer players in the US and its a constanly growing figure and soccer is becoming increasingly more popular in the country.

So in the most simplistic terms the US could be 8x better in 20 years than they are now.


4,000,000 is probably the highest number of registered you players in the world more than France, Spain or Italy. Obviously its hard to compare this number to places like Brazil where the majority of youth players are not registered.

I believe the US will become a top team in the next 20 years as soccer is growing in popularity there, they have a modest but stable and growing MLS, sheer numbers of active players, a huge imigrant population (recently Latinos became the 2nd biggest population). In 20 years soccer could become a top 4 sport in the US, if they got (should have) the WC instead of Qatar it would have been an epic WC.

Paully D

Belgium are my shout to win a major tournament in the future.

partyndbs

Hazys wrote: »

I see the OP's point.

In the mid 80's in the US there were 500,000 registered youth players in the US when the majority of the current US team played (probably 5 years later, but only stat i could find)

Current day there are over 4,000,000 youth soccer players in the US and its a constanly growing figure and soccer is becoming increasingly more popular in the country.

So in the most simplistic terms the US could be 8x better in 20 years than they are now.


4,000,000 is probably the highest number of registered you players in the world more than France, Spain or Italy. Obviously its hard to compare this number to places like Brazil where the majority of youth players are not registered.

I believe the US will become a top team in the next 20 years as soccer is growing in popularity there, they have a modest but stable and growing MLS, sheer numbers of active players, a huge imigrant population (recently Latinos became the 2nd biggest population). In 20 years soccer could become a top 4 sport in the US, if they got (should have) the WC instead of Qatar it would have been an epic WC.

thats it, its not long before the us produces a world class player in the mould of messi, ronaldo etc. 4,000.000 is a lot of players, adu was meant to be but doesnt look like it(he has time tho i use franck ribery as an example as to why i think adu still has a chance although see hes playing in turkish 2nd division)
altidore was meant to be that player as well but has gone backwards in recent years, but i think we will see this player emerge soon.

agudelo has a chance, a real chance.

cardwizzard

partyndbs wrote: »

thats it, its not long before the us produces a world class player in the mould of messi, ronaldo etc. 4,000.000 is a lot of players, adu was meant to be but doesnt look like it(he has time tho i use franck ribery as an example as to why i think adu still has a chance)
altidore was meant to be that player as well but has gone backwards in recent years, but i think we will see this player emerge soon.

agudelo has a chance, a real chance.

I hear what you are saying. Thing is there is usually a few players at a top level then a really really good one comes along. They haven't any good internationals yet. I mean standout not brillant players.

UpTheSlashers

Over the next 20 years there 5 world cups. They wont win it in 2014 so that leaves four. Do you really think they will win one of those ahead of teams like Brazil, Argentina, Spain, Holland, France, Italy, Germany, Croatia, Portugal, England?







No.

parker kent

cardwizzard wrote: »

So by that rational(spelling) Saudi Arabia should be just about to win the world cup in Qatar.

Yeah because that's a like-for-like comparison alright.

cardwizzard wrote: »

Thats all well and dandy fatherted but other nations are not standing still either. While the yanks may get closer to the top teams, they won't win a world cup in the next 20 years, imo.

You can't dogmatically say that. They already are performing decently at WCs. It is not inconceivable that they could build on that.

cardwizzard

parker kent wrote: »

Well you don't know either way. Dutch football was amateur not long before Cruyff et all arrived, You would have been called mad if you suggested they would reach 2 consecutive World Cup finals.

Nobody can say one way or the other. But a country with the money and population of the USA always stand a chance of getting very good.

parker kent wrote: »

Yeah because that's a like-for-like comparison alright.




You can't dogmatically say that. They already are performing decently at WCs. It is not inconceivable that they could build on that.

If your going to quote me quote the whole paragragh please. Anybody can rip one sentence to shreds.

Dogmatically, like that. That is why I put in IMO, did you not see that. I've heard of selective hearing,but you got selective eyesight.

I've no doubt they will improve, and as all my posts have said this. Wether they can win a WC in the next 20 years, I, me, and only my opinion think not. However I could well be proved wrong, and that wouldn't be the first time.

Have a nice day.:)

parker kent

cardwizzard wrote: »

If your going to quote me quote the whole paragragh please. Anybody can rip one sentence to shreds.

Dogmatically, like that. That is why I put in IMO, did you not see that. I've heard of selective hearing,but you got selective eyesight.

I've no doubt they will improve, and as all my posts have said this. Wether they can win a WC in the next 20 years, I, me, and only my opinion think not. However I could well be proved wrong, and that wouldn't be the first time.

Have a nice day.:)

What are you on about? This is the post I quoted from you, which is the full post. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=71435782&postcount=85

Then the other quote from you is this one: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=71434949&postcount=83 I quoted everything you said in that post. The part I deleted was the line from my quote which you had not quoted correctly (as in it did not appear in your post as a quote from me)

I didn't "selectively quote".

And the other post of mine you have just quoted was replying to gavredking's post. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=71432530&postcount=75

Dogmatically refers to any opinion which is "Characterized by an authoritative, arrogant assertion of unproved or unprovable principles". I thought your post matches that criteria. Whether you add "imo" doesn't change that you were pretty clearly dismissing the USA despite lacking a crystal ball.

el dude

probably not, no. it's not just about numbers either, look at Uruguay, then look at China. and youth soccer has been huge in the US for some time, just not amongst the African American and in the more urban areas. until that changes I don't see the US getting all that much better. it's not like they have a raft of young players coming through and in truth, they are no better than our Ireland side.