Why am I so insecure about the British?

OPENROAD

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Well hold on a minute - generally I like people from the UK, and I find a lot of their culture to be very interesting and worthy of respect. But lets not be ignoring the underside, which some seem bound and determined to do.


Why?

You have good and bad everywhere. You seem to think things are perfect here.

Level of immigration of different races, creeds colors far more then Ireland,yet on the whole people get on pretty well.

LondonIrish90

OPENROAD wrote: »

I still think it is rather an unfair picture you are painting of the UK, far right have had little or no success, although they did gain a Euro seat, this was down to such a terrible voter turn out, the actual vote fell.

As said you really can't compare the UK to Ireland.

Hopefully things will change (which they seem to be). For too long have the people, culture, history, and identity of British people played second fiddle to a small but very noisy and politically aggressive group of newcomers to Britain. Thankfully, Mr Cameron has identified we arent a successful multicultural country, and he has identified that we cannot go on appeasing those who come here, no matter how much their views conflict with ours. All people have a breaking point, and people here(sensible, intelligent people, not necessarity those who go on rallys with soccer fans) and coming close to theirs.

Amhran Nua

OPENROAD wrote: »

You have good and bad everywhere. You seem to think things are perfect here.

Hardly. But there's a lot to admire about Irish culture too.

OPENROAD wrote: »

Level of immigration of different races, creeds colors far more then Ireland,yet on the whole people get on pretty well.

You may have missed the point I was making - recent immigration figures to Ireland have far outstripped anything experienced by the UK. And not a race riot in sight. In fact I challenge you to find the country where the population increased by 10% over the course of a couple of years due to immigration without serious social repercussions.

OPENROAD

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

Hopefully things will change (which they seem to be). For too long have the people, culture, history, and identity of British people played second fiddle to a small but very noisy and politically aggressive group of newcomers to Britain. Thankfully, Mr Cameron has identified we arent a successful multicultural country, and he has identified that we cannot go on appeasing those who come here, no matter how much their views conflict with ours. All people have a breaking point, and people (sensible, intelligent people, not necessarity those who go on rallys with soccer fans) and coming close to theirs.

In fairness you have only yourselves to blame that your identity has come second fiddle, perfect example-April 23rd

What I would agree and what I think David Cameron was really trying to say is that UK law has to come first and people need to accept this, and also have to respect the local culture. Now if an Irish Taoiseach said the same, everyone here would agree.

As said the far right still have very little support, that is not to say that this can't change , which is why DC said what he did imo

OPENROAD

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Hardly. But there's a lot to admire about Irish culture too.


You may have missed the point I was making - recent immigration figures to Ireland have far outstripped anything experienced by the UK. And not a race riot in sight. In fact I challenge you to find the country where the population increased by 10% over the course of a couple of years due to immigration without serious social repercussions.

I totally agree with you regarding our culture , but surely that is the same in the UK

I really don't want to go down the whole immigration road, to be honest, I avoid such threads on purpose particularly in AH , but our immigration has been quite different, if I walk into a shop, it is only when someone comes to serve me that I realize they are not Irish.

Having said that on the whole I believe we are not racist , but I would also apply the same statement to the English

LondonIrish90

OPENROAD wrote: »

In fairness you have only yourselves to blame that your identity has come second fiddle, perfect example-April 23rd

What I would agree and what I think David Cameron was really trying to say is that UK law has to come first and people need to accept this, and also have to respect the local culture. Now if an Irish Taoiseach said the same, everyone here would agree.

As said the far right still have very little support, that is not to say that this can't change , which is why DC said what he did imo

It could obviously be a symptom of the current economic climate. As history shows times like these never fail to politically polarize the population of a country.

Maybe David Cameron was playing to the current views of the country, and in five years time should he still be the Prime Minister, we may never hear another word from him about it. I just think that within the all aspects of the media, both local and national, and from the general population too, there are definate rumblings of discontent.

As it is, the UK is pretty peaceful and safe for everyone, from everywhere. But I think we only have to look across the English channel to see how divided a nation France has become, and how much anger there is from the native and the newer immigrant population. I think things need to change in Britain before we get to that stage.

sandmanporto

QUINCY M.E is on RTE2

OPENROAD

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

It could obviously be a symptom of the current economic climate. As history shows times like these never fail to politically polarize the population of a country.

Maybe David Cameron was playing to the current views of the country, and in five years time should he still be the Prime Minister, we may never hear another word from him about it. I just think that within the all aspects of the media, both local and national, and from the general population too, there are definate rumblings of discontent.

As it is, the UK is pretty peaceful and safe for everyone, from everywhere. But I think we only have to look across the English channel to see how divided a nation France has become, and how much anger there is from the native and the newer immigrant population. I think things need to change in Britain before we get to that stage.

Most people here seem to compare ourselves to the UK and never look further afield, hence my comment that things are not as bad in the UK as they are elsewhere in Europe.

I'm very much up on things in the UK, as you say when economic times become more difficult you tend to have less happy people, but this is amongst all English people( irrespective of color-i.e. Jermaine Defoe is every bit as English as anyone else) and in fact many immigrants who have been in the UK for many years would also seem to voice concerns.

OPENROAD

sandmanporto wrote: »

QUINCY M.E is on RTE2

Double helping, top bloke imo

Dozen Wicked Words

sandmanporto wrote: »

QUINCY M.E is on RTE2

Oh no, hes not going to launch one of his trademark tirades...... This time against the english is he?

Amhran Nua

OPENROAD wrote: »

but our immigration has been quite different, if I walk into a shop, it is only when someone comes to serve me that I realize they are not Irish.

Funny little anecdote, I was in Dublin a year or so ago, and I asked the white gentleman behind the counter for directions to a certain location - with an embarassed look he waved over a Chinese looking individual, who told me how to get there in a thick Dublin north soide accent.

I mention this because of your subtext that our reaction to immigrants has been better because the immigrants have been white. I would dispute this, although I haven't immediate access to percentage of population data on ethnic groups in Ireland relative to the UK, so lets look at indough's points:

ive personally witnessed eastern europeans getting abuse on the streets for no good reason -> I've gotten plenty of abuse on the streets for no good reason, from drunks, students, and general troublemakers, despite being as Irish as Máire Mac Mathúna.

black taxi drivers getting abuse on here -> there are no shortage of threads abusing taxi drivers in general on here

loads of threads criticising anything english on a regular basis -> That's what we're talking about.

oh and lets not forget the threads on the travelling community -> Government policy on this issue is to change the behavior rather than get rid of the individuals, and so far in my observations it has been successful, abeit slowly.

or that warm welcome the orange boys got when they came to walk down a few dublin streets not too long ago. -> Yeah, they were looking to provoke a reaction, and that's what they got. Even northern unionist types understand that.

this country is just as rank with bigotry as everywhere else is -> No, it's not.

The bottom line is, our record as far as racism and tolerance of immigrant cultures goes is far better than that of the UK. I have linked to the facts to support this assertion.

OPENROAD

Amhran Nua wrote: »

The bottom line is, our record as far as racism and tolerance of immigrant cultures goes is far better than that of the UK. I have linked to the facts to support this assertion.

We will have to agree to disagree, though as I have said on the whole I feel we are tolerant, I just happen to believe the English are also

Amhran Nua

OPENROAD wrote: »

We will have to agree to disagree

Why? I've linked to the facts of race riots, widespread racial intolerance, and right wing parties in the UK. I have yet to see the above anywhere in Ireland.

guitarzero

I'm kinda on the same boat.

Whats up with English adds like Malteesers ...and....other....adds using the word 'Naughty' constantly, such as "Oooh, NAUGHTY!", "Ohhh, you're naughty!", gets on my wick!

And 'Saucy', when I hear that I feel I'm gonna wage war on them.

'Get ya bits out!', thats another one. 'Oh, we LAVING it!!".

'Fancy a bit ah babbly!?!', why bubbly?!?!

Their soaps and celebrity dance shows, X factor all endorse mediocrity. I hate when the camera pans around the audience, looks like a weight watchers convention. Hahaha!

Admittedly they have produced some great things, people and music.

sandmanporto

dooferoaks wrote: »

Oh no, hes not going to launch one of his trademark tirades...... This time against the english is he?

Just leave me joke for once! This topic is to pointless. Why dont u come up with something instead of criticizing my bull. There's a stench of bullying culture on this website

Dozen Wicked Words

How very dare you. I have the utmost respect for Quincy. I dont think you should discount his opinion until we have heard him. I would never criticise anyone vouching for jack klugman.

Spook_ie

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Indeed you can't, if an equivalent number of Eastern Europeans had landed in the UK over the course of three years you'd have six million of them there in a short space of time. I leave it as an exercise for the readers to surmise the reaction of the local population.


Great but; no race riots, no right wing parties, and not enough racial tension to be worth mentioning. The odd bods and contrarians you meet on boards are somewhat disproportional in their contributions relative to the general population. Most in my experience take people as they come.

Don't exagerate

The Home Office publishes quarterly statistics on the number of applications to the Worker Registration Scheme. Figures published in August 2007 indicate that 656,395 people were accepted on to the scheme between 1 May 2004 and 30 June 2007, of whom 430,395 were Polish nationals. However, this figure is only indicative as the scheme is an opt-in system without incentive: it costs Poles time and money and isn't enforced. Poles are able to ignore the scheme and work in the UK provided they have a Polish passport and a National Insurance Number Card, which has led to estimates of Polish nationals in the UK being much higher

The Polish minority in the Republic of Ireland numbers approximately 63,276 according to 2006 census figures,[1] making it the largest minority in the country excluding those born in the United Kingdom. However, the census that year is believed by the government to have underestimated the number of Polish nationals, whose numbers may be as high as 200,00

So given the actual figures UK had 7x as many Poles, however given Irelands population as being circa 4.5 million then the % of poles would have been circa. 1.4% which if extropalated to the UKs population of circa 61,000,000 in 2006 would give a Polish pro rata population of 854,000, the actual number who fillled in the required paperwork to give an exact figure is as stated in the citation unknown

Fratton Fred

Amhran Nua wrote: »

You may have missed the point I was making - recent immigration figures to Ireland have far outstripped anything experienced by the UK. And not a race riot in sight. In fact I challenge you to find the country where the population increased by 10% over the course of a couple of years due to immigration without serious social repercussions.

Ireland has seen a large number if immigrants who were conveniently white and catholic. If you are white and catholic I doubt if Ireland is too difficult a place to integrate into. If you are non white and non catholic I dare say it is a lot harder, as was demonstrated by the north Dublin schools fiasco a few years ago.

In the UK the only real right wing party of note is the BNP, who cater for all the sad ****wits who like to blame other people for their sad existence. In Ireland sinn fein, rsf and erigi fill the same void.

Mr.Crinklewood

Downlinz wrote: »

It's something I've been thinking a lot about lately and began wondering if others felt this way or if there was anyway to be less uncomfortable about things like the below.

-> I won't watch television programs if they're british based. Which might be fine if it was out of loyalty to Ireland or not enjoying foreign culture based things expect 90% of what I watch is american programming.

-> I don't like people who use british based phrases like "yummy mummy" "mum" "boxing day" yet people who use american phrases are no problem, and will point out what they're doing to make them feel awkward and bad.

-> I don't like people who follow british soaps and not fair city, X-Factor/Dancing on Ice but not all-ireland talent show or watch the english coverage of sporting events covered on Irish tv.

-> I don't like people who study abroad in the UK

-> I despise anyone who emigrates to the UK but can sympathise with someone who emigrates to Australia/America or somewhere else.

-> I don't like people who follow the english national team in any sport with any level of higher interest than any other country. e.g. Sports news reporting Irelands results and afterwards England, Scotland, Wales, NI's results while ignoring Spain and Frances games.


To summarise it I have nothing against the English but I really don't like how their culture is jammed down my throat in this country and seemingly an awful lot of people like to get in on it, and those people really grate with me.

I think its ok to dislike a culture but theres probably a more healthy way to do this than scowl or complain at anybody who shows the slightest interest in it. Any wannabe interest psychologists with comments on this behaviour? :pac:

Should you not be writing this in English?

Buceph

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

Should you not be writing this in English?

He did write it in English.

Mr.Crinklewood

Buceph wrote: »

He did write it in English.

My bad, meant to say Irish.

Buceph

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

My bad, meant to say Irish.

PERVASIVE ENGLISH CULTURE OVERTAKING IRISH!

pow wow

Downlinz wrote: »

I

-> I don't like people who study abroad in the UK

Obligatory "how dare you" with NI & GB Colleges mod hat on.

@ Amhran Nua, the absence of race riots in Ireland is based on a fundamentally different history and immigration pattern in the UK, not Irish awesomeness :rolleyes:

John_Rambo

Downlinz wrote: »

It's something I've been thinking a lot about lately and began wondering if others felt this way or if there was anyway to be less uncomfortable about things like the below.

-> I won't watch television programs if they're british based. Which might be fine if it was out of loyalty to Ireland or not enjoying foreign culture based things expect 90% of what I watch is american programming.

-> I don't like people who use british based phrases like "yummy mummy" "mum" "boxing day" yet people who use american phrases are no problem, and will point out what they're doing to make them feel awkward and bad.

-> I don't like people who follow british soaps and not fair city, X-Factor/Dancing on Ice but not all-ireland talent show or watch the english coverage of sporting events covered on Irish tv.

-> I don't like people who study abroad in the UK

-> I despise anyone who emigrates to the UK but can sympathise with someone who emigrates to Australia/America or somewhere else.

-> I don't like people who follow the english national team in any sport with any level of higher interest than any other country. e.g. Sports news reporting Irelands results and afterwards England, Scotland, Wales, NI's results while ignoring Spain and Frances games.


To summarise it I have nothing against the English but I really don't like how their culture is jammed down my throat in this country and seemingly an awful lot of people like to get in on it, and those people really grate with me.

I think its ok to dislike a culture but theres probably a more healthy way to do this than scowl or complain at anybody who shows the slightest interest in it. Any wannabe interest psychologists with comments on this behaviour? :pac:

But you really enjoyed the Munster v Leinster Match on Saturday.

Grow up..

blaze1

guitarzero wrote: »

I'm kinda on the same boat.

Whats up with English adds like Malteesers ...and....other....adds using the word 'Naughty' constantly, such as "Oooh, NAUGHTY!", "Ohhh, you're naughty!", gets on my wick!

And 'Saucy', when I hear that I feel I'm gonna wage war on them.

'Get ya bits out!', thats another one. 'Oh, we LAVING it!!".

'Fancy a bit ah babbly!?!', why bubbly?!?!

Their soaps and celebrity dance shows, X factor all endorse mediocrity. I hate when the camera pans around the audience, looks like a weight watchers convention. Hahaha!

Admittedly they have produced some great things, people and music.

I completely agree with you regarding celebrity shows and most other trash tv, its just gash. Also theres fat chicks in my job who talk about nothing else than xfactor and all the other cack that goes with it

BUT I will not have a bad word said against the bird from the malteasers ad/The IT crowd Katherine Parkinson

Fratton Fred

blaze1 wrote: »

I completely agree with you regarding celebrity shows and most other trash tv, its just gash. Also theres fat chicks in my job who talk about nothing else than xfactor and all the other cack that goes with it

BUT I will not have a bad word said against the bird from the malteasers ad/The IT crowd Katherine Parkinson

That is not British culture though, that is trashy mass produced tv. It's like watching take me out or some other crappy rte dating show or reading VIP magazine and thinking that represents Irish culture.

mike65

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Why? I've linked to the facts of race riots, widespread racial intolerance, and right wing parties in the UK. I have yet to see the above anywhere in Ireland.

Wait 10-20 years before declaring success. Its when the children of immigrants become dissafected things tend to kick off as battle lines get drawn. Obviously the general social-economic context plays a part, in the UK that second generation conincided with the industrial/ficsal malaise of the 70s, the far right were on the march and the Afro-Carribean population were a handy target. Lets all hope that if the current slump here is sustained it doesn't result in something similair.

blaze1

Fratton Fred wrote: »

That is not British culture though, that is trashy mass produced tv. It's like watching take me out or some other crappy rte dating show or reading VIP magazine and thinking that represents Irish culture.

yup,

I'm gonna poke the bees nest here.

I find that tv in general on the likes of rte is shockingly bad. How many
re-runs of farm life from the 60's-70's do we really need to see. Everytime i switch on to rte its something like that.

LordSutch

Downlinz wrote: »

People who covet the british should get the hell out of my country and go to where they want to be. I say I despise emigrants to the UK but in reality I don't give them a second thought I'm just glad they're gone.

Have you considered Therapy?

Fratton Fred

LordSutch wrote: »

Have you considered Therapy?

Is that on BBC2 on a Tuesday evening?

guitarzero

Fratton Fred wrote: »

That is not British culture though, that is trashy mass produced tv. It's like watching take me out or some other crappy rte dating show or reading VIP magazine and thinking that represents Irish culture.

What is British culture? Dads Army ? Anyway, culture is an ever evolving thing, other than language its kinda hard but I'll say Last of the Summer Wine and...The Beattles?

Wibbs

Seanchai wrote: »

Your obsession with "boggers" seems to permeate all the threads you contribute to.

Tickle a nerve have I? Sheesh you chucky gaelgoires do love the oul inaccurate hyperbole don'tcha? "All the threads. All I tells ya!!! :eek::eek:" Meh maybe try stalking me a little better.

As many other posters have told you, you have a serious chip on your shoulder about Irish culture.

Ah inaccurate hyperbole again. I have no issue with Irish culture. I have an issue with some and their stupidly narrow vision of it and the forced imposition of same on the rest of us. Oh I'm sure you're happier to think otherwise, but you're wrong. Simples. BTW the "many" you refer to are only the ones with usernames as Gaelige. Not all of them either. Plus how is a bogger Irish culture? How is an insular, clannish, moronic person redolent of Irish culture? Maybe yours oul son, not mine and not most of ours.

If deriding anybody who's not up to your "standard" (which is clearly delusional) as a "bogger" is acceptable, then deriding immoral people as British mass murdering scumbags is equally acceptable. That's the way it works in retard stereotype land.

You're really bad at this compare and contrast lark aren't you? I'm delusional, apparently a retard too. And I'm apparently the one with a chip on my shoulder? Muahahhahaha. Ah bless.

Fratton Fred

guitarzero wrote: »

What is British culture? Dads Army ? Anyway, culture is an ever evolving thing, other than language its kinda hard but I'll say Last of the Summer Wine and...The Beattles?

It may be ever evolving, but it isn't based around reality tv and consumerism.

jackiebaron

English women have the best fcuking tits in the world.

FACT!

Wibbs

I dunno about that. If you're a big boob man, Ireland is the place to be in my experience anyway.

mike65

Lets not drag this thread down. *cough*

pow wow

jackiebaron wrote: »

English women have the best fcuking tits in the world.

FACT!

Looks like someone appreciates the work of the NHS.

Downlinz

andrew wrote: »

OP, I hate to break it to you but the World Wide Web was invented by a Brit. Best log out and switch off before what little Irish culture left in you is warped and destroyed by this malicious and insidious British invention.

Learn to read, I at no point said I had anything against the English. I've been to England several times and have friends over there and respect their culture and its people.

My issue is with Irish people coveting and flaunting the British culture. So ditch your small minded tabloid mentality looking for sensationalist drivel that isn't being said.

Downlinz

guitarzero wrote: »

I'm kinda on the same boat.

Whats up with English adds like Malteesers ...and....other....adds using the word 'Naughty' constantly, such as "Oooh, NAUGHTY!", "Ohhh, you're naughty!", gets on my wick!

And 'Saucy', when I hear that I feel I'm gonna wage war on them.

'Get ya bits out!', thats another one. 'Oh, we LAVING it!!".

'Fancy a bit ah babbly!?!', why bubbly?!?!

This is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about.

LordSutch

Downlinz wrote: »

My issue is with Irish people coveting and flaunting the British culture. So ditch your small minded tabloid mentality looking for sensationalist drivel that isn't being said.

:rolleyes:

If you could stand back and analize what you are actually saying Downlinz, you might think again?
Two islands next door to each other since the beginning of time, two islands in a small group of islands, connected by culture, connected by history, connected by bloodlines, people on this island with English, Welsh & Scottish blood in their veins, and many generations of Irish people on that island with Irish blood in their veins 'who openly practice their Irish culture'. There is no reason whatsoever Downlinz why we shouldn't embrace each others cultures.

Suggest you spend more time in England to broaden your mind.

dr gonzo

Downlinz wrote: »

Learn to read, I at no point said I had anything against the English. I've been to England several times and have friends over there and respect their culture and its people.

Youve basically just rephrased "I'm not a racist but..." Sandwiching points that convery your dislike of a culture with statements about how you have nothing really against it doesnt mean you Actually have nothing against it since you clearly do. You say your problem is not with English culture itself but with Irish people "flaunting" it, that means you very much do have a problem with it because, by your own admission, you wouldnt care if it was another culture entirely. You can say youre not anglophobic as much as you want it doesnt change the fact that, for whatever reason, you are.

Also

Downlinz wrote: »

This is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about.

That kind of thing is called an accent. You dislike people for having a different way of pronouncing words...?

patrickbrophy18

To the OP! Lie down before you hurt yourself! The reason why British sports teams are so popular over here is because of the large variety of teams, in football and rugby anyway. Don't forget that there is a rugby team called "The British and Irish Lions". Furthermore, the island of Ireland is very close to Britain geographically. Also, whether you like it or not, from a genealogical perspective, the British and Irish share a lot of the same blood. For example, there are a good few British names in my family tree as well as French. While I am mostly Irish, I am of British and French decent. So, you are lucky that I amn't taking offense to your comments. Some sources have it that my surname 'Brophy' is of Scottish Origin. I'm beginning to suspect that these feelings take their roots in the early 1900's despite the fact that we settled our differences shortly there after and more importantly, the British are a very good and important ally to the Irish.

Sonnenblumen

Downlinz wrote: »

It's something I've been thinking a lot about lately and began wondering if others felt this way or if there was anyway to be less uncomfortable about things like the below.

-> I won't watch television programs if they're british based. Which might be fine if it was out of loyalty to Ireland or not enjoying foreign culture based things expect 90% of what I watch is american programming.

-> I don't like people who use british based phrases like "yummy mummy" "mum" "boxing day" yet people who use american phrases are no problem, and will point out what they're doing to make them feel awkward and bad.

-> I don't like people who follow british soaps and not fair city, X-Factor/Dancing on Ice but not all-ireland talent show or watch the english coverage of sporting events covered on Irish tv.

-> I don't like people who study abroad in the UK

-> I despise anyone who emigrates to the UK but can sympathise with someone who emigrates to Australia/America or somewhere else.

-> I don't like people who follow the english national team in any sport with any level of higher interest than any other country. e.g. Sports news reporting Irelands results and afterwards England, Scotland, Wales, NI's results while ignoring Spain and Frances games.


To summarise it I have nothing against the English but I really don't like how their culture is jammed down my throat in this country and seemingly an awful lot of people like to get in on it, and those people really grate with me.

I think its ok to dislike a culture but theres probably a more healthy way to do this than scowl or complain at anybody who shows the slightest interest in it. Any wannabe interest psychologists with comments on this behaviour? :pac:

Yeah, how about writing your whinge in another language, ie your own? Oh no, don't say your an english only speaking Irish person? OMG, is it a case of being trapped within a foreign body?:eek: